ImageImageImageImageImage

2023 Draft Discussion Part 5

Moderators: DG88, niQ, Duffman100, tsherkin, Reeko, lebron stopper, HiJiNX, 7 Footer, Morris_Shatford

User avatar
Psubs
RealGM
Posts: 20,785
And1: 11,885
Joined: Nov 20, 2004
Location: Toronto

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1801 » by Psubs » Fri Jun 2, 2023 12:27 pm

Grew wrote:
C_Money wrote:
Mark_83 wrote:Remember that poster "NoLillard" a few years ago. He was so convinced Lillard would be a bust and we should avoid him at all costs that he literally made that his identity. I wonder what he ended up changing his name to. lol


I remember being on the board back then. Half of us wanted Lillard and the other half wanted Kendall Marshall. Just goes to show none of us really know wtf we’re talking about and even the scouts get it dead wrong.


The half that wanted Lillard knew a little more than the Kendall Marshall half though :lol:


Get the player that can attack the rim and dunk. :nod: Actually, Scoot reminds me of Lillard a bit.
Image
User avatar
WuTang_CMB
RealGM
Posts: 41,169
And1: 51,633
Joined: Sep 26, 2017
   

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1802 » by WuTang_CMB » Fri Jun 2, 2023 12:50 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20

11. Orlando Magic: Keyonte George (Baylor, SG, Freshman)

Already with the No. 6 pick and a young roster, Orlando could look to trade No. 11, though adding George's scoring and shooting should also be appealing. The fact that he looked slim and well conditioned during his pro day sat well with scouts. Still, Orlando's pick at No. 6 could impact its decision at No. 11. It will be difficult to find minutes for two lottery picks in 2023-24.

12. Oklahoma City Thunder: Dereck Lively (Duke, C, Freshman)

Teams at Lively's pro day came away impressed by his shooting, something we saw more of in AAU and high school. With Oklahoma City's backcourt set and Jalen Williams a clear starter, the Thunder could think about the defensive upside of a Chet Holmgren-Lively frontcourt, with the Duke freshman having made tremendous improvement throughout the season in pick-and-roll coverage and rim protection.

13. Toronto Raptors: Bilal Coulibaly (Metropolitans 92, SF, 2004)

While most prospects use pro days and workouts to try and improve their stock, Coulibaly is helping himself in the LNB Pro A playoffs, most recently going for 15 points in a Game 2 semi-final win over ASVEL. Rumors of a lottery promise have started swirling in NBA circles. Teams in the late lottery have been considering the 18-year-old who's making an impact for Victor Wembanyama's Mets 92 with his effortless bounce, two-way activity and spot-up shooting. Recent flashes of self-creation have only made Coulibaly look more enticing weeks before the draft.


14. New Orleans Pelicans: Nick Smith Jr. (Arkansas, SG, Freshman)

After injuries affected Smith's season and inefficiency cast a cloud over it, scouts sounded pleased with his pro day. Percentages aside, there is plenty of confidence in his shot-making and three-level scoring, which the Pelicans could use in the 2-guard slot or second unit.


It's either Bilal or Bufkin.
Mark_83
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,799
And1: 3,851
Joined: Jun 26, 2008

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1803 » by Mark_83 » Fri Jun 2, 2023 1:23 pm

Psubs wrote:
Grew wrote:
C_Money wrote:
I remember being on the board back then. Half of us wanted Lillard and the other half wanted Kendall Marshall. Just goes to show none of us really know wtf we’re talking about and even the scouts get it dead wrong.


The half that wanted Lillard knew a little more than the Kendall Marshall half though :lol:


Get the player that can attack the rim and dunk. :nod: Actually, Scoot reminds me of Lillard a bit.

He does, except Lillard was already an elite shooter in his draft year.
Mark_83
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,799
And1: 3,851
Joined: Jun 26, 2008

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1804 » by Mark_83 » Fri Jun 2, 2023 1:28 pm

I'll be pretty happy with any of the following at 13.

Coulibaly
Wallace
Bufkin
George
Lively
Cissoko
User avatar
PhilBlackson
RealGM
Posts: 31,805
And1: 46,539
Joined: May 02, 2017
Location: No Wastemans Land
     

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1805 » by PhilBlackson » Fri Jun 2, 2023 1:45 pm

WuTang_OG wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

11. Orlando Magic: Keyonte George (Baylor, SG, Freshman)

Already with the No. 6 pick and a young roster, Orlando could look to trade No. 11, though adding George's scoring and shooting should also be appealing. The fact that he looked slim and well conditioned during his pro day sat well with scouts. Still, Orlando's pick at No. 6 could impact its decision at No. 11. It will be difficult to find minutes for two lottery picks in 2023-24.

12. Oklahoma City Thunder: Dereck Lively (Duke, C, Freshman)

Teams at Lively's pro day came away impressed by his shooting, something we saw more of in AAU and high school. With Oklahoma City's backcourt set and Jalen Williams a clear starter, the Thunder could think about the defensive upside of a Chet Holmgren-Lively frontcourt, with the Duke freshman having made tremendous improvement throughout the season in pick-and-roll coverage and rim protection.

13. Toronto Raptors: Bilal Coulibaly (Metropolitans 92, SF, 2004)

While most prospects use pro days and workouts to try and improve their stock, Coulibaly is helping himself in the LNB Pro A playoffs, most recently going for 15 points in a Game 2 semi-final win over ASVEL. Rumors of a lottery promise have started swirling in NBA circles. Teams in the late lottery have been considering the 18-year-old who's making an impact for Victor Wembanyama's Mets 92 with his effortless bounce, two-way activity and spot-up shooting. Recent flashes of self-creation have only made Coulibaly look more enticing weeks before the draft.


14. New Orleans Pelicans: Nick Smith Jr. (Arkansas, SG, Freshman)

After injuries affected Smith's season and inefficiency cast a cloud over it, scouts sounded pleased with his pro day. Percentages aside, there is plenty of confidence in his shot-making and three-level scoring, which the Pelicans could use in the 2-guard slot or second unit.


It's either Bilal or Bufkin.


Lively makes so much sense to OKC buuuut I just don’t trust Presti not to take the Long Boi lol & I’m sure he watches Bilal and it’s not hard for him to picture BC doing the same stuff next to Chet that he does Vic. I’m just praying that Presti is feeling “practical” at the draft lol and elects to go with Lively (or Miller) to try and help keep Chet healthy by having another big that can help him defend.

It’s gonna be nerve wrecking to wait & hear who they pick right before us. Still so annoying that we made this stupid Play In push that may cost us a high level prospect.
>>>THENOTORIOUSBI3<<< :guitar: *INGRAM*ALLSTARSEASON* Wemby is HIM - Top 5 Player this year
Image
Names of who OG will be better than Shaedon: DelAbbott, ThaCynic, pingpongrac, Los_29, OakleyDokley
User avatar
PhilBlackson
RealGM
Posts: 31,805
And1: 46,539
Joined: May 02, 2017
Location: No Wastemans Land
     

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1806 » by PhilBlackson » Fri Jun 2, 2023 1:54 pm

Mark_83 wrote:I'll be pretty happy with any of the following at 13.

Coulibaly
Wallace
Bufkin
George
Lively
Cissoko


With Lively and Wallace, I wouldn’t be upset but I wouldn’t be thrilled either. I get it, both fantastic defenders but I just want the team to take a chance on trying to find another player with star like potential so I like the rest of your list and if we don’t take someone with star like potential I hope we get a shooter like Hawkins (who can defend) that can alter a defence. My board of players that I’d be happy to end up with…wish we could take one out the first two & one of the last three lol

Bilal
Sidy
Keyonte
Hawkins
Bufkin
>>>THENOTORIOUSBI3<<< :guitar: *INGRAM*ALLSTARSEASON* Wemby is HIM - Top 5 Player this year
Image
Names of who OG will be better than Shaedon: DelAbbott, ThaCynic, pingpongrac, Los_29, OakleyDokley
User avatar
WuTang_CMB
RealGM
Posts: 41,169
And1: 51,633
Joined: Sep 26, 2017
   

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1807 » by WuTang_CMB » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:12 pm

PhilBlackson wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

11. Orlando Magic: Keyonte George (Baylor, SG, Freshman)

Already with the No. 6 pick and a young roster, Orlando could look to trade No. 11, though adding George's scoring and shooting should also be appealing. The fact that he looked slim and well conditioned during his pro day sat well with scouts. Still, Orlando's pick at No. 6 could impact its decision at No. 11. It will be difficult to find minutes for two lottery picks in 2023-24.

12. Oklahoma City Thunder: Dereck Lively (Duke, C, Freshman)

Teams at Lively's pro day came away impressed by his shooting, something we saw more of in AAU and high school. With Oklahoma City's backcourt set and Jalen Williams a clear starter, the Thunder could think about the defensive upside of a Chet Holmgren-Lively frontcourt, with the Duke freshman having made tremendous improvement throughout the season in pick-and-roll coverage and rim protection.

13. Toronto Raptors: Bilal Coulibaly (Metropolitans 92, SF, 2004)

While most prospects use pro days and workouts to try and improve their stock, Coulibaly is helping himself in the LNB Pro A playoffs, most recently going for 15 points in a Game 2 semi-final win over ASVEL. Rumors of a lottery promise have started swirling in NBA circles. Teams in the late lottery have been considering the 18-year-old who's making an impact for Victor Wembanyama's Mets 92 with his effortless bounce, two-way activity and spot-up shooting. Recent flashes of self-creation have only made Coulibaly look more enticing weeks before the draft.


14. New Orleans Pelicans: Nick Smith Jr. (Arkansas, SG, Freshman)

After injuries affected Smith's season and inefficiency cast a cloud over it, scouts sounded pleased with his pro day. Percentages aside, there is plenty of confidence in his shot-making and three-level scoring, which the Pelicans could use in the 2-guard slot or second unit.


It's either Bilal or Bufkin.


Lively makes so much sense to OKC buuuut I just don’t trust Presti not to take the Long Boi lol & I’m sure he watches Bilal and it’s not hard for him to picture BC doing the same stuff next to Chet that he does Vic. I’m just praying that Presti is feeling “practical” at the draft lol and elects to go with Lively (or Miller) to try and help keep Chet healthy by having another big that can help him defend.

It’s gonna be nerve wrecking to wait & hear who they pick right before us. Still so annoying that we made this stupid Play In push that may cost us a high level prospect.


After further thought, I actually think Lively / Chet front court could work. They will play Chet as a stretch 4 and they will have a nice interior presence and clog up lane. Chet will need to be able to guard on the perimeter though.

OKC has a tough call on draft night. Does Presti draft for need considering he already has a nice a glut of guard/wing play (SGA, Giddey, Jalen Williams) ... all 3 of which look to be max guys. Then Dort, Isiah Joe, Dieng. You always draft BPA I get it but OKC turned the corner last year and they should be ready to compete for a playoff spot. Their front court is weak. Lively / Leonard would be nice fits.
Yallbecrazy
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,790
And1: 5,461
Joined: Nov 25, 2013

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1808 » by Yallbecrazy » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:13 pm

PhilBlackson wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

11. Orlando Magic: Keyonte George (Baylor, SG, Freshman)

Already with the No. 6 pick and a young roster, Orlando could look to trade No. 11, though adding George's scoring and shooting should also be appealing. The fact that he looked slim and well conditioned during his pro day sat well with scouts. Still, Orlando's pick at No. 6 could impact its decision at No. 11. It will be difficult to find minutes for two lottery picks in 2023-24.

12. Oklahoma City Thunder: Dereck Lively (Duke, C, Freshman)

Teams at Lively's pro day came away impressed by his shooting, something we saw more of in AAU and high school. With Oklahoma City's backcourt set and Jalen Williams a clear starter, the Thunder could think about the defensive upside of a Chet Holmgren-Lively frontcourt, with the Duke freshman having made tremendous improvement throughout the season in pick-and-roll coverage and rim protection.

13. Toronto Raptors: Bilal Coulibaly (Metropolitans 92, SF, 2004)

While most prospects use pro days and workouts to try and improve their stock, Coulibaly is helping himself in the LNB Pro A playoffs, most recently going for 15 points in a Game 2 semi-final win over ASVEL. Rumors of a lottery promise have started swirling in NBA circles. Teams in the late lottery have been considering the 18-year-old who's making an impact for Victor Wembanyama's Mets 92 with his effortless bounce, two-way activity and spot-up shooting. Recent flashes of self-creation have only made Coulibaly look more enticing weeks before the draft.


14. New Orleans Pelicans: Nick Smith Jr. (Arkansas, SG, Freshman)

After injuries affected Smith's season and inefficiency cast a cloud over it, scouts sounded pleased with his pro day. Percentages aside, there is plenty of confidence in his shot-making and three-level scoring, which the Pelicans could use in the 2-guard slot or second unit.


It's either Bilal or Bufkin.


Lively makes so much sense to OKC buuuut I just don’t trust Presti not to take the Long Boi lol & I’m sure he watches Bilal and it’s not hard for him to picture BC doing the same stuff next to Chet that he does Vic. I’m just praying that Presti is feeling “practical” at the draft lol and elects to go with Lively (or Miller) to try and help keep Chet healthy by having another big that can help him defend.

It’s gonna be nerve wrecking to wait & hear who they pick right before us. Still so annoying that we made this stupid Play In push that may cost us a high level prospect.


My boy Podz now listed @ 20 and he's been floated around the late teens to early 20s range. Soon we'll be hoping he falls to 13.

https://youtu.be/6v5apHgYO1A

Watch the 1st half against a top team in the country and tell me you don't want him @#13.
They hedged and doubled him off every screen, had Strawther on him the whole game who wouldn't help off him at all, no one on Santa Clara could set a screen worth a lick too. Strawther isn't a good defender, but he's 6'7 and athletic and a projected late 1st rounder so when you tell him to just shadow a guy the whole game and not worry about anyone else he can do that pretty well.

edit: shot 44% from 3 facing defenses like this every game the last 3/4 of the year. He had by far the fewest catch and shoot 3s of all the top college shooters as no one helped off him at all, defenses played him like they do Curry in the NBA, you can rotate with the other 4 guys...this guy you don't. All his 3 pt volume were pullups, off the dribble, and some 30 footers too.
Harold_and_Kumar
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,729
And1: 6,662
Joined: Aug 05, 2004
       

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1809 » by Harold_and_Kumar » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:25 pm

PhilBlackson wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

11. Orlando Magic: Keyonte George (Baylor, SG, Freshman)

Already with the No. 6 pick and a young roster, Orlando could look to trade No. 11, though adding George's scoring and shooting should also be appealing. The fact that he looked slim and well conditioned during his pro day sat well with scouts. Still, Orlando's pick at No. 6 could impact its decision at No. 11. It will be difficult to find minutes for two lottery picks in 2023-24.

12. Oklahoma City Thunder: Dereck Lively (Duke, C, Freshman)

Teams at Lively's pro day came away impressed by his shooting, something we saw more of in AAU and high school. With Oklahoma City's backcourt set and Jalen Williams a clear starter, the Thunder could think about the defensive upside of a Chet Holmgren-Lively frontcourt, with the Duke freshman having made tremendous improvement throughout the season in pick-and-roll coverage and rim protection.

13. Toronto Raptors: Bilal Coulibaly (Metropolitans 92, SF, 2004)

While most prospects use pro days and workouts to try and improve their stock, Coulibaly is helping himself in the LNB Pro A playoffs, most recently going for 15 points in a Game 2 semi-final win over ASVEL. Rumors of a lottery promise have started swirling in NBA circles. Teams in the late lottery have been considering the 18-year-old who's making an impact for Victor Wembanyama's Mets 92 with his effortless bounce, two-way activity and spot-up shooting. Recent flashes of self-creation have only made Coulibaly look more enticing weeks before the draft.


14. New Orleans Pelicans: Nick Smith Jr. (Arkansas, SG, Freshman)

After injuries affected Smith's season and inefficiency cast a cloud over it, scouts sounded pleased with his pro day. Percentages aside, there is plenty of confidence in his shot-making and three-level scoring, which the Pelicans could use in the 2-guard slot or second unit.


It's either Bilal or Bufkin.


Lively makes so much sense to OKC buuuut I just don’t trust Presti not to take the Long Boi lol & I’m sure he watches Bilal and it’s not hard for him to picture BC doing the same stuff next to Chet that he does Vic. I’m just praying that Presti is feeling “practical” at the draft lol and elects to go with Lively (or Miller) to try and help keep Chet healthy by having another big that can help him defend.

It’s gonna be nerve wrecking to wait & hear who they pick right before us. Still so annoying that we made this stupid Play In push that may cost us a high level prospect.


When Bilal gets taken right before us and blows up, we'll see articles for the next five years giving Masai credit anyway because he tried to trade for the right to pick him...
User avatar
ItsDanger
RealGM
Posts: 28,449
And1: 25,652
Joined: Nov 01, 2008

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1810 » by ItsDanger » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:38 pm

At this point Lively has gotten overrated being projected in 10-13 range. He's getting bumped up the rankings because of position scarcity. Smart GMs will pass and trade for need instead.
Organization can be defined as an organized body of people with a particular purpose. Not random.
User avatar
Psubs
RealGM
Posts: 20,785
And1: 11,885
Joined: Nov 20, 2004
Location: Toronto

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1811 » by Psubs » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:46 pm

Bilal will be taken #8 by Washington. They reached for Deni Avdija. They will be forming a UN team in the Capital.

Beal and Bilal. Kuzma?

PG Morris - Delon
SG Beal - Davis - Bilal
SF Avdija - Kispert - Bilal
PF Porzingis - Avdija
C Gafford - Porzingis
Image
User avatar
PhilBlackson
RealGM
Posts: 31,805
And1: 46,539
Joined: May 02, 2017
Location: No Wastemans Land
     

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1812 » by PhilBlackson » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:52 pm

Yallbecrazy wrote:
PhilBlackson wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20



It's either Bilal or Bufkin.


Lively makes so much sense to OKC buuuut I just don’t trust Presti not to take the Long Boi lol & I’m sure he watches Bilal and it’s not hard for him to picture BC doing the same stuff next to Chet that he does Vic. I’m just praying that Presti is feeling “practical” at the draft lol and elects to go with Lively (or Miller) to try and help keep Chet healthy by having another big that can help him defend.

It’s gonna be nerve wrecking to wait & hear who they pick right before us. Still so annoying that we made this stupid Play In push that may cost us a high level prospect.


My boy Podz now listed @ 20 and he's been floated around the late teens to early 20s range. Soon we'll be hoping he falls to 13.

https://youtu.be/6v5apHgYO1A

Watch the 1st half against a top team in the country and tell me you don't want him @#13.
They hedged and doubled him off every screen, had Strawther on him the whole game who wouldn't help off him at all, no one on Santa Clara could set a screen worth a lick too. Strawther isn't a good defender, but he's 6'7 and athletic and a projected late 1st rounder so when you tell him to just shadow a guy the whole game and not worry about anyone else he can do that pretty well.

edit: shot 44% from 3 facing defenses like this every game the last 3/4 of the year. He had by far the fewest catch and shoot 3s of all the top college shooters as no one helped off him at all, defenses played him like they do Curry in the NBA, you can rotate with the other 4 guys...this guy you don't. All his 3 pt volume were pullups, off the dribble, and some 30 footers too.


Yeah you've been trying to sell Podz for the longest kudoos to you for the commitment but unfortunately I'm not buying lol. I don't mean that as if I'm hating on him. I do absolutely think he can become a VERY good rotation piece but personally I don't see a star player, maybe like a better Luke Kennard type of player. I admit I could be wrong but I'm just not that high on him personally but to each their own.

Psubs wrote:Bilal will be taken #8 by Washington. They reached for Deni Avdija. They will be forming a UN team in the Capital.

Beal and Bilal. Kuzma?

PG Morris - Delon
SG Beal - Davis - Bilal
SF Avdija - Kispert - Bilal
PF Porzingis - Avdija
C Gafford - Porzingis


I doubt it, getting a PG like Black or Wallace makes A LOT more sense especially when they've already made it public that they fully intend on bringing Kuzma back to make another pathetic attempt to squirm into a Play In spot. They won't look to bring in another guy that will clearly need to be developed especially with Beal finally talking as if winning matters to him.
>>>THENOTORIOUSBI3<<< :guitar: *INGRAM*ALLSTARSEASON* Wemby is HIM - Top 5 Player this year
Image
Names of who OG will be better than Shaedon: DelAbbott, ThaCynic, pingpongrac, Los_29, OakleyDokley
Mark_83
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,799
And1: 3,851
Joined: Jun 26, 2008

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1813 » by Mark_83 » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:54 pm

PhilBlackson wrote:
Mark_83 wrote:I'll be pretty happy with any of the following at 13.

Coulibaly
Wallace
Bufkin
George
Lively
Cissoko


With Lively and Wallace, I wouldn’t be upset but I wouldn’t be thrilled either. I get it, both fantastic defenders but I just want the team to take a chance on trying to find another player with star like potential so I like the rest of your list and if we don’t take someone with star like potential I hope we get a shooter like Hawkins (who can defend) that can alter a defence. My board of players that I’d be happy to end up with…wish we could take one out the first two & one of the last three lol

Bilal
Sidy
Keyonte
Hawkins
Bufkin

You know I've liked Hawkins for a while, but 13th might be a bit high for me. For me he was a steal in the 20s before he blew up in the tournament.
REJECTEDBYCLARK
Head Coach
Posts: 6,514
And1: 4,662
Joined: Jan 25, 2023

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1814 » by REJECTEDBYCLARK » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:56 pm

Yallbecrazy wrote:
PhilBlackson wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20



It's either Bilal or Bufkin.


Lively makes so much sense to OKC buuuut I just don’t trust Presti not to take the Long Boi lol & I’m sure he watches Bilal and it’s not hard for him to picture BC doing the same stuff next to Chet that he does Vic. I’m just praying that Presti is feeling “practical” at the draft lol and elects to go with Lively (or Miller) to try and help keep Chet healthy by having another big that can help him defend.

It’s gonna be nerve wrecking to wait & hear who they pick right before us. Still so annoying that we made this stupid Play In push that may cost us a high level prospect.


My boy Podz now listed @ 20 and he's been floated around the late teens to early 20s range. Soon we'll be hoping he falls to 13.

https://youtu.be/6v5apHgYO1A

Watch the 1st half against a top team in the country and tell me you don't want him @#13.
They hedged and doubled him off every screen, had Strawther on him the whole game who wouldn't help off him at all, no one on Santa Clara could set a screen worth a lick too. Strawther isn't a good defender, but he's 6'7 and athletic and a projected late 1st rounder so when you tell him to just shadow a guy the whole game and not worry about anyone else he can do that pretty well.

edit: shot 44% from 3 facing defenses like this every game the last 3/4 of the year. He had by far the fewest catch and shoot 3s of all the top college shooters as no one helped off him at all, defenses played him like they do Curry in the NBA, you can rotate with the other 4 guys...this guy you don't. All his 3 pt volume were pullups, off the dribble, and some 30 footers too.


In all fairness Gonzaga's defense is garbage
Jadoogar
RealGM
Posts: 17,325
And1: 16,963
Joined: May 06, 2010
   

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1815 » by Jadoogar » Fri Jun 2, 2023 2:56 pm

ItsDanger wrote:At this point Lively has gotten overrated being projected in 10-13 range. He's getting bumped up the rankings because of position scarcity. Smart GMs will pass and trade for need instead.


Idk he seems like a perfect starting center in the modern NBA. I know people love to focus on the ceiling but if you can get a starting caliber center in the late lottery, you have to strongly consider it. Like Poeltl was the #9 pick, if you can get that caliber of player from 10-15, i would take that over gambling on a guy who could be an allstar but could also be out of the league in 4 years.

Edit - just thought of another great example. Walker Kessler dropped to the 20s because it's clear he doesn't have a ton of upside but it's also clear that he doesn't have a ton of downside. He easily goes top 5-8 in a redraft as of now
User avatar
ItsDanger
RealGM
Posts: 28,449
And1: 25,652
Joined: Nov 01, 2008

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1816 » by ItsDanger » Fri Jun 2, 2023 3:01 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
ItsDanger wrote:At this point Lively has gotten overrated being projected in 10-13 range. He's getting bumped up the rankings because of position scarcity. Smart GMs will pass and trade for need instead.


Idk he seems like a perfect starting center in the modern NBA. I know people love to focus on the ceiling but if you can get a starting caliber center in the late lottery, you have to strongly consider it. Like Poeltl was the #9 pick, if you can get that caliber of player from 10-15, i would take that over gambling on a guy who could be an allstar but could also be out of the league in 4 years.

Edit - just thought of another great example. Walker Kessler dropped to the 20s because it's clear he doesn't have a ton of upside but it's also clear that he doesn't have a ton of downside. He easily goes top 5-8 in a redraft as of now

Kessler was a much better player in college but was a sophomore in draft year. Key for Lively is can he shoot a little, I have my doubts. I think C's like this should be slotted in 15-25 range. Back end of the lottery, most team should be looking for upside still.
Organization can be defined as an organized body of people with a particular purpose. Not random.
Rapsfan07
RealGM
Posts: 14,989
And1: 6,028
Joined: Nov 19, 2010
 

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1817 » by Rapsfan07 » Fri Jun 2, 2023 3:01 pm

Yallbecrazy wrote:
PhilBlackson wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20



It's either Bilal or Bufkin.


Lively makes so much sense to OKC buuuut I just don’t trust Presti not to take the Long Boi lol & I’m sure he watches Bilal and it’s not hard for him to picture BC doing the same stuff next to Chet that he does Vic. I’m just praying that Presti is feeling “practical” at the draft lol and elects to go with Lively (or Miller) to try and help keep Chet healthy by having another big that can help him defend.

It’s gonna be nerve wrecking to wait & hear who they pick right before us. Still so annoying that we made this stupid Play In push that may cost us a high level prospect.


My boy Podz now listed @ 20 and he's been floated around the late teens to early 20s range. Soon we'll be hoping he falls to 13.

https://youtu.be/6v5apHgYO1A

Watch the 1st half against a top team in the country and tell me you don't want him @#13.
They hedged and doubled him off every screen, had Strawther on him the whole game who wouldn't help off him at all, no one on Santa Clara could set a screen worth a lick too. Strawther isn't a good defender, but he's 6'7 and athletic and a projected late 1st rounder so when you tell him to just shadow a guy the whole game and not worry about anyone else he can do that pretty well.

edit: shot 44% from 3 facing defenses like this every game the last 3/4 of the year. He had by far the fewest catch and shoot 3s of all the top college shooters as no one helped off him at all, defenses played him like they do Curry in the NBA, you can rotate with the other 4 guys...this guy you don't. All his 3 pt volume were pullups, off the dribble, and some 30 footers too.


I've liked Podz for a while. I really hope we can get another pick and take him.

I don't see a lotto guy there but I see a guy that a few years from now, teams will wonder how he went so low.

That BleacherReport mock draft is very similar to mine that I posted yesterday. At #13, I'm still hoping for Bufkin or Wallace. I really, really want to see what everyone sees in Coulibaly so bad. It's either I'm seriously missing something with him or some GM is going to make a lotto gamble and be very sorry about it.

Either way, this is the draft we should be looking to acquire extra picks in. I think there's going to be a lot of quality role players available, even into the second round.
Image
REJECTEDBYCLARK
Head Coach
Posts: 6,514
And1: 4,662
Joined: Jan 25, 2023

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1818 » by REJECTEDBYCLARK » Fri Jun 2, 2023 3:07 pm

ItsDanger wrote:At this point Lively has gotten overrated being projected in 10-13 range. He's getting bumped up the rankings because of position scarcity. Smart GMs will pass and trade for need instead.


I don't know man, athletic 7'1 freshman center who looks the part averaging 4.2 blocks and a steal per 36, very good offensive rebounder, positive AST/TO ratio and did it against good competition.

You put a premium on interior defense because there are only a handful of guys who are truly special interior defenders in the league and they bring tremendous value. Even the greatest players in the league will think twice about how they go about their business on offense against such guys and when you can help deny high percentage looks and discourage penetration you lower the other team's TS%. Then if that player can hit 3's on top of that you have something very valuable. Might be some upside as a guy who can get to the line a bit since he had a .3 ftR.



This kid is legit.
Jadoogar
RealGM
Posts: 17,325
And1: 16,963
Joined: May 06, 2010
   

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1819 » by Jadoogar » Fri Jun 2, 2023 3:08 pm

ItsDanger wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:
ItsDanger wrote:At this point Lively has gotten overrated being projected in 10-13 range. He's getting bumped up the rankings because of position scarcity. Smart GMs will pass and trade for need instead.


Idk he seems like a perfect starting center in the modern NBA. I know people love to focus on the ceiling but if you can get a starting caliber center in the late lottery, you have to strongly consider it. Like Poeltl was the #9 pick, if you can get that caliber of player from 10-15, i would take that over gambling on a guy who could be an allstar but could also be out of the league in 4 years.

Edit - just thought of another great example. Walker Kessler dropped to the 20s because it's clear he doesn't have a ton of upside but it's also clear that he doesn't have a ton of downside. He easily goes top 5-8 in a redraft as of now

Kessler was a much better player in college but was a sophomore in draft year. Key for Lively is can he shoot a little, I have my doubts. I think C's like this should be slotted in 15-25 range. Back end of the lottery, most team should be looking for upside still.


If the raptors hadn't made the Poeltl trade, i would have been championing Lively a lot more. Most late lottery picks don't turn into much so i'm just more inclined towards guys with high floors at this point in the draft.
Rodrickle
Rookie
Posts: 1,012
And1: 653
Joined: Mar 16, 2021

Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1820 » by Rodrickle » Fri Jun 2, 2023 3:11 pm

ItsDanger wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:
ItsDanger wrote:At this point Lively has gotten overrated being projected in 10-13 range. He's getting bumped up the rankings because of position scarcity. Smart GMs will pass and trade for need instead.


Idk he seems like a perfect starting center in the modern NBA. I know people love to focus on the ceiling but if you can get a starting caliber center in the late lottery, you have to strongly consider it. Like Poeltl was the #9 pick, if you can get that caliber of player from 10-15, i would take that over gambling on a guy who could be an allstar but could also be out of the league in 4 years.

Edit - just thought of another great example. Walker Kessler dropped to the 20s because it's clear he doesn't have a ton of upside but it's also clear that he doesn't have a ton of downside. He easily goes top 5-8 in a redraft as of now

Kessler was a much better player in college but was a sophomore in draft year. Key for Lively is can he shoot a little, I have my doubts. I think C's like this should be slotted in 15-25 range. Back end of the lottery, most team should be looking for upside still.



Lots of upside with Lively. Especially if he can shoot. Those type of players are super valuable

Return to Toronto Raptors