2023 Draft Discussion Part 5

[PhilBlackson]

At this point Lively has gotten overrated being projected in 10-13 range. He's getting bumped up the rankings because of position scarcity. Smart GMs will pass and trade for need instead.

Not to ambush ya lol because I know a lot of posters have already responded to this but I'd have to agree with them, I don't think he's being overrated in that range either because once you get out of the top 5 or so of most drafts, typically you're not expecting a star player (still hopeful) and once you're out of the top 10 typically you'd be happy with just a high level starter ie/ like most of our starting line up lol

I think Lively at the height of his potential will have a similar "impact" on his team like Cason, Dick etc. They're guys who you can definitely see them helping a team win by being excellent at their role. But generally I think in the 10-15 range teams are either hoping someone slid in the draft to them, take a flyer on upside or pick a player with a high floor that they think can help their team win. Lively fits that last category.

He's very quick, athletic & strong for a guy his size and he's showing a great ability to anchor a defence and read what's happening on the court. Yes the league is mainly about shooting (which he shows signs of) but we seen with prime Gobert there will always be a place for 1 dimensional rim protector and it's nothing to sneeze at because when Rudy was quicker, his impact on their defence/team was immense and Lively's feet are much quicker so he projects to handle perimeter defence better. I'm not saying he'll be quite the level of rim protector Rudy was, he still has the potential to be one of the best rim protectors in the league and if he can continue to clean up his shooting maybe you can hope to make him into a poorboy's Brook Lopez (because DL simply doesn't have a post game like Brook). But look how much prime Rudy helped Mitchell to make Utah a 50+W year in & year out...I think SGA is at Donovan's level, now you throw in Williams, Giddey & Chet -- those 3 potential absolutely SMOKE what Mitchell had around him imo so that to me can have the makings of a DAMN good team in about 2-3 years.

BUUUT Presti loves him some Long Boi with upside so I'm still hating that he's THE worst GM possible to have ahead of us in the draft.

[mademan]

Hard to see Presti taking Lively when im not sure if they know what position Chet is gonna play. Is he a PF? A C? Can they play together? Or are you spending a lotto pick on someone who cant play beside your 2nd pick last year?

[PhilBlackson]

Hard to see Presti taking Lively when im not sure if they know what position Chet is gonna play. Is he a PF? A C? Can they play together? Or are you spending a lotto pick on someone who cant play beside your 2nd pick last year?

Oh there's no question, Chet will be a PF (period).

He's simply too thin (and potentially injury probe) to handle the pounding at C, ask AD who is MUCH stronger than him...and why wouldn't they be able to play together?! lol Chet's whole thing is being a perimeter player that's in a tallboy body so offensively it's a non-issue while defensively they have potential to be one of the best damn defensive duos in the league ala Mobley/Allen, except Chet is more skilled than Mobley with a better jumper.

[ItsDanger]

Hard to see Presti taking Lively when im not sure if they know what position Chet is gonna play. Is he a PF? A C? Can they play together? Or are you spending a lotto pick on someone who cant play beside your 2nd pick last year?

I think he will be a 4/5. He's a good help defender so starting him at the 4 makes sense.

[OakleyDokely]

Chet will likely be used like AD, JJJ etc. He will play the 5 in smallball lineups or closing lineups, but they will need a more traditional C who can eat up 20-25 defending the big Cs.

[WuTang_CMB]

We'll see. OKC puts out a lot of smoke especially 2021 with Booknight

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[mademan]

Hard to see Presti taking Lively when im not sure if they know what position Chet is gonna play. Is he a PF? A C? Can they play together? Or are you spending a lotto pick on someone who cant play beside your 2nd pick last year?

Oh there's no question, Chet will be a PF (period).

He's simply too thin (and potentially injury probe) to handle the pounding at C, ask AD who is MUCH stronger than him...and why wouldn't they be able to play together?! lol Chet's whole thing is being a perimeter player that's in a tallboy body so offensively it's a non-issue while defensively they have potential to be one of the best damn defensive duos in the league ala Mobley/Allen, except Chet is more skilled than Mobley with a better jumper.

i dunno, we'll see. We're already seeing problems in Cleveland of having Mobley play PF,. But then again, Chet/Lively project to be significantly better floor spacers than Mobley/Allen

[PhilBlackson]

We'll see. OKC puts out a lot of smoke especially 2021 with Booknight

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Knew it & now that's the 2nd time this rumour is leaking.

FU Masai & Bobby for that stupid damn Play In push...guess it's Cissiko time. I still really like Sidy but just like the STYLE of potential Bilal had more a wing/slasher scorer type of play than Sidy's swiss army knife style of play.

[WuTang_CMB]

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[ItsDanger]

They really had to win that meaningless last game vs Bucks didn't they? That's 100% on management.

[Jadoogar]

Hard to see Presti taking Lively when im not sure if they know what position Chet is gonna play. Is he a PF? A C? Can they play together? Or are you spending a lotto pick on someone who cant play beside your 2nd pick last year?

Chet might end up being a center later in his career but at this point, he will absolutely start at PF. He's very thin, i wouldn't subject him to too much punishment right away. I like what Cavs have done with Mobley by pairing him with Allen until he grows into his body a bit more.

However, i don't a rookie center is the solution for OKC. I think they chase a center in free agency or trade. Like Brook Lopez would be a pretty good fit for them, veteran player that they could get on short term, big money contract.

[mademan]

We'll see. OKC puts out a lot of smoke especially 2021 with Booknight

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Knew it & now that's the 2nd time this rumour is leaking.

FU Masai & Bobby for that stupid damn Play In push...guess it's Cissiko time. I still really like Sidy but just like the STYLE of potential Bilal had more a wing/slasher scorer type of play than Sidy's swiss army knife style of play.

Dont worry bud. 4 years from now, if he becomes a stud, we'll hear the story of how Masai was targeting him and almost traded for him.

[Tortiglioni]

Sidy Cissoko is not being taken in the lottery. lol.

[PhilBlackson]

Hard to see Presti taking Lively when im not sure if they know what position Chet is gonna play. Is he a PF? A C? Can they play together? Or are you spending a lotto pick on someone who cant play beside your 2nd pick last year?

Oh there's no question, Chet will be a PF (period).

He's simply too thin (and potentially injury probe) to handle the pounding at C, ask AD who is MUCH stronger than him...and why wouldn't they be able to play together?! lol Chet's whole thing is being a perimeter player that's in a tallboy body so offensively it's a non-issue while defensively they have potential to be one of the best damn defensive duos in the league ala Mobley/Allen, except Chet is more skilled than Mobley with a better jumper.

i dunno, we'll see. We're already seeing problems in Cleveland of having Mobley play PF,. But then again, Chet/Lively project to be significantly better floor spacers than Mobley/Allen

Well exactly...in particular Chet.

Mobley is mainly a lob threat/good composure around the rim finisher with signs of a jumper. Chet plays like a wing (period) so you're not having the same issues of congestion offensively around the post as you are with Mobley & Allen who are both mainly looking to be set up the same way & in the same area offensively. Chet isn't hunting lobs or drop offs like Mobley, he wants to create from the wings or just lace a shot out there. Not the same dynamic at all andddd....

Lively unlike Allen shows some hope of being able to hit a 3. If they just make him a passable corner 3 shooter or spot up ala PJ Tucker, Draymond then their duo could actually end up being quite deadly.

Hard to see Presti taking Lively when im not sure if they know what position Chet is gonna play. Is he a PF? A C? Can they play together? Or are you spending a lotto pick on someone who cant play beside your 2nd pick last year?

Chet might end up being a center later in his career but at this point, he will absolutely start at PF. He's very thin, i wouldn't subject him to too much punishment right away. I like what Cavs have done with Mobley by pairing him with Allen until he grows into his body a bit more.

However, i don't a rookie center is the solution for OKC. I think they chase a center in free agency or trade. Like Brook Lopez would be a pretty good fit for them, veteran player that they could get on short term, big money contract.

Why would wouldn't they secure a C for the first 7-8 years of Chet's career?!

Chet will damn near have to reach his 30s before he has the frame to really take on C full time - see KG (220pds) who unbelievably was actually heavier than Chet (195pds) by 25 POUNDS despite being shorter and didn't miss his entire rookie season with a foot injury that scares tfo most GMs as that's a common reoccuring issue with big men. So while I do like a Brook Lopez signing, I don't think it is the actual solution because Chet will not be able to handle the C position within 3-4 years, sorry. He's going to NEED a bigger bodied C next to him for the good bulk of his career imo.

[PhilBlackson]

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Pascal to HOU for 4th and one of Green or Smith Jr.

[ItsDanger]

At this point Lively has gotten overrated being projected in 10-13 range. He's getting bumped up the rankings because of position scarcity. Smart GMs will pass and trade for need instead.

Not to ambush ya lol because I know a lot of posters have already responded to this but I'd have to agree with them, I don't think he's being overrated in that range either because once you get out of the top 5 or so of most drafts, typically you're not expecting a star player (still hopeful) and once you're out of the top 10 typically you'd be happy with just a high level starter ie/ like most of our starting line up lol

I think Lively at the height of his potential will have a similar "impact" on his team like Cason, Dick etc. They're guys who you can definitely see them helping a team win by being excellent at their role. But generally I think in the 10-15 range teams are either hoping someone slid in the draft to them, take a flyer on upside or pick a player with a high floor that they think can help their team win. Lively fits that last category.

He's very quick, athletic & strong for a guy his size and he's showing a great ability to anchor a defence and read what's happening on the court. Yes the league is mainly about shooting (which he shows signs of) but we seen with prime Gobert there will always be a place for 1 dimensional rim protector and it's nothing to sneeze at because when Rudy was quicker, his impact on their defence/team was immense and Lively's feet are much quicker so he projects to handle perimeter defence better. I'm not saying he'll be quite the level of rim protector Rudy was, he still has the potential to be one of the best rim protectors in the league and if he can continue to clean up his shooting maybe you can hope to make him into a poorboy's Brook Lopez (because DL simply doesn't have a post game like Brook). But look how much prime Rudy helped Mitchell to make Utah a 50+W year in & year out...I think SGA is at Donovan's level, now you throw in Williams, Giddey & Chet -- those 3 potential absolutely SMOKE what Mitchell had around him imo so that to me can have the makings of a DAMN good team in about 2-3 years.

BUUUT Presti loves him some Long Boi with upside so I'm still hating that he's THE worst GM possible to have ahead of us in the draft.

I'd still go for upside in that range. OKC has cap room and should sign Poeltl at a slight overpay. That would be a more ideal scenario. If I'm Poeltl, and can read the writing on the wall, I 100% bail and go to a better situation. But it takes two to make a deal happen. There are a lot of potential options on the table.

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

I'm still ironing this out and changing my mind on a lot of stuff so here are some modifications namely based on some issues Barlowe brought up about Hendricks, looking deeper into Ausar's game and Lively growing on me like crazy. It's also gotten to a point where Bufkin and Coulibaly's games just look a lot better than guys like Dick, Black and Ausar to me so I have to go against the grain:

1. Victor Wembanyama
2. Scoot Henderson
3. Cameron Whitmore
4. Cason Wallace
5. Dereck Lively II
6. Kobe Bufkin
7. Bilal Coulibaly
8. Amen Thompson
9. Brandon Miller
10. Taylor Hendricks
11. Brandin Podziemski
12. Marcus Sasser
13. Gradey Dick
14. Jarace Walker
15. Ausar Thompson
16. Anthony Black
17. Amari Bailey
18. Leonard Miller
19. Olivier Maxence-Prosper
20. Trayce Jackson-Davis

Feels like I have Lively more where I want him and it reflects how much I believe in Bufkin and Black down to my initial thoughts about him where as good as he looks especially at that size the erratic decision making and poor shooting will be a struggle to overcome.

[Jadoogar]

Hard to see Presti taking Lively when im not sure if they know what position Chet is gonna play. Is he a PF? A C? Can they play together? Or are you spending a lotto pick on someone who cant play beside your 2nd pick last year?

Chet might end up being a center later in his career but at this point, he will absolutely start at PF. He's very thin, i wouldn't subject him to too much punishment right away. I like what Cavs have done with Mobley by pairing him with Allen until he grows into his body a bit more.

However, i don't a rookie center is the solution for OKC. I think they chase a center in free agency or trade. Like Brook Lopez would be a pretty good fit for them, veteran player that they could get on short term, big money contract.

Why would wouldn't they secure a C for the first 7-8 years of Chet's career?!
.

They very well might.
I'm just thinking that OKC might think they're good. They were very close to making the playoffs. Getting another veteran with SGA and Giddey improving might actually propel them into the lower half of the playoffs. Having essentially 2 rookies in your starting lineup will result in a terrible defense. If they were more in the rebuilding stage i would say go for it but i think SGA is just too good for that at this point. A lineup of Giddey/SGA/Jwill/Chet/Veteran C is a legit playoff team imo.

[tdotrep2]

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Pascal to HOU for 4th and one of Green or Smith Jr.

theres no way they give up 4 and green, its green and filler or 4 and maaaybe smith

[niQ]

Some updates:

https://www.nbadraft.net/nba-mock-drafts/?year-mock=2023

https://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft