2023 NBA Draft (tonight's discussion on pg 58)

[zzaj]

Very risky for Portland of all teams, to go after this generation's Greg Oden.

You must not remember Greg Oden's injuries very well. Oden was in way worse shape with degenerative knees.

Dame also liked a tweet from a Blazer fan suggesting bringing Zion to Portland, but I get why you don't like that idea lol...

I am just a Heat fan having NBA withdrawal after the finals run, I usually don't comment on other teams boards but damn, This Dame to Miami thing is juicy and coming just a few weeks after the finals. That being said, I can't for the life of me understand why Portland of all teams would even consider trading this amazing opportunity for a rebuild for a player with so many red flags in regards to his health like Zion.

There are plenty of us here (a majority, probably) that feel it'd be a MASSIVE mistake to invest the #3 as an asset into Zion. Zion's value has only gone down since he's come into the league, and it will only continue to do so. There were questions about his ability to stay healthy coming into the NBA and he's done absolutely nothing to address those questions in his career.

[DusterBuster]

We are going to try and have our cake and eat it too. I will be shocked (probably in a good way) if Portland actually commits to one lane or the other.

I still believe doing the two timelines can work, but if they want to do it, they need to have the roster like 70-30% vets to youth. Last year, they tried to do that closer to 50-50 or 40-60 vets to youth and that's too much youth. You can get away with 2 out of your top 10 players being youth guys if the rest are vets. If Portland can get to that range, basically only having Sharpe and Miller/Scoot as your only two young guys and the rest vets, I think it can work.

This means though, if you keep 3, you HAVE to trade Simons and 23 and probably a host of additional firsts (still working under the assumption Portland can negotiate their way out of the Chicago mess) for some vets, then spend on vets in FA... I think that's how you can walk the tightrope with Dame.

That said, if they are really sold on Scoot and he's the pick at 3 and the deals out there aren't great still... then I'm pretty onboard with the trade Dame reboot. Less-so if it's Miller at 3.

Someone needs to tell Charlotte to make up their damn mind.

[Norm2953]

It certainly appears Scoot's camp in no certain terms has made it clear to both Charlotte
and Portland, he prefers to go to New Orleans. How he would fit there with CJ remains to
be seen.

It would seem to me if Charlotte is disinterested in Zion, they will pass on Scoot and take Miller,
who is the best fit for both Portland and Charlotte.

That would leave the problem on how Scoot fits to Portland. Trading for Zion doesn't
mean Dame will not ask for a trade and if he flames out, they'd have to settle for whatever else
is in the Zion trade package for the #3 pick in the draft.

[DusterBuster]

It certainly appears Scoot's camp in no certain terms has made it clear to both Charlotte
and Portland, he prefers to go to New Orleans. How he would fit there with CJ remains to
be seen.

It would seem to me if Charlotte is disinterested in Zion, they will pass on Scoot and take Miller,
who is the best fit for both Portland and Charlotte.

That would leave the problem on how Scoot fits to Portland. Trading for Zion doesn't
mean Dame will not ask for a trade and if he flames out, they'd have to settle for whatever else
is in the Zion trade package for the #3 pick in the draft.

CJ played SG for almost 10 full years. Scoot and CJ complement each other well stylistically, just they have the same problem almost all CJ at SG teams have, they’ll be undersized.

As for Dame and still asking out after the trade… that’s true regardless of what player the Blazers move 3 for, not just Zion. They could trade for Paul George and he blows an ACL in November and Dame asks out at the deadline. That’s just a risk you’re running regardless with a win-now trade using #3. You can make the same excuse if they trade for a guy with only a year left on his deal and he leaves in FA. It’s just inherently risky trading #3 period. Full stop.

I agree tho, it very well could just be that Charlotte takes Miller at 2 and this gets much simpler for the Blazers. If Charlotte wants to get some assets tho, it will want Portland guessing about taking Scoot at 2 so they can convince Portland to try and swap 3 for 2 and get some additional assets out of it.

[Blazinaway]

It certainly appears Scoot's camp in no certain terms has made it clear to both Charlotte
and Portland, he prefers to go to New Orleans. How he would fit there with CJ remains to
be seen.

It would seem to me if Charlotte is disinterested in Zion, they will pass on Scoot and take Miller,
who is the best fit for both Portland and Charlotte.

That would leave the problem on how Scoot fits to Portland. Trading for Zion doesn't
mean Dame will not ask for a trade and if he flames out, they'd have to settle for whatever else
is in the Zion trade package for the #3 pick in the draft.

Yeah huge risk/reward situation with Zion, personally I would not do it because his health/weight concerns and now this added porn star stuff - does he really care much about basketball?

[Blazinaway]

It certainly appears Scoot's camp in no certain terms has made it clear to both Charlotte
and Portland, he prefers to go to New Orleans. How he would fit there with CJ remains to
be seen.

It would seem to me if Charlotte is disinterested in Zion, they will pass on Scoot and take Miller,
who is the best fit for both Portland and Charlotte.

That would leave the problem on how Scoot fits to Portland. Trading for Zion doesn't
mean Dame will not ask for a trade and if he flames out, they'd have to settle for whatever else
is in the Zion trade package for the #3 pick in the draft.

CJ played SG for almost 10 full years. Scoot and CJ complement each other well stylistically, just they have the same problem almost all CJ at SG teams have, they’ll be undersized.

As for Dame and still asking out after the trade… that’s true regardless of what player the Blazers move 3 for, not just Zion. They could trade for Paul George and he blows an ACL in November and Dame asks out at the deadline. That’s just a risk you’re running regardless with a win-now trade using #3. You can make the same excuse if they trade for a guy with only a year left on his deal and he leaves in FA. It’s just inherently risky trading #3 period. Full stop.

I agree tho, it very well could just be that Charlotte takes Miller at 2 and this gets much simpler for the Blazers. If Charlotte wants to get some assets tho, it will want Portland guessing about taking Scoot at 2 so they can convince Portland to try and swap 3 for 2 and get some additional assets out of it.

F giving them anything, if we want one of Scoot or Miller just take whoever is left at 3

[The Sebastian Express]

Very risky for Portland of all teams, to go after this generation's Greg Oden.

You must not remember Greg Oden's injuries very well. Oden was in way worse shape with degenerative knees.

Dame also liked a tweet from a Blazer fan suggesting bringing Zion to Portland, but I get why you don't like that idea lol...

I am just a Heat fan having NBA withdrawal after the finals run, I usually don't comment on other teams boards but damn, This Dame to Miami thing is juicy and coming just a few weeks after the finals. That being said, I can't for the life of me understand why Portland of all teams would even consider trading this amazing opportunity for a rebuild for a player with so many red flags in regards to his health like Zion.

It's okay. Most of us get why you're here and some of your other Heat fans. You guys have been much more respectful and fun to interact with than some of the Nets and Toronto fans we've had come over. It's cool.

[The Sebastian Express]

According to Marang, Charlotte is planning on making their pick tonight. Scoot wants to goto New Orleans the most and his camp is trying to make that happen. He would be fine coming to Portland, but he really doesn't want to goto Charlotte to share the ball with LaMelo. So Charlotte could consider moving down if they want Miller to get more assets.

Basically, it's looking like the Hornets are locked in on Miller, so you could start to see the framework of a deal where in the #2 pick goes to NO so they get Scoot, #3 pick goes to Charlotte for Miller, and Zion comes to Portland.

The only sticking point would be the potential of Charlotte and New Orleans just working directly together to maybe trade the #2 pick for Ingram, but so far New Orleans has not shown much interest in moving BI. Also, from Charlotte's standpoint, you have to wonder if that's very appealing to them, BI is still youngish, but they don't get him on a rookie scale deal for a few years like they'd get with Miller. If you think Miller will be as good as Ingram (which imo isn't an unreasonable projection for the type of player Miller can be), then why take the older version of that player on a more expensive contract? There are also still plenty of rumblings in NO that they're pretty sick of Zion's offcourt stuff.

Another alternative, if NO isn't moving Ingram and Charlotte has made its mind up for Miller, maybe making two separate deals is the way to go for the Blazers. They move 3 and like 5 2nd rounders to get up to 2. Then Blazers move 2 and Nurk for Zion. Then you have Simons and the 23rd pick to get another C upgrade, probably Orlando?

It's really interesting to me he apparently, allegedly, wouldn't want to go to the Hornets to share those duties but would be fine here, since there's a chance Dame would remain.

Thursday is going to be wild one way or another.

[The Sebastian Express]

It certainly appears Scoot's camp in no certain terms has made it clear to both Charlotte
and Portland, he prefers to go to New Orleans. How he would fit there with CJ remains to
be seen.

It would seem to me if Charlotte is disinterested in Zion, they will pass on Scoot and take Miller,
who is the best fit for both Portland and Charlotte.

That would leave the problem on how Scoot fits to Portland. Trading for Zion doesn't
mean Dame will not ask for a trade and if he flames out, they'd have to settle for whatever else
is in the Zion trade package for the #3 pick in the draft.

CJ played SG for almost 10 full years. Scoot and CJ complement each other well stylistically, just they have the same problem almost all CJ at SG teams have, they’ll be undersized.

As for Dame and still asking out after the trade… that’s true regardless of what player the Blazers move 3 for, not just Zion. They could trade for Paul George and he blows an ACL in November and Dame asks out at the deadline. That’s just a risk you’re running regardless with a win-now trade using #3. You can make the same excuse if they trade for a guy with only a year left on his deal and he leaves in FA. It’s just inherently risky trading #3 period. Full stop.

I agree tho, it very well could just be that Charlotte takes Miller at 2 and this gets much simpler for the Blazers. If Charlotte wants to get some assets tho, it will want Portland guessing about taking Scoot at 2 so they can convince Portland to try and swap 3 for 2 and get some additional assets out of it.

I actually do not think Dame would ask for a trade if a trade for Zion or PG was completed but flamed out. I think he would respect and appreciate a real effort was made but would understand sometimes there's forces beyond anyone's control. I don't think he'd do that to Portland.

[DusterBuster]

According to Marang, Charlotte is planning on making their pick tonight. Scoot wants to goto New Orleans the most and his camp is trying to make that happen. He would be fine coming to Portland, but he really doesn't want to goto Charlotte to share the ball with LaMelo. So Charlotte could consider moving down if they want Miller to get more assets.

Basically, it's looking like the Hornets are locked in on Miller, so you could start to see the framework of a deal where in the #2 pick goes to NO so they get Scoot, #3 pick goes to Charlotte for Miller, and Zion comes to Portland.

The only sticking point would be the potential of Charlotte and New Orleans just working directly together to maybe trade the #2 pick for Ingram, but so far New Orleans has not shown much interest in moving BI. Also, from Charlotte's standpoint, you have to wonder if that's very appealing to them, BI is still youngish, but they don't get him on a rookie scale deal for a few years like they'd get with Miller. If you think Miller will be as good as Ingram (which imo isn't an unreasonable projection for the type of player Miller can be), then why take the older version of that player on a more expensive contract? There are also still plenty of rumblings in NO that they're pretty sick of Zion's offcourt stuff.

Another alternative, if NO isn't moving Ingram and Charlotte has made its mind up for Miller, maybe making two separate deals is the way to go for the Blazers. They move 3 and like 5 2nd rounders to get up to 2. Then Blazers move 2 and Nurk for Zion. Then you have Simons and the 23rd pick to get another C upgrade, probably Orlando?

It's really interesting to me he apparently, allegedly, wouldn't want to go to the Hornets to share those duties but would be fine here, since there's a chance Dame would remain.

Thursday is going to be wild one way or another.

I can think of two reasons for that. One, it may just be pretty well known that if the Blazers are keeping Scoot, Dame is gone and it's just not much of a question. Two, Scoot is on record as saying Dame is his idol and his favorite player in the league. He looks up to Dame and would seemingly love to play and learn under him for a time vs playing with another younger player who's done nothing that he would compete for the spotlight like LaMelo.

[DusterBuster]

It certainly appears Scoot's camp in no certain terms has made it clear to both Charlotte
and Portland, he prefers to go to New Orleans. How he would fit there with CJ remains to
be seen.

It would seem to me if Charlotte is disinterested in Zion, they will pass on Scoot and take Miller,
who is the best fit for both Portland and Charlotte.

That would leave the problem on how Scoot fits to Portland. Trading for Zion doesn't
mean Dame will not ask for a trade and if he flames out, they'd have to settle for whatever else
is in the Zion trade package for the #3 pick in the draft.

CJ played SG for almost 10 full years. Scoot and CJ complement each other well stylistically, just they have the same problem almost all CJ at SG teams have, they’ll be undersized.

As for Dame and still asking out after the trade… that’s true regardless of what player the Blazers move 3 for, not just Zion. They could trade for Paul George and he blows an ACL in November and Dame asks out at the deadline. That’s just a risk you’re running regardless with a win-now trade using #3. You can make the same excuse if they trade for a guy with only a year left on his deal and he leaves in FA. It’s just inherently risky trading #3 period. Full stop.

I agree tho, it very well could just be that Charlotte takes Miller at 2 and this gets much simpler for the Blazers. If Charlotte wants to get some assets tho, it will want Portland guessing about taking Scoot at 2 so they can convince Portland to try and swap 3 for 2 and get some additional assets out of it.

I actually do not think Dame would ask for a trade if a trade for Zion or PG was completed but flamed out. I think he would respect and appreciate a real effort was made but would understand sometimes there's forces beyond anyone's control. I don't think he'd do that to Portland.

This is what I think as well. It's not 100% and maybe he would still ask out if the big swing trade was a disaster, but my respect for Dame makes me believe you're right.

[DusterBuster]

Read on Twitter

[Goldbum]

I think they had to make an offer for Bam, but I think those discussions will end up being about Dame to Miami instead. I still think a 3 way with Boston and Houston is our best chance.
Essentially
Dame to BOS
Brown to Hou
#4 and Jabari Smith and TPE to Portland.
That's the sort of move I pursue if Dame asks out.

Really? These would all seem pretty against the grain of what's been reported (BOS not interested in moving Brown, Dame not wanting to goto BOS)

You are 100% correct and my post was just throwing out the type of deal that could interest me. That is absolutely not a rumor or anything just another goofy idea.

[DeBlazerRiddem]

As for Dame and still asking out after the trade… that’s true regardless of what player the Blazers move 3 for, not just Zion. They could trade for Paul George and he blows an ACL in November and Dame asks out at the deadline. That’s just a risk you’re running regardless with a win-now trade using #3. You can make the same excuse if they trade for a guy with only a year left on his deal and he leaves in FA. It’s just inherently risky trading #3 period. Full stop.

I totally agree, and would add that drafting a player at #3 is risky too if they get chronically injured or turn out to be a bust. There are no moves without risk in the NBA, especially not needling moving ones. I'm not the biggest advocate of trading for Zion but I understand the home run swing that kind of move is, healthy for one playoff run and that is a serious difference maker. My problem with betting on inconsistently healthy players at this point with Dame is what are the actual chances of that happening and how many years do we have to roll the dice on that?

I would probably make a terrible GM because at this point I would probably prioritize consistency very highly *if* I was trading the #3 just because then next year kind of HAS to work out. If there is (for example) a 33% chance of Zion being healthy for a playoff run then do we have 3 years to gamble? But that would mean a slightly less talented player and a lesser chance of a miracle championship and the stars aligning with a big home run swing might be the only actual shot at a chip we have - even if the chances of it blowing up in our face is more likely.

[DusterBuster]

As for Dame and still asking out after the trade… that’s true regardless of what player the Blazers move 3 for, not just Zion. They could trade for Paul George and he blows an ACL in November and Dame asks out at the deadline. That’s just a risk you’re running regardless with a win-now trade using #3. You can make the same excuse if they trade for a guy with only a year left on his deal and he leaves in FA. It’s just inherently risky trading #3 period. Full stop.

I totally agree, and would add that drafting a player at #3 is risky too if they get chronically injured or turn out to be a bust. There are no moves without risk in the NBA, especially not needling moving ones. I'm not the biggest advocate of trading for Zion but I understand the home run swing that kind of move is, healthy for one playoff run and that is a serious difference maker. My problem with betting on inconsistently healthy players at this point with Dame is what are the actual chances of that happening and how many years do we have to roll the dice on that?

I would probably make a terrible GM because at this point I would probably prioritize consistency very highly *if* I was trading the #3 just because then next year kind of HAS to work out. If there is (for example) a 33% chance of Zion being healthy for a playoff run then do we have 3 years to gamble? But that would mean a slightly less talented player and a lesser chance of a miracle championship and the stars aligning with a big home run swing might be the only actual shot at a chip we have - even if the chances of it blowing up in our face is more likely.

Exactly. So much of the NBA really is just dumb luck. Even "can't miss" prospects can miss. So keeping and drafting the player, then having him get derailed by injuries or just not panning out is just about as big a risk as trading away a player.

My reason for being more bullish on Zion is his age and contract situation. He's only 22yo, so as old as some 4yr college kids and locked into a multi-year deal, not a 28yo on an expiring deal looking for his 2nd max contract like a Siakam. So to your point, you have a lot of runway with a Zion type, you've just skipped over the education years of a rookie. And also like you said, if the stars align and he is healthy for even one playoff run, you have a serious shot at doing something because he can be soooo dominant. More dominant than anyone in this draft not named Wemby.

[DusterBuster]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=ytu8_lCpASqsmEN-XvYq2g

[DeBlazerRiddem]

I'm curious on people's takes of home run vs consistency.

Trade #3 for:

A. Zion
B. Mikal


?

[PDXKnight]

I'm curious on people's takes of home run vs consistency.

Trade #3 for:

A. Zion
B. Mikal


?

B easily for me

[DusterBuster]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=ytu8_lCpASqsmEN-XvYq2g

[DusterBuster]

I'm curious on people's takes of home run vs consistency.

Trade #3 for:

A. Zion
B. Mikal


?

I’m so tired of consistency base hits, give me 20% at home run.