poll: Austin Reaves and/or Fred VanVleet

[drsd]

The two threads on Austin Reaves and Fred VanVleet keep chugging along - led to this question.


My thoughts:

1 - Fred VanVleet only means this starting five: VanVleet/Fultz/F-Wagner/Banchero/Carter. This is the Portland 2.0 experiment. It didn't work with CJ McCollum and Damian Lillard. And frankly Fultz and VanVleet are nowhere near the quality level of McCollum and Lillard.
Signing VanVleet, for me, means the Magic must unload Suggs and Fultz. Let me get back to this - on point 3.

2 - Austin Reaves only means this starting five: Fultz/Reaves/F-Wagner/Banchero/Carter. I love me a traditional starting five. And this is five "normal" players playing "normal" NBA roles. This is a playoff team to me. Is it an eventual Championship contender? That's a tough call.

3 - Both means this starting five: VanVleet/Reaves/F-Wagner/Banchero/Carter. I love, love, love that roster. That is a potential Championship contender. Coming back to point-1, Fultz and Suggs both would need to be shipped off. Fultz as he is redundant and Suggs because he would be overly expensive relative to a 20 mpg backup. (Orlando's team is getting ready the at lux-tax levels in a year or two).

4 - Neither means G-Harris got resigned. This leads to all players presumably being resigned. This makes sense only if one believes that 4 starters will individually improve (Fultz shooting; F-Wagner incremental improvements; Banchero shooting and less TOs; Carter increased rebounding), AND G-Harris stays healthy all season, AND the bench all gets better individually, AND the team learns to continue to play closer and tighter. That's a lot of "ANDs". (If this gets a single vote, I am not sure what I think of that).


p.s. For me this discussion is a proxy for "should Orlando upgrade the PG and/or the SG slot" (or run combo guards). One could replace the names "VanVleet" and "Reaves", and the outcomes and progressions are the same, in my opinion.

[MoMM]

I would wait and use the cap space + our assets to bring a real star before the trade deadline.

We also have 2 lottery picks who will need playing time until then and they could change our needs (PG, SG, combo guard or whatever). It's time to consolidate our assets into a tier higher, not add more of the same (or kind of).

[basketballRob]

Reaves would probably fit better, but the Lakers will match.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app

[Petre1978]

Useless thread.
All just speculation.
Only Jeff and John knows.

[Skybox]

First of all, it’s completely clear that FVV would not be getting $30m to play the CJ “undersized spot up SG” role, so the whole poll is misleading. He would come in as QB1, pushing Fultz out of that spot…just because FVV has successfully played next to Lowry in the past doesn’t make it an ideal pairing. SG’s who can shoot are a lot easier to find than a savvy lead PG.

[Last Guardian]

If I had to choose between this terrible selection I would go with Reaves. At least he has some size and doesn’t have attitude problems.

[RichCollab]

First of all, it’s completely clear that FVV would not be getting $30m to play the CJ “undersized spot up SG” role, so the whole poll is misleading. He would come in as QB1, pushing Fultz out of that spot…just because FVV has successfully played next to Lowry in the past doesn’t make it an ideal pairing. SG’s who can shoot are a lot easier to find than a savvy lead PG.

FVV would take Gary Harris spot. This coach and FO aren’t taking away the starting PG role at the start of the year. I predict even Scoot won’t start the season as starting PG if drafted.

FVV could take over the starting PG as the season progresses and Suggs or someone else take the starting SG spot.

[MasterGMer]

Austin Reaves could fit perfectly here. He has ball handling skills plus he is a good 3pt shooter. He can move without the ball and he showed that he has skills to play with the ball. He seems to have a high basketball IQ also.

If he wants to come to Magic, we can possibly offer him around 25M per year and save the rest for another rotational player

[Skybox]

First of all, it’s completely clear that FVV would not be getting $30m to play the CJ “undersized spot up SG” role, so the whole poll is misleading. He would come in as QB1, pushing Fultz out of that spot…just because FVV has successfully played next to Lowry in the past doesn’t make it an ideal pairing. SG’s who can shoot are a lot easier to find than a savvy lead PG.

FVV would take Gary Harris spot. This coach and FO aren’t taking away the starting PG role at the start of the year. I predict even Scoot won’t start the season as starting PG if drafted.

FVV could take over the starting PG as the season progresses and Suggs or someone else take the starting SG spot.

Just...No

rookie Scoot-perhaps, he would take over quickly or show he's not ready and then Fultz is moved at TD or simply expires. If we luck into Scoot, I'd quickly try to attach Fultz (largely as an expiring or even as a waivable partially guaranteed guy) with something and try for a big upgrade at SG (Simons?) or even just a future pick and call it an amazing summer. Just grabbing Scoot and Hawkins with our picks would be an amazing summer, we could then fill in with vet depth guys like DDV, maybe Naz Reid.

FVV is not going to slowly creep in and get to know the guys and play some video games and...NO. He's a veteran pro and he'd only be here to take the lead. If you're worried about on-court chemistry, that's what camp is for. Sounds more like you're worried about Fultz's feelings, which there is way too much of here. This isn't the YMCA 8 year old league, this is a multi-billion dollar, best in the world situation. Nobody in the NBA would pay FVV the salary he's earned to play off guard, particularly if said team didn't have a top PG (or even a top 20 PG). If FVV comes in (especially considering Fultz's contract status), it's the end of Fultz.

If the FO decides Fultz is the guy, we don't bring in FVV...I could live with that and hope they're right about Fultz...but the two side by side would be a ridiculous investment and the idea of transitioning gently makes no sense at all.

[MasterGMer]

Absolutely no to FVV. He costs way more than Austin Reaves. Plus he is not just a rotational player, he is D starting PG. Austin Reaves plays off guard and he can be a rotational player if needed. He is more versatile with the ball and he has that ball handling skill. FVV seems too one dimensional plus he doesn't have the size

[drsd]

First of all, it’s completely clear that FVV would not be getting $30m to play the CJ “undersized spot up SG” role, so the whole poll is misleading. He would come in as QB1, pushing Fultz out of that spot…just because FVV has successfully played next to Lowry in the past doesn’t make it an ideal pairing. SG’s who can shoot are a lot easier to find than a savvy lead PG.

If Fultz is in Magic blue, he will be starting. This thus squarely leads to a lot of confusion as to why VanVleet would be brought in. At least confusing to me. But that's been discussed in depth in the VanVleet thread.

..

[AaronB]

First of all, it’s completely clear that FVV would not be getting $30m to play the CJ “undersized spot up SG” role, so the whole poll is misleading. He would come in as QB1, pushing Fultz out of that spot…just because FVV has successfully played next to Lowry in the past doesn’t make it an ideal pairing. SG’s who can shoot are a lot easier to find than a savvy lead PG.

I keep trying to figure out who you keep referring to when you write about "FVV"?

The only FVV that I know played for the Raptors last season and he is not a good shooter and is a ball hog (the exact opposite of a "savvy lead PG").

Not to mention that he is commonly referred to as Freddie Toast (other times Freddie Ball Hog) as he gets burnt so bad on defense.

Yeh, that is the guy I want to bring in to lead this team.

And before moving on to his "championship pedigree", that team was made up of Snow White and the 7 dwarves and Freddie Ball Hog was Grumpy. Not sure bringing in Grumpy dwarf to a young Magic team is a great fit.

[KillMonger]

neither.....FVV is a better player than reeves but whats the price tag on that....reeves is fine i guess but paying someone like reeves 20+ million for what exactly? for him to be maybe a 3rd option standing in the corner? nah...pass on both

[tiderulz]

Absolutely no to FVV. He costs way more than Austin Reaves. Plus he is not just a rotational player, he is D starting PG. Austin Reaves plays off guard and he can be a rotational player if needed. He is more versatile with the ball and he has that ball handling skill. FVV seems too one dimensional plus he doesn't have the size

a little strange point of view. FVV has played both PG and SG and has produced for years. And he is a very solid defender, so not sure what you mean by one dimensional.

[tiderulz]

First of all, it’s completely clear that FVV would not be getting $30m to play the CJ “undersized spot up SG” role, so the whole poll is misleading. He would come in as QB1, pushing Fultz out of that spot…just because FVV has successfully played next to Lowry in the past doesn’t make it an ideal pairing. SG’s who can shoot are a lot easier to find than a savvy lead PG.

I keep trying to figure out who you keep referring to when you write about "FVV"?

The only FVV that I know played for the Raptors last season and he is not a good shooter and is a ball hog (the exact opposite of a "savvy lead PG").

Not to mention that he is commonly referred to as Freddie Toast (other times Freddie Ball Hog) as he gets burnt so bad on defense.

Yeh, that is the guy I want to bring in to lead this team.

And before moving on to his "championship pedigree", that team was made up of Snow White and the 7 dwarves and Freddie Ball Hog was Grumpy. Not sure bringing in Grumpy dwarf to a young Magic team is a great fit.

do we only cherry pick 1 year out of 7? so 6 years of being a good shooter, 1 year a not great shooter dealing with injury and now he is a bad shooter? and for a ball hog, had the most apg this year in his career.

[tiderulz]

neither.....FVV is a better player than reeves but whats the price tag on that....reeves is fine i guess but paying someone like reeves 20+ million for what exactly? for him to be maybe a 3rd option standing in the corner? nah...pass on both

why does he have to stand in the corner?

[eyriq]

I voted for FVV.

My ideal backcourt is FVV, one of [Scoot, Amen, Cason, Black], Suggs, and one of [Keyonte, Gradey, Ausar].

Draft a PG & SG, sign and trade for FVV. Out of Suggs and two lottery picks I feel confident we'll get an allstar guard to pair with Franz and Paolo when the time comes.

FVV more that compensates for dropping Fultz, Cole, and Harris.

#blowitup

[KillMonger]

neither.....FVV is a better player than reeves but whats the price tag on that....reeves is fine i guess but paying someone like reeves 20+ million for what exactly? for him to be maybe a 3rd option standing in the corner? nah...pass on both

why does he have to stand in the corner?

well he's best with the ball in his hands, who's hands we taking the ball out of if he plays here? Fultz? not a chance he runs the show as of now....Franz? can't see it......Paolo? that would be a joke.....So until Fultz shows he can shoot consistently, it's no use having him on the floor unless he has the ball in his hands a lot as he's not an off-ball threat......So how is reeves fitting into that? primarily as a floor spacer in my eyes....

[tiderulz]

neither.....FVV is a better player than reeves but whats the price tag on that....reeves is fine i guess but paying someone like reeves 20+ million for what exactly? for him to be maybe a 3rd option standing in the corner? nah...pass on both

why does he have to stand in the corner?

well he's best with the ball in his hands, who's hands we taking the ball out of if he plays here? Fultz? not a chance he runs the show as of now....Franz? can't see it......Paolo? that would be a joke.....So until Fultz shows he can shoot consistently, it's no use having him on the floor unless he has the ball in his hands a lot as he's not an off-ball threat......So how is reeves fitting into that? primarily as a floor spacer in my eyes....

Reaves though doesnt have to pound the air out of the ball. with more people that can handle the ball, the ball can move around faster. the better teams have multiple ball handlers

[eyriq]

I don't think it can quite be overstated just how big an upgrade FVV would be for our backcourt. He's currently ranked 53rd by the Ringer. Our only backcourt player to rank is Fultz, at 122.

A. Our backcourt sucks, probably worse in the league
B. FVV IS A FREAKING STUD