2023 Draft Discussion Part 5

[Bruin]

At 13 I’m good with any of Keyonte, Kobe, or Wallace

If we can acquire 23 (alongside 3) from Portland then we could use that one to take a flyer on a raw prospect

[Psubs]

I'm down for Wallace, Bufkin or Cissoko. All guards that can dunk.

[dozo]

Read on Twitter

[Bruin]

Wearing Raptors shorts

[DreamTeam09]

I'm down for Wallace, Bufkin or Cissoko. All guards that can dunk.

Are we sure Cissoko is a guard ? If he is then what's the issue for not being higher or our #1

[ATLTimekeeper]

Jimmy Butler is showing how unimportant to success a Tyler Herro is to winning. Just plug in Strus and Martin like players for the MLE or less and you can get by. We first saw how useless (now overpaid) Jordan Poole can be. They will put up points and get paid a lot but not help you win. You need the elite ones like Jamal Murray or a Jrue Holiday that brings defense to help win.

Yeah there's a good point in there about how scoring gets paid, and so teams will have to pony up on the second contract. In the draft you might get better overall value from OG (now we have to overpay on the 3rd contract, though).

[Dalek]

I like that Max Lewis has only one image on his Instagram and he is wearing Toronto Raptors shorts.

He is the singular wing in this draft:

6'7, 7' WS, 207 lbs prototypical wing size
20+ Dunks
20+ Usage
30+ FTR
15+ Ast%
30+ Threes

Raps unafraid of drafting mid-major, late to bball prospects as long as they work hard and believe in themselves.

I believe that he can ironout the playmaking and defense because it just requires more reps. The instincts and will are there it just a technique issue.

He is working out 2+ months with Abunasser in Vegas where Malachi worked out. He says he has been working out daily with Josh Green, Blake Wesley and just as good if not better than those players so he is playing NBA guys to get better.

Overall, I put him at 13 because he can dribble pass and shoot and has optimal size and athleticism.

In the interview Barlowe did with him he said his efficiency went down as the season went on once teams singularly focused on him, doubled him and made his life hell. You have to wonder what he looks like as an off-ball player to start where the focus won't be on him and he can play a different role than he did at Pepperdine which involves less dribbling (and overdribbling), offense initiation, ability to focus more on defense.

If he does put it all together he might be one of those guys who needs until like 25-26 years old.

Regarding how this season went, he did face a lot of adjustments and the pressure of being the primary was a huge leap for a guy who wasn't even the primary option in high school. A couple numbers to consider from this year:

61% at the rim is excellent (85-139 - close to Bufkin territory); but also has +30 FTR so he is getting contact and is 20 lbs heavier than KB.

56% assisted threes shows a huge self-creation burden that likely impacted his numbers as the season went. If you watch Pepperdine he is often operating late into the shotclock with defensive pressure. Jordan Hawkins had 90% assisted threes.

43% catch and shoot (28/65) shows the upside of him in his secondary/tertiary role.

Honestly, he is bigger, more athletic and seems dynamic enough to be a lottery pick. The lack of winning and sketchy defense are red flags, but his size/athleticism/skill combo to me equates to low bust potential because he looks the profile and shows some impressive flashes (spot up, off-movement shots, and off-the-dribble at his size are special).

[Psubs]

I'm down for Wallace, Bufkin or Cissoko. All guards that can dunk.

Are we sure Cissoko is a guard ? If he is then what's the issue for not being higher or our #1

He was PG for France juniors. He's grew around an inch to almost 6'6 (without shoes) this past year. Scoot was the PG, you can see Sidy run the P&R and make sweet pocket passes. He looks like he's around average at guarding the POA; better than having Barnes roaming around there.

Cason looks like he shoots the 3 better and I would take him if available as might be able to trade for a later pick and also get Sidy.

[Psubs]

Jimmy Butler is showing how unimportant to success a Tyler Herro is to winning. Just plug in Strus and Martin like players for the MLE or less and you can get by. We first saw how useless (now overpaid) Jordan Poole can be. They will put up points and get paid a lot but not help you win. You need the elite ones like Jamal Murray or a Jrue Holiday that brings defense to help win.

Yeah there's a good point in there about how scoring gets paid, and so teams will have to pony up on the second contract. In the draft you might get better overall value from OG (now we have to overpay on the 3rd contract, though).

But is it really an overpay when he's 2nd team all-defense (could argue he is 1st team). He still might be paid less than Poole and John Collins because of his well-roundedness and that's amazing.

[deeps6x]

Watch on YouTube

If Wallace and Bufkin shot 70 and 71% at the rim, as these guys said, then I'm fine with either of them. Will either be available at #13? I don't know.

[niQ]

Would love Kobe or Cason.
Cason likely gone before 13 though.
If Kobe also gone, wouldn't mind swinging on Keyonte, Coulibaly, or Cissoko.

I still do love Hawkins' shooting though.

[WuTang_CMB]

Would love Kobe or Cason.
Cason likely gone before 13 though.
If Kobe also gone, wouldn't mind swinging on Keyonte, Coulibaly, or Cissoko.

I still do love Hawkins' shooting though.

I'm in the same space minus Keyonte. But maybe Raps look at the offensive upside and say its too good to pass up and we can live with the mediocre defense.

Interviewing guys like JJ and Nash might also point to this. I'm not saying we won't value defense as I still believe that's #1 for us on the overall for team building ... but I am sure witnessing what's going on in the NBA right now, you can see the shift and how you need to score in the playoffs to be successful. Therefore, they might lean to a more balanced approach.

I always found it odd that Nurse wanted all defenders on the team and if you couldn't defend, you couldnt play. He hated GTJ because he wasn't an above average defender... that's not really practical in today's NBA - just look at the playoffs. If you have one guy who can really score it but is an average defender, is it that bad? You need those guys.

I think Raps realizing they need better balance and that's a good thing. Wouldn't be surprised if they go with Keyonte

[DreamTeam09]

Who's actually supposed to take Wallace before Us?

Spurs - Vic
Hornets - Miller or Scoot
Portland - Scoot or Miller
Rockets - Amen
Det - Cam Whitmore
Orlando - Taylor Hendricks
Indy - Jarace Walker
Was - Asur or Black
Utah - Black or Asur
Dal - Grady Dick
Orlando - NSJ
Thunder - Reupert or Miller
Raptors - Cason Wallace

This is the best mock I've seen to date, Wallace is definitely a drop candidate

[Psubs]

Watch on YouTube

If Wallace and Bufkin shot 70 and 71% at the rim, as these guys said, then I'm fine with either of them. Will either be available at #13? I don't know.

Bufkin is young enough to be a freshman so could he still grow? The guy on the left thinks he's almost 6'6 Maybe 6'6 in shoes? He's could be Manu 2.0!

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

I like that Max Lewis has only one image on his Instagram and he is wearing Toronto Raptors shorts.

He is the singular wing in this draft:

6'7, 7' WS, 207 lbs prototypical wing size
20+ Dunks
20+ Usage
30+ FTR
15+ Ast%
30+ Threes

Raps unafraid of drafting mid-major, late to bball prospects as long as they work hard and believe in themselves.

I believe that he can ironout the playmaking and defense because it just requires more reps. The instincts and will are there it just a technique issue.

He is working out 2+ months with Abunasser in Vegas where Malachi worked out. He says he has been working out daily with Josh Green, Blake Wesley and just as good if not better than those players so he is playing NBA guys to get better.

Overall, I put him at 13 because he can dribble pass and shoot and has optimal size and athleticism.

In the interview Barlowe did with him he said his efficiency went down as the season went on once teams singularly focused on him, doubled him and made his life hell. You have to wonder what he looks like as an off-ball player to start where the focus won't be on him and he can play a different role than he did at Pepperdine which involves less dribbling (and overdribbling), offense initiation, ability to focus more on defense.

If he does put it all together he might be one of those guys who needs until like 25-26 years old.

Regarding how this season went, he did face a lot of adjustments and the pressure of being the primary was a huge leap for a guy who wasn't even the primary option in high school. A couple numbers to consider from this year:

61% at the rim is excellent (85-139 - close to Bufkin territory); but also has +30 FTR so he is getting contact and is 20 lbs heavier than KB.

56% assisted threes shows a huge self-creation burden that likely impacted his numbers as the season went. If you watch Pepperdine he is often operating late into the shotclock with defensive pressure. Jordan Hawkins had 90% assisted threes.

43% catch and shoot (28/65) shows the upside of him in his secondary/tertiary role.

Honestly, he is bigger, more athletic and seems dynamic enough to be a lottery pick. The lack of winning and sketchy defense are red flags, but his size/athleticism/skill combo to me equates to low bust potential because he looks the profile and shows some impressive flashes (spot up, off-movement shots, and off-the-dribble at his size are special).

I mean that's why he's a fascinating player to me but I can't deny that the defense was atrocious and that his handle isn't as tight as it needs to be for a guy like him who you're drafting to become a 3 level scorer. He has a very steep hill to climb as he is way behind a lot of other players but at the same time he possesses traits that you cannot teach which only the most elite NBA players possess which makes him an enigma. This guy can score in every way imaginable in transition and in the half court and makes it look easy at times.

I think a team like Sacramento might be in a position to gamble on him and he would be well served going to an offensive powerhouse like that, they can possibly find a way to get him to an adequate level of defense and then mask the rest of it.

[DreamTeam09]

NBAdrsdt.net has us taking Wallace as well with NSJ and GG Jackson being the two players in front of him making him fall to us

[Jadoogar]

My top 3 right now would be Gradey Dick, Kobe Bufin and Jordan Hawkins
The emphasis has to on acquiring shooting and/or shot creation.

[niQ]

Who's actually supposed to take Wallace before Us?

Spurs - Vic
Hornets - Miller or Scoot
Portland - Scoot or Miller
Rockets - Amen
Det - Cam Whitmore
Orlando - Taylor Hendricks
Indy - Jarace Walker
Was - Asur or Black
Utah - Black or Asur
Dal - Grady Dick
Orlando - NSJ
Thunder - Reupert or Miller
Raptors - Cason Wallace

This is the best mock I've seen to date, Wallace is definitely a drop candidate

Most likely Washington and Utah as they need a starting PG.

Then there's a small chance a team like Dallas or Magic take him.

My gut feeling is OKC doesn't need another PG with Shai, Giddey, and to a lesser extent Tre Mann. I feel like their team needs more shooting.

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

I think there's a solid chance Jarace falls out of top 10.

[ATLTimekeeper]

Regarding how this season went, he did face a lot of adjustments and the pressure of being the primary was a huge leap for a guy who wasn't even the primary option in high school. A couple numbers to consider from this year:

61% at the rim is excellent (85-139 - close to Bufkin territory); but also has +30 FTR so he is getting contact and is 20 lbs heavier than KB.

I think this is a bad comparison. He's 6'7, and so that's more of a average to slightly below % for that height. Bufkin is close to 69% at 6"4 on similar attempts but much lower usage. That's why people are impressed with his number.