1995 Spurs: Replace D-Rob w/ 2023 Jokic

[Matt15]

How far would the Spurs get if you replaced D-Rob w/ 2023 Jokic?

[thekdog34]

Vs. the Rockets, Admiral shot 45% and had 27 turnovers to 16 assists wiuth 106 ortg. So should be significant improvement there.

On the other hand, Hakeem might do better offensively, and he averaged 35 ppg on 59 TS% and 5 APG. Rockets made 8 threes per game too, which was high for that era.

Since they traded Thorpe for Drexler and started Horry at the 4, they had a lot more shooting compared to '94.

[One_and_Done]

Not as far. Jokic game is less suited to that era and that team. Not alot of shooting for one thing.

[Colbinii]

I have them winning the title.

Typically speaking, backwards comparisons are unfair given the advantage modern players have to less-modern players in terms of understanding of the game--both analytical analysis and emphasis on shooting. Jokic and his team would be taking far more 3P shots, which would result in an unbelievable Ortg for that era.

[One_and_Done]

To shoot more 3s you actually need 3 point shooters on the roster. You do get that right? Jokic is taking over the 95 Spurs, not the team you would like him to have.

[Colbinii]

To shoot more 3s you actually need 3 point shooters on the roster. You do get that right? Jokic is taking over the 95 Spurs, not the team you would like him to have.

You do realize Sean Elliot was a 40% 3P shooter shooting only 4 3PA in 1995, right? Ya dew get dat, wright?

Don't forget Jokic gets to shoot on the shortened 3P line and understands the efficiency of a 3P shot.

[henshao]

We're assuming Jokic has the most trouble with Hakeem but it won't be a field day with the young, running the court, hustling and diving-for-loose-balls version of Shaq either and honestly Divac and Mutumbo warrant some consideration as well. Really it boils down to whether or not Jokic has to run the 95 Spurs offense or gets to run an offense optimized for him because I find it highly unlikely he outdoes Robinson at Robinson things but if left to do Jokic things it will make for a great playoffs. I don't know how well he will be able to score on the aforementioned defenders/defenses but for sure the Spurs will be allowing a lot more points so I lean towards a lesser result than they achieved in 95

[One_and_Done]

To shoot more 3s you actually need 3 point shooters on the roster. You do get that right? Jokic is taking over the 95 Spurs, not the team you would like him to have.

You do realize Sean Elliot was a 40% 3P shooter shooting only 4 3PA in 1995, right? Ya dew get dat, wright?

40% on open shots because nobody guarded the 3 properly. Jokic doesn't change that by getting him more open, because he's already wide open. How does the rest of that Spurs roster look?

[Colbinii]

We're assuming Jokic has the most trouble with Hakeem but it won't be a field day with the young, running the court, hustling and diving-for-loose-balls version of Shaq either and honestly Divac and Mutumbo warrant some consideration as well. Really it boils down to whether or not Jokic has to run the 95 Spurs offense or gets to run an offense optimized for him because I find it highly unlikely he outdoes Robinson at Robinson things but if left to do Jokic things it will make for a great playoffs. I don't know how well he will be able to score on the aforementioned defenders/defenses but for sure the Spurs will be allowing a lot more points so I lean towards a lesser result than they achieved in 95

I mean, Jokic just says "guys, shoot 3P shots" and they roast everyone, right? Especially with the shortened 3P line.

[Colbinii]

To shoot more 3s you actually need 3 point shooters on the roster. You do get that right? Jokic is taking over the 95 Spurs, not the team you would like him to have.

You do realize Sean Elliot was a 40% 3P shooter shooting only 4 3PA in 1995, right? Ya dew get dat, wright?

40% on open shots because nobody guarded the 3 properly. Jokic doesn't change that by getting him more open, because he's already wide open. How does the rest of that Spurs roster look?

Sure Jokic changes that. He understands modern concepts.

Del Negro shot 40%+ on 2.2 3PA and Pearson shot 38% on 5.5 3PA.

They would ravage the NBA. They would be shooting 35-40+ 3PA while Hakeem and the Rockets are 2nd at 20 3PA.

[migya]

We're assuming Jokic has the most trouble with Hakeem but it won't be a field day with the young, running the court, hustling and diving-for-loose-balls version of Shaq either and honestly Divac and Mutumbo warrant some consideration as well. Really it boils down to whether or not Jokic has to run the 95 Spurs offense or gets to run an offense optimized for him because I find it highly unlikely he outdoes Robinson at Robinson things but if left to do Jokic things it will make for a great playoffs. I don't know how well he will be able to score on the aforementioned defenders/defenses but for sure the Spurs will be allowing a lot more points so I lean towards a lesser result than they achieved in 95

People don't seem to realise how grinding and physical the mid 90s were. Jokic isn't defending anything let alone Olajuwon. He'd score some but the environment was far less suited to the ease of scoring today. Houston was simply too good those playoffs and Orlando not far off them.

[thekdog34]

We're assuming Jokic has the most trouble with Hakeem but it won't be a field day with the young, running the court, hustling and diving-for-loose-balls version of Shaq either and honestly Divac and Mutumbo warrant some consideration as well. Really it boils down to whether or not Jokic has to run the 95 Spurs offense or gets to run an offense optimized for him because I find it highly unlikely he outdoes Robinson at Robinson things but if left to do Jokic things it will make for a great playoffs. I don't know how well he will be able to score on the aforementioned defenders/defenses but for sure the Spurs will be allowing a lot more points so I lean towards a lesser result than they achieved in 95

I mean, Jokic just says "guys, shoot 3P shots" and they roast everyone, right? Especially with the shortened 3P line.

Are we also assuming the rockets shoot more 3s? Horry was 17-40 as a PF that series.

[Ambrose]

With current knowledge? Title. Transporting him back and somehow making him only aware of history up to that point is a lot trickier.

[Colbinii]

We're assuming Jokic has the most trouble with Hakeem but it won't be a field day with the young, running the court, hustling and diving-for-loose-balls version of Shaq either and honestly Divac and Mutumbo warrant some consideration as well. Really it boils down to whether or not Jokic has to run the 95 Spurs offense or gets to run an offense optimized for him because I find it highly unlikely he outdoes Robinson at Robinson things but if left to do Jokic things it will make for a great playoffs. I don't know how well he will be able to score on the aforementioned defenders/defenses but for sure the Spurs will be allowing a lot more points so I lean towards a lesser result than they achieved in 95

I mean, Jokic just says "guys, shoot 3P shots" and they roast everyone, right? Especially with the shortened 3P line.

Are we also assuming the rockets shoot more 3s? Horry was 17-40 as a PF that series.

Would they?

It would be like Sabonis coming over in 1995 and then his team plays completely different. You really think the stubbornness of America in the 1990s would all just adapt to play like this giant European in the 1990s?

Of course not.

[One_and_Done]

I think the first problem here, as people have said, is that you're assuming Jokic is going back with 2023 knowledge, and that somehow he will get those 'stubborn Americans' who you say won't adapt to just agree to play the way Jokic wants.

In reality 2 full time starters next to Jokic wouldn't be able to shoot 3s ar all. That's a problem. Some of the Spurs best shooters play small roles.

I'm not sure the rules would favour Jokic either. The increased physicality, hand checking and so on would hurt him; and in this era there are guys who will dominate him physically. In a weird way the illegal defence rules kind of hurt him too, because fewer double teams will happen. Today he kills you partly because he can pass so well when doubled. Guys like Shaq and Hakeem mean a double is never coming.

[70sFan]

Not as far. Jokic game is less suited to that era and that team. Not alot of shooting for one thing.

Do you think even less shooting would hurt Jokic even more in the 1960s?

I'm not sure the rules would favour Jokic either. The increased physicality, hand checking and so on would hurt him; and in this era there are guys who will dominate him physically.

Jokic is an enormous human being with elite balance and coordination and he's a very physical player as well. Who would be able to dominate him physically? Shaq I guess, Hakeem and Robinson would be too quick for him, but they were also smaller and weaker than him. Who else?

In a weird way the illegal defence rules kind of hurt him too, because fewer double teams will happen. Today he kills you partly because he can pass so well when doubled. Guys like Shaq and Hakeem mean a double is never coming.

1. Not doubling Jokic wouldn't help defenses at all, because Jokic is one of the best post players ever.
2. Rockets doubled Robinson in the post even though he was much worse post scorer than Jokic. They also doubled Shaq in the finals.

[One_and_Done]

Less shooting in the 60s, and no 3pt line, would hurt that part of Jokic's game. The general dearth of talent in a weak era would more than cancel it out though. There are many bench guys today who would be all-stars in the 60s.

The only place the 90s big men are smaller than Jokic is in the gut. He is shorter than guys like D.Rob, worse wingspan, athleticism, etc. I honestly see him struggling to match up with Karl Malone.

[LA Bird]

The mythologizing of 90s physicality and hand checking strikes once again

Watch on YouTube

Look at all that (non-existent) hand checking stopping Robinson from scoring.

Spurs could very well have won the series and title if Robinson had even played to his usual playoff level. But he did even worse, putting up 21 points on 29% shooting with 7 turnovers and 19 points on 35% shooting with 6 turnovers in two close losses. Robinson absolutely blew the series with how bad he was offensively. Sure, he is much better than Jokic defensively but realistically, I don't see Hakeem scoring much better than he already did. And if anything, Jokic being heavier and more ground bound might be more advantageous for the matchup since he is less likely to fall for Hakeem's fakes than Robinson who was jumping all over the place.

[70sFan]

Less shooting in the 60s, and no 3pt line, would hurt that part of Jokic's game. The general dearth of talent in a weak era would more than cancel it out though.

The general dearth of talent in a weak 1990s era would more than cancel out less shooting.

There are many bench guys today who would be all-stars in the 60s.

There are many bench guys today who would be all-stars in the 90s.

The only place the 90s big men are smaller than Jokic is in the gut. He is shorter than guys like D.Rob, worse wingspan, athleticism, etc. I honestly see him struggling to match up with Karl Malone.

Robinson is slightly taller and longer, but he also has much smaller frame than Jokic and doesn't have the quarter of Joker's lower body strength.

[One_and_Done]

Compared to big men D.Rob regularly matched up with like Shaq and Ewing, Jokic's 'physicality' would be a nice change of pace. How did overpowering the smaller Draymond Green go for Jokic. Obviously he's a great offensive player, but this idea D.Rob can't take him defensively when Draymond can is a bit silly. I don't care if he has a lower centre of gravity, Draymond is not a better match up in the post than D.Rob. D.Rob was strong af, the dude was chiselled out of stone.

There are indeed bench players today who would be all-stars in the 90s, but there are G-league role players who would be all-stars in the 60s.