(Lock Please) The LeBron James - 22-23 NBA Playoff Thread - (Part 3)

[MyUniBroDavis]

Davis has been great defensively, but I think we undderrate the supporting cast. I've seen "lakers were 29th without Davis defensively", but this doesn't account for

A. The Lakers not having a functional back-up center(which is why we've seen lebron/rui at the 5 when davis is off)
B. The Lakers playing most of the season without a bunch of the pieces they have now
C. Lebron(2nd best defender somehow) missing a bunch of post-trade games
and
D. Playoff-elevation(this is especially true for lebron)

Rui offers strong paint-protection for the position and has done decently defending wings.

Lebron's reduced offensive load(probably compulsory due to his injury) has led to him offering the best paint=protection I've seen from him since Cleveland along with some strong help defense, very good defensive rebounding(alot of what he's picking up is contested), and whatever amount of credit you want to allot to him as a on-court coach. All considered I'm rather comfortable saying he's been the best defensive forward these playoffs, even if his plus-minus gets nuked with minutes where he's stuck as the 5 or the 4 next to rui.

Schroder doesn't get much defensive hype, but he's done a pretty suprising as a poa defender chasing and pestering the likes of curry relentlessy. Maybe he isn't all that in the regular season, but I'd probably prefer him in a playoff setting than I would a bledsoe.

we'll see if this mantains, but even vanderbilt has done a job dealing with steph and dray and whatever has happened to reeves offense, his defense has remained solid and disruptive.

It's really an excellent, and cruicially, playoff resilient, collection of pieces surrounding a guy playing defense on a level we've only seen from the likes of dray and giannis over the last decade(can see a case for highlighting gobert's 19 but i imagine the guys i mentioned do even better in that situation).

All they're really missing is 2020 dwight

Post trades we got Dlo, vando, and Beasley, 2 bad defenders one good one that wasn’t all that impactful outside of a few key matchups


The defensive cast is competent but comparing it to the bucks cast is crazy lol

2023 maybe, 2019 nah. Jrue was a big upgrade, brooks(at least according to the data) got much better(though I suspect big factors in the alleged fluctuation is portis in non-giannis minutes and the bucks losing robin/lopez and only having three functional front-court pieces, 70's is free to fact-check me tho). 2019 Bucks were also "competent" defensively. Them being some loaded defensive team is misapplying 2023 stuff backwards

My recollection is the bucks without Giannis outside the games they played their bench were still top 10 on defense, and it’s been like that their whole run

The games AD didn’t play they were 29th.

Middleton/brogdan/lopez/hill/Bledsoe is a stacked 2-6 on defense lol (not in order obviously)

[mcraft]

The clamps the Lakers put on in the 2nd & 3rd stunned me. They’ve been awesome defensively since the trade, but AD is on a different level now. Incredible.

It was impressive. I hope they can continue that level of play.

[The Master]

Btw. Ham is really underrated as a coach in my eyes at this point, like it or not. He got very questionable roster at the beginning, but his work since TD is simply fantastic:

- basically no adjustment period to play really great under a pressure with completely new roster;
- great defensive schemes (there's a direct correlation between Ham/Bud and low number of opponent's FTA in Hawks/Bucks/Lakers);
- decent adjustments in the playoffs;
- much better than Vogel offensively, had no problems with taking a ball from LeBron's hands/potentially great semi-adjustments before G3 to get LeBron into his more natural role;
- if he was as acclaimed coach as Pop/Spo/Kerr - he would get a fair share of compliments for making AD playing a historical defense.

I know it wasn't a perfect year for him/of him to say it lightly, nor I'm saying he's a top-top coach right now -- but I'm really impressed, by far the best coach of LeBron since he's a Laker.

[MisterHibachi]

Read on Twitter

"Steph said to me yo I'm tryna figure Bron out"

[Heej]

Read on Twitter

"Steph said to me yo I'm tryna figure Bron out"

Steph in dismay that LeBron has had a comparable supporting cast to him for the 2nd time in almost a decade. God he'd be such a one hit wonder without KD. They even got Wiggins as a domino effect of turning KD into DLo

[MisterHibachi]

Read on Twitter

"Steph said to me yo I'm tryna figure Bron out"

Steph in dismay that LeBron has had a comparable supporting cast to him for the 2nd time in almost a decade. God he'd be such a one hit wonder without KD. They even got Wiggins as a domino effect of turning KD into DLo

This whole **** would've been smothered in the crib if Kyrie or Love weren't injured in 2015.

[DonaldSanders]

This whole **** would've been smothered in the crib if Kyrie or Love weren't injured in 2015.

Or if Bogut/Iggy/Ezeli weren't injured in 2016 and Draymond wasn't suspended Warriors would have went back to back.

[OhayoKD]

Post trades we got Dlo, vando, and Beasley, 2 bad defenders one good one that wasn’t all that impactful outside of a few key matchups


The defensive cast is competent but comparing it to the bucks cast is crazy lol

2023 maybe, 2019 nah. Jrue was a big upgrade, brooks(at least according to the data) got much better(though I suspect big factors in the alleged fluctuation is portis in non-giannis minutes and the bucks losing robin/lopez and only having three functional front-court pieces, 70's is free to fact-check me tho). 2019 Bucks were also "competent" defensively. Them being some loaded defensive team is misapplying 2023 stuff backwards

My recollection is the bucks without Giannis outside the games they played their bench were still top 10 on defense, and it’s been like that their whole run

The games AD didn’t play they were 29th.

Middleton/brogdan/lopez/hill/Bledsoe is a stacked 2-6 on defense lol (not in order obviously)

Brogdan missed the second half of the season(and bucks elevated in the playoffs without). And middleton and hill were nuetral. Bledsoe was super good against harden but was inconsistent in the playoffs(bleh vs the raptors).

I also think this set of teammates playing at this level is good defensively without davis if they have a passable backup center.

I also am guessing playing undersized interior threats with a bunch of good interior defenders helps a fair bit

[Heej]

This whole **** would've been smothered in the crib if Kyrie or Love weren't injured in 2015.

Or if Bogut/Iggy/Ezeli weren't injured in 2016 and Draymond wasn't suspended Warriors would have went back to back.

Bron had 41 in game 6 lmao and the game was out of reach by the end of G5. Doubtful, the Cavs had them outfoxed schematically with the PNR switching and scouting their split cuts

[xb3at band1tx]

AD is better than Embiid.

[Homer38]

This whole **** would've been smothered in the crib if Kyrie or Love weren't injured in 2015.

Or if Bogut/Iggy/Ezeli weren't injured in 2016 and Draymond wasn't suspended Warriors would have went back to back.

Most of his players were available for most of the series...Nothing to compare in 2015 for the cavs....It's as if the warriors lost Klay and Green after game 1 and they were playing against a great healthy team....I'm not sure that Curry would have been able to win 2 games....I know the warriors had struggle big time without Klay against Toronto in 2019, even if it was only 6 quarter who was out

[Homer38]

AD is better than Embiid.

In the playoffs yes

[MisterHibachi]

This whole **** would've been smothered in the crib if Kyrie or Love weren't injured in 2015.

Or if Bogut/Iggy/Ezeli weren't injured in 2016 and Draymond wasn't suspended Warriors would have went back to back.

Nah they wouldn't have. Cavs were winning Game 5 regardless of Draymond.

[nbhadja]

Read on Twitter

"Steph said to me yo I'm tryna figure Bron out"

Steph in dismay that LeBron has had a comparable supporting cast to him for the 2nd time in almost a decade. God he'd be such a one hit wonder without KD. They even got Wiggins as a domino effect of turning KD into DLo

This whole **** would've been smothered in the crib if Kyrie or Love weren't injured in 2015.

Most people don't remember but the refs stole game 1 of the 2015 finals away from the cavs with a BS last second foul call. Cavs would have been up 3-0 if not for that.

The only real time curry beat LeBron is when he had a unfair super team with KD.


Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk

[The Master]

Most people don't remember but the refs stole game 1 of the 2015 finals away from the cavs with a BS last second foul call. Cavs would have been up 3-0 if not for that. The only real time curry beat LeBron is when he had a unfair super team with KD.

lol, you guys are reaching, haha.

2015 finals had this weird dynamics that Warriors were very slow to adjust despite much superior lineup and since they did, they dominated the series from G4 onwards. Hard to say how this series would have developed with healthy Kyrie: on the one hand Warriors played badly until g4 and they would be 1-2 without HCA against Cavs with LeBron and Kyrie, on the other hand LeBron objectively was kind of weak for his standards and Warriors were +42 in g4-g6. 50/50 series I would say.

And don't forget Love due to concussion was basically a non factor until game 7 in 2016 as well with some awful production for star-level player.

[OhayoKD]

Most people don't remember but the refs stole game 1 of the 2015 finals away from the cavs with a BS last second foul call. Cavs would have been up 3-0 if not for that. The only real time curry beat LeBron is when he had a unfair super team with KD.

lol, you guys are reaching, haha.

2015 finals had this weird dynamics that Warriors were very slow to adjust despite much superior lineup and since they did, they dominated the series from G4 onwards. Hard to say how this series would have developed with healthy Kyrie: on the one hand Warriors played badly until g4 and they would be 1-2 without HCA against Cavs with LeBron and Kyrie, on the other hand LeBron objectively was kind of weak for his standards and Warriors were +42 in g4-g6. 50/50 series I would say.

And don't forget Love due to concussion was basically a non factor until game 7 in 2016 as well with some awful production for star-level player.

Lebron weak for his standards doing something only bill russell has ever replicated is pretty wild yeah

[The Master]

Lebron weak for his standards doing something only bill russell has ever replicated is pretty wild yeah

I don't know what only Bill Russell has ever replicated, but his jumper was completely off throughout the playoffs and knee/back problems from RS clearly affected his overall impact. It's worthless speculation at this point but I'm not as high on Cavs '15 chances, although they would have had a legit title shot if healthy. It was more of an exclamation point of LeBron as a GOAT-floor raiser and that's why these finals are valuable from cognitive perspective, because in terms of overall impact, this is around 2008-season on my LeBron's ranking, so spots 9-10. And this is pretty wild, lol, but that's a different thing.

[OhayoKD]

Lebron weak for his standards doing something only bill russell has ever replicated is pretty wild yeah

I don't know what only Bill Russell has ever replicated, but his jumper was completely off throughout the playoffs and knee/back problems from RS clearly affected his overall impact. It's worthless speculation at this point but I'm not as high on Cavs '15 chances, although they would have had a legit title shot if healthy. It was more of an exclamation point of LeBron as a GOAT-floor raiser and that's why these finals are valuable from cognitive perspective, because in terms of overall impact, this is around 2008-season on my LeBron's ranking, so spots 9-10. And this is pretty wild, lol, but that's a different thing.

Specifcially sweeping the hawks and forcing the warriors to pull the 73-win death lineup from their sleeve with kyrie and love having minimal involvement. Cavs were a +10 PSRS per sansteere in 2015. By their best possible measures cavs with kyrie and love(without lebron) were a negative defense and a neutral offense.

Only things that tops it is Russell's 69

[OhayoKD]

This whole **** would've been smothered in the crib if Kyrie or Love weren't injured in 2015.

Or if Bogut/Iggy/Ezeli weren't injured in 2016 and Draymond wasn't suspended Warriors would have went back to back.

If love isn't concussed warriors lose in 5

[The Master]

Specifcially sweeping the hawks and forcing the warriors to pull the 73-win death lineup from their sleeve with kyrie and love having minimal involvement. Cavs were a +10 PSRS per sansteere in 2015. By their best possible measures cavs with kyrie and love(without lebron) were a negative defense and a neutral offense.

Only things that tops it is Russell's 69

If you assume that Hawks '15 were really 60W-level team that got swept by -15 net margin, then yeah. LeBron obviously still had a realistic shot for being the best player in a league that year, but Cavs' team success that year was very contextual in my eyes. Obviously, Warriors crumbling under the pressure at the beginning of the finals on its own may be an argument for healthy Cavs' chances in the finals, but Warriors completely controlling the series since g4 makes it very tricky to evaluate.

For a long time in my eyes, 2015 finals have been overrated in these general assessments while 2008 ECSF are really underrated - not saying LeBron '08 was better than LeBron '15, but while 2015 finals weren't winnable, 23yo LeBron was really close to eliminate +9 SRS Boston team if not Pierce having the best game of his life in G7. LeBron's stats are ugly, so that's why this series is underrated, but it was mainly G1-G2 on a road, and against historically great defense. I rewatched this series once for whatever reason and it was the first time we've seen LeBron playing DPOTY-level defense, with 31-6-8 on 54TS% in G3-G7 against -8,6 rDRTG team with Ilgauskas as a 2nd option, and 45pts game7 on a road. The most annoying loss in a 1st stint in Cavs.

That's why these two playoff runs are very close to each other on my list. '17, '16, '12, '13, '18, '20, '09 and '14 are higher. Kind of ridiculous that advancing to the finals in age of 22 is like 11th-best playoff run in my eyes, lol.