Woj: Harden Opting into $35.6M Player Option and Demanding Trade from Philly; Wants to Play for the Clippers

[xb3at band1tx]

Harden in Philly is an automatic top 4 seed/50 games won in the east.

Might be more more lucrative to just keep Harden for a year in hopes of them getting it together one last time instead of trading for whatever the desperate Clippers are offering. Unless it's PG or Kawhi idk how you sell any of those Clippers to Embiid as contending.

That offer is probably still there next trade deadline anyways.

[xb3at band1tx]

.

[Wigginstime]

If I'm Philly and Harden forces the situation, i would do everything in my power to figure out how to get in on the Dame situation. Basically Dame to Philly, Harden to Team C, and Team C provides assets to Portland.

[Chuck Everett]

If I'm Philly and Harden forces the situation, i would do everything in my power to figure out how to get in on the Dame situation. Basically Dame to Philly, Harden to Team C, and Team C provides assets to Portland.

Does replacing Harden with Dame actually make Philly a title contender though? I'm personally not sure.

[xb3at band1tx]

If I'm Philly and Harden forces the situation, i would do everything in my power to figure out how to get in on the Dame situation. Basically Dame to Philly, Harden to Team C, and Team C provides assets to Portland.

Does replacing Harden with Dame actually make Philly a title contender though? I'm personally not sure.

Absolutely, however Embiid still needs to get it together in the post-season.

[ryguy613]

Morey: Just take Covington, Morris, Batum, and the 2028 and 2030 1sts for Harden and be done with it.

Enough with having to show the biggest b**** in the room BS. Who f****** cares? Move on, keep the cap clean for next summer, and get everyone on board that this year is just a waiting game.

Which of those pieces will be an asset that Embiid will care about at all? You don’t get one meaningful player and the picks don’t convey until after his prime. At the very least, it needs to be a 3-team deal where the Sixers get assets that will convey during Embiid’s prime even if that package turns out to be what the Clippers send out.

Well, he's friends with Covington... but that's not the point of this trade.

The point of the trade is to keep the books clean for 24 free agency. And restock the asset cupboard, which is practically bare.

This coming season is a wash no matter how you want to spin it.

1. the books are going to be clean in 24 with or without a trade
2. the assets coming back in the trade wont be restocking anything since, as you just said, theyre expiring contracts and oh by the way... they're old so theyre not guys that important to the future of a team.
3. You dont have the luxury of treating this season as a wash. Your MVP is about to turn 30 this upcoming season. Punting down the road with the promise that "we'll pick up something in a season or two" is a great way to get yet another disgruntled star to demand a trade
4. Have you even looked at the '24 FA's. Which of them is going to be the missing piece to a championship team?

Sorry dude but none of what you're saying adds up. The sixers need actual GOOD assets if theyre going to trade one of their best players. If they get Powell and Mann back in a potential trade, thats something... but Covington, Morris, and Batum? You literally sound like you're doing the clippers bidding.

[Exp0sed]

How do you eff over Harden on a contract, make him want to leave, and say out the other side of your face you want him to stay? Morey following the new age playbook of just openly lying.

When he doesn't play hard at all and they are fighting for a playin in December, then they will trade him. Did he not see what happened in Houston?

He pulls that Houston crap way 34 years old, heading to 35 before his next contract end hell be looking at Westbrook money.

His best bet right now, whether we like it or not is to play 1+1 deals with Daryl for big money until he fully deteriorates. But ownership was not going to allow a 3 year deal

No, he won't. He'll just be traded for far less. That's what happened last time. Why should he ever trust Morey or sixers ownership again?

People saying there isn't a rift here... he took almost 15 million less so they could sign two players and that was predicated on it coming back later. Now he's stuck for a 2nd year at the 15 million less just to get out and go to another team. And people think that's something a player would overlook?

i'm not sure that's accurate

Harden forced his way to the 76ers and following the trade (and still recovering from that Nets hamstring injury) - he wasn't his best self post the trade (i'm talking about 2022) - yeah it was only like 20 games but he shot 40% from the field and like 32% from 3 and the talk (including on this forum) was that he was washed etc

he didn't really take less money to help the team, the 76ers weren't willing to max him but he still wanted to stay so he took a little paycut and was allowed to save face by telling the media it was for team building, selfless purposes

we don't know what kind of specific understanding there was between Morey and Harden at the time of the trade, it's just rumors and speculation. if Morey really promised him he will be maxed and then didn't get a max offer (last offseaso) - then he would have demanded a trade then and there so i don't buy that it actually happened

more likely: both sides assumed there will be a max extention coming but Harden's poor play in 2021 put a damper on that

Morey didn't commit to it, i don't believe for a second he committed and then backed out and Harden was cool with it
that's an unlikely scenario so those reports were probably like most reports - made up click bait off the top of the dome of some reporter

[the_process]

Which of those pieces will be an asset that Embiid will care about at all? You don’t get one meaningful player and the picks don’t convey until after his prime. At the very least, it needs to be a 3-team deal where the Sixers get assets that will convey during Embiid’s prime even if that package turns out to be what the Clippers send out.

Well, he's friends with Covington... but that's not the point of this trade.

The point of the trade is to keep the books clean for 24 free agency. And restock the asset cupboard, which is practically bare.

This coming season is a wash no matter how you want to spin it.

1. the books are going to be clean in 24 with or without a trade
2. the assets coming back in the trade wont be restocking anything since, as you just said, theyre expiring contracts and oh by the way... they're old so theyre not guys that important to the future of a team.
3. You dont have the luxury of treating this season as a wash. Your MVP is about to turn 30 this upcoming season. Punting down the road with the promise that "we'll pick up something in a season or two" is a great way to get yet another disgruntled star to demand a trade
4. Have you even looked at the '24 FA's. Which of them is going to be the missing piece to a championship team?

Sorry dude but none of what you're saying adds up. The sixers need actual GOOD assets if theyre going to trade one of their best players. If they get Powell and Mann back in a potential trade, thats something... but Covington, Morris, and Batum? You literally sound like you're doing the clippers bidding.

The assets are the 1sts, not the players.

All of those contracts are expiring, Powell and Mann are not.

Sixers aren't winning with Harden. And they aren't winning with Cov, Batum, and Morris. No difference. This is a punt year because there is no choice. So take the first round picks for future trades and go into free agency next summer and try to sign... IDK. Let's say Dejounte Murray. And they'd have room for more after Murray as well. Then extend Maxey and go.

[ryguy613]

Well, he's friends with Covington... but that's not the point of this trade.

The point of the trade is to keep the books clean for 24 free agency. And restock the asset cupboard, which is practically bare.

This coming season is a wash no matter how you want to spin it.

1. the books are going to be clean in 24 with or without a trade
2. the assets coming back in the trade wont be restocking anything since, as you just said, theyre expiring contracts and oh by the way... they're old so theyre not guys that important to the future of a team.
3. You dont have the luxury of treating this season as a wash. Your MVP is about to turn 30 this upcoming season. Punting down the road with the promise that "we'll pick up something in a season or two" is a great way to get yet another disgruntled star to demand a trade
4. Have you even looked at the '24 FA's. Which of them is going to be the missing piece to a championship team?

Sorry dude but none of what you're saying adds up. The sixers need actual GOOD assets if theyre going to trade one of their best players. If they get Powell and Mann back in a potential trade, thats something... but Covington, Morris, and Batum? You literally sound like you're doing the clippers bidding.

The assets are the 1sts, not the players.

All of those contracts are expiring, Powell and Mann are not.

Sixers aren't winning with Harden. And they aren't winning with Cov, Batum, and Morris. No difference. This is a punt year because there is no choice. So take the first round picks for future trades and go into free agency next summer and try to sign... IDK. Let's say Dejounte Murray. And they'd have room for more after Murray as well. Then extend Maxey and go.

so just to recap... 2 late frp's and old expiring contracts is the BEST deal the sixers are going to get for Harden, and the clippers are the ONLY team that can meet that outrageously high demand. Do I have that right?

[jstross]

Unless Harden is willing to take $35 mil a season he'll play out his contract in Philly and become a free agent. Having no offers in FA this turn I think he'll do a two year $70 million deal if Philly will do it.

[jstross]

Unless Harden is willing to take $35 mil a season he'll play out his contract in Philly and become a free agent. Having no offers in FA this turn I think he'll do a two year $70 million deal if Philly will do it.

[the_process]

1. the books are going to be clean in 24 with or without a trade
2. the assets coming back in the trade wont be restocking anything since, as you just said, theyre expiring contracts and oh by the way... they're old so theyre not guys that important to the future of a team.
3. You dont have the luxury of treating this season as a wash. Your MVP is about to turn 30 this upcoming season. Punting down the road with the promise that "we'll pick up something in a season or two" is a great way to get yet another disgruntled star to demand a trade
4. Have you even looked at the '24 FA's. Which of them is going to be the missing piece to a championship team?

Sorry dude but none of what you're saying adds up. The sixers need actual GOOD assets if theyre going to trade one of their best players. If they get Powell and Mann back in a potential trade, thats something... but Covington, Morris, and Batum? You literally sound like you're doing the clippers bidding.

The assets are the 1sts, not the players.

All of those contracts are expiring, Powell and Mann are not.

Sixers aren't winning with Harden. And they aren't winning with Cov, Batum, and Morris. No difference. This is a punt year because there is no choice. So take the first round picks for future trades and go into free agency next summer and try to sign... IDK. Let's say Dejounte Murray. And they'd have room for more after Murray as well. Then extend Maxey and go.

so just to recap... 2 late frp's and old expiring contracts is the BEST deal the sixers are going to get for Harden, and the clippers are the ONLY team that can meet that outrageously high demand. Do I have that right?

Why are we assuming they're late picks? Unprotected 1sts in 2028 and 2030 could be anything.

And Harden has asked to go to the Clippers. And has a history of quitting on teams where he doesn't want to be, so other teams will likely not bother. And if they do bother, it will be a lowball offer with the risk of Harden flaking baked in.

[ryguy613]

The assets are the 1sts, not the players.

All of those contracts are expiring, Powell and Mann are not.

Sixers aren't winning with Harden. And they aren't winning with Cov, Batum, and Morris. No difference. This is a punt year because there is no choice. So take the first round picks for future trades and go into free agency next summer and try to sign... IDK. Let's say Dejounte Murray. And they'd have room for more after Murray as well. Then extend Maxey and go.

so just to recap... 2 late frp's and old expiring contracts is the BEST deal the sixers are going to get for Harden, and the clippers are the ONLY team that can meet that outrageously high demand. Do I have that right?

Why are we assuming they're late picks? Unprotected 1sts in 2028 and 2030 could be anything.

And Harden has asked to go to the Clippers. And has a history of quitting on teams where he doesn't want to be, so other teams will likely not bother. And if they do bother, it will be a lowball offer with the risk of Harden flaking baked in.

what i like about this is the spin that it would be better to just get expiring contracts and 2 picks instead of getting... good players... like Powell and Mann. You dont need to have zero contracts on the book going into 2024. youre like... WAAAAY better off having movable assets than hoping maybe you can sign *checks notes* dejounte murray in a year. lol.

And if your philly, if you're apparently going to lose one way or another, why are you in a rush to move this guy for the lowest of lowball possible offers? it does not behoove them to do that. if youre really correct that its a punt year, you might as well look for the best deal for him. you really arent making much sense. your argument is all over the place.

[the_process]

so just to recap... 2 late frp's and old expiring contracts is the BEST deal the sixers are going to get for Harden, and the clippers are the ONLY team that can meet that outrageously high demand. Do I have that right?

Why are we assuming they're late picks? Unprotected 1sts in 2028 and 2030 could be anything.

And Harden has asked to go to the Clippers. And has a history of quitting on teams where he doesn't want to be, so other teams will likely not bother. And if they do bother, it will be a lowball offer with the risk of Harden flaking baked in.

what i like about this is the spin that it would be better to just get expiring contracts and 2 picks instead of getting... good players... like Powell and Mann. You dont need to have zero contracts on the book going into 2024. youre like... WAAAAY better off having movable assets than hoping maybe you can sign *checks notes* dejounte murray in a year. lol.

And if your philly, if you're apparently going to lose one way or another, why are you in a rush to move this guy for the lowest of lowball possible offers? it does not behoove them to do that. if youre really correct that its a punt year, you might as well look for the best deal for him. you really arent making much sense. your argument is all over the place.

Mann is fine, but is not a needle mover.

Powell is a bench guard. Again, he's fine but nothing special.

Your definition of good player is hysterical.

If they can get Lillard or Paul George, then do that. But they won't be able to.

If you want clean books, then clean the books. Don't trade for a guy you then have to trade again.

Oh, and I probably should add the Clippers have to take back PJ Tucker, too. So the full trade would be Harden and Tucker for Batum, Covington, Morris, UNP 2028 1st, and UNP 2030 1st.

[ryguy613]

Why are we assuming they're late picks? Unprotected 1sts in 2028 and 2030 could be anything.

And Harden has asked to go to the Clippers. And has a history of quitting on teams where he doesn't want to be, so other teams will likely not bother. And if they do bother, it will be a lowball offer with the risk of Harden flaking baked in.

what i like about this is the spin that it would be better to just get expiring contracts and 2 picks instead of getting... good players... like Powell and Mann. You dont need to have zero contracts on the book going into 2024. youre like... WAAAAY better off having movable assets than hoping maybe you can sign *checks notes* dejounte murray in a year. lol.

And if your philly, if you're apparently going to lose one way or another, why are you in a rush to move this guy for the lowest of lowball possible offers? it does not behoove them to do that. if youre really correct that its a punt year, you might as well look for the best deal for him. you really arent making much sense. your argument is all over the place.

Mann is fine, but is not a needle mover.

Powell is a bench guard. Again, he's fine but nothing special.

Your definition of good player is hysterical.

If they can get Lillard or Paul George, then do that. But they won't be able to.

If you want clean books, then clean the books. Don't trade for a guy you then have to trade again.

Oh, and I probably should add the Clippers have to take back PJ Tucker, too. So the full trade would be Harden and Tucker for Batum, Covington, Morris, UNP 2028 1st, and UNP 2030 1st.

Literally wiping the roster clean outside of Embiid so that you can overpay a limited and not particularly impressive FA class in 2024 (assuming players dont just sign new contracts with their current teams) is not a good strategy and thats your answer as to why Morrey isnt going after your proposed trade deal... because its terrible lol. They dont need to have "clean books" in a year. having cap flexibility is great. having 1 or 2 people on your roster and then filling up in FA is what young rebuilding teams do. Embiid aint young and if you think this team should be rebuilding you might as well kiss him goodbye cos hes not sticking around for that. The grown up teams who want to contend for a title tend to operator over the cap by moving contracts around to pick up as much talent as possible. the team you're proposing doing this deal with is one of those teams. they're not concerned with clearing their books. their the ones looking to trade out the expiring contracts and picks to get maximum talent.

[Tor_Raps]

Ya I don't see Harden going anywhere. It was weird enough for him to opt in and then demand a trade.

He easily could have gotten a 1 year deal at the same amount from anyone. Heck, the Rockets could have signed Fred and given Harden around the same amount in the worst case.

[John Murdoch]

Clippers just dont have the assets, Toronto would be interesting

[ryguy613]

what i like about this is the spin that it would be better to just get expiring contracts and 2 picks instead of getting... good players... like Powell and Mann. You dont need to have zero contracts on the book going into 2024. youre like... WAAAAY better off having movable assets than hoping maybe you can sign *checks notes* dejounte murray in a year. lol.

And if your philly, if you're apparently going to lose one way or another, why are you in a rush to move this guy for the lowest of lowball possible offers? it does not behoove them to do that. if youre really correct that its a punt year, you might as well look for the best deal for him. you really arent making much sense. your argument is all over the place.

Mann is fine, but is not a needle mover.

Powell is a bench guard. Again, he's fine but nothing special.

Your definition of good player is hysterical.

If they can get Lillard or Paul George, then do that. But they won't be able to.

If you want clean books, then clean the books. Don't trade for a guy you then have to trade again.

Oh, and I probably should add the Clippers have to take back PJ Tucker, too. So the full trade would be Harden and Tucker for Batum, Covington, Morris, UNP 2028 1st, and UNP 2030 1st.

Literally wiping the roster clean outside of Embiid so that you can overpay a limited and not particularly impressive FA class in 2024 (assuming players dont just sign new contracts with their current teams) is not a good strategy and thats your answer as to why Morrey isnt going after your proposed trade deal... because its terrible lol. They dont need to have "clean books" in a year. having cap flexibility is great. having 1 or 2 people on your roster and then filling up in FA is what young rebuilding teams do. Embiid aint young and if you think this team should be rebuilding you might as well kiss him goodbye cos hes not sticking around for that. The grown up teams who want to contend for a title tend to operator over the cap by moving contracts around to pick up as much talent as possible. the team you're proposing doing this deal with is one of those teams. they're not concerned with clearing their books. their the ones looking to trade out the expiring contracts and picks to get maximum talent.

Dont get me wrong, if you have A specific guy in mind that you think is THE guy who will put your team over the top then being way under the cap and making an aggressive push to land that player in FA is an understandable (albeit risky) strategy. So like, a Luka Doncic is nearing the end of his contract and youre hearing that he doesnt want to sign an extension, he wants to test Free Agency... and you think you can make a better pitch to win him over than Dallas can? OK, get in position to make that pitch and potentially land the big fish. That you can sell to your star. But hoarding cap space so you can chase Dejounte Murray or Pascal Siakam is not a winning strategy.

[HardenGoat]

He pulls that Houston crap way 34 years old, heading to 35 before his next contract end hell be looking at Westbrook money.

His best bet right now, whether we like it or not is to play 1+1 deals with Daryl for big money until he fully deteriorates. But ownership was not going to allow a 3 year deal

No, he won't. He'll just be traded for far less. That's what happened last time. Why should he ever trust Morey or sixers ownership again?

People saying there isn't a rift here... he took almost 15 million less so they could sign two players and that was predicated on it coming back later. Now he's stuck for a 2nd year at the 15 million less just to get out and go to another team. And people think that's something a player would overlook?

i'm not sure that's accurate

Harden forced his way to the 76ers and following the trade (and still recovering from that Nets hamstring injury) - he wasn't his best self post the trade (i'm talking about 2022) - yeah it was only like 20 games but he shot 40% from the field and like 32% from 3 and the talk (including on this forum) was that he was washed etc

he didn't really take less money to help the team, the 76ers weren't willing to max him but he still wanted to stay so he took a little paycut and was allowed to save face by telling the media it was for team building, selfless purposes

we don't know what kind of specific understanding there was between Morey and Harden at the time of the trade, it's just rumors and speculation. if Morey really promised him he will be maxed and then didn't get a max offer (last offseaso) - then he would have demanded a trade then and there so i don't buy that it actually happened

more likely: both sides assumed there will be a max extention coming but Harden's poor play in 2021 put a damper on that

Morey didn't commit to it, i don't believe for a second he committed and then backed out and Harden was cool with it
that's an unlikely scenario so those reports were probably like most reports - made up click bait off the top of the dome of some reporter

He absolutely took less money to help the team. How did they sign Tucker and open the non tax MLE without Harden taking taking less money? Embiid specifically asked for Tucker and Harden delivered him. Harden also helped the team duck the tax last year which opened up 15 million additional to the team in disbursement money. Who got that?. As stated, teams that go all in on contending maximize the talent pool for team or trade purposes and operate above the cap. A team like the Warriors never let their free agents walk when they were building. They always got something back. Philly is operating to save the owner money and is acting half in. That’s the part Harden is most pissed about.

[the_process]

No, he won't. He'll just be traded for far less. That's what happened last time. Why should he ever trust Morey or sixers ownership again?

People saying there isn't a rift here... he took almost 15 million less so they could sign two players and that was predicated on it coming back later. Now he's stuck for a 2nd year at the 15 million less just to get out and go to another team. And people think that's something a player would overlook?

i'm not sure that's accurate

Harden forced his way to the 76ers and following the trade (and still recovering from that Nets hamstring injury) - he wasn't his best self post the trade (i'm talking about 2022) - yeah it was only like 20 games but he shot 40% from the field and like 32% from 3 and the talk (including on this forum) was that he was washed etc

he didn't really take less money to help the team, the 76ers weren't willing to max him but he still wanted to stay so he took a little paycut and was allowed to save face by telling the media it was for team building, selfless purposes

we don't know what kind of specific understanding there was between Morey and Harden at the time of the trade, it's just rumors and speculation. if Morey really promised him he will be maxed and then didn't get a max offer (last offseaso) - then he would have demanded a trade then and there so i don't buy that it actually happened

more likely: both sides assumed there will be a max extention coming but Harden's poor play in 2021 put a damper on that

Morey didn't commit to it, i don't believe for a second he committed and then backed out and Harden was cool with it
that's an unlikely scenario so those reports were probably like most reports - made up click bait off the top of the dome of some reporter

He absolutely took less money to help the team. How did they sign Tucker and open the non tax MLE without Harden taking taking less money? Embiid specifically asked for Tucker and Harden delivered him. Harden also helped the team duck the tax last year. As stated, teams that go all in on contending maximize the talent pool for team or trade purposes and operate above the cap. A team like the Warriors never let their free agents walk when they were building. They always got something back. Philly is operating to save the owner money and is acting half in. That’s the part Harden is most pissed about.

Harden took less money so Morey could bring in his guys Tucker and House.

Getting your boys paid is still pretty much you getting paid.