2022-23 Season Discussion and Review - the Blockbuster trade and playoff downfall

[Slim Charless]

Wow.

Are those numbers right? Shame is the worst shooting player in the league. That doesn't even seem possible. Good Lord, Monty lol.

I don't even know what to say. I'm speechless. I am without speech.

[Djedefre]

Who would've thought Ayton will be disinterested and demonstrating idgaf attitude after heated altercation with the coach, complete lack of communication for months during the offseason, unwillingness to offer desired max and then dragging things even further in RFA with all that matching circus. And after all of that, you trade Mikal and Cam and keep the guy you basically already told in a million ways you do not appreciate or even want to be around. Bunch of imbeciles running this franchise.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Who would've thought Ayton will be disinterested and demonstrating idgaf attitude after heated altercation with the coach, complete lack of communication for months during the offseason, unwillingness to offer desired max and then dragging things even further in RFA with all that matching circus. And after all of that, you trade Mikal and Cam and keep the guy you basically already told in a million ways you do not appreciate or even want to be around. Bunch of imbeciles running this franchise.

'If' has ran hot and cold his whole career even back to college. I call him IF because with his supporters it's always some 'if' that's going to unlock him. I'm done with the ifs, I don't give a give a **** if he hates everyone in Phoenix I'd hope he have a little more personal pride play with for fire, it's the god damn playoffs.



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[Revived]

Read on Twitter

I wouldn’t take Wiseman over Ayton no but everything KG says here about Ayton is basically what most of us say about Ayton.

[Ghost of Kleine]

I see and understand both perspectives equitably in regards to Ayton. He really showed out for us from the jump after being drafted here. And we obviously wouldn't have beat the Clippers to make it the finals Nor would we have swept Denver in the "Suns in 4" series either without his defense/ impact on Jokic in that series. So it's debatable that he entirely earned the max he wanted back then. But we had a notoriously cheap and ignorant owner ( Saver) and an arrogant horrible talent evaluator (Jones) back then that dropped the ball big time and alienated Ayton from that point.

But with respect to the other contrasting perspectives, He really didn't help himself or us either by not working harder to develop and advance more aspects of his game. He also hasn't silenced all the naysayers with his hot/ cold motor or frequent passive play when we all know how easily he could dominate (no pun intended) the game with his absurd athletic gifts and mobility/ versatility. Ayton is a top 5 center talent that has lost his interest or passion for the game from letting all the past front office slights and constant media criticism get to him and create apathy in his role here. He absolutely needs a fresh start in a new environment, And the suns need a fresh start in a different direction. IF his next team actually and genuinely shows appreciation for him and features him prominently, I'll fully expect him to show major strides in his game and impact again. But here in Phoenix we've simply burned those bridges repeatedly since 2021. It's unfortunate, but you have to (as a franchise) keep moving forward and seeking to improve whenever possible.

[kennydorglas]

Read on Twitter

I wouldn’t take Wiseman over Ayton no but everything KG says here about Ayton is basically what most of us say about Ayton.

thats why I was shocked when GSW took him.
Imagine if they had lamelo on this **** team lol

[kennydorglas]

Wow.

Are those numbers right? Shame is the worst shooting player in the league. That doesn't even seem possible. Good Lord, Monty lol.

I don't even know what to say. I'm speechless. I am without speech.

He had a 70 ORtg in the clippers series lol
meaning we score 70 in the whole game with him in the court ahahah
its so bad I had no words when I actually saw that.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Wow.

Are those numbers right? Shame is the worst shooting player in the league. That doesn't even seem possible. Good Lord, Monty lol.

I don't even know what to say. I'm speechless. I am without speech.

It's like I've been saying ad nauseum for two seasons now about Shamet. Monty's biggest weakness is his security blanket players that he's kept on this roster for too long offering no impact or production whilst eating up significant cap space for multiple seasons. Players like Shamet and Saric and Payne too at times. All represented a cumulative of 26-27 million tied up cap since Paul arrived and none of them (maybe Payne RARELY)!!! played to their contract values. When it mattered most in the postseason, they were all pretty inconsistent and unreliable throughout the playoffs. But Shamet was/ is the worst representation of what we needed in his role, and cost us multiple assets and cap space opportunities. This is why I had him in trades for expirings like Sato two seasons ago. But so many here were promoting keeping him for continuity or some other comedic reasons.

Plain and simple, I'll say it again! Shamet is our 2nd coming of the Tyler Johnson or the poor shooting guard version of our Ryan Anderson experience. useless player occupying important roster spot on significant salary.

[Revived]

This isn't a question because of game 1.
I want to know how people feel about a couple of things.

1. Would a center like Jarret Allen or Mitch Robinson work better with our team? I feel like these might be potentially obtainable type players in the summer in a trade for Ayton. Maybe not a 1 for 1 team trade. Perhaps multi-team.
2. Would a trade of Poetl for Ayton make sense? I'm not sure what he offers that DA doesn't but perhaps a better fit?

The key things would be that they are cheaper and reduce our tax hit going forward, meaning we can better avoid the 2nd tax apron.

Doesn’t even have to be Allen or Robinson, guys like Looney, Paul Reed, Robert Williams would all work well with what Suns are looking from the C position. Which is consistency, effort, and defense.

All those guys cost like 1/4th of Ayton’s salary or around there.

[AtheJ415]

The effort was at least at better, but that is why you have to play with effort both games, so that you can steal one. We punted game 1, and KD playing like Landry Shamet 2.0 cost us this one.

This team is broken. We have limited assets to improve and are anchored by an aging point guard on the decline and a terrible playoff coach who has no ability to adjust on the fly and gives into every opponent's strategy.

Book deserves better. He won't win one here.

[AtheJ415]

This isn't a question because of game 1.
I want to know how people feel about a couple of things.

1. Would a center like Jarret Allen or Mitch Robinson work better with our team? I feel like these might be potentially obtainable type players in the summer in a trade for Ayton. Maybe not a 1 for 1 team trade. Perhaps multi-team.
2. Would a trade of Poetl for Ayton make sense? I'm not sure what he offers that DA doesn't but perhaps a better fit?

The key things would be that they are cheaper and reduce our tax hit going forward, meaning we can better avoid the 2nd tax apron.

Doesn’t even have to be Allen or Robinson, guys like Looney, Paul Reed, Robert Williams would all work well with what Suns are looking from the C position. Which is consistency, effort, and defense.

All those guys cost like 1/4th of Ayton’s salary or around there.

I don't understand how anybody watches this specific game and thinks Ayton is the problem. We got rebounds today. Jokic dominates basically everybody. Our issue today was a complete inability for anybody to score other than Booker, including the dude eating up 40% of our salary cap that we traded an all-star level young player on a bargain contract and half a decade of draft picks for.

Oh, and our coach remains completely flabbergasted by basically any adjustment the opposition makes.

[Revived]

This isn't a question because of game 1.
I want to know how people feel about a couple of things.

1. Would a center like Jarret Allen or Mitch Robinson work better with our team? I feel like these might be potentially obtainable type players in the summer in a trade for Ayton. Maybe not a 1 for 1 team trade. Perhaps multi-team.
2. Would a trade of Poetl for Ayton make sense? I'm not sure what he offers that DA doesn't but perhaps a better fit?

The key things would be that they are cheaper and reduce our tax hit going forward, meaning we can better avoid the 2nd tax apron.

Doesn’t even have to be Allen or Robinson, guys like Looney, Paul Reed, Robert Williams would all work well with what Suns are looking from the C position. Which is consistency, effort, and defense.

All those guys cost like 1/4th of Ayton’s salary or around there.

I don't understand how anybody watches this specific game and thinks Ayton is the problem.

Are you trolling? I’m not in the mood to deal with trolling right now, maybe tomorrow. Because I clearly made my post before this game.

I said it only a million times in the game thread how well Ayton played today. But I’m also not an idiot so I know completely well that Ayton is gonna follow up that high energy game with a crap, zero energy game in the next one.

Ayton’s one of the easiest players to predict and if you play daily fantasy sports, it’s very fun to actually him to make $$. Because his inconsistency is consistent and extremely predictable.

[Revived]

Speaking of Ayton, found this on Reddit and it’s 100% accurate lol. They call it the “The Ayton Cycle”.

[spanishninja]

as a fan of 30+ years, I think I have to accept that we will never have a championship, or at least, I won't be alive when we eventually get one. every year it's a mix of bad luck, lack of effort, and poor management. the only thing that even changes the pattern is the occasional scandal.

[BobbieL]

as a fan of 30+ years, I think I have to accept that we will never have a championship, or at least, I won't be alive when we eventually get one. every year it's a mix of bad luck, lack of effort, and poor management. the only thing that even changes the pattern is the occasional scandal.

Suns had a very good thing going
this season was a train wreck from the stupid Durant talks in the summer to Jae to injuries to the actual dumb durant trade

I actually liked watching the team play and they were just getting healthy. They had expirings and could have really upgraded the bench.

[spanishninja]

as a fan of 30+ years, I think I have to accept that we will never have a championship, or at least, I won't be alive when we eventually get one. every year it's a mix of bad luck, lack of effort, and poor management. the only thing that even changes the pattern is the occasional scandal.

Suns had a very good thing going
this season was a train wreck from the stupid Durant talks in the summer to Jae to injuries to the actual dumb durant trade

I actually liked watching the team play and they were just getting healthy. They had expirings and could have really upgraded the bench.

the team as it is now is definitely not as fun to watch even when fully healthy, because it's more predictable. Booker and KD going for 35+ and...what else? Book is definitely fun to watch most of the time, but KD? I keep waiting to see when he will finally "turn it on" and i don't think we see it this season.

and regarding the bench, the frustrating thing is they seemed capable of contributing late in the season. hate to see even more changes to the lineup as it doesnt' look like the full roster got a chance to really show what it could do, but hopefully next season we have a full season to develop with KD.

[Biff]

Who would have thought that playing a 35-year-old post achilles tear KD 43mpg would be a bad idea?

I'm glad we turned our defense around and I didn't really expect that but it's clear the big minutes are running our main guys ragged. There's no way we make a deep run as currently constructed. We need some role players capable of making shots.

[kennydorglas]

Read on Twitter

?s=20

not really surprising but wow

[spanishninja]

Read on Twitter

?s=20

not really surprising but wow

yeah it's not even like a "would love to see him back but if he gets a better offer, he should go get it". they just flat out told him he's done lol.

[enigmatics]

I see and understand both perspectives equitably in regards to Ayton. He really showed out for us from the jump after being drafted here. And we obviously wouldn't have beat the Clippers to make it the finals Nor would we have swept Denver in the "Suns in 4" series either without his defense/ impact on Jokic in that series. So it's debatable that he entirely earned the max he wanted back then. But we had a notoriously cheap and ignorant owner ( Saver) and an arrogant horrible talent evaluator (Jones) back then that dropped the ball big time and alienated Ayton from that point.

But with respect to the other contrasting perspectives, He really didn't help himself or us either by not working harder to develop and advance more aspects of his game. He also hasn't silenced all the naysayers with his hot/ cold motor or frequent passive play when we all know how easily he could dominate (no pun intended) the game with his absurd athletic gifts and mobility/ versatility. Ayton is a top 5 center talent that has lost his interest or passion for the game from letting all the past front office slights and constant media criticism get to him and create apathy in his role here. He absolutely needs a fresh start in a new environment, And the suns need a fresh start in a different direction. IF his next team actually and genuinely shows appreciation for him and features him prominently, I'll fully expect him to show major strides in his game and impact again. But here in Phoenix we've simply burned those bridges repeatedly since 2021. It's unfortunate, but you have to (as a franchise) keep moving forward and seeking to improve whenever possible.

One more layer to the onion is that he's been saddled with Mark Bryant as his big man coach his entire tenure here with this Suns.

No offense to Bryant who was a hard worker for the Portland Trailblazers, but that's all he was. He's not THE GUY to get the most out of a DeAndre Ayton who clearly doesn't love basketball the way the Suns need him to and I'm surprised they have not looked to upgrade that coaching position. I mean just look at Deandre's arsenal - it's basically stagnant and he's become way too dependent on mid range jump shots around the 18 ft area.