Grade the Trade, KP + 2 1st for Smart & a 2nd plus filler – (Reminisce Thread)

[lon3lytoaster]

Tentative B- from me. My intuitive self knows it was time for Smart to go, or at least have his role downgraded. Smart and Porzingis will probably both miss the same number of games so I guess it’s a bit of a wash there? The Warriors pick is what can really put this over the top though. That could be a lottery pick if Dray leaves and they get a bit unlucky with health again.

Definitely in some shock that Brad and the Celtics pulled the trigger on dealing Smart after 9 years. Crazy.

[Ben-N1ce]

I won't give it an A based on injury concerns so I went with B plus. Got the better player and bigger need. The way I see it. The gap between Al and Porzingas..and White and Smart is much larger..

[31to6]

Thoughts on the trade:

This is the second time the Celtics traded an ubergritty player to Memphis. Years ago it was Tony Allen, which resulted in the whole Grindfather lore. This might not be all that again, but it does echo.

The swap removes some major redundancy as Smart and White largely overlapped, and one had to sit in crunchtime. That unused value was just cashed in.

It opens up an opportunity for one or more of Boston's young long-shots. Madar, Begarin, and Davison all have reasons to be thinking about playing in green next year.

With a little Warrior bad luck out west, you never know what that Golden State pick might turn into.

The risks of doing this deal were way less than the risks of not doing it.

They had to do something after those playoffs.

There's a lot of roster construction still to come.


The biggest news of all: The Celtics now have the the only two devotees of the Kornet Kontest.

https://www.basketballnetwork.net/latest-news/kristaps-porzingis-believes-the-kornet-contest-actually-works

GANT AND AFAM sightings in this thread — Marcus Smart did it — he brought us back together!

Good on ya, mates. Glad you’re alive and hopefully well in the Celtics cyberverse.

[sully00]

In the end Boston was a small ball basketball team that found a way to lose to a worse small ball team at the worst possible time. Factor in losing to the Warriors the year before as well and I don’t think that Boston could double down on being a defense first small ball basketball team. The concept of swapping Brogdon for KP was okay but in some ways it just created another problem. I loved Smart as much anyone but teams were allowed to ignore him defensively put more attention on Tatum and Brown. Teams are going to have to account for KP defensively and Brogdon is such offensive upgrade compared to Smart and Smart’s loss is offset by having White on the defensive end. Have to get something out of the picks but moving Gallo and it costing you nothing in itself is somewhat of head scratcher.

[Jammer]

Thoughts on the trade:

This is the second time the Celtics traded an ubergritty player to Memphis. Years ago it was Tony Allen, which resulted in the whole Grindfather lore. This might not be all that again, but it does echo.

The swap removes some major redundancy as Smart and White largely overlapped, and one had to sit in crunchtime. That unused value was just cashed in.

It opens up an opportunity for one or more of Boston's young long-shots. Madar, Begarin, and Davison all have reasons to be thinking about playing in green next year.

With a little Warrior bad luck out west, you never know what that Golden State pick might turn into.

The risks of doing this deal were way less than the risks of not doing it.

They had to do something after those playoffs.

There's a lot of roster construction still to come.


The biggest news of all: The Celtics now have the the only two devotees of the Kornet Kontest.

https://www.basketballnetwork.net/latest-news/kristaps-porzingis-believes-the-kornet-contest-actually-works

[Jammer]

Suddenly the rotation is crystallized, but some of these guys are not always available.

PG: Derrick White / Malcolm Brogdan / Payton Pritchard

SG: Jaylen Brown / Malcolm Brogdan / Justin Champagnie

SF: Jayson Tatum / Sam Hauser

PF: Al Horford / 2023 #25 Pick ???

C: Kristaps Porzingis / Rob Williams III / Luke Kornet

That's 12 guys.

Would not be surprised if the #25 pick is used on a Power Forward to replace the higher priced Grant WIlliams.

Then they have to decide between bringing over Begarin or Madar, elevating Davison, Free Agents and the Undrafted G-Leaguers that Miami keeps finding Diamonds from. At least they'll have some roster spots open to maybe attract some of the Undrafted to camp, although everyone is probably heading to Phoenix first with only 6 guys under contract right now.

[Jammer]

I'm really happy that this will finally shift Jayson Tatum to SF (where he belongs) for MOST of his minutes, and Jaylen Brown to SG for most of his minutes. It makes the Celtics bigger. Having Porzingis certainly doesn't hurt on the length side either.

[Jammer]

The Celtics have a lot riding on Brogdan's elbow.

We have to hope that Brogdan doesn't pull a Scot Pollard and wait until training camp to decide he needs surgery.

[BK_2020]

I'm really happy that this will finally shift Jayson Tatum to SF (where he belongs) for MOST of his minutes, and Jaylen Brown to SG for most of his minutes. It makes the Celtics bigger. Having Porzingis certainly doesn't hurt on the length side either.

Jaylen Brown can't play SG anymore. His lateral movement, which was never his strong point, has gotten to 38 year old Lebron-level.

[leper-con]

Clearly Brsdcwsbts a different voice in the locker room as the leader is gone

[Hal14]

Read on Twitter

[JaMarco]

One of the greatest trades in Celtics history. All hail Goat Stevens.

[cloverleaf]

Suddenly the rotation is crystallized, but some of these guys are not always available.

PG: Derrick White / Malcolm Brogdan / Payton Pritchard

SG: Jaylen Brown / Malcolm Brogdan / Justin Champagnie

SF: Jayson Tatum / Sam Hauser

PF: Al Horford / 2023 #25 Pick ???

C: Kristaps Porzingis / Rob Williams III / Luke Kornet

That's 12 guys.

Would not be surprised if the #25 pick is used on a Power Forward to replace the higher priced Grant WIlliams.

Then they have to decide between bringing over Begarin or Madar, elevating Davison, Free Agents and the Undrafted G-Leaguers that Miami keeps finding Diamonds from. At least they'll have some roster spots open to maybe attract some of the Undrafted to camp, although everyone is probably heading to Phoenix first with only 6 guys under contract right now.

Better to shift Al to the bench at the start of the year IMO--and get it over with. Big opportunity for Rob to get in the groove with Porzi. Especially with Smart gone and Brogdon hurt, I want both Yam and JD on the regular roster and Begarin on a two-way. I wonder where Pritchard's head is and body will be. Some sort of project big (Clowney?) from the draft and some more rugged wing and big vets.

[djFan71]

Going A. A++++ would have been the original version, lol.
Sucks that Brogdon's elbow helped cost a championship and Marcus Smart within a few months.

But, we addressed a huge need and got extra picks in the process. I love Smart, but this was the first year I considered trading him. We lose toughness for sure (he & Grant), but upgrade talent and future deal flexibility with the picks.

[captain green]

Does this mean we have to keep can't will now ? God I hope not!

[Zeroforwinger]

In my head, I know it’s a good trade. I think it’s not as good as the original trade with Brogdon though. Watching the team will be much more difficult without Smart there. Hate all you want, but we just lost a lot of leadership that I don’t think the Jays are capable of covering.

[Tyakack]

Going with an A-. Being a bit biased because of how badly I wanted the core broken up but even objectively speaking this was a great trade.

We got the better player and picks. There is a risk involved but if winning it all means anything to you, running it back with this core was a HUGE risk too. We've already seen what they do when it matters. They fail, alot, for the same exact reasons.

I personally always thought smart or brown, or maybe even both, needed to go if we were gonna win it all. This was a huge step in the right direction IMO.

[Parasite]

I’m just happy they aren’t running it back like many of the fools on this board wanted. I hope they aren’t done, frankly. Good move getting rid of Smart, one of the most overrated players in Celtics history.

A+

[Slartibartfast]

On paper, it's a massive win.

Trade from positional glut for a younger, more talented player at a position of need plus get picks... Roll out with Big 3 of 20 plus scorers with lineups boasting tremendous defensive size at every position without sacrificing floor spacing.

But there's some paper tiger qualities... The big one obviously being Brogdon and KP's health... Bu there is also the question of offensive composition and overall intensity which the last playoff run illustrated is no small matter.

We already had a problem with too little quality playmaking. Now we are shifting from combo guards as our third wheels to a scoring PF/C who will need/want to see a lot of the ball (ie not just a roll/pop man). That means an increase in the amount of possessions that are going to be controlled by scorers only one of whom is above average as a playmaker (and Tatum is more of a secondary playmaker, not a LeBron style point forward). That could lead to a whole that is less than the sum of its parts.

Then there's the intensity question. Moving from Marcus to KP is a big change in identity. Who is going to bring the toughness on this squad? Who is going to be the warrior? It's not like Marcus prevented the amazing lapses in focus and competitiveness this past season, but it's hard not to see the tendency towards flakiness increasing with the switch. Esp. if Grant Williams leaves too.

The worry is this team becomes an even more extreme version of last year, capable of destroying anyone when the threes are falling and everyone is feeling good, but prone to collapse and lose to anyone when things stagnate.

[lon3lytoaster]

With a day or two to reflect, I really like that this puts DW in a position to be the lead guard, more or less. He had that amazing breakout stretch in that role when Marcus got hurt and while I think he’s not quite the defender you’d think he is, good things happen with him out there and the overall intelligence of the team raises significantly by not having to play both Smart and Brown together.

Brogdon is a little worrisome. He’s going to miss time next year, so your guard rotation has potential to be pretty light a lot of the time next season without another body there.. or Pritchard damn well better be ready to play a lot more like he wanted.

Think you’re also one big shy at the moment. Kris, Rob and Al will all miss games to injury and load management. What do you do if there’s an injury and planned time off? Need another body here as well.