The Jett Howard Thread

[fendilim]

I’ve never once heard anyone blame management for selecting Suggs. People blame Suggs for not being Jamal Murray.

People don’t criticize Weltham for not being risky or playing it safe. They criticize them for trying to overthink their position and their predictable actions.

Okeke, Cole, and Jett were taken because they were either injured or underwhelmed compared to where they would have been taken ranked prior. Franz, Bamba, Isaac, and Black all fit their length per position agenda.

Suggs and Paolo are the only two that don’t fit either category taken in the first round. Probably because they could afford to play 4-D chess with top 5 picks.

Just quick searches

Re: Weltman not being risky

That being said, Weltman takes very few risks. Their draft record isn't good enough to play it as safe as possible every offseason.

Source: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=2185971&hilit=Weltman+more+credit#p98399418

Drafting suggs:

Out of our entire guard roster. Doubling down on Cole / Suggs / Fultz screams disaster. Unless, mediocrity is the goal.....

Source: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=2283652&p=105675901&hilit=Doubling+down+suggs#p105675901


Weham predictable actions? So the Jett howard pick didnt surprise you at draft night?

Yes. Weltman takes few risks. I’m talking about how he approaches everything as a GM and in regards to roster construction and trades. That isn’t a controversial thing to say. He doesn’t move in the draft (risk) and doesn’t trade players unless he absolutely has to for lack of playing time and contract.

Drafting of Suggs, and now Black, has nothing to do with the picks themselves. Both were great picks. Again, the criticism comes down to what Weltman does with the roster after making those picks. Will he actually move players now? Who knows. That was what I was talking about.

If you are going to pull receipts you should have context to what I’m referencing. I’ve been the most consistent person here regarding my feelings on this current FO and their choices/ lack thereof.

WeHam is predictable. Yes. It surprised me how predictable it was to take the 6’8 shooter from Michigan with injury history that was ranked higher in January as opposed to 6 months later after scouting services did the majority of their work. However, It was unpredictable because players like Dick and Bufkin had much less glaring weaknesses in their game comparatively.

I gave this draft a B/B-. I don’t think they made the wrong decisions. I also think they reached for Jett. Both can be true. I just wished they maximized value by moving back a few spots. It was predictable they didn’t.

you questioned what i said, i answered. Sheesh


Like i said, damn you do, damn you dont. Lol

[The Effect]

If the Magic wanted Jett, they could have traded down 3 to 4 picks for him.

And gotten what?

What would exactly would we trade down and get? A 2028 2nd round pick? Cause of all the other trades, that's all that was gained by moving down...future 2nd rounders

And before someone stupidly says "atleast it's something", just remember....We've literally sold off the #36 pick this year for nothing, the #35 pick last year, 33 the year before that etc

Trading down literally does nothing in the NBA draft unless you're in the top 3-5 and there's a Luka doncic level player available that you don't want for some reason. That's the only way you get value to trade down. This isnt the NFL draft where trading down actually nets you something positive

[VFX]

Spoiler:

Just quick searches

Re: Weltman not being risky

Source: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=2185971&hilit=Weltman+more+credit#p98399418

Drafting suggs:

Source: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=2283652&p=105675901&hilit=Doubling+down+suggs#p105675901


Weham predictable actions? So the Jett howard pick didnt surprise you at draft night?

Yes. Weltman takes few risks. I’m talking about how he approaches everything as a GM and in regards to roster construction and trades. That isn’t a controversial thing to say. He doesn’t move in the draft (risk) and doesn’t trade players unless he absolutely has to for lack of playing time and contract.

Drafting of Suggs, and now Black, has nothing to do with the picks themselves. Both were great picks. Again, the criticism comes down to what Weltman does with the roster after making those picks. Will he actually move players now? Who knows. That was what I was talking about.

If you are going to pull receipts you should have context to what I’m referencing. I’ve been the most consistent person here regarding my feelings on this current FO and their choices/ lack thereof.

WeHam is predictable. Yes. It surprised me how predictable it was to take the 6’8 shooter from Michigan with injury history that was ranked higher in January as opposed to 6 months later after scouting services did the majority of their work. However, It was unpredictable because players like Dick and Bufkin had much less glaring weaknesses in their game comparatively.

I gave this draft a B/B-. I don’t think they made the wrong decisions. I also think they reached for Jett. Both can be true. I just wished they maximized value by moving back a few spots. It was predictable they didn’t.

you questioned what i said, i answered. Sheesh


Like i said, damn you do, damn you dont. Lol

?

I just answered as to why this wasn’t really the case at all.

[pepe1991]

Jett can't guard college guards, i don't know where idea of him being able to guard and be nba SG comes from.

[bigdogdylan5]

Jett can't guard college guards, i don't know where idea of him being able to guard and be nba SG comes from.

Do you think Grady Dick can?

[MagicFan101]

Jett can't guard college guards, i don't know where idea of him being able to guard and be nba SG comes from.

Do you think Grady Dick can?

Can Tyler Herro?

[bigdogdylan5]

Ok everyone I finally found it! A podcast of draft people who actually like the Jett Howard pick!

https://open.spotify.com/episode/1e0nqDBB9WqDUvCEITbOq7?si=g5_eumowTWiGU0lS-yBT5g&context=spotify%3Ashow%3A1uonUntTi8IgoMMLx1KydM

No ceilings 2023 draft pre-show and lottery episode

Starting at 1:45:00

[bigdogdylan5]

Jett can't guard college guards, i don't know where idea of him being able to guard and be nba SG comes from.

Do you think Grady Dick can?

Can Tyler Herro?

Even better point and that guy got **** paid. Maybe too much but w/e. Also this goes back to my favorite RealGM issue and Pepe I am not targeting you. When we take a defensive guy it’s he can’t shoot what about the offense! When we take a shooter who can dribble, it’s what about the defense! The only perfect prospect was Wemby on both ends.

[pepe1991]

Jett can't guard college guards, i don't know where idea of him being able to guard and be nba SG comes from.

Do you think Grady Dick can?

Can Tyler Herro?

Herro and Dick are more agile and faster latherally to deal with players who are their size. Herro is still bad defender tho.

Being unathletic, flat footed, slow latherally 6'7- 6'8 player who couldn't even guard space in college simply means he can't defend nba guards.

And spoiler alert, Dick is better athlete than Jett. Jett and Houstan both skipped combine because they are poor athletes.

[bigdogdylan5]

Do you think Grady Dick can?

Can Tyler Herro?

Herro and Dick are more agile and faster latherally to deal with players who are their size. Herro is still bad defender tho.

Being unathletic, flat footed, slow latherally 6'7- 6'8 player who couldn't even guard space in college simply means he can't defend nba guards.

And spoiler alert, Dick is better athlete than Jett. Jett and Houstan both skipped combine because they are poor athletes.

I want to see them play before I make any sweeping judgements. And you may well be right but will see I certainly like Howard’s handle and playmaking better than Dick. Maybe he is only able to play backup 3 but if he can provide shooting off the bench I think he is an asset to the team. Again I am not saying they made the right pick but I won’t be making any conclusions until after their rookie year. I really don’t even like doing that. I am patient lol

[pepe1991]

Can Tyler Herro?

Herro and Dick are more agile and faster latherally to deal with players who are their size. Herro is still bad defender tho.

Being unathletic, flat footed, slow latherally 6'7- 6'8 player who couldn't even guard space in college simply means he can't defend nba guards.

And spoiler alert, Dick is better athlete than Jett. Jett and Houstan both skipped combine because they are poor athletes.

I want to see them play before I make any sweeping judgements. And you may well be right but will see I certainly like Howard’s handle and playmaking better than Dick. Maybe he is only able to play backup 3 but if he can provide shooting off the bench I think he is an asset to the team. Again I am not saying they made the right pick but I won’t be making any conclusions until after their rookie year. I really don’t even like doing that. I am patient lol

You realize Jett averaged 0,3 apg more than Dick? And most of his assists were entery paces to paint to 7'1 center who shoots hook shots and averages near 20 ppg? This was one of biggest mistakes of Suggs evaluation as playmaker, most of his 'playmaking" was ball feeding Timme

[fendilim]

Do you think Grady Dick can?

Can Tyler Herro?

Even better point and that guy got **** paid. Maybe too much but w/e. Also this goes back to my favorite RealGM issue and Pepe I am not targeting you. When we take a defensive guy it’s he can’t shoot what about the offense! When we take a shooter who can dribble, it’s what about the defense! The only perfect prospect was Wemby on both ends.

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=iLAy6FEi9caa6E4C9teZYQ

[fendilim]

Herro and Dick are more agile and faster latherally to deal with players who are their size. Herro is still bad defender tho.

Being unathletic, flat footed, slow latherally 6'7- 6'8 player who couldn't even guard space in college simply means he can't defend nba guards.

And spoiler alert, Dick is better athlete than Jett. Jett and Houstan both skipped combine because they are poor athletes.

I want to see them play before I make any sweeping judgements. And you may well be right but will see I certainly like Howard’s handle and playmaking better than Dick. Maybe he is only able to play backup 3 but if he can provide shooting off the bench I think he is an asset to the team. Again I am not saying they made the right pick but I won’t be making any conclusions until after their rookie year. I really don’t even like doing that. I am patient lol

You realize Jett averaged 0,3 apg more than Dick? And most of his assists were entery paces to paint to 7'1 center who shoots hook shots and averages near 20 ppg? This was one of biggest mistakes of Suggs evaluation as playmaker, most of his 'playmaking" was ball feeding Timme

It doesn’t matter if he is passing to a 7’1” guy or not. The fact that they can assist off a pick and roll means they are capable of reading the situation, and still have a positive a:to ratio.

I like Grady and Hawkins, in fact they are better shooters than Jett. But Jett is a more complete offensive player than them. Jett can create better on offense than both Grady and Hawkins. Look at the shots or even highlights (if you dont have time), of all 3, you can see Jett is the only player that can put the ball down and create his own shot. Grady’s pullup jumper are mostly coming from the 1-2 combo dribble to get his rhythm.

If you’re looking at the archetype of players WeHam are drafting, those are players than can play make and have the ability to create their own shot, starting from the year they drafted Cole Anthony. Even Okeke was a capable shot maker in Auburn. Only Caleb Houstan was really the 3&d guy they have drafted so far.

[bigdogdylan5]

Herro and Dick are more agile and faster latherally to deal with players who are their size. Herro is still bad defender tho.

Being unathletic, flat footed, slow latherally 6'7- 6'8 player who couldn't even guard space in college simply means he can't defend nba guards.

And spoiler alert, Dick is better athlete than Jett. Jett and Houstan both skipped combine because they are poor athletes.

I want to see them play before I make any sweeping judgements. And you may well be right but will see I certainly like Howard’s handle and playmaking better than Dick. Maybe he is only able to play backup 3 but if he can provide shooting off the bench I think he is an asset to the team. Again I am not saying they made the right pick but I won’t be making any conclusions until after their rookie year. I really don’t even like doing that. I am patient lol

You realize Jett averaged 0,3 apg more than Dick? And most of his assists were entery paces to paint to 7'1 center who shoots hook shots and averages near 20 ppg? This was one of biggest mistakes of Suggs evaluation as playmaker, most of his 'playmaking" was ball feeding Timme

Sure that is probably accurate. I am sure the decision to pick Jett over Dick wasn’t because of a 0.3 apg more even with an adjustment. I think assists are a damn poor measure of playmaking. Like a Jokic pass that really causes a shooter or player to be open is not Westbrook passing to Durant for a contested 30 footer. All assists are not created equal. I just don’t want you to be like Whitmore and have one of the lowest numbers you have seen.

To me Jett Howard, Grady Dick, and Jordan Hawkins were all in the same tier. I was fine with any of the three. It’s just what flavor guy do you want and are you willing to take a guy at 37% with tougher shotmaking or the pure off screen guy. Dick to me was more hybrid with interesting playmaking upside. You disagree with the FO that’s cool. We will see who is right and I really could see you being right. I would have picked Dick. But I really liked Jett so I don’t think they reached.

[bigdogdylan5]

Can Tyler Herro?

Even better point and that guy got **** paid. Maybe too much but w/e. Also this goes back to my favorite RealGM issue and Pepe I am not targeting you. When we take a defensive guy it’s he can’t shoot what about the offense! When we take a shooter who can dribble, it’s what about the defense! The only perfect prospect was Wemby on both ends.

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=iLAy6FEi9caa6E4C9teZYQ

Green font? lmao

[eyriq]

Ok everyone I finally found it! A podcast of draft people who actually like the Jett Howard pick!

https://open.spotify.com/episode/1e0nqDBB9WqDUvCEITbOq7?si=g5_eumowTWiGU0lS-yBT5g&context=spotify%3Ashow%3A1uonUntTi8IgoMMLx1KydM

No ceilings 2023 draft pre-show and lottery episode

Starting at 1:45:00

Yeah, one of their analysts has Jett like top 5 I think. They do good work and have an interesting way of integrating mocks into their analysis that I don't really understand.

[pepe1991]

I want to see them play before I make any sweeping judgements. And you may well be right but will see I certainly like Howard’s handle and playmaking better than Dick. Maybe he is only able to play backup 3 but if he can provide shooting off the bench I think he is an asset to the team. Again I am not saying they made the right pick but I won’t be making any conclusions until after their rookie year. I really don’t even like doing that. I am patient lol

You realize Jett averaged 0,3 apg more than Dick? And most of his assists were entery paces to paint to 7'1 center who shoots hook shots and averages near 20 ppg? This was one of biggest mistakes of Suggs evaluation as playmaker, most of his 'playmaking" was ball feeding Timme

It doesn’t matter if he is passing to a 7’1” guy or not. The fact that they can assist off a pick and roll means they are capable of reading the situation, and still have a positive a:to ratio.

I like Grady and Hawkins, in fact they are better shooters than Jett. But Jett is a more complete offensive player than them. Jett can create better on offense than both Grady and Hawkins. Look at the shots or even highlights (if you dont have time), of all 3, you can see Jett is the only player that can put the ball down and create his own shot. Grady’s pullup jumper are mostly coming from the 1-2 combo dribble to get his rhythm.

If you’re looking at the archetype of players WeHam are drafting, those are players than can play make and have the ability to create their own shot, starting from the year they drafted Cole Anthony. Even Okeke was a capable shot maker in Auburn. Only Caleb Houstan was really the 3&d guy they have drafted so far.

Solve me one simple question:

how many pick&rolls Jett Howard had in his college career.

I'll wait.


This whole notion of him being some hidden gem of pick&roll maestro is a joke. It reminds me of Jabari Smith alleged elite defense that literally was never on display but was affected by Kessler just existing as best shot blocker in past decade. In same sense lot of stuff Jett is now credited for, have nothing to do with him but with Di ckinson bing one of best all around center at college hoops last year. ( can easly make argument for being the best C at college last year without much competition).

For example MItchigan would run set play where ballhandler hands off ball to Jett on top of key, he curls to his right on already set screen of Dicknson and shoots mid range jumper. Is that "pick&roll" paly in your books?


Look, Jett Howard played for his damn father out of all people to be in best position possible to have sucess ,on very mediocre team. And best he could do is 14-2,5-2 on 56% TS. ( 41FG, 36,8% for 3)

For all " Kevin Hueter " campers, Huerter averaged 15 ppg, 5 rpg and 3,4 apg on 50% FG and 42% for 3. on 64% TS.
Albet on his second seasaon, But at same age as Jett. And drafted 19th. Not in lottery.


It's just lot of demage control posted here for people that need to feel better about pick. Nobody had Jett that high among us because he simply didn't show he can be more than just your average spot up shooter , 3 and D guy with pretty average on ball defense and below average off ball defense. And very poor pick&roll defense.

This pick isn't high ceiling pick, and isn't even "fit" pick because he flat out can't play SG and we just fried 11th pick on player and position who will be stuck behind Wagner as backup SF until he is FA or Franz gets hurt.
And i'm not 100% sure that he is today significant upgrade over Okeke nor Houstan. Maybe in year or two.

[yoyojw17]

Ok everyone I finally found it! A podcast of draft people who actually like the Jett Howard pick!

https://open.spotify.com/episode/1e0nqDBB9WqDUvCEITbOq7?si=g5_eumowTWiGU0lS-yBT5g&context=spotify%3Ashow%3A1uonUntTi8IgoMMLx1KydM

No ceilings 2023 draft pre-show and lottery episode

Starting at 1:45:00

Yeah, one of their analysts has Jett like top 5 I think. They do good work and have an interesting way of integrating mocks into their analysis that I don't really understand.

Loved this!

What did intrigue me was that he was apparently known for his defense in highschool.... And has blossomed now for his offense.... Albeit a step back in defense. If that's the case ... The potential to be a complete player when rebalanced is real.

[pepe1991]

Ok everyone I finally found it! A podcast of draft people who actually like the Jett Howard pick!

https://open.spotify.com/episode/1e0nqDBB9WqDUvCEITbOq7?si=g5_eumowTWiGU0lS-yBT5g&context=spotify%3Ashow%3A1uonUntTi8IgoMMLx1KydM

No ceilings 2023 draft pre-show and lottery episode

Starting at 1:45:00

Yeah, one of their analysts has Jett like top 5 I think. They do good work and have an interesting way of integrating mocks into their analysis that I don't really understand.

Loved this!

What did intrigue me was that he was apparently known for his defense in highschool.... And has blossomed now for his offense.... Albeit a step back in defense. If that's the case ... The potential to be a complete player when rebalanced is real.

Yea, he had elite defensive numbers in highschool. Than he was matched against better athletes. And got runned over. That's what happends when you are mediocre athlete with good instics but without any latheral quickness to keep up.
Now at next stage, NBA has wider court, athletes are even bigger, even faster and better shooters. Jeez i wonder how will that play ... *hard eyeroll saracsm inserted here*

[yoyojw17]

Yeah, one of their analysts has Jett like top 5 I think. They do good work and have an interesting way of integrating mocks into their analysis that I don't really understand.

Loved this!

What did intrigue me was that he was apparently known for his defense in highschool.... And has blossomed now for his offense.... Albeit a step back in defense. If that's the case ... The potential to be a complete player when rebalanced is real.

Yea, he had elite defensive numbers in highschool. Than he was matched against better athletes. And got runned over. That's what happends when you are mediocre athlete with good instics but without any latheral quickness to keep up.
Now at next stage, NBA has wider court, athletes are even bigger, even faster and better shooters. Jeez i wonder how will that play ... *hard eyeroll saracsm inserted here*

I don't care if he's an elite defensive player or not.... I just now have some holes that he could be at least average on the next level as he figures things out. That was my point of the comment. Would it be great to be more.... Of course... But it at least has a sign that hes not a total failure on that end. Nor do we know how much his injuries played in his production. So... We will see!