Bucks Offseason Thread - Trade, news, re-tool discussion

[Brewhoopfan]

Easiest thing we could do to help this team is start Beauchamp.

Let him play big minutes in the regular season and see if you have something there.

Run it back with everyone else and a new coach and see what happens in 2024

If he is good enough? Great. There's no time for a Thon Maker 2.0 experiment. The coaches see what he can do every day. A big leap from him in year 2 would be needed. It will be very interesting how a new set of head coach eyes will evaluate the roster.

[paulpressey25]

Easiest thing we could do to help this team is start Beauchamp.

Not sure what to make of MarJon. Most good NBA players usually show some flashes of brilliance as a rookie. Didn't really see any of that with MarJon.

But at the same time, as a fair criticism of Bud, MarJon needed more time in the regular season.

I'm not sure he's got much trade value. We'll have to ride him and see if we get an 8th man out of it. That's my hot take.

[midranger]

Feel like no matter what happens, we can’t just lose Middleton’s salary slot completely. Obviously, he has to participate in it, but if he is leaving, it’d be great to get a couple smaller/medium sized deals and an asset or two that increases our flexibility to make trades next year.

[paulpressey25]

Feel like no matter what happens, we can’t just lose Middleton’s salary slot completely. Obviously, he has to participate in it, but if he is leaving, it’d be great to get a couple smaller/medium sized deals and an asset or two that increases our flexibility to make trades next year.

It's going to be hard, if not impossible to do that if he wants to go to Houston, Orlando or OKC.

Houston has zero bad contracts we could take back for salary slot purposes.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/HOU.html

Same for OKC
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/OKC.html

Orlando - maybe Gary Harris or Jonathan Isaac. Maybe.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/ORL.html

The only hope is Dallas offers him a boatload and he wants to go there. Maybe you get pick #10 out of it.

[midranger]

Feel like no matter what happens, we can’t just lose Middleton’s salary slot completely. Obviously, he has to participate in it, but if he is leaving, it’d be great to get a couple smaller/medium sized deals and an asset or two that increases our flexibility to make trades next year.

It's going to be hard, if not impossible to do that if he wants to go to Houston, Orlando or OKC.

Houston has zero bad contracts we could take back for salary slot purposes.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/HOU.html

Same for OKC
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/OKC.html

Orlando - maybe Gary Harris or Jonathan Isaac. Maybe.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/ORL.html

The only hope is Dallas offers him a boatload and he wants to go there. Maybe you get pick #10 out of it.

No doubt. Houston would probably prefer to lose Tate, I’m not sure what the Orlando guys are partially guaranteed for, and OKC seems tough unless Khash wants the 40+ million starting deal, in which case they need to add salary.

Sacramento has a moderate amount of space and would love to get rid of Holmes deal. Charlotte in a similar boat, but doubt they’d have interest.

With Dallas, you’re probably taking back two pretty bad deals, so the hope would be to get 10 and a couple future assets.

At the very least, we need to get that huge TPE.

[RiotPunch]

Feel like no matter what happens, we can’t just lose Middleton’s salary slot completely. Obviously, he has to participate in it, but if he is leaving, it’d be great to get a couple smaller/medium sized deals and an asset or two that increases our flexibility to make trades next year.

It's going to be hard, if not impossible to do that if he wants to go to Houston, Orlando or OKC.

Houston has zero bad contracts we could take back for salary slot purposes.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/HOU.html

Same for OKC
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/OKC.html

Orlando - maybe Gary Harris or Jonathan Isaac. Maybe.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/ORL.html

The only hope is Dallas offers him a boatload and he wants to go there. Maybe you get pick #10 out of it.

Atlanta is close to where he grew up and they could use a 2nd/3rd banana alongside Young/Murray. They also watched first hand as Middleton obliterated them in the ECF. Too bad Bogdan isn't eligible for trade until September, but they have some pieces they are looking to move. Take Hunter for ourselves, get a 3rd team that wants Collins or Capela.

[RiotPunch]

Giannis should be on the phone with Porzingus rn... double sign and trade for Middleton would benefit each wouldn't it? F the Wizards

That might actually be doable with Porzingis being in the exact same boat Khris is in, ie not getting a 5% raise and triggering BYC.

I probably wouldn't do it, but crazy that two teams over the cap could evade BYC in a double S&T.

[emunney]

I don't think we should be super concerned about Khris' salary slot. It's kind of in the slurry of distant 3rd considerations after

1) What level of play Khris can provide over the term of his next contract, and
2) What opportunities must we forego / what penalties do we incur by signing him to that contract

If you decide that opportunity cost + penalty > Khris' contributions, you do the best you can with salvaging value, but also recognize that we have a lot of salary on this team and will have opportunities to add more if Khris walks.

[rayallenscalves]

Feel like no matter what happens, we can’t just lose Middleton’s salary slot completely. Obviously, he has to participate in it, but if he is leaving, it’d be great to get a couple smaller/medium sized deals and an asset or two that increases our flexibility to make trades next year.

It's going to be hard, if not impossible to do that if he wants to go to Houston, Orlando or OKC.

Houston has zero bad contracts we could take back for salary slot purposes.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/HOU.html

Same for OKC
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/OKC.html

Orlando - maybe Gary Harris or Jonathan Isaac. Maybe.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/ORL.html

The only hope is Dallas offers him a boatload and he wants to go there. Maybe you get pick #10 out of it.

Atlanta is close to where he grew up and they could use a 2nd/3rd banana alongside Young/Murray. They also watched first hand as Middleton obliterated them in the ECF. Too bad Bogdan isn't eligible for trade until September, but they have some pieces they are looking to move. Take Hunter for ourselves, get a 3rd team that wants Collins or Capela.

Atlanta makes sense and would likely allow for a 2-for-1 deal. I have to also admit being intrigued with Michael Porter, Jr. I get all the reasons he's a bad idea (injuries, contract, defense), but he can be Durant-like smooth on offense. If Denver flames out, I could see them being interested in Middleton as a more reliable SF option for them. For the Bucks, he brings youth, size, and shooting while maintaining the salary slot. Big risk with potentially big rewards.

[paulpressey25]

recognize that we have a lot of salary on this team and will have opportunities to add more if Khris walks.

Glad you're staying with this theme. Khris walking free to Houston on a 4/$160 deal isn't optimal, but a lot of options now open up in the trade market going forward, without the luxury tax/2nd apron issues.

That said, as with the coach, it's all about what Giannis wants here with Khris.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

Easiest thing we could do to help this team is start Beauchamp.

Let him play big minutes in the regular season and see if you have something there.

Run it back with everyone else and a new coach and see what happens in 2024

Don't understand the Marjon love. Dude will be 23 next time he see the court and besides having a few awesome dunks was pretty bad in the 50+ games we saw from him as an old rookie. I'm not writing him off, but I really don't see him being better in the next 2 years than some random guy we sign for the vet min (someone like '21 Malik Monk). And I don't think Marjon has the high ceiling where it is worth force feeding him minutes. I don't mind keeping him around/picking up options. But I'm not betting on him at all to play meaningful minutes next year.

[emunney]

recognize that we have a lot of salary on this team and will have opportunities to add more if Khris walks.

Glad you're staying with this theme. Khris walking free to Houston on a 4/$160 deal isn't optimal, but a lot of options now open up in the trade market going forward, without the luxury tax/2nd apron issues.

That said, as with the coach, it's all about what Giannis wants here with Khris.

I don't want anybody getting the idea that I think there are good options here. But if Khris' knee is ok, I'm keeping him (for as short a deal as he'll sign), and if it's not, I'm not. The second scenario wouldn't have been clear to me without the new CBA. Used to be the penalties were only monetary, and now there are concrete, direct personnel implications.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

OT: But sucks this team needs a refresh. It was pretty damn likeable and seemed like good people to have in Milwaukee. I've heard of random sightings of Giannis, Midds, Pat, etc at doctors appointments, kids soccer games, restaurants. Like these guys weren't in a hurry to get to Cancun or LA. They seemed to have built lives here.

[paulpressey25]

Used to be the penalties were only monetary, and now there are concrete, direct personnel implications.

And on the monetary penalties, I do not think much of our fanbase comprehends how onerous this payroll is on the team when compared to revenues generated. We've been running a massive top 3-5 payroll the past few years. When we hit the repeater tax, literally every extra dollar we extend to a guy on a contract could end up costing 3 to 4x the nominal amount.

In the past 20-years, when small markets hit success, the ownership usually had to start bailing on talent because they couldn't afford the payroll. OKC with Harden, Indy a number of years back with Brad Miller and others. Even the Maloof's hit a wall with the Kings.

We've only made two misteps with the money. Brogdon (but there were other factors at play) and PJ. Everyone else we've wanted, we've kept.

[neiLz]

we went from "this is the best bucks roster we've seen in 30 years" to "we need a full tear down and rebuild around Giannis." This roster got OLD really fast... they blew 2 games vs the heat in pathetic fashion and could have easily won that series.

I don't know what they can do, but this is the NBA and if westbrook can bring back a bunch of pieces, I think Khris or Jrue can bring back similar if not more value. It's up to Fed Ex's pride and Joy to deliver us a new and improved roster.

[RiotPunch]

I know I am the resident Maxey stan, so I am admittedly biased but how do we feel about a framework of:

MKE: Maxey, Harris, multiple 2nds
PHI: Holiday, Portis

Philly fans I've chatted with love it, so it probably sucks for us. Certainly a step back overall, but gains guard dynamism and widens the Giannis window. Harris is a massive expiring as a deadline chip, and could still move Midds in a separate deal to reset further.

MKE: Hunter, Powell
ATL: Middleton
LAC: Capela

Maxey / Carter
Powell / Allen
Hunter / Connaughton
Giannis / Harris
Lopez / FA

[jakecronus8]

Hypothetical: San Antonio wins the lottery and offers us Wembo+ for Giannis and Jrue.

WYD?

[Ron Swanson]

One avenue to explore is to canvas what other teams are gonna look to be maneuvering/cutting long-term salary to avoid the new CBA restrictions with an eye towards 2024-25. A lot currently riding on Denver and whether their current core is good enough to finally get over the hump, plus they're currently on the hook for a massive luxury tax bill ($170 million payroll for just 10 rostered players as of now). If Middleton opts in, I think Denver would look long and hard at the cost benefit of getting off MPJ's contract for a $40 million expiring. I'd be exploring something where we're getting a younger but flawed blue-chip talent over a lot of these proposed ideas where we're simply gaining cap flexibility and a few picks.

[rayallenscalves]

One avenue to explore is to canvas what other teams are gonna look to be maneuvering/cutting long-term salary to avoid the new CBA restrictions with an eye towards 2024-25. A lot currently riding on Denver and whether their current core is good enough to finally get over the hump, plus they're currently on the hook for a massive luxury tax bill ($170 million payroll for just 10 rostered players as of now). If Middleton opts in, I think Denver would look long and hard at the cost benefit of getting off MPJ's contract for a $40 million expiring. I'd be exploring something where we're getting a younger but flawed blue-chip talent over a lot of these proposed ideas where we're simply gaining cap flexibility and a few picks.

As I posted earlier, I think MPJ is real intriguing despite the obvious risks.

[Milbucks96]

Hypothetical: San Antonio wins the lottery and offers us Wembo+ for Giannis and Jrue.

WYD?

Ill take it fully acknowledging that I don’t think Wemby is going to be as good as Giannis. I do feel confident in saying he’ll be a hof and 7 more years of that is better than maybe 2 more of Giannis with a meh team around him.