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Around The NBA

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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#761 » by JujitsuFlip » Fri Apr 28, 2023 6:59 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
JujitsuFlip wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
The Mitchell trade was about establishing our core, and I think you'll find most contenders play their core in the playoffs. So, Thibs stuck with RJ Barrett even though he looked pretty shaky in the first couple games, and JBB stuck with Allen and Mobley even though they were getting pushed around throughout the series.

He could have used Lopez when one of those guys were sitting, but he preferred to go small. I actually feel pretty good about Isaac going in to next season because of how he played against the Knicks, but our problems were obviously far deeper than slowing down Brunson and Randle.

If this truly was all JBB's fault, the players will have him fired. If they buy in to that this is a process where making the playoffs is just the first step for all of them, they will stick with it and do what it takes to not repeat their errors.

We were well on our way to becoming a 50-win team before trading for Mitchell, so, our draft picks weren't going to be especially exciting. We can use them to help fill a hole now rather than take a gamble that we might be able to fill a bigger hole somewhere down the line. And even with the Mitchell trade, we'll be able to do that every other year starting in 2024.
I've been telling you for almost 8 months now, it is not about drafting players with those picks. It is the flexibility of having those assets to use in trades. Cavs have next to zero assets to upgrade the roster, that is the issue.


The expected draft position also affects the value of those picks in trade, but personally I'm more interested in improving the team long-term via the draft and player development. Get those Travers, Diops, Mobleys, and Diakites in the pipeline and something good should come of it. Undrafted picks got us Stevens and Wade. We will hopefully do better with those 2nd rounders from last year, and hopefully even better if we hold on to our firsts starting in 2024.

Look at the Knicks and all their first round picks. They got Cam Reddish with one and then traded him with another 1st for Josh Hart who is going to be a free-agent this Summer unless he goes insane and doesn't decline his player option. Sure, they can keep Hart but he's going to cost them and the 28 yr old for some reason has been real hesitant to fire up 3's this season.

He'd be a nice depth player and perhaps a short-term starter, especially in the short-term before Mobley, Allen, and Mitchell get their next deals; but pipelining affordable depth should be the goal, IMO.

Terms like development and long term are complete contradictions to the action of trading essentially 6 first rounders for Mitchell.

Also, the Knicks own all of their own firsts after this season plus they own the Mavs, Pistons, and Wizards first rounders next season... They can afford to throw firsts around, a luxury the Cavs won't have until 2030.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#762 » by JonFromVA » Fri Apr 28, 2023 9:53 pm

jasonxxx102 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
Did he?

Donovan Mitchell had a great regular season but we knew what he was.

Was Garland that much better? Mobley? Allen? None of those guys were any better this year.

Mobley was better during the 2nd half of the season but it had absolutely nothing to do with JB. He was just being more aggressive.

Garland was exactly the same. Jarrett Allen was worse this year. Okoro, exactly the same. Cedi, the same.

Who got better this year? JB got the exact same amount out of the team this year as he did last year there was no development


You're asking a different question: did he make them better, did he help them improve, etc.

What I said is he got a lot of out of them ... and we don't need to look beyond 51 wins for evidence of that. Feel free to review the pre-season predictions for the season from non-homers like me.


They matched the Vegas win total post Mitchell trade.

The entire point of a coach is for the team to improve and develop each year. Otherwise what is he there for?

This team didn’t change at all from last season and I guarantee they won’t next year with JB either. The only difference will be that we will waste a whole year before the org stops being stubborn and fires him


51 wins, 4th seed playoffs, 8th best offense, 1st ranked defense ... that's what many would consider improvement; but lots of people need to improve and learn including our head coach.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#763 » by JujitsuFlip » Fri Apr 28, 2023 9:59 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
You're asking a different question: did he make them better, did he help them improve, etc.

What I said is he got a lot of out of them ... and we don't need to look beyond 51 wins for evidence of that. Feel free to review the pre-season predictions for the season from non-homers like me.


They matched the Vegas win total post Mitchell trade.

The entire point of a coach is for the team to improve and develop each year. Otherwise what is he there for?

This team didn’t change at all from last season and I guarantee they won’t next year with JB either. The only difference will be that we will waste a whole year before the org stops being stubborn and fires him


51 wins, 4th seed playoffs, 8th best offense, 1st ranked defense ... that's what many would consider improvement; but lots of people need to improve and learn including our head coach.
8th best offense was nowhere to be found in the playoffs, when it counts...
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#764 » by jbk1234 » Fri Apr 28, 2023 10:08 pm

jasonxxx102 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
But that’s not how it works unless you’ve got a team full of vet super stars.

The coach has to create a system that maximizes the talent they have an JB clearly did not do that. I’m not saying it’s all his fault but a significant part of it is.


He got a lot out of this collection of players, it's presumptive to believe that somebody could have gotten more given the limitations of the roster. Every coach makes mistakes, heck Ty Lue was still letting Mike Longabardi run his defense right up until game 3 in the 2016 finals.

But if the players feel they were misused, they will get him fired. Not what I'm hearing so far ...


Did he?

Donovan Mitchell had a great regular season but we knew what he was.

Was Garland that much better? Mobley? Allen? None of those guys were any better this year.

Mobley was better during the 2nd half of the season but it had absolutely nothing to do with JB. He was just being more aggressive.

Garland was exactly the same. Jarrett Allen was worse this year. Okoro, exactly the same. Cedi, the same.

Who got better this year? JB got the exact same amount out of the team this year as he did last year there was no development


I think Garland is better and I think a player like Garland being asked to share a back court with Mitchell and maintain the same production is tough.
cbosh4mvp wrote:
Jarret Allen isn’t winning you anything. Garland won’t show up in the playoffs. Mobley is a glorified dunk man. Mitchell has some experience but is a liability on defense. To me, the Cavs are a treadmill team.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#765 » by jasonxxx102 » Fri Apr 28, 2023 10:59 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
He got a lot out of this collection of players, it's presumptive to believe that somebody could have gotten more given the limitations of the roster. Every coach makes mistakes, heck Ty Lue was still letting Mike Longabardi run his defense right up until game 3 in the 2016 finals.

But if the players feel they were misused, they will get him fired. Not what I'm hearing so far ...


Did he?

Donovan Mitchell had a great regular season but we knew what he was.

Was Garland that much better? Mobley? Allen? None of those guys were any better this year.

Mobley was better during the 2nd half of the season but it had absolutely nothing to do with JB. He was just being more aggressive.

Garland was exactly the same. Jarrett Allen was worse this year. Okoro, exactly the same. Cedi, the same.

Who got better this year? JB got the exact same amount out of the team this year as he did last year there was no development


I think Garland is better and I think a player like Garland being asked to share a back court with Mitchell and maintain the same production is tough.


I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt having to integrate with a ball dominator. I am disappointed that his assist rate rate down more than his usage but again, I blame that on scheme not him.

You’ve got a score first guard in Mitchell why did Garlands assist rate not go up? Makes no sense to me. It’s like there was no plan other than “my turn your turn” with 2 talented guards rather than actually figuring out how to play them off each other
76ciology wrote:Wouldn't Edey have a better chance of winning the scoring battle against Tatum in the post after a switch than Tatum shooting over Edey's 9'6" standing reach?
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#766 » by jasonxxx102 » Fri Apr 28, 2023 11:08 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
You're asking a different question: did he make them better, did he help them improve, etc.

What I said is he got a lot of out of them ... and we don't need to look beyond 51 wins for evidence of that. Feel free to review the pre-season predictions for the season from non-homers like me.


They matched the Vegas win total post Mitchell trade.

The entire point of a coach is for the team to improve and develop each year. Otherwise what is he there for?

This team didn’t change at all from last season and I guarantee they won’t next year with JB either. The only difference will be that we will waste a whole year before the org stops being stubborn and fires him


51 wins, 4th seed playoffs, 8th best offense, 1st ranked defense ... that's what many would consider improvement; but lots of people need to improve and learn including our head coach.


I don’t care about the regular season. I’m not willing to accept “good enough”. We didn’t mortgage our entire future to be a perennial 4-5 and get bounced.

2 years in a row we got absolutely stomped when it mattered
76ciology wrote:Wouldn't Edey have a better chance of winning the scoring battle against Tatum in the post after a switch than Tatum shooting over Edey's 9'6" standing reach?
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#767 » by jbk1234 » Sat Apr 29, 2023 12:05 pm

jasonxxx102 wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
Did he?

Donovan Mitchell had a great regular season but we knew what he was.

Was Garland that much better? Mobley? Allen? None of those guys were any better this year.

Mobley was better during the 2nd half of the season but it had absolutely nothing to do with JB. He was just being more aggressive.

Garland was exactly the same. Jarrett Allen was worse this year. Okoro, exactly the same. Cedi, the same.

Who got better this year? JB got the exact same amount out of the team this year as he did last year there was no development


I think Garland is better and I think a player like Garland being asked to share a back court with Mitchell and maintain the same production is tough.


I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt having to integrate with a ball dominator. I am disappointed that his assist rate rate down more than his usage but again, I blame that on scheme not him.

You’ve got a score first guard in Mitchell why did Garlands assist rate not go up? Makes no sense to me. It’s like there was no plan other than “my turn your turn” with 2 talented guards rather than actually figuring out how to play them off each other


Almost all of Mitchell's points are unassisted because he almost always prefers to dribble into his shot.
cbosh4mvp wrote:
Jarret Allen isn’t winning you anything. Garland won’t show up in the playoffs. Mobley is a glorified dunk man. Mitchell has some experience but is a liability on defense. To me, the Cavs are a treadmill team.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#768 » by JonFromVA » Sun Apr 30, 2023 3:22 am

JujitsuFlip wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
They matched the Vegas win total post Mitchell trade.

The entire point of a coach is for the team to improve and develop each year. Otherwise what is he there for?

This team didn’t change at all from last season and I guarantee they won’t next year with JB either. The only difference will be that we will waste a whole year before the org stops being stubborn and fires him


51 wins, 4th seed playoffs, 8th best offense, 1st ranked defense ... that's what many would consider improvement; but lots of people need to improve and learn including our head coach.
8th best offense was nowhere to be found in the playoffs, when it counts...


Apples to apples ... this was the teams first playoff series, so it's the baseline for future comparison. That's why if the Cavs don't do better next year, JBB's job is more likely to be on the line.

But rationally and fairly it still depends on Koby giving him a complete team which he may not be able to pull off in this off- season.

Mitchell had some amazing floor spacers and still disappointed in that series .vs. the Mavs. Of course he was also dealing with a hamstring injury. The team is fully aware of what the players are dealing with, whereas most fans are either oblivious or unforgiving.

Thats one benefit of depth ... Thibs could afford to bench Randle or even lose him altogether because he had bench depth
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#769 » by jbk1234 » Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:15 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
JujitsuFlip wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
51 wins, 4th seed playoffs, 8th best offense, 1st ranked defense ... that's what many would consider improvement; but lots of people need to improve and learn including our head coach.
8th best offense was nowhere to be found in the playoffs, when it counts...


Apples to apples ... this was the teams first playoff series, so it's the baseline for future comparison. That's why if the Cavs don't do better next year, JBB's job is more likely to be on the line.

But rationally and fairly it still depends on Koby giving him a complete team which he may not be able to pull off in this off- season.

Mitchell had some amazing floor spacers and still disappointed in that series .vs. the Mavs. Of course he was also dealing with a hamstring injury. The team is fully aware of what the players are dealing with, whereas most fans are either oblivious or unforgiving.

Thats one benefit of depth ... Thibs could afford to bench Randle or even lose him altogether because he had bench depth


I don't know by what metrics we're arriving at the conclusion we had the 8th best regular season offense, but we had the second lowest PPG average of any playoff team other than the Heat (who only had Love for 20 or so games). Given the fact that you win or lose based on your ability to outscore opposing teams in games, that seems like a pretty important metric.

Also, it's not like our offensive shortcomings only manifested in the playoffs. Our record against teams with a record over .500 was meh. We lost series to good defensive teams and had to play our starters heavy minutes against bad ones. We ran a simple Simon high PNR offense that got stymied against good defensive teams.

I hope the private conversations going on with JBB and Altman are very different than the public face they're putting out there. Burning through another season of team control on Mitchell only to get bounced in the first round again would be a disaster.
cbosh4mvp wrote:
Jarret Allen isn’t winning you anything. Garland won’t show up in the playoffs. Mobley is a glorified dunk man. Mitchell has some experience but is a liability on defense. To me, the Cavs are a treadmill team.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#770 » by JujitsuFlip » Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:43 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
JujitsuFlip wrote:8th best offense was nowhere to be found in the playoffs, when it counts...


Apples to apples ... this was the teams first playoff series, so it's the baseline for future comparison. That's why if the Cavs don't do better next year, JBB's job is more likely to be on the line.

But rationally and fairly it still depends on Koby giving him a complete team which he may not be able to pull off in this off- season.

Mitchell had some amazing floor spacers and still disappointed in that series .vs. the Mavs. Of course he was also dealing with a hamstring injury. The team is fully aware of what the players are dealing with, whereas most fans are either oblivious or unforgiving.

Thats one benefit of depth ... Thibs could afford to bench Randle or even lose him altogether because he had bench depth


I don't know by what metrics we're arriving at the conclusion we had the 8th best regular season offense, but we had the second lowest PPG average of any playoff team other than the Heat (who only had Love for 20 or so games). Given the fact that you win or lose based on your ability to outscore opposing teams in games, that seems like a pretty important metric.

Also, it's not like our offensive shortcomings only manifested in the playoffs. Our record against teams with a record over .500 was meh. We lost series to good defensive teams and had to play our starters heavy minutes against bad ones. We ran a simple Simon high PNR offense that got stymied against good defensive teams.

I hope the private conversations going on with JBB and Altman are very different than the public face they're putting out there. Burning through another season of team control on Mitchell only to get bounced in the first round again would be a disaster.

Cavs had the 8th best offensive rating in the regular season of the 30 teams at 115.5. However, in the playoffs they had the worst offensive rating of all 16 teams at 101.9, it was anemic.

The formula for teams is: (Players Points*Total FG%) + Opponents Differential= 1/5 of possessions - Times Fouled + FTM* FT% * OAPOW (Official Adjusted Players Offensive Withstand). The article says that this stat can't be influenced by the defense of a player's teammates.

I agree the offense was very rudimentary, why it was so easy to defend.

To your last paragraph, that was always my issue with the trade. It immediately put the Cavs on a 3 year clock to win now. This season was a bust so now that time constraint is even tighter at a 2 year window with Lloyd stating Mitchell just wants to be on one of the NY teams. I agree, going down this path for another year if it doesn't result in at least an ECF berth it will be a failure too. At that point ya gotta fire JB but it will probably be too late since it will be Mitchell's final season in the Cavs. Followed by us giving the next 5 first rounders to the Jazz.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#771 » by jbk1234 » Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:54 pm

JujitsuFlip wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
Apples to apples ... this was the teams first playoff series, so it's the baseline for future comparison. That's why if the Cavs don't do better next year, JBB's job is more likely to be on the line.

But rationally and fairly it still depends on Koby giving him a complete team which he may not be able to pull off in this off- season.

Mitchell had some amazing floor spacers and still disappointed in that series .vs. the Mavs. Of course he was also dealing with a hamstring injury. The team is fully aware of what the players are dealing with, whereas most fans are either oblivious or unforgiving.

Thats one benefit of depth ... Thibs could afford to bench Randle or even lose him altogether because he had bench depth


I don't know by what metrics we're arriving at the conclusion we had the 8th best regular season offense, but we had the second lowest PPG average of any playoff team other than the Heat (who only had Love for 20 or so games). Given the fact that you win or lose based on your ability to outscore opposing teams in games, that seems like a pretty important metric.

Also, it's not like our offensive shortcomings only manifested in the playoffs. Our record against teams with a record over .500 was meh. We lost series to good defensive teams and had to play our starters heavy minutes against bad ones. We ran a simple Simon high PNR offense that got stymied against good defensive teams.

I hope the private conversations going on with JBB and Altman are very different than the public face they're putting out there. Burning through another season of team control on Mitchell only to get bounced in the first round again would be a disaster.

Cavs had the 8th best offensive rating in the regular season of the 30 teams at 115.5. However, in the playoffs they had the worst offensive rating of all 16 teams at 101.9, it was anemic.

The formula for teams is: (Players Points*Total FG%) + Opponents Differential= 1/5 of possessions - Times Fouled + FTM* FT% * OAPOW (Official Adjusted Players Offensive Withstand). The article says that this stat can't be influenced by the defense of a player's teammates.

I agree the offense was very rudimentary, why it was so easy to defend.

To your last paragraph, that was always my issue with the trade. It immediately put the Cavs on a 3 year clock to win now. This season was a bust so now that time constraint is even tighter at a 2 year window with Lloyd stating Mitchell just wants to be on one of the NY teams. I agree, going down this path for another year if it doesn't result in at least an ECF berth it will be a failure too. At that point ya gotta fire JB but it will probably be too late since it will be Mitchell's final season in the Cavs. Followed by us giving the next 5 first rounders to the Jazz.


The problem is that the Cavs were underperforming the predictive metric by more than 3 points already and team scoring almost always drops in the playoffs. It's like when there's a significant delta between a player's BPM and +/- or on/off over a large sample size. The BPM matters far less.
cbosh4mvp wrote:
Jarret Allen isn’t winning you anything. Garland won’t show up in the playoffs. Mobley is a glorified dunk man. Mitchell has some experience but is a liability on defense. To me, the Cavs are a treadmill team.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#772 » by jbk1234 » Sun Apr 30, 2023 6:38 pm

K. Love currently putting on a clinic in all the ways he could've helped us beat the Knicks.
cbosh4mvp wrote:
Jarret Allen isn’t winning you anything. Garland won’t show up in the playoffs. Mobley is a glorified dunk man. Mitchell has some experience but is a liability on defense. To me, the Cavs are a treadmill team.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#773 » by JujitsuFlip » Sun Apr 30, 2023 6:41 pm

jbk1234 wrote:K. Love currently putting on a clinic in all the ways he could've helped us beat the Knicks.
I was thinking that, great defensive rebounding, phenomenal outlet passes for easy buckets, and hitting some open 3s.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#774 » by jbk1234 » Sun Apr 30, 2023 6:44 pm

JujitsuFlip wrote:
jbk1234 wrote:K. Love currently putting on a clinic in all the ways he could've helped us beat the Knicks.
I was thinking that, great defensive rebounding, phenomenal outlet passes for easy buckets, and hitting some open 3s.


It helps that the Knicks are missing a bunch of shots, because the rebounding and outlet passes go away if they convert.
cbosh4mvp wrote:
Jarret Allen isn’t winning you anything. Garland won’t show up in the playoffs. Mobley is a glorified dunk man. Mitchell has some experience but is a liability on defense. To me, the Cavs are a treadmill team.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#775 » by JonFromVA » Sun Apr 30, 2023 6:52 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
JujitsuFlip wrote:8th best offense was nowhere to be found in the playoffs, when it counts...


Apples to apples ... this was the teams first playoff series, so it's the baseline for future comparison. That's why if the Cavs don't do better next year, JBB's job is more likely to be on the line.

But rationally and fairly it still depends on Koby giving him a complete team which he may not be able to pull off in this off- season.

Mitchell had some amazing floor spacers and still disappointed in that series .vs. the Mavs. Of course he was also dealing with a hamstring injury. The team is fully aware of what the players are dealing with, whereas most fans are either oblivious or unforgiving.

Thats one benefit of depth ... Thibs could afford to bench Randle or even lose him altogether because he had bench depth


I don't know by what metrics we're arriving at the conclusion we had the 8th best regular season offense, but we had the second lowest PPG average of any playoff team other than the Heat (who only had Love for 20 or so games). Given the fact that you win or lose based on your ability to outscore opposing teams in games, that seems like a pretty important metric.

Also, it's not like our offensive shortcomings only manifested in the playoffs. Our record against teams with a record over .500 was meh. We lost series to good defensive teams and had to play our starters heavy minutes against bad ones. We ran a simple Simon high PNR offense that got stymied against good defensive teams.

I hope the private conversations going on with JBB and Altman are very different than the public face they're putting out there. Burning through another season of team control on Mitchell only to get bounced in the first round again would be a disaster.


The generally accepted metrics for team performance are offensive rating, defensive rating, and net rating. There's certainly an art to turning a very good regular season performance in to a very good post-season performance, not sure who presumes that's something that just happens.

Sure, all of our problems we've seen at times in the regular season, but that goes for every other team too. Still, we we averaged 9.7 offensive rebounds per game .and our opponents averaged 9.8 which is a very minor difference, suggesting our struggles specifically against the Knicks in that area was matchup related and/or perhaps effort related. Given the Knicks outrebounded on the offensive boards pretty handily in the regular season, it just seems to a matchup issue.

Likely the same issue we've seen against other teams when our young/light bigs are matched up against older/stronger bigs.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#776 » by JonFromVA » Sun Apr 30, 2023 7:00 pm

jasonxxx102 wrote:
JonFromVA wrote:
jasonxxx102 wrote:
They matched the Vegas win total post Mitchell trade.

The entire point of a coach is for the team to improve and develop each year. Otherwise what is he there for?

This team didn’t change at all from last season and I guarantee they won’t next year with JB either. The only difference will be that we will waste a whole year before the org stops being stubborn and fires him


51 wins, 4th seed playoffs, 8th best offense, 1st ranked defense ... that's what many would consider improvement; but lots of people need to improve and learn including our head coach.


I don’t care about the regular season. I’m not willing to accept “good enough”. We didn’t mortgage our entire future to be a perennial 4-5 and get bounced.

2 years in a row we got absolutely stomped when it mattered


I'm not trying to tell you what to think, I'm trying to tell you how our organization is looking at this and that should help inform you what sort of decisions they're going to make. You don't have to like it. 8-)

btw, back on the subject of pre-season predictions, I'm not sure who you found that had us at 51-wins, but according to this article:

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/34795174/nba-season-preview-2022-23-contenders-stars-big-questions#cle

ESPN Forecast: 45-37

FiveThirtyEight: 44-38

Caesars: 47.5 wins | Title odds: +3000
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#777 » by jbk1234 » Sun Apr 30, 2023 7:47 pm

Of course the Knicks just went 7 of 34 from 3 in Game 1 against the Heat. Of course.
cbosh4mvp wrote:
Jarret Allen isn’t winning you anything. Garland won’t show up in the playoffs. Mobley is a glorified dunk man. Mitchell has some experience but is a liability on defense. To me, the Cavs are a treadmill team.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#778 » by JujitsuFlip » Sun Apr 30, 2023 8:24 pm

jbk1234 wrote:Of course the Knicks just went 7 of 34 from 3 in Game 1 against the Heat. Of course.
They went 8 of 29 in game 1, 7 of 29 game 2, 10 of 33 game 3, 8 of 29 game 4, and 9 of 29 game 5 against us. So not like they ever shot it well against us either.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#779 » by JujitsuFlip » Sun Apr 30, 2023 9:41 pm

Man, if Mobley could play like Sabonias in offense, we could trade Allen. Mobley needs to bulk up and work on his ball handling. Would have to be tougher on defense as a whole too.
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Re: Around the NBA 

Post#780 » by afarmenian » Sun Apr 30, 2023 9:54 pm

JujitsuFlip wrote:Man, if Mobley could play like Sabonias in offense, we could trade Allen. Mobley needs to bulk up and work on his ball handling. Would have to be tougher on defense as a whole too.




Its funny i was literally about to comment on how the Warriors are defending Sabonis. He looks like a liability out there and is infinitely more skilled than Allen and he is playing next to 4 shooters at all times. The Allen Mobley pairing has to go, the cavs will be handicapped on offense until it does.

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