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Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!!

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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1581 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:30 pm

dean456 wrote:
3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
dean456 wrote:
I'd be fine if it went that way. But the fact that Heat have permission to talk to Beal/his reps. Feel like they'd know how much he'd leverage his NTC for specific teams if any.

If Beal tells you that he's told WAS that its only MIL or MIA then at that point what are you are competing with.

Bucks have 1FRP in either 2029 or 2030 they can trade and 2023 2nd (#60) and POR 2024 2nd rounder.

Milwaukee also seemingly have no path to trading matching salaries unless it's a Middleton S&T which hard caps MIL or they trading Holiday.


Bucks are not a good trade partner at all.


This whole thing with the Bucks feels like more of a play of Beal appearing to co-operate with Washington seemingly giving them options but ultimately strengthening Miami's position to low ball as far as they can and strong arm Washington


There’s definitely something fishy about it. Hell, bucks might even be leaking it just to try and suck away some more of Miamis assets to make things harder for us this summer since they know we’re major players for everyone this summer and we just busted their ass in 5
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1582 » by gom » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:32 pm

AirP. wrote:The only time in recent history that Washington had a very good team is when they got top tier talent from the draft with Wall at #1 and Beal at #3, outside of that it's not been good.


What he said. ^

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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1583 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:34 pm

powerball1373 wrote:
3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
powerball1373 wrote:
Just curious if we ever traded Bam, would you still be a Heat fan, or would you follow Bam wherever he goes?


I’ve been here since 03, Wade started my Heat fandom when I was a kid. I’m not going anywhere and neither is Bam unless you’re getting a ridiculously good haul back or he leaves.

Where am I wrong in my bam takes?


No need to deflect, it was a simple question lol. Not talking about any of your Bam takes and whether they are right or wrong, just wanted to know if Bam got traded tomorrow if you're still a Heat fan or rooting for whatever team he gets traded to.


Tight!
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1584 » by MorbidHEAT » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:34 pm

DayofMourning wrote:Need to keep Martin in any trade scenario. Im not sure any team is going to demand he be included. Hes a necessary component to our team.


After he showed out in the ECF and demonstrated the potential he has, the chances that teams don’t demand he be included in trades are slim to none. Somebody is going to ask. Should a deal for Dame or Beal be held up so we don’t include Caleb? Absolutely not.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1585 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:36 pm

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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1586 » by MorbidHEAT » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:37 pm

DayofMourning wrote:Id give Strus $3 mil per year. Dude was a no show the entire year. The entire year! The only thing going for him is his experience in our system.


No chance. He will fall into the 8 to 12 mil range.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1587 » by MettaWorldPanda » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:39 pm

AirP. wrote:
MettaWorldPanda wrote:Why in the world would he turn down a chance to play for the Clippers with Westbrook, George, and Leonard. Because of some state tax? That sounds asinine and only fitting a narrative that the Wiz are forced to take our trash offer of Lowry, Robinson and picks over a full clean sheet swipe the Clippers can offer with picks. I still think Herro trumps that offer but some in here are getting awfully cocky that we are the only show in town and able to get Beal for a hotdog and a half a bag of chips.


What? The state tax is 12.3%, for the rest of the ~207 million he's old, he'd be giving up around 25 million dollars just in state taxes, who knows how much he's paying in federal taxes and there's also his agent's cut but those are the same no matter where he plays. That's a lot of money.

Back to the matter at hand, why would he turn down the chance to play with the Clippers? Health concerns with the star players? They've been healthy enough to make the conference finals once since acquiring Kawhi and George.

So the money it'll cost plus the health concerns would be a big issue for someone finally leaving the franchise he's been all career long.

You still don't get it. Washington is just trying to get off Beal's money and his talent to be able to tank and get franchise changing talent. If they can get expiring contracts to clear cap room for next summer they can be in the same situation OKC and Utah have been in, able to take on other people's bad contracts for picks. Washington couldn't even get hometown kid KD to look at them, they have to develop their own stars. Miami fans are lucky, you're building a great tradition, you're located where others want to live in and currently are showing that even a team with inferior talent can compete with the big dogs. Try rooting for a smaller market team and hope you can develop enough talent to make a little noise in the playoffs and even then they were doing it with Gortat and Nene... unless you want to talk about DeJuan Blair who had no ACLs in his knees.

The only time in recent history that Washington had a very good team is when they got top tier talent from the draft with Wall at #1 and Beal at #3, outside of that it's not been good.


Clippers offer them a clean wipe of the sheet. Them having to take on Duncan does not. I don’t think it’s about clearing the books rather then resetting there timeline with a 23 year old Herro. If it’s about wiping the books then the Clips offer is better. Sure Beal can turn it down but also turning down a good team in a big city and putting the Wiz in an awful position. Most realistic talking heads have mentioned Herro as a centerpiece. Robinson, Lowry, and our picks will not get this over the line. Beal is not going to screw the franchise over.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1588 » by Flash4thewin » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:41 pm

MettaWorldPanda wrote:
DayofMourning wrote:Need to keep Martin in any trade scenario. Im not sure any team is going to demand he be included. Hes a necessary component to our team.

He’s not going anywhere. He’s engulfed in Heat culture


If he is not traded he is not going anywhere for one year. After that culture or not dude is going hard after the money, it will be his first time getting paid. Seeing how cash strapped we have acted for the past 4 years, when he hits the free market we won't come close to matching the offers he gets. Thats not even factoring the tax implications.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1589 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:42 pm

If Gabe and/or Strus are gone we need to work out sign and trades if possible and get something back for each, idc if it’s multiple 2nds a piece. Just anything we can flip as sweetener
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1590 » by Bishop45 » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:46 pm

3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
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Raps likely not going to put him out there for cheap, but man our defense would be top tier
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1591 » by AirP. » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:46 pm

MettaWorldPanda wrote:
AirP. wrote:
MettaWorldPanda wrote:Why in the world would he turn down a chance to play for the Clippers with Westbrook, George, and Leonard. Because of some state tax? That sounds asinine and only fitting a narrative that the Wiz are forced to take our trash offer of Lowry, Robinson and picks over a full clean sheet swipe the Clippers can offer with picks. I still think Herro trumps that offer but some in here are getting awfully cocky that we are the only show in town and able to get Beal for a hotdog and a half a bag of chips.


Spoiler:
What? The state tax is 12.3%, for the rest of the ~207 million he's old, he'd be giving up around 25 million dollars just in state taxes, who knows how much he's paying in federal taxes and there's also his agent's cut but those are the same no matter where he plays. That's a lot of money.

Back to the matter at hand, why would he turn down the chance to play with the Clippers? Health concerns with the star players? They've been healthy enough to make the conference finals once since acquiring Kawhi and George.

So the money it'll cost plus the health concerns would be a big issue for someone finally leaving the franchise he's been all career long.

You still don't get it. Washington is just trying to get off Beal's money and his talent to be able to tank and get franchise changing talent. If they can get expiring contracts to clear cap room for next summer they can be in the same situation OKC and Utah have been in, able to take on other people's bad contracts for picks. Washington couldn't even get hometown kid KD to look at them, they have to develop their own stars. Miami fans are lucky, you're building a great tradition, you're located where others want to live in and currently are showing that even a team with inferior talent can compete with the big dogs. Try rooting for a smaller market team and hope you can develop enough talent to make a little noise in the playoffs and even then they were doing it with Gortat and Nene... unless you want to talk about DeJuan Blair who had no ACLs in his knees.

The only time in recent history that Washington had a very good team is when they got top tier talent from the draft with Wall at #1 and Beal at #3, outside of that it's not been good.


Clippers offer them a clean wipe of the sheet. Them having to take on Duncan does not. I don’t think it’s about clearing the books rather then resetting there timeline with a 23 year old Herro. If it’s about wiping the books then the Clips offer is better. Sure Beal can turn it down but also turning down a good team in a big city and putting the Wiz in an awful position. Most realistic talking heads have mentioned Herro as a centerpiece. Robinson, Lowry, and our picks will not get this over the line. Beal is not going to screw the franchise over.


Sure, but Beal could also say I'm not dropping my NTC with Herro in the trade understanding that's the best asset to make his new team even better. If he didn't have the NTC you'd be completely right. So say Washington says it's not enough and keep Beal, what's their future, better than it was this year? To me and most they're 1 year further from having a shot at the top of the draft and Beal's one year older with an even higher average salary.

I'm fine with Herro being moved for Beal because Miami would still have a nearly 30 million dollar expiring contract in Lowry to get help later in the season but would actually rather see Miami expand the deal with Washington and try to extract Porzingis from them also. I don't believe Miami would go after Beal and Dame, that seems overkill and you start having to depend on offense and watch your defense go bye bye.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1592 » by dean456 » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:49 pm

MettaWorldPanda wrote:
AirP. wrote:
MettaWorldPanda wrote:Why in the world would he turn down a chance to play for the Clippers with Westbrook, George, and Leonard. Because of some state tax? That sounds asinine and only fitting a narrative that the Wiz are forced to take our trash offer of Lowry, Robinson and picks over a full clean sheet swipe the Clippers can offer with picks. I still think Herro trumps that offer but some in here are getting awfully cocky that we are the only show in town and able to get Beal for a hotdog and a half a bag of chips.


What? The state tax is 12.3%, for the rest of the ~207 million he's old, he'd be giving up around 25 million dollars just in state taxes, who knows how much he's paying in federal taxes and there's also his agent's cut but those are the same no matter where he plays. That's a lot of money.

Back to the matter at hand, why would he turn down the chance to play with the Clippers? Health concerns with the star players? They've been healthy enough to make the conference finals once since acquiring Kawhi and George.

So the money it'll cost plus the health concerns would be a big issue for someone finally leaving the franchise he's been all career long.

You still don't get it. Washington is just trying to get off Beal's money and his talent to be able to tank and get franchise changing talent. If they can get expiring contracts to clear cap room for next summer they can be in the same situation OKC and Utah have been in, able to take on other people's bad contracts for picks. Washington couldn't even get hometown kid KD to look at them, they have to develop their own stars. Miami fans are lucky, you're building a great tradition, you're located where others want to live in and currently are showing that even a team with inferior talent can compete with the big dogs. Try rooting for a smaller market team and hope you can develop enough talent to make a little noise in the playoffs and even then they were doing it with Gortat and Nene... unless you want to talk about DeJuan Blair who had no ACLs in his knees.

The only time in recent history that Washington had a very good team is when they got top tier talent from the draft with Wall at #1 and Beal at #3, outside of that it's not been good.


Clippers offer them a clean wipe of the sheet. Them having to take on Duncan does not. I don’t think it’s about clearing the books rather then resetting there timeline with a 23 year old Herro. If it’s about wiping the books then the Clips offer is better. Sure Beal can turn it down but also turning down a good team in a big city and putting the Wiz in an awful position. Most realistic talking heads have mentioned Herro as a centerpiece. Robinson, Lowry, and our picks will not get this over the line. Beal is not going to screw the franchise over.



Herro being the centre piece wouldn't be a deal breaker especially if we get off Robinson's deal. But doing that as well as multiple picks would be too much in my opinion.

If they want multiple picks it has to be Lowry and Robinson as the players moving.

I just don't think there's a team out there that's giving multiple picks that Beal will agree to go to unless it's Brooklyn and they can make other moves to get better enough to compete.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1593 » by AirP. » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:53 pm

gom wrote:
AirP. wrote:The only time in recent history that Washington had a very good team is when they got top tier talent from the draft with Wall at #1 and Beal at #3, outside of that it's not been good.


What he said. ^

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Note: For 2022-2023, the data ends before the Finals, so Miami is actually better. I still have some web scraping to do.


It kinda sucks rooting for a franchise who doesn't really care about winning a title and really favors profits. It's exactly why I quit being a Bulls fan. The dumping of all-star Luol Deng for A.Bynum so they could waive him to save 12 million dollars right before his guarantee set in and the old 2 transaction trade with OKC to dump McDermott and Gibson for Payne, Morrow and Lauvergne were about the last straws and cemented my understanding they were all about profits and without Jordan that franchise would have won nothing.

Miami fans are extremely lucky to have one of the best run organizations in the NBA.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1594 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:53 pm

Bishop45 wrote:
3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
Read on Twitter


Raps likely not going to put him out there for cheap, but man our defense would be top tier


Man, it would be insane
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1595 » by DayofMourning » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:54 pm

AirP. wrote:
MettaWorldPanda wrote:
AirP. wrote:
Spoiler:
What? The state tax is 12.3%, for the rest of the ~207 million he's old, he'd be giving up around 25 million dollars just in state taxes, who knows how much he's paying in federal taxes and there's also his agent's cut but those are the same no matter where he plays. That's a lot of money.

Back to the matter at hand, why would he turn down the chance to play with the Clippers? Health concerns with the star players? They've been healthy enough to make the conference finals once since acquiring Kawhi and George.

So the money it'll cost plus the health concerns would be a big issue for someone finally leaving the franchise he's been all career long.

You still don't get it. Washington is just trying to get off Beal's money and his talent to be able to tank and get franchise changing talent. If they can get expiring contracts to clear cap room for next summer they can be in the same situation OKC and Utah have been in, able to take on other people's bad contracts for picks. Washington couldn't even get hometown kid KD to look at them, they have to develop their own stars. Miami fans are lucky, you're building a great tradition, you're located where others want to live in and currently are showing that even a team with inferior talent can compete with the big dogs. Try rooting for a smaller market team and hope you can develop enough talent to make a little noise in the playoffs and even then they were doing it with Gortat and Nene... unless you want to talk about DeJuan Blair who had no ACLs in his knees.

The only time in recent history that Washington had a very good team is when they got top tier talent from the draft with Wall at #1 and Beal at #3, outside of that it's not been good.


Clippers offer them a clean wipe of the sheet. Them having to take on Duncan does not. I don’t think it’s about clearing the books rather then resetting there timeline with a 23 year old Herro. If it’s about wiping the books then the Clips offer is better. Sure Beal can turn it down but also turning down a good team in a big city and putting the Wiz in an awful position. Most realistic talking heads have mentioned Herro as a centerpiece. Robinson, Lowry, and our picks will not get this over the line. Beal is not going to screw the franchise over.


Sure, but Beal could also say I'm not dropping my NTC with Herro in the trade understanding that's the best asset to make his new team even better. If he didn't have the NTC you'd be completely right. So say Washington says it's not enough and keep Beal, what's their future, better than it was this year? To me and most they're 1 year further from having a shot at the top of the draft and Beal's one year older with an even higher average salary.

I'm fine with Herro being moved for Beal because Miami would still have a nearly 30 million dollar expiring contract in Lowry to get help later in the season but would actually rather see Miami expand the deal with Washington and try to extract Porzingis from them also. I don't believe Miami would go after Beal and Dame, that seems overkill and you start having to depend on offense and watch your defense go bye bye.


A fully healthy squad of Monte, Beal, Butler, Bam, Zinger with Caleb, Gabe, Jovic, Omer, etc. looks pretty damn good.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1596 » by AirP. » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:57 pm

dean456 wrote:
MettaWorldPanda wrote:
AirP. wrote:
What? The state tax is 12.3%, for the rest of the ~207 million he's old, he'd be giving up around 25 million dollars just in state taxes, who knows how much he's paying in federal taxes and there's also his agent's cut but those are the same no matter where he plays. That's a lot of money.

Back to the matter at hand, why would he turn down the chance to play with the Clippers? Health concerns with the star players? They've been healthy enough to make the conference finals once since acquiring Kawhi and George.

So the money it'll cost plus the health concerns would be a big issue for someone finally leaving the franchise he's been all career long.

You still don't get it. Washington is just trying to get off Beal's money and his talent to be able to tank and get franchise changing talent. If they can get expiring contracts to clear cap room for next summer they can be in the same situation OKC and Utah have been in, able to take on other people's bad contracts for picks. Washington couldn't even get hometown kid KD to look at them, they have to develop their own stars. Miami fans are lucky, you're building a great tradition, you're located where others want to live in and currently are showing that even a team with inferior talent can compete with the big dogs. Try rooting for a smaller market team and hope you can develop enough talent to make a little noise in the playoffs and even then they were doing it with Gortat and Nene... unless you want to talk about DeJuan Blair who had no ACLs in his knees.

The only time in recent history that Washington had a very good team is when they got top tier talent from the draft with Wall at #1 and Beal at #3, outside of that it's not been good.


Clippers offer them a clean wipe of the sheet. Them having to take on Duncan does not. I don’t think it’s about clearing the books rather then resetting there timeline with a 23 year old Herro. If it’s about wiping the books then the Clips offer is better. Sure Beal can turn it down but also turning down a good team in a big city and putting the Wiz in an awful position. Most realistic talking heads have mentioned Herro as a centerpiece. Robinson, Lowry, and our picks will not get this over the line. Beal is not going to screw the franchise over.



Herro being the centre piece wouldn't be a deal breaker especially if we get off Robinson's deal. But doing that as well as multiple picks would be too much in my opinion.

If they want multiple picks it has to be Lowry and Robinson as the players moving.

I just don't think there's a team out there that's giving multiple picks that Beal will agree to go to unless it's Brooklyn and they can make other moves to get better enough to compete.


Right, if your Beal and you're going to LAC, Miami or Milwaukee are you going to want them sending a bunch of assets for you or do you want your new team to have as many assets as possible to continue to upgrade the team? It's not like he's going to leave wherever he goes next, teams can't dump him, his NTC doesn't change if allows a team to trade for him, so he's going to want to have success the whole time he's with his new team and how does that happen, by not giving away assets they didn't have to.

Way back in around 2007-08 or somewhere around that time, a video overseas popped up of Kobe saying he was going to Chicago. Why did he want to go to Chicago? To play with Luol Deng, so when Kobe tried to force a trade every single time LAL would ask for Deng to make sure Kobe wouldn't want to go.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1597 » by MettaWorldPanda » Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:58 pm

3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
Bishop45 wrote:
3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
Read on Twitter


Raps likely not going to put him out there for cheap, but man our defense would be top tier


Man, it would be insane

If Raps put him in play with Siakim for Scoot, Simons, picks then mission accomplished for the Blazers.
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1598 » by AirP. » Sat Jun 17, 2023 12:00 am

MettaWorldPanda wrote:If Raps put him in play with Siakim for Scoot, Simons, picks then mission accomplished for the Blazers.

Kinda, but they really need to upgrade the center position, maybe they could move Nurkic in a package for Ayton?
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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

Post#1599 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Sat Jun 17, 2023 12:03 am

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Re: Miami Heat 2023 Off-Season Thread 1.0 - Give them Cancun!!! 

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