2022-2023 Magic Trade and Free Agency Idea Thread III

[basketballRob]

I don't ever recall a team that has 25% of their cap available trading a bunch of picks for a player. We're in the position now, like Atlanta, a few years ago when they signed Bogdanovic and Galinari. Then, two years later, they traded a bunch of picks for Murray.

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[pepe1991]

I would say that Hawks f*** up by keeping their picks ( Cam Reddish selected 10, Okonwgu 6#) when they didn't need those guys and those picks had way more value as picks , before they turned into players.

Hawks on backs of Young, Collins ;Capella, Galo, Bogdan went to ECF.
Their lottery picks (Hunter, Okonwgu, Cam) are all mediocre role players that would have been way more valuable as trade assets than actual players. Hell, Cam is excellent example of player who's value nosedived over time to the point of no value left to be traded.

[eyriq]

I would say that Hawks f*** up by keeping their picks ( Cam Reddish selected 10, Okonwgu 6#) when they didn't need those guys and those picks had way more value as picks , before they turned into players.

Hawks on backs of Young, Collins ;Capella, Galo, Bogdan went to ECF.
Their lottery picks (Hunter, Okonwgu, Cam) are all mediocre role players that would have been way more valuable as trade assets than actual players. Hell, Cam is excellent example of player who's value nosedived over time to the point of no value left to be traded.

That's an argument in favor of the Magic trading the picks

[pepe1991]

I would say that Hawks f*** up by keeping their picks ( Cam Reddish selected 10, Okonwgu 6#) when they didn't need those guys and those picks had way more value as picks , before they turned into players.

Hawks on backs of Young, Collins ;Capella, Galo, Bogdan went to ECF.
Their lottery picks (Hunter, Okonwgu, Cam) are all mediocre role players that would have been way more valuable as trade assets than actual players. Hell, Cam is excellent example of player who's value nosedived over time to the point of no value left to be traded.

That's an argument in favor of the Magic trading the picks

i would draft somebody at 6# and trade pick for future pick(s) or established player, or use pick to facilitate bigger trade for other team(s).

I just don't see any tengable value of bringing two rookies on already young team where everybody needs ball and usage to even develop, let alone come together and win some games.

[Blue_and_Whte]

I would say that Hawks f*** up by keeping their picks ( Cam Reddish selected 10, Okonwgu 6#) when they didn't need those guys and those picks had way more value as picks , before they turned into players.

Hawks on backs of Young, Collins ;Capella, Galo, Bogdan went to ECF.
Their lottery picks (Hunter, Okonwgu, Cam) are all mediocre role players that would have been way more valuable as trade assets than actual players. Hell, Cam is excellent example of player who's value nosedived over time to the point of no value left to be traded.

That's an argument in favor of the Magic trading the picks

Or maybe the Hawks should draft better.

[basketballRob]

I would say that Hawks f*** up by keeping their picks ( Cam Reddish selected 10, Okonwgu 6#) when they didn't need those guys and those picks had way more value as picks , before they turned into players.

Hawks on backs of Young, Collins ;Capella, Galo, Bogdan went to ECF.
Their lottery picks (Hunter, Okonwgu, Cam) are all mediocre role players that would have been way more valuable as trade assets than actual players. Hell, Cam is excellent example of player who's value nosedived over time to the point of no value left to be traded.

That's an argument in favor of the Magic trading the picks

i would draft somebody at 6# and trade pick for future pick(s) or established player, or use pick to facilitate bigger trade for other team(s).

I just don't see any tengable value of bringing two rookies on already young team where everybody needs ball and usage to even develop, let alone come together and win some games.

The Cam Reddish pick was in the Trae Young for Doncic trade. The Hawks traded the 3rd pick for the 5th and 10th.

If we follow that mold, we would trade the 6th and 11th pick for the 4th pick. I'm just not a fan of the projected 4th pick.

Correction, the Mavs traded Young and the 30th pick, Omari Spellman for Doncic.





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[Skybox]

Poole would, arguably, be a payroll dump (with upside). Wiggins is a completely different bet...he's proven to be what maybe, just maybe Ausar or Whitmore could perhaps, if everything goes right, become. Wiggins also just signed a very reasonable extension for a guy in his prime that can, basically do everything at 2/3.

But I get it.

Trading 6 for a guy who turns 29 during next season and isn't really an all-star seems like bad business.

Andrew Wiggins for 3 or 4 years has more value than the #6. Eating his contract will be tough, so the Magic need compensation for that.

Here's the list of Mr. #6. Orlando will end up with this sort of player. More busts than booms.
Bennedict Mathurin
Josh Giddey
Onyeka Okongwu
Jarrett Culver
Mo Bamba
Jonathan Isaac
Buddy Hield
Willie Cauley-Stein
Marcus Smart
Nerlens Noel
Damian Lillard
Jan Veselý
Ekpe Udoh
Jonny Flynn
Danilo Gallinari

Are you guys aware that Wiggins' new contract (starting this year) averages $27m? We are not talking about some Jaylen Brown/Beal $50m deal...he is a healthy 28 yo, a lockdown defender as a Warrior, very long and elite athleticism at the 2, shot 39.5% from 3 on 6 attempts over the last couple of years, would easily score 20+ outside of the Splash Bros. massive shadow (has done it before). This is not the MIN guy with the giant contract...who was actually always good, but overshadowed by the contract and the losing in MIN. We'd be getting a seasoned, polished, ring-wearing version. He's got quite a few years left in his prime...we've got too many children already. Wiggins is a sure thing...he's far more offensively well-rounded than GTJ and twice the defender. Not sure what you hope to get with 6...we could get a younger Gary Trent at 11, for a much lower salary if that's all we are aiming for.

So much talk about GSW needing a salary dump that I think people are confusing Poole's high-risk profile (at $32m per with wild swings of inefficiency) with Wiggins. I'd rather have Wiggins at $27m than Jaylen Brown at $40+ or Klay at $40+. Check the GSW page...they about threw me out the door as Wiggins is "core" along with Curry. Wiggins, playing elite D and scoring 23ppg in ORL, would be an East All-Star...who's doing that at 6 and IF they do -when? Who else at SG is as big, as athletic, as offensively gifted, and plays lockdown D?

[pepe1991]

I would say that Hawks f*** up by keeping their picks ( Cam Reddish selected 10, Okonwgu 6#) when they didn't need those guys and those picks had way more value as picks , before they turned into players.

Hawks on backs of Young, Collins ;Capella, Galo, Bogdan went to ECF.
Their lottery picks (Hunter, Okonwgu, Cam) are all mediocre role players that would have been way more valuable as trade assets than actual players. Hell, Cam is excellent example of player who's value nosedived over time to the point of no value left to be traded.

That's an argument in favor of the Magic trading the picks

Or maybe the Hawks should draft better.

It's not really objective scenario to win games, go for title, develop young players and give them proper repetition, usage and time to learn through mistakes.

For example Cam Reddish, he was BPA and player in position of need. They gave him starting job off gates, they played worst with him.
In sophmore year he was still starter, but they benefited a lot from his injury. They were 31-15 without him and 10-16 with him.
by year 3 they tapped out on that experiment and he was removed.

Kuminga/Wiseman/ Moody thing pretty much suggests that it's not possible to keep high winning percentage and play that many young , inexperienced, flat out bad players all at once without decline in quality of final outcome.

[GatorbaitDD]

I would say that Hawks f*** up by keeping their picks ( Cam Reddish selected 10, Okonwgu 6#) when they didn't need those guys and those picks had way more value as picks , before they turned into players.

Hawks on backs of Young, Collins ;Capella, Galo, Bogdan went to ECF.
Their lottery picks (Hunter, Okonwgu, Cam) are all mediocre role players that would have been way more valuable as trade assets than actual players. Hell, Cam is excellent example of player who's value nosedived over time to the point of no value left to be traded.

That's an argument in favor of the Magic trading the picks

i would draft somebody at 6# and trade pick for future pick(s) or established player, or use pick to facilitate bigger trade for other team(s).

I just don't see any tengable value of bringing two rookies on already young team where everybody needs ball and usage to even develop, let alone come together and win some games.

Funny enough, I think 6 is more desirable to trade out of based on perceived value and players in that range. All depends on the asset coming back of course, but I love a lot of the guys in the 11 range (Wallace, Dick, George, Hawkins).

I think our trade target should be a player with 3 or less years left on their deal to protect ourselves for the inevitable max deal for both Wagner/Banchero. Goal should be building a consistent playoff team over the next 3 years until Wagner/Banchero are ready to carry the load.

[Skybox]

That's an argument in favor of the Magic trading the picks

i would draft somebody at 6# and trade pick for future pick(s) or established player, or use pick to facilitate bigger trade for other team(s).

I just don't see any tengable value of bringing two rookies on already young team where everybody needs ball and usage to even develop, let alone come together and win some games.

Funny enough, I think 6 is more desirable to trade out of based on perceived value and players in that range. All depends on the asset coming back of course, but I love a lot of the guys in the 11 range (Wallace, Dick, George, Hawkins).

I think our trade target should be a player with 3 or less years left on their deal to protect ourselves for the inevitable max deal for both Wagner/Banchero. Goal should be building a consistent playoff team over the next 3 years until Wagner/Banchero are ready to carry the load.

I totally agree about 6 vs 11 for ORL...there are guys at 6 (range) that should have more value to others than to us. And...for all the concern about "timeline", you could say we have too many guys the same age...that's not optimal, beyond a certain point.

I think at 11, we could easily grab a guy that we would probably have to pay 18m+ for in FA, like Gary Trent, to fill that limited specific need of a knock down shooter. There WILL be a star available at 6, but God only knows who (among the busts) it will be.

[VFX]

That's an argument in favor of the Magic trading the picks

Or maybe the Hawks should draft better.

It's not really objective scenario to win games, go for title, develop young players and give them proper repetition, usage and time to learn through mistakes.

For example Cam Reddish, he was BPA and player in position of need. They gave him starting job off gates, they played worst with him.
In sophmore year he was still starter, but they benefited a lot from his injury. They were 31-15 without him and 10-16 with him.
by year 3 they tapped out on that experiment and he was removed.

Kuminga/Wiseman/ Moody thing pretty much suggests that it's not possible to keep high winning percentage and play that many young , inexperienced, flat out bad players all at once without decline in quality of final outcome.

Well yeah, Golden State decided to pay Poole a ridiculous undeserving contract and trade back for Gary Payton.

Wiseman is a bust and Kuminga/Moody simply weren’t good enough to log real minutes. They used their vet deals on J. Green and Iguodala who wasn’t available.

That’s kinda what happens when you have the most expensive roster in history paying 5 guys huge salaries.

Where I’d meet you halfway is that the Warriors should have traded one or both of the Kuminga/Moody picks considering they were already contenders.

[zaymon]

i would draft somebody at 6# and trade pick for future pick(s) or established player, or use pick to facilitate bigger trade for other team(s).

I just don't see any tengable value of bringing two rookies on already young team where everybody needs ball and usage to even develop, let alone come together and win some games.

Funny enough, I think 6 is more desirable to trade out of based on perceived value and players in that range. All depends on the asset coming back of course, but I love a lot of the guys in the 11 range (Wallace, Dick, George, Hawkins).

I think our trade target should be a player with 3 or less years left on their deal to protect ourselves for the inevitable max deal for both Wagner/Banchero. Goal should be building a consistent playoff team over the next 3 years until Wagner/Banchero are ready to carry the load.

I totally agree about 6 vs 11 for ORL...there are guys at 6 (range) that should have more value to others than to us. And...for all the concern about "timeline", you could say we have too many guys the same age...that's not optimal, beyond a certain point.

I think at 11, we could easily grab a guy that we would probably have to pay 18m+ for in FA, like Gary Trent, to fill that limited specific need of a knock down shooter. There WILL be a star available at 6, but God only knows who (among the busts) it will be.

I think value of #6 is tied closely to Thompson twins. I am also not sure how much someone like Cason Wallace or Kobe Bufkin can raise his value until draft. I am more and more interested in Kobe Bufkin, even consider him at 6. He has rare combination of skills and tools

[Skybox]

Funny enough, I think 6 is more desirable to trade out of based on perceived value and players in that range. All depends on the asset coming back of course, but I love a lot of the guys in the 11 range (Wallace, Dick, George, Hawkins).

I think our trade target should be a player with 3 or less years left on their deal to protect ourselves for the inevitable max deal for both Wagner/Banchero. Goal should be building a consistent playoff team over the next 3 years until Wagner/Banchero are ready to carry the load.

I totally agree about 6 vs 11 for ORL...there are guys at 6 (range) that should have more value to others than to us. And...for all the concern about "timeline", you could say we have too many guys the same age...that's not optimal, beyond a certain point.

I think at 11, we could easily grab a guy that we would probably have to pay 18m+ for in FA, like Gary Trent, to fill that limited specific need of a knock down shooter. There WILL be a star available at 6, but God only knows who (among the busts) it will be.

I think value of #6 is tied closely to Thompson twins. I am also not sure how much someone like Cason Wallace or Kobe Bufkin can raise his value until draft. I am more and more interested in Kobe Bufkin, even consider him at 6. He has rare combination of skills and tools

I'm with you...I'd love to drop back from 6, grab a good young vet and still draft a lesser upside, higher floor guy like Bufkin or Lively.
* obviously, assuming FO has killer secret workouts and recognizes "It" in a less-visible pick.

[VFX]

I totally agree about 6 vs 11 for ORL...there are guys at 6 (range) that should have more value to others than to us. And...for all the concern about "timeline", you could say we have too many guys the same age...that's not optimal, beyond a certain point.

I think at 11, we could easily grab a guy that we would probably have to pay 18m+ for in FA, like Gary Trent, to fill that limited specific need of a knock down shooter. There WILL be a star available at 6, but God only knows who (among the busts) it will be.

I think value of #6 is tied closely to Thompson twins. I am also not sure how much someone like Cason Wallace or Kobe Bufkin can raise his value until draft. I am more and more interested in Kobe Bufkin, even consider him at 6. He has rare combination of skills and tools

I'm with you...I'd love to drop back from 6, grab a good young vet and still draft a lesser upside, higher floor guy like Bufkin or Lively.
* obviously, assuming FO has killer secret workouts and recognizes "It" in a less-visible pick.

Who do you think equals pick #6 value for a vet?

[Skybox]

I think value of #6 is tied closely to Thompson twins. I am also not sure how much someone like Cason Wallace or Kobe Bufkin can raise his value until draft. I am more and more interested in Kobe Bufkin, even consider him at 6. He has rare combination of skills and tools

I'm with you...I'd love to drop back from 6, grab a good young vet and still draft a lesser upside, higher floor guy like Bufkin or Lively.
* obviously, assuming FO has killer secret workouts and recognizes "It" in a less-visible pick.

Who do you think equals pick #6 value for a vet?

I'm leaning Wiggins at the moment, considering cap space too for GSW...otherwise, they'd have no interest
In another thread, Lavine came up...I'd only do it if we still had cap (and a wink wink) for FVV, I don't want Lavine without a strong vet presence at PG.
It's well documented that I'd like a vet PG...anyone you'd see out there for #6 that could run things?

What do you think?

[VFX]

I'm with you...I'd love to drop back from 6, grab a good young vet and still draft a lesser upside, higher floor guy like Bufkin or Lively.
* obviously, assuming FO has killer secret workouts and recognizes "It" in a less-visible pick.

Who do you think equals pick #6 value for a vet?

I'm leaning Wiggins at the moment, considering cap space too for GSW...otherwise, they'd have no interest
In another thread, Lavine came up...I'd only do it if we still had cap (and a wink wink) for FVV, I don't want Lavine without a strong vet presence at PG.
It's well documented that I'd like a vet PG...anyone you'd see out there for #6 that could run things?

What do you think?

Warriors will move Poole before Wiggins I think.

Pass on Lavine.

[yoyojw17]

Trading 6 for a guy who turns 29 during next season and isn't really an all-star seems like bad business.

Andrew Wiggins for 3 or 4 years has more value than the #6. Eating his contract will be tough, so the Magic need compensation for that.

Here's the list of Mr. #6. Orlando will end up with this sort of player. More busts than booms.
Bennedict Mathurin
Josh Giddey
Onyeka Okongwu
Jarrett Culver
Mo Bamba
Jonathan Isaac
Buddy Hield
Willie Cauley-Stein
Marcus Smart
Nerlens Noel
Damian Lillard
Jan Veselý
Ekpe Udoh
Jonny Flynn
Danilo Gallinari

Are you guys aware that Wiggins' new contract (starting this year) averages $27m? We are not talking about some Jaylen Brown/Beal $50m deal...he is a healthy 28 yo, a lockdown defender as a Warrior, very long and elite athleticism at the 2, shot 39.5% from 3 on 6 attempts over the last couple of years, would easily score 20+ outside of the Splash Bros. massive shadow (has done it before). This is not the MIN guy with the giant contract...who was actually always good, but overshadowed by the contract and the losing in MIN. We'd be getting a seasoned, polished, ring-wearing version. He's got quite a few years left in his prime...we've got too many children already. Wiggins is a sure thing...he's far more offensively well-rounded than GTJ and twice the defender. Not sure what you hope to get with 6...we could get a younger Gary Trent at 11, for a much lower salary if that's all we are aiming for.

So much talk about GSW needing a salary dump that I think people are confusing Poole's high-risk profile (at $32m per with wild swings of inefficiency) with Wiggins. I'd rather have Wiggins at $27m than Jaylen Brown at $40+ or Klay at $40+. Check the GSW page...they about threw me out the door as Wiggins is "core" along with Curry. Wiggins, playing elite D and scoring 23ppg in ORL, would be an East All-Star...who's doing that at 6 and IF they do -when? Who else at SG is as big, as athletic, as offensively gifted, and plays lockdown D?

Yeah... i made a push for a wiggins trade earlier as well. I like his fit here. He will bring what we want at the sg and sf position... with now playoff experience. His mindset seems to have changed since no longer having to fill the #1 option shoes and playing the secondary or tertiary role. He would fit right in with what we've got. At that point... with the wing position all sured up... i would see a place where they go with a player like lively with the 11th pick... and he will have an immediate role on the team.

Gary harris + 6th pick and cap space for wiggins. not sure if that gets it done.

Fultz/Anthony
Wiggins/Suggs/#36 pick
Wagner/Houstan/Okeke/#36 pick
Banchero/Isaac/Bol
Wendell/Lively/Mo/Goga

That would be a fun team to watch next season

[89Magicfan]

Any lineup I see Fultz with gives me doubts.

[basketballRob]

I remember the Magic trying to get a lottery pick for AG, and they couldn't. So I would assume you would have to be a player that is better than him to get the 6th pick.

It was rumored that the Magic wanted to move up and get a guard that season. So either Garland, Coby White, or Herro.

I still think the Magic should trade the 6th pick for a later lottery pick and a potential lottery pick next season.

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[cedric76]

I d prefer trade for guys like vassell, Mikal or OG, but if those trades are not available OR too pricey I think we should strongly consider Gary Trent junior.

He is unhappy in Toronto (might change now that nurse is gone) and we could offer him decent money and the starting SG position here.

Looking at other teams with cap space I can see any teams offering him more than 75 M for 4 yrs.

I would be happy offering this front loaded (21 19 18 17), this is the salary for a solid 4th option

If you know you can get him in free agency (teams don't wait for 1st July to speak), then you can draft differently

Go for high risk high reward picks

Highest upside with 6
Lively with 11

Imo lively s floor is Mitchell Robinson, however if we draft him we should have him in g league next season for him to get bigger and get used to play against bigger bodies


Fultz,cole, suggs
Trent jr,suggs, Harris
Franz, Hendricks
Paolo, JI
Wcj,goga

Bench: Chuma, Houstan, bol, Moe
Lively to join team in Feb 2024

I love your team, (Lively is a 3rd stringer in year one and might get a lot of Osceola time. )

For me, a) there is no circumstance I would want G-Harris on this team. With Trent, that is now at 11 on the dial. And if the Magic draft Hendricks at 6, to swing for the fences at 11, I would instead draft Leonard Miller. Resigning M-Wagner is key.

My team based on this is similar to yours.

Fultz/Anthony/some-dude
Trent/Suggs/Houstan
F-Wagner/Bol/Miller
Banchero/Isaac/Hendricks
Carter/Bitadze/M-Wagner

That is a playoff team, and a team that can grow into a 2024 title contender (perhaps requiring a Fultz upgrade next off-season).

For me the key to your plan and my plan, is that these are easy outcomes. Making the above teams is not GM-of-the-year calibre activities! This is WeHamm doable.
..

Why don't you want Harris around? He is a good vet and is expiring (nice trade chip)

Miller could be a nice gamble tooe