Jokic Making a lot of folks look dumb

[AleksandarN]

Call me when he makes it out of the West. I'm not impressed.

Your hatred is so sad and pathetic. There are players I strongly dislike, like Embiid, but not even I am foolish enough to call him unimpressive.

He is trolling.

[Sharkboy242]

Call me when he makes it out of the West. I'm not impressed.

Your hatred is so sad and pathetic. There are players I strongly dislike, like Embiid, but not even I am foolish enough to call him unimpressive.

He is trolling.

Probably. Calling any player in the top ten 'unimpressive' just makes you seem like you're trying hard to project a tough guy image

Him and the guy with the David Robinson icon should kiss.

[Teen Girl Squad]

Jokic has been this player for a while. Its amusing to see casual fans flip so aggressively from "Jokic is media hype" to "Media underrates Jokic so hard."

[RipHamilton]

He is another level. Clearly the best basketball player in the world right now. One step ahead of Embiid, Curry, Booker, Butler...

[zeebneeb]

He is another level. Clearly the best basketball player in the world right now. One step ahead of Embiid, Curry, Booker, Butler...

I am hoping for a Nuggets/Sixers finals.

Man what a show that would be.

[QingJames]

That's a weird thing to say as (1) Claxton is certainly a better defender than Ayton and (2) I provided hard proof of Embiid dominating Ayton. Literally never scored less than 33 points in their 8 matchups lol

Those are regular season games against Ayton... Embiid also averaged 33.1 pts in the regular season but sniffed the average just once (34p) in the 6 playoffs games with 23.2 ppg average. Very impressive regular season player in the past three years combined, but playoffs? Call me not impressed:
Regular: 30.9p/10.8r/3.8a/ 31PER/.636TS%/.258WS/48/8.8BPM
Playoffs: 25.3p/10.6r/2.9a/ 22.5PER/.606TS%/.151WS/48/3.5BPM

What stat are you using to measure that PnR defense (or defense as a whole)? What about offensive gravity? Somehow Jokic gets credit for winning more in the playoffs when the reality is...

Jokic
18-19 Playoff Net (14 games): +7.0
18-19 Playoff On/Off (14 games): +23.7

19-20 Playoff Net (19 games): -3.5
19-20 Playoff On/Off (19 games): -3.0

20-21 Playoff Net (10 games): -8.4
20-21 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -8.2

21-22 Playoff Net (5 games): -14.4
21-22 Playoff On/Off (5 games): -16.5

22-23 Playoff Net (10 games): +6.9
22-23 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -4.3

Cumulative Playoff Net (58 games): -0.6
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (58 games): +1.8


Embiid
17-18 Playoff Net (8 games): +5.6
17-18 Playoff On/Off (8 games): +6.6

18-18 Playoff Net (11 games): +20.5
18-19 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +41.6

19-20 Playoff Net (4 games): -21.2
19-20 Playoff On/Off (4 games): -32.9

20-21 Playoff Net (11 games): +14.7
20-21 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +19.9

21-22 (10 games): +4.6
21-22 (10 games): +11.3

22-23 Playoff Net (7 games): +4.6
22-23 Playoff On/Off (7 games): +4.5

Cumulative Playoff Net (51): +7.7
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (51): +13.4


The ONLY smudge on Embiid's playoff impact profile was in by far the smallest sample (4 games) and furthermore the only season in which Embiid was forced to play next to another big man in Horford (which everyone knew would not work).

At the end of the day winning is what matters and JoJo does it even better than Joker. Yeah I said it

If Embiid is better at winning than Jokic in the postseason then why hasn’t he won more than Jokic in the postseason? Especially given he has consistently had better supporting casts.

I also don’t think you can say that Embiid has only one bad stain on his postseason career, especially given that he was terrible at the end of the final few games against the Hawks (he was generally quite bad in the series, despite putting up points). He was far more to blame for that humiliation than Simmons.

Really makes you think…

[MikeM]

Jokic is a 7 foot Steve Nash. None of his teammates are even that good either tbh.

[cool93]

Those are regular season games against Ayton... Embiid also averaged 33.1 pts in the regular season but sniffed the average just once (34p) in the 6 playoffs games with 23.2 ppg average. Very impressive regular season player in the past three years combined, but playoffs? Call me not impressed:
Regular: 30.9p/10.8r/3.8a/ 31PER/.636TS%/.258WS/48/8.8BPM
Playoffs: 25.3p/10.6r/2.9a/ 22.5PER/.606TS%/.151WS/48/3.5BPM

What stat are you using to measure that PnR defense (or defense as a whole)? What about offensive gravity? Somehow Jokic gets credit for winning more in the playoffs when the reality is...

Jokic
18-19 Playoff Net (14 games): +7.0
18-19 Playoff On/Off (14 games): +23.7

19-20 Playoff Net (19 games): -3.5
19-20 Playoff On/Off (19 games): -3.0

20-21 Playoff Net (10 games): -8.4
20-21 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -8.2

21-22 Playoff Net (5 games): -14.4
21-22 Playoff On/Off (5 games): -16.5

22-23 Playoff Net (10 games): +6.9
22-23 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -4.3

Cumulative Playoff Net (58 games): -0.6
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (58 games): +1.8


Embiid
17-18 Playoff Net (8 games): +5.6
17-18 Playoff On/Off (8 games): +6.6

18-18 Playoff Net (11 games): +20.5
18-19 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +41.6

19-20 Playoff Net (4 games): -21.2
19-20 Playoff On/Off (4 games): -32.9

20-21 Playoff Net (11 games): +14.7
20-21 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +19.9

21-22 (10 games): +4.6
21-22 (10 games): +11.3

22-23 Playoff Net (7 games): +4.6
22-23 Playoff On/Off (7 games): +4.5

Cumulative Playoff Net (51): +7.7
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (51): +13.4


The ONLY smudge on Embiid's playoff impact profile was in by far the smallest sample (4 games) and furthermore the only season in which Embiid was forced to play next to another big man in Horford (which everyone knew would not work).

At the end of the day winning is what matters and JoJo does it even better than Joker. Yeah I said it

If Embiid is better at winning than Jokic in the postseason then why hasn’t he won more than Jokic in the postseason? Especially given he has consistently had better supporting casts.

I also don’t think you can say that Embiid has only one bad stain on his postseason career, especially given that he was terrible at the end of the final few games against the Hawks (he was generally quite bad in the series, despite putting up points). He was far more to blame for that humiliation than Simmons.

Really makes you think…

Jokic literally made his only conference finals so far when Murray averaged 30+ a game in a series lmao

Sent from my G3416 using RealGM mobile app

[Clyde Frazier]

What stat are you using to measure that PnR defense (or defense as a whole)? What about offensive gravity? Somehow Jokic gets credit for winning more in the playoffs when the reality is...

Jokic
18-19 Playoff Net (14 games): +7.0
18-19 Playoff On/Off (14 games): +23.7

19-20 Playoff Net (19 games): -3.5
19-20 Playoff On/Off (19 games): -3.0

20-21 Playoff Net (10 games): -8.4
20-21 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -8.2

21-22 Playoff Net (5 games): -14.4
21-22 Playoff On/Off (5 games): -16.5

22-23 Playoff Net (10 games): +6.9
22-23 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -4.3

Cumulative Playoff Net (58 games): -0.6
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (58 games): +1.8


Embiid
17-18 Playoff Net (8 games): +5.6
17-18 Playoff On/Off (8 games): +6.6

18-18 Playoff Net (11 games): +20.5
18-19 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +41.6

19-20 Playoff Net (4 games): -21.2
19-20 Playoff On/Off (4 games): -32.9

20-21 Playoff Net (11 games): +14.7
20-21 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +19.9

21-22 (10 games): +4.6
21-22 (10 games): +11.3

22-23 Playoff Net (7 games): +4.6
22-23 Playoff On/Off (7 games): +4.5

Cumulative Playoff Net (51): +7.7
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (51): +13.4


The ONLY smudge on Embiid's playoff impact profile was in by far the smallest sample (4 games) and furthermore the only season in which Embiid was forced to play next to another big man in Horford (which everyone knew would not work).

At the end of the day winning is what matters and JoJo does it even better than Joker. Yeah I said it

If Embiid is better at winning than Jokic in the postseason then why hasn’t he won more than Jokic in the postseason? Especially given he has consistently had better supporting casts.

I also don’t think you can say that Embiid has only one bad stain on his postseason career, especially given that he was terrible at the end of the final few games against the Hawks (he was generally quite bad in the series, despite putting up points). He was far more to blame for that humiliation than Simmons.

Really makes you think…

Jokic literally made his only conference finals so far when Murray averaged 30+ a game in a series lmao

Sent from my G3416 using RealGM mobile app

Ah yes, because *jokic* of all players has no effect on his teammates playing well.

[Woodsanity]

What stat are you using to measure that PnR defense (or defense as a whole)? What about offensive gravity? Somehow Jokic gets credit for winning more in the playoffs when the reality is...

Jokic
18-19 Playoff Net (14 games): +7.0
18-19 Playoff On/Off (14 games): +23.7

19-20 Playoff Net (19 games): -3.5
19-20 Playoff On/Off (19 games): -3.0

20-21 Playoff Net (10 games): -8.4
20-21 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -8.2

21-22 Playoff Net (5 games): -14.4
21-22 Playoff On/Off (5 games): -16.5

22-23 Playoff Net (10 games): +6.9
22-23 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -4.3

Cumulative Playoff Net (58 games): -0.6
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (58 games): +1.8


Embiid
17-18 Playoff Net (8 games): +5.6
17-18 Playoff On/Off (8 games): +6.6

18-18 Playoff Net (11 games): +20.5
18-19 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +41.6

19-20 Playoff Net (4 games): -21.2
19-20 Playoff On/Off (4 games): -32.9

20-21 Playoff Net (11 games): +14.7
20-21 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +19.9

21-22 (10 games): +4.6
21-22 (10 games): +11.3

22-23 Playoff Net (7 games): +4.6
22-23 Playoff On/Off (7 games): +4.5

Cumulative Playoff Net (51): +7.7
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (51): +13.4


The ONLY smudge on Embiid's playoff impact profile was in by far the smallest sample (4 games) and furthermore the only season in which Embiid was forced to play next to another big man in Horford (which everyone knew would not work).

At the end of the day winning is what matters and JoJo does it even better than Joker. Yeah I said it

If Embiid is better at winning than Jokic in the postseason then why hasn’t he won more than Jokic in the postseason? Especially given he has consistently had better supporting casts.

I also don’t think you can say that Embiid has only one bad stain on his postseason career, especially given that he was terrible at the end of the final few games against the Hawks (he was generally quite bad in the series, despite putting up points). He was far more to blame for that humiliation than Simmons.

Really makes you think…

Jokic literally made his only conference finals so far when Murray averaged 30+ a game in a series lmao

Sent from my G3416 using RealGM mobile app

Embiid Playoff PER: 22.1

Jokic Playoff PER: 28.7

Its not even a comparison. Funny how you don't even know how net rating works. All this is telling me is Embiid had stacked lineups and still sucked in the playoffs.

But props to Embiid for winning game 1 away while sitting on the bench. Those claps per minute must have helped the Sixers a ton.

[Exp0sed]

Let's conveniently leave out that another center is playing through a knee injury and played a first round series where he was blitz doubled/tripled on every touch.

lemme get this straight:

Embiid was blitzed \ doubled etc. vs the Nets almost automatically
you realize that a team like the Nets, employs such a strategy because it's somewhat effective?

there's a reason why Jokic isn't guarded like that, his atg passing skill makes it into a non viable option. i would argue the gap between the two as passers is at least as significant as the gap between the two on D

Embiid played 3 games vs the Nets and despite being "blitzed", double and tripled (which means other guys were constantly open) - had just 12 assists and 15 turnovers over 3 games in that series

it's not like they did a great job getting the ball out of Embiid's hands and that's why he had less FGA, less points but made up for it in setting up his teammates. right?

12 assists my dude over 3 games where half of ur team is open with 15 To's to boot well..

there are nights when Embiid is on point, decisive and is making shots and good decisions but there are nights when blitzing him is very effective

obviously he still gonna get his, but he won't beat u on his own and he won't dominate the game

yeah, Harden put up two total duds but he also put up 3 stellar performances
overall he's got 40 assists to 11 Tos in the Boston series - that's insane!
he also has a game winner and oh - he beat the C's in game 1 basically on his own

if Harden wasn't around to set up Embiid and being a real scoring threat himself - the 76ers wouldn't be beating the C's

Harden was MVP just a couple of years ago for crying out loud

Embiid himself btw, has said that he is fine health wise and he's moving just fine on the court
Jokic has a wrist injury that's bothering him as well and will continue to bother him till his season ends, everybody's banged up this time of the year - that's no excuse

[Zombiesonics]

Jokic is a 7 foot Steve Nash. None of his teammates are even that good either tbh.

He's better than nash ever was in the postseason, which is crazy to say coming from a huge 7sol fan.

[Homer38]

Read on Twitter

[liquidswords]

Let's conveniently leave out that another center is playing through a knee injury and played a first round series where he was blitz doubled/tripled on every touch.

lemme get this straight:

Embiid was blitzed \ doubled etc. vs the Nets almost automatically
you realize that a team like the Nets, employs such a strategy because it's somewhat effective?

there's a reason why Jokic isn't guarded like that, his atg passing skill makes it into a non viable option. i would argue the gap between the two as passers is at least as significant as the gap between the two on D

Embiid played 3 games vs the Nets and despite being "blitzed", double and tripled (which means other guys were constantly open) - had just 12 assists and 15 turnovers over 3 games in that series

it's not like they did a great job getting the ball out of Embiid's hands and that's why he had less FGA, less points but made up for it in setting up his teammates. right?

12 assists my dude over 3 games where half of ur team is open with 15 To's to boot well..

there are nights when Embiid is on point, decisive and is making shots and good decisions but there are nights when blitzing him is very effective

obviously he still gonna get his, but he won't beat u on his own and he won't dominate the game

yeah, Harden put up two total duds but he also put up 3 stellar performances
overall he's got 40 assists to 11 Tos in the Boston series - that's insane!
he also has a game winner and oh - he beat the C's in game 1 basically on his own

if Harden wasn't around to set up Embiid and being a real scoring threat himself - the 76ers wouldn't be beating the C's

Harden was MVP just a couple of years ago for crying out loud

Embiid himself btw, has said that he is fine health wise and he's moving just fine on the court
Jokic has a wrist injury that's bothering him as well and will continue to bother him till his season ends, everybody's banged up this time of the year - that's no excuse

The numbers comparison was largely around scoring and not passing. We all know that Embiid isn't even in the same neighborhood as Jokic as far as passing. We don't need a dissertation on that. The point is that Embiid wasn't scoring like he could have because he's very hurt (still playing through) and BKN wouldn't allow him to even go 1:1 for any period of time.

[Pennebaker]

30/14/9 on 61 TS% against good defenders most of the time. I don't wanna compare him to any other big but I'll just say ... he's comfortably got the spot as best player in the world, w. being the best center being just a small part of that.

Jimmy Butler also once again forcing people to put respect on his name, once again proving he's a top 7 player, being one of the few ball players besides prime LeBron with essentially no meaningful weaknesses.

Until he loses in the WCF to AD and Bron then it's back to square one. Back to 2020.

[bebopdeluxe]

Who said he isn’t very very good?

Or is this just a random strawman you are building?

THIS.

People wonder why some people are tired of the Jokic fanboys on the GB. It is threads with titles like this one that are so exhausting for people like me to read...and they happen ALL SEASON LONG.

[bebopdeluxe]

30/14/9 on 61 TS% against good defenders most of the time. I don't wanna compare him to any other big but I'll just say ... he's comfortably got the spot as best player in the world, w. being the best center being just a small part of that.

Jimmy Butler also once again forcing people to put respect on his name, once again proving he's a top 7 player, being one of the few ball players besides prime LeBron with essentially no meaningful weaknesses.

Which folks look dumb? Embiid fans who wanted him to win MVP over Jokic? I don't think anyone doubted Jokic.

Even fans of Embiid like me respect Jokic's game. The guy is literally a walking triple-double. While I think that Embiid's better rim protection (which was in clear evidence last night against the Celtics) is a differentiating factor between the two players, that does not mean that I don't respect Jokic's game. It is impossible not to.

Here's hoping for a Sixers-Nuggets finals.

[Duke4life831]

That's a weird thing to say as (1) Claxton is certainly a better defender than Ayton and (2) I provided hard proof of Embiid dominating Ayton. Literally never scored less than 33 points in their 8 matchups lol

Those are regular season games against Ayton... Embiid also averaged 33.1 pts in the regular season but sniffed the average just once (34p) in the 6 playoffs games with 23.2 ppg average. Very impressive regular season player in the past three years combined, but playoffs? Call me not impressed:
Regular: 30.9p/10.8r/3.8a/ 31PER/.636TS%/.258WS/48/8.8BPM
Playoffs: 25.3p/10.6r/2.9a/ 22.5PER/.606TS%/.151WS/48/3.5BPM

What stat are you using to measure that PnR defense (or defense as a whole)? What about offensive gravity? Somehow Jokic gets credit for winning more in the playoffs when the reality is...

Jokic
18-19 Playoff Net (14 games): +7.0
18-19 Playoff On/Off (14 games): +23.7

19-20 Playoff Net (19 games): -3.5
19-20 Playoff On/Off (19 games): -3.0

20-21 Playoff Net (10 games): -8.4
20-21 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -8.2

21-22 Playoff Net (5 games): -14.4
21-22 Playoff On/Off (5 games): -16.5

22-23 Playoff Net (10 games): +6.9
22-23 Playoff On/Off (10 games): -4.3

Cumulative Playoff Net (58 games): -0.6
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (58 games): +1.8


Embiid
17-18 Playoff Net (8 games): +5.6
17-18 Playoff On/Off (8 games): +6.6

18-18 Playoff Net (11 games): +20.5
18-19 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +41.6

19-20 Playoff Net (4 games): -21.2
19-20 Playoff On/Off (4 games): -32.9

20-21 Playoff Net (11 games): +14.7
20-21 Playoff On/Off (11 games): +19.9

21-22 (10 games): +4.6
21-22 (10 games): +11.3

22-23 Playoff Net (7 games): +4.6
22-23 Playoff On/Off (7 games): +4.5

Cumulative Playoff Net (51): +7.7
Cumulative Playoff On/Off (51): +13.4


The ONLY smudge on Embiid's playoff impact profile was in by far the smallest sample (4 games) and furthermore the only season in which Embiid was forced to play next to another big man in Horford (which everyone knew would not work).

At the end of the day winning is what matters and JoJo does it even better than Joker. Yeah I said it

Based off of what? Both in their career have 5 playoff series wins. If we dont count the first 3 years of Embiid's career where he only played a total of 33 games. So in their last 6 seasons Jokic has 40 more regular season wins than Embiid. There is no way we are judging who is the better winner based off of small sample sizes of On/Off and Net Rating. That in no way trumps all the other factors.

[Zombiesonics]

Jokic has got to be one of the best playoff performers in the history of the game. He put up inexplicable numbers @ 23 when he got his first bite at the apple, 4 years later he is peaking it seems. Lebron and MJ won their first chip @ 27...jokic on the same path? Need murray and MPJ to really put their imprint on things to help him out

But I thought he was unplayable in the playoffs because teams will just pick and roll him to death

Its funny to reflect on the hacks in the media going after him during the season. It really does seem insane in hindsight, guys like perkins etc going off on how he is being overrated. But then you see a real HOF pantheon level players like barkley and shaq completely gush over him... real recognize real!

[Joao Saraiva]

And we will have to listen to guys saying Embiid is better, that Joker won 2 MVPs cause he's white and stuff like that all over again next year.

It's just the media. But I can't blame em, Jokic is probably not a guy who generates as much views and online interactions when mentioned as some others do.