2023 NBA Draft Thread 4

[jayrehme]

I don't know why everyone's down on him for us, but Jarace Walker would compliment Franz and Paolo well, a glue guy with high motor and high IQ.. I see a Draymond Green, Ben Wallace, Paul Milsap type of player. Give me Walker at #6 and then best player who falls at #11, or even package #11 with WCJ, who is likely highly coveted by other teams (blazers have #3 and simons, would make great trade partner)

[89Magicfan]

It's funny how much "elite athleticism" is overvalued this time of year. Every June we suffer collective amnesia and forget that the best players in the game have a particular set of skills, and many are not elite athletes with explosive leaping ability etc. etc.

Nikola Jokic
Steph Curry
Luka Doncic
Trae Young
Tyrese Haliburton
Domantas Sabonis

Here's a portion of Jonathan Givony's 2016 scouting report of Jamal Murray coming out of college:

"He has an average combination of height, length, frame and athleticism for a guard prospect, not being particularly impressive in terms of his quickness or vertical explosiveness either."

Givony did rate Murray highly on shooting stroke, ability to get off screens, balance on his shot, ability to create space, etc.

I just think we overrate guys like Ausar Thompson, thinking they'll become something they're not simply based on athletic ability, and then we're surprised when they bust.

Draft skill. If you miss you miss, but don't miss on another brick-layer with massive wingspan.

Yup and draft intelligence. High IQ is a good sign the player gets it quicker than others and is more capable of improving on their weakness to some degree. If they also are Uber athletic, that’s just the icing on the cake.

[JBSouthpaw]

Givony just put this out on ESPN. https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/37796305/2023-nba-mock-draft-best-fit-vs-best-available-first-round
Best fit vs. best available
6. Orlando Magic
Best fit: Gradey Dick | Kansas | SG/SF | Age: 19.5

Best available: Ausar Thompson

Many NBA teams view Dick as the best shooter in the draft. He has elite footwork, balance and confidence running off screens, pulling up off the dribble and drifting into spot-up 3-pointers with excellent mechanics and range.

He's also a competitive defender with good size at 6-foot-7 ½ and a strong frame, making him playable immediately at a huge position of need for the Magic without needing plays called for him. That's an important factor for integrating him into a roster with several featured options already in Paolo Banchero and Franz Wagner.

The Magic might hope Dick is available still with their second lottery pick at No. 11, allowing them to take a swing on a prospect like Ausar who seems to have a higher upside with his superior frame, length, explosiveness and shot-creation prowess. There's optimism Ausar can develop into a capable shooter after making significant improvement over the last year in that area, and he clearly brings more to the table with his court vision, electric first step, live-dribble passing prowess and ability to lock up guards, wings and forwards alike. -- Givony


This is the 1st explanation I understand where taking Thompson over Gradey.

[Magic_Kingdom]

Bleacher Report on Darius Garland:

"He may never be a top set-up man. He's shoot-first and prefers to settle for tough jumpers, a likely result of his lack of explosiveness around the basket. Garland struggles to execute passes, floaters and layups in traffic."

NBADraft.net on Donovan Mitchell:

"Mitchell is a much better leaper off of two feet than one foot, and his explosiveness on his drives diminishes when he has to elevate off of one foot, especially when forced to his weaker left hand … He also doesn’t get all the way to the rim as one might expect, as shown by his low two-point field goal percentage (46%) and below average free throw rate (4 attempts per-40), especially when operating against strong defenses … Despite a big 6’10 wingspan, his 8’1 standing reach is very small for an NBA 2-guard … "

[Ralof]

what?new thread and already 6 pages,woooofffff

[89Magicfan]

Givony just put this out on ESPN. https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/37796305/2023-nba-mock-draft-best-fit-vs-best-available-first-round
Best fit vs. best available
6. Orlando Magic
Best fit: Gradey Dick | Kansas | SG/SF | Age: 19.5

Best available: Ausar Thompson

Many NBA teams view Dick as the best shooter in the draft. He has elite footwork, balance and confidence running off screens, pulling up off the dribble and drifting into spot-up 3-pointers with excellent mechanics and range.

He's also a competitive defender with good size at 6-foot-7 ½ and a strong frame, making him playable immediately at a huge position of need for the Magic without needing plays called for him. That's an important factor for integrating him into a roster with several featured options already in Paolo Banchero and Franz Wagner.

The Magic might hope Dick is available still with their second lottery pick at No. 11, allowing them to take a swing on a prospect like Ausar who seems to have a higher upside with his superior frame, length, explosiveness and shot-creation prowess. There's optimism Ausar can develop into a capable shooter after making significant improvement over the last year in that area, and he clearly brings more to the table with his court vision, electric first step, live-dribble passing prowess and ability to lock up guards, wings and forwards alike. -- Givony


This is the 1st explanation I understand where taking Thompson over Gradey.

It’s where I’m at right now. I think a combo of Ausar, Hendricks, Whitmore, Dick, and Hawkins would be a solid draft.

I’m still holding out hope on Scoot but yeah...

[tiderulz]

mentioned on the trade boards. but i would look at #11 for Simons. Simons has shown he can shoot and score in the NBA, willing passer and looking around the league his contract isnt bad at all. yes, defense not great, but that can be improved on. his age aligns well with the core.

Could then trade back from #6 if were not sold on a player and pick up another couple of picks. Convince Utah for #9 and #16.

[Ralof]

I'll believe g.dick will guard opponent shooting guards,when i'll see that.

and i mean not during playoff,or superstar shooting guards.
even average ones,during regular season.

[bigdogdylan5]

So is anyone still pro Cason Wallace with his measurements at the combine?

[basketballRob]

So is anyone still pro Cason Wallace with his measurements at the combine?

He measured pretty well with his wingspan.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app

[MasterGMer]

I think we should stay away from Thompson twins. Lack of competition is a big reason plus shooting.

I am interested in Taylor Hendricks plus Bilal at 11. Dude shouts potential to me

[jonbob17]

I feel like we have to come out of this draft with a wing. Not sure there will be any ones with good outcomes at 11. Currently thinking . Previously was in favor of two of: cason, hendricks, gradey

This is where i am at now:
6. Hendricks
11. Lively

We can sign a shooter. Hendricks shoots well.

Fultz/Cole
Suggs/Harris or FA/Houstan
Franz/Hendricks
Paolo/JI/Bol
WCJ/Lively/MoVV

I try to picture what WCJ would look like on the Heat or the Celtics...I just can't see it. Lively is going to be a difference maker on the defensive side.

Hendricks add shooting and defense to the perimeter. We will need to upgrade PG through trade, FA, or development. It's just not available in this draft.

Hendricks and Lively should be very good NBA rotation players around the same time Paolo and Franz are starting to hit their upside.

[89Magicfan]

I think we should stay away from Thompson twins. Lack of competition is a big reason plus shooting.

I am interested in Taylor Hendricks plus Bilal at 11. Dude shouts potential to me

Bilal shouts late lotto to me. Thompson twins at least show ability to put ball on the floor and create.

The competition in the French league isn’t much better.

[89Magicfan]

If I were to go with a Thompson twin, think I’d go with Amen over Ausar. I know I know...Jump shot...I just think he has more skills.

[yoyojw17]

I feel like we have to come out of this draft with a wing. Not sure there will be any ones with good outcomes at 11. Currently thinking . Previously was in favor of two of: cason, hendricks, gradey

This is where i am at now:
6. Hendricks
11. Lively

We can sign a shooter. Hendricks shoots well.

Fultz/Cole
Suggs/Harris or FA/Houstan
Franz/Hendricks
Paolo/JI/Bol
WCJ/Lively/MoVV

I try to picture what WCJ would look like on the Heat or the Celtics...I just can't see it. Lively is going to be a difference maker on the defensive side.

Hendricks add shooting and defense to the perimeter. We will need to upgrade PG through trade, FA, or development. It's just not available in this draft.

Hendricks and Lively should be very good NBA rotation players around the same time Paolo and Franz are starting to hit their upside.

Not my number 1 outcome. but i can totally see the upside in all this. Our team would be stacked at all positions. In this scenario i can see us picking up a player like bruce brown at a really good deal for SG... and them for sure resigning both fultz and cole. and still have suggs fight for that starting position @ SG.

OMG... and that bench defense would be stifling!

[MAGICian619]

I feel like we have to come out of this draft with a wing. Not sure there will be any ones with good outcomes at 11. Currently thinking . Previously was in favor of two of: cason, hendricks, gradey

This is where i am at now:
6. Hendricks
11. Lively

We can sign a shooter. Hendricks shoots well.

Fultz/Cole
Suggs/Harris or FA/Houstan
Franz/Hendricks
Paolo/JI/Bol
WCJ/Lively/MoVV

I try to picture what WCJ would look like on the Heat or the Celtics...I just can't see it. Lively is going to be a difference maker on the defensive side.

Hendricks add shooting and defense to the perimeter. We will need to upgrade PG through trade, FA, or development. It's just not available in this draft.

Hendricks and Lively should be very good NBA rotation players around the same time Paolo and Franz are starting to hit their upside.

Big UCF guy here. Hendricks is not a 3 and anyone will be very disappointed if they try and play him there. He is a 4 who will be able to play some small ball 5.

[yoyojw17]

I feel like we have to come out of this draft with a wing. Not sure there will be any ones with good outcomes at 11. Currently thinking . Previously was in favor of two of: cason, hendricks, gradey

This is where i am at now:
6. Hendricks
11. Lively

We can sign a shooter. Hendricks shoots well.

Fultz/Cole
Suggs/Harris or FA/Houstan
Franz/Hendricks
Paolo/JI/Bol
WCJ/Lively/MoVV

I try to picture what WCJ would look like on the Heat or the Celtics...I just can't see it. Lively is going to be a difference maker on the defensive side.

Hendricks add shooting and defense to the perimeter. We will need to upgrade PG through trade, FA, or development. It's just not available in this draft.

Hendricks and Lively should be very good NBA rotation players around the same time Paolo and Franz are starting to hit their upside.

Big UCF guy here. Hendricks is not a 3 and anyone will be very disappointed if they try and play him there. He is a 4 who will be able to play some small ball 5.

Awwww man.... good to know. thanks

and i'm kinda fine not thinking Isaac can fulltime guard 3's need to protect those knees. lol

[cedric76]

Pepe peping, now he is a French League expert

Please stop

Agreed.
He is

Bro i live in middle of f*** Europe so who knows more about Europien baketball? Somebody who heared about french league month ago or somebody who follows Euro basketball for 20 years? I assume you right?

Cedric made 14 000 posts and majority of them are "Ur wrung g' magic" . Guy has one of the worst +1 to post ratios on this forum because he can't elaborate nor articulate his own opinion to save his life.

If you have something to argue against me- argue with facts and arguments not with whatever you think you are doing ( tbh 99% of time you just spam youtube videos like nobody else can use youtube and write : "XY highlight video" )

You two are now head over heels about player you never seen single full basketball game in your lifes, because some twitter head told you he has " Jimmy Butler/ OG written all over him" and that he "outscored Wemby in one game" .

I can help you if you actually want to WATCH him play. in 4 days, you can catch stream on Spotklub ( Croatian/serbian tv channel, you know, place i'm from ) and they will have game 1 finals. Or i can provide stream of that game in inbox if you need.

You will be very shocked once you learn your favorite flavor of a month is 6'6 but apsolutley never puts ball on the floor nor tries to attack off dribble, yet those internet wannabe "scouts" are trying to sell you as "shooting guard" and than just smam you with percentages instad of volumen of his actual shots. Guy makes 0,5 threes a game as "shooter", in league where 3 point line stands at 20,5 feet. But who needs facts when guy on twitter wrote he is great? Who needs critical thinking? Who needs own head to make own opinons when twitter can provide one for you?

btw pss don't let Evan haters, hear you, but in league where Culibaliy averages 5 ppg, Evan averaged 14

Stop trolling, I live in France, you are clueless about French basketball or any basketball for that matter.
You just a hater.

For those speaking french, here is a nice video about people would followed Bilal since he is 15

Watch on YouTube

[zaymon]

mentioned on the trade boards. but i would look at #11 for Simons. Simons has shown he can shoot and score in the NBA, willing passer and looking around the league his contract isnt bad at all. yes, defense not great, but that can be improved on. his age aligns well with the core.

Could then trade back from #6 if were not sold on a player and pick up another couple of picks. Convince Utah for #9 and #16.

I would prefer to gamble on the cheap rookie contract than expensive extension for limited player. His defense wont get much better, he has awful size and strength for a point guard, and he is not a point guard. He would have to guard wings, good luck with that. Portland was 28 in defensive ranking. 28 !!!!!!! Even pre allstar they were 27. Simons destroyed their defense and on offense he is nothing special. We want to put the ball in Franz hands or Simons ? He is even not that good off sceens.

[MAGICian619]

I feel like we have to come out of this draft with a wing. Not sure there will be any ones with good outcomes at 11. Currently thinking . Previously was in favor of two of: cason, hendricks, gradey

This is where i am at now:
6. Hendricks
11. Lively

We can sign a shooter. Hendricks shoots well.

Fultz/Cole
Suggs/Harris or FA/Houstan
Franz/Hendricks
Paolo/JI/Bol
WCJ/Lively/MoVV

I try to picture what WCJ would look like on the Heat or the Celtics...I just can't see it. Lively is going to be a difference maker on the defensive side.

Hendricks add shooting and defense to the perimeter. We will need to upgrade PG through trade, FA, or development. It's just not available in this draft.

Hendricks and Lively should be very good NBA rotation players around the same time Paolo and Franz are starting to hit their upside.

Big UCF guy here. Hendricks is not a 3 and anyone will be very disappointed if they try and play him there. He is a 4 who will be able to play some small ball 5.

Awwww man.... good to know. thanks

and i'm kinda fine not thinking Isaac can fulltime guard 3's need to protect those knees. lol

Isaac is a solid comp for Hendricks but I think Isaac has better dribbling and play making skills (which isn't saying much). Hendricks is probably a better natural shooter. They are both 4's but I think Hendricks (on offense specifically) would have a much harder time playing the 3 than Isaac.