Draymond vs Pau as Team's #2

[rand]

Assuming you already had a great scorer like Dame or Booker on your roster, which player in their average prime condition would you take for a single season in the 2023 NBA?

[RCM88x]

Which Gasol?

If this is Pau, I would probably pick Gasol because Dame/Booker are not good enough offensive players to carry a roster with Draymond as the #2, you'd need an extraordinary supporting cast of offensive role players (or two way guys) to make this team a title contender.

If its Marc, I'd probably pick Draymond here, versatility is maybe more value than the pure rim protection.

[Jaivl]

Green is just a clearly better player as a #2.

[Texas Chuck]

Like everything its very situation dependent. If your best player is Bill Russell or KG, you probably benefit more from Pau's offense.

[OhayoKD]

Like everything its very situation dependent. If your best player is Bill Russell or KG, you probably benefit more from Pau's offense.

FWIW, in practice, stacking defensive anchors seems to work better than stacking scoring

[parsnips33]

Like everything its very situation dependent. If your best player is Bill Russell or KG, you probably benefit more from Pau's offense.

This should be the answer to like 90% of questions on here. Feels superficially like a cop out answer, but I think it actually allows for far more insightful conversation

EVERY SINGLE ASPECT of 5-on-5 basketball is contextual

[Texas Chuck]

Like everything its very situation dependent. If your best player is Bill Russell or KG, you probably benefit more from Pau's offense.

FWIW, in practice, stacking defensive anchors seems to work better than stacking scoring

How is adding Pau Gasol to Bill Russell stacking scoring?

I'm not saying KG/Draymond wouldn't be fierce defensively. Of course they would be. But trying to win 4 series offensively is much tougher than it would be with Pau. And I think your defense is just fine with KG/Pau at the back of it.

[iggymcfrack]

Like everything its very situation dependent. If your best player is Bill Russell or KG, you probably benefit more from Pau's offense.

FWIW, in practice, stacking defensive anchors seems to work better than stacking scoring

How is adding Pau Gasol to Bill Russell stacking scoring?

I'm not saying KG/Draymond wouldn't be fierce defensively. Of course they would be. But trying to win 4 series offensively is much tougher than it would be with Pau. And I think your defense is just fine with KG/Pau at the back of it.

A KG/Pau defense is… fine, like you said. A defense with Dray at the 4 and KG at the 5 is immediately the best defense in the history of basketball if you surround them with anyone competent. And it’s not like KG can’t score or that he wouldn’t fit next to Dray on offense. I think Dray absolutely crushes Pau for that potential fit. Russell’s literally the only superstar in history where I could see it going the other way. Peak Dray’s an almost perfect #2.

[Texas Chuck]

We saw KG unable to singularly anchor offenses in the playoffs for a long time. A problem likely only worse today. Sorry, but I don't think KG/Draymond is as competitive a core, given an average, randomized supporting cast as KG/Pau. And a KG/Pau defense is likely far more than just fine assuming any kind of competent perimeter defenders. Pau was a good defensive player in his own right and his ability to provide some rim protection addresses one of KG's few weaknesses as a defender.

If the question is who is a better player, sure I take Draymond too. I'm well on the record thinking he's an absolute beast. But team building is about more than just putting good players together. Did we learn nothing from Brooklyn at all?

[Dr Positivity]

Probably depends on fit and if you give Pau 3pt range in modern era.

Kind of unfair to say this, but Draymond actually doesn't have any titles where he's the clearcut #2 guy. I think 2016 would have been one if they won game 7.

[OhayoKD]

Like everything its very situation dependent. If your best player is Bill Russell or KG, you probably benefit more from Pau's offense.

FWIW, in practice, stacking defensive anchors seems to work better than stacking scoring

How is adding Pau Gasol to Bill Russell stacking scoring?

I'm not saying KG/Draymond wouldn't be fierce defensively. Of course they would be. But trying to win 4 series offensively is much tougher than it would be with Pau. And I think your defense is just fine with KG/Pau at the back of it.

Is the only scenario you're considering here "how would the team look with bill russell or kg"?

[Texas Chuck]

FWIW, in practice, stacking defensive anchors seems to work better than stacking scoring

How is adding Pau Gasol to Bill Russell stacking scoring?

I'm not saying KG/Draymond wouldn't be fierce defensively. Of course they would be. But trying to win 4 series offensively is much tougher than it would be with Pau. And I think your defense is just fine with KG/Pau at the back of it.

Is the only scenario you're considering here "how would the team look with bill russell or kg"?

no

[OhayoKD]

How is adding Pau Gasol to Bill Russell stacking scoring?

I'm not saying KG/Draymond wouldn't be fierce defensively. Of course they would be. But trying to win 4 series offensively is much tougher than it would be with Pau. And I think your defense is just fine with KG/Pau at the back of it.

Is the only scenario you're considering here "how would the team look with bill russell or kg"?

no

In that case, which skill/source of value stacks easier is worth considering

[Jaivl]

Probably depends on fit and if you give Pau 3pt range in modern era.

Kind of unfair to say this, but Draymond actually doesn't have any titles where he's the clearcut #2 guy. I think 2016 would have been one if they won game 7.

Pau easily has 3 point range on the modern era, as he... had 3 point range in the modern era.

[Dr Positivity]

Probably depends on fit and if you give Pau 3pt range in modern era.

Kind of unfair to say this, but Draymond actually doesn't have any titles where he's the clearcut #2 guy. I think 2016 would have been one if they won game 7.

Pau easily has 3 point range on the modern era, as he... had 3 point range in the modern era.

The floor is probably what Sabonis and Valanciunas do from 3, to be really meaningful spacing threat he'd have to hit higher volume though.

[OhayoKD]

Probably depends on fit and if you give Pau 3pt range in modern era.

Kind of unfair to say this, but Draymond actually doesn't have any titles where he's the clearcut #2 guy. I think 2016 would have been one if they won game 7.

He wasn't the clear #2 in 2015?

[Dr Positivity]

Probably depends on fit and if you give Pau 3pt range in modern era.

Kind of unfair to say this, but Draymond actually doesn't have any titles where he's the clearcut #2 guy. I think 2016 would have been one if they won game 7.

He wasn't the clear #2 in 2015?

I think Klay has better argument against him than basically any time since, as Green’s passing took a step up starting in 16. Green has good case in 22 as well but it’s not clear cut.

[Tim Lehrbach]

Impossible to answer, as we only ever saw Pau Gasol as a #1.

[GSP]

Draymond by far.

Prime Draymond was a better 1 option and flatout better player too. Pau couldnt win a playoff game as the best player on his team. Not as a Grizzly and not when Kobe went down in 13. He was 0-16 in playoff games as his teams best player and couldnt win one without Kobe until he got to Chicago where he was Jimmys 2nd option. We saw 16 Draymond win multiple playoff games without Steph VS Dame and Harden. He went 4-2 w/o Steph in 16 playoffs and nearly 5-1 if not for a last second Harden gamewinner

And from when Memphis became a playoff team from 04-06 they were 20-12 without Pau which is a 51 win pace. He had arguably the best defensive roster around def the best perimeter defense and Memphis fell off a cliff and won 22 games in 07 after Battier who was prolly their most important player got traded.

Even aside Draymond just being a much better player prime for prime hes a far better fit next to an offensive engine like Dame or Booker who can play with or without the ball and would benefit immensely from Draymonds alltime help defense and big man playmaking. The pick and roll defense w/ Dame,Book and Pau would be alltime bad and Pau is a poor defender in general

[carlquincy]

WTF Pau ofcourse.

How is this close?