pipfan wrote:Owly wrote:pipfan wrote:I would assume everyone shares the first 12 names-that they are all top 20 players
I concur with Colbinii.
First only on a philosophical level I think it's not great practice.
Secondarily, as you note, that 85% covers beyond the 12 to the 17.
Thirdly it depends on the audience but just looking at published lists whilst there may well also be some groupthink just asking enough people you will always see difference. Someone recently had LeBron at 23 (viewtopic.php?f=64&t=2261392)... not to endorse that view.
I'm sure I've seen views on Curry that suggest not top 20 though maybe the title quieted that?
I can see a case that Kobe belongs with a Nowitzki ... similarly productive, think the long-term RAPMs somewhat clearly favor Dirk.
In the second list I can very easily see (i.e. I possess ...) a view that has Erving out of the top 20 ... perhaps a considerable way out. The 76ers era impact stuff, however noisy, would kill a modern player's candidacy and I think it does for him.
It doesn't really matter but the baked in assumptions would, I think, tend to hurt the debate and, more so, mess with the poll, for whatever that matters (if people don't bother engaging in the chat then at best we get their top three, but not necessarily all those who would be in the top 20), though for me the discussion would be the more important thing.
Thanks for the good points, but I just like the polls-fine them interesting. This board seems like the highest level of BBall discussion possible (that I know of, at least). So I find it hard to believe a quality poster on the PC board would have LBJ out of the top 10, no matter the criteria.
I see the argument for Dr. J, but I think the ABA years have to count.
I like to see that the 3 I voted for (KD, DRob, Dirk) are leading the voting. OF COURSE, there are arguments for others, but I guess I don't see a logical argument to have the Big O or West out of the GOAT top 20.
fwiw ...
I'm absolutely not endorsing the LeBron ranking. I think he's 1. I think you could go to a higher ranking, lower number than 10 and say it's not credible.
I would also count ABA unless the listing criteria/context demanded otherwise. I just think the impact stuff hurts his other years so much (and probably tend to confirm the view that his D was significantly worse than his box defense and at best okay - perhaps coloring his net ABA goodness).
My at a glance interpretation would be
82 looks strong (+10)
'77 looks pretty solid (+6)
'83 looks part of an effective unit, but likely not the driver (+10.3: behind Malone, Cheeks, Jones).
Beyond that there's not a lot that looks great. His overall on-off might possibly be a touch inflated for the spell as I think core lineups were better than the bench (more so than other teams). You'd have to look at it closer, we're on the stronger end of the ABA and there's strong playoff runs there but for me, given how much on-off doesn't see him as an impact player in the NBA, it's hard for me to see him belonging in this territory.
