Will Giannis ever overtake Karl Malone/Tim Duncan as the greatest PF of all-time?

cam24thomas · Post #1 » by **cam24thomas** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 9:39 pm

Giannis is listed as PF from 2017-18 to 2022-23 (6 seasons), so that's his position historically I assume.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/a/antetgi01.html
Will he need as many rings as Duncan to overtake?
And is he ahead of Karl Malone yet?
Any other PFs ahead of Giannis?

UcanUwill · Post #2 » by **UcanUwill** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 9:41 pm

I still hate when people call TIm Duncan PF, because he was obviously center in every way beside what he was listed on paper, but whatever, I never gonna win this debate, so will just say it NO, he will not be better than Duncan.

cam24thomas · Post #3 » by **cam24thomas** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 9:42 pm

UcanUwill wrote:I still hate when people call TIm Duncan PF, because he was obviously center in every way beside what he was listed on paper, but whatever, I never gonna win this debate, so will just say it NO, he will not be better than Duncan.

Yep i just go by basketball-reference. It doesn't mean i think Duncan's a PF.

bovice · Post #4 » by **bovice** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 9:42 pm

what are giannis' elite offensive skills?

cam24thomas · Post #5 » by **cam24thomas** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 9:43 pm

bovice wrote:what are giannis' elite offensive skills?

Slashing, because he's probably the hardest slasher in the NBA to stop without fouling him.
No surprise he averages 12.3 free-throws per game.
I doubt anyone his size has ever moved as fast.

UcanUwill · Post #6 » by **UcanUwill** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 9:46 pm

bovice wrote:what are giannis' elite offensive skills?

more talent than skill, but offensive TALENT is undeniable.

Lockdown504090 · Post #7 » by **Lockdown504090** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 9:52 pm

Giannis won’t have the health to pass tim, but I think he’s already surpassed everyone else

Blame Rasho · Post #8 » by **Blame Rasho** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 9:54 pm

He has a ways to go if you look at his all nba first team selections and all defensive selections and post season runs.

He is a special player but it speaks to Duncan’s longevity that I don’t think he is close as of this moment.

I am excited to see what the future holds for him along with the Joker. The NBA is in good hands with them.

He has had a mofo post season run that was capped off with a 50 point triple double which I think matches Duncan’s 03 run.

dirkdiggler4177 · Post #9 » by **dirkdiggler4177** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:06 pm

UcanUwill wrote:I still hate when people call TIm Duncan PF, because he was obviously center in every way beside what he was listed on paper, but whatever, I never gonna win this debate, so will just say it NO, he will not be better than Duncan.

He played power forward. Centers like Robison, Nesterović, Mohammed, Oberto, Elson started with him. Yes, he played some center, but he was a power forward, even if his style in today's game was center-like, he was a power forward in any other era. Later in his career he was a center and played the center spot.

baldur · Post #10 » by **baldur** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:09 pm

UcanUwill wrote:I still hate when people call TIm Duncan PF, because he was obviously center in every way beside what he was listed on paper, but whatever, I never gonna win this debate, so will just say it NO, he will not be better than Duncan.

played with centers most of his career. robinson, malik rose, nestorovic, dejuan blair, oberto, tiago splitter. are all these guys pf?

Post #11 » by **dockingsched** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:09 pm

UcanUwill wrote:I still hate when people call TIm Duncan PF, because he was obviously center in every way beside what he was listed on paper, but whatever, I never gonna win this debate, so will just say it NO, he will not be better than Duncan.

I mean, are we about to disregard all his all nba and all star starter appearances he wouldn’t have even sniffed if he was considered a center? His accolades would be drastically different at center behind shaq.

lambchop · Post #12 » by **lambchop** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:14 pm

Probably will overtake malone based on his ring + finals MVP and sympathy cause many despite Malone. As for Duncan, I think that's unlikely.

Taj FTW · Post #13 » by **Taj FTW** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:15 pm

Is it time we start referring to Duncan as a C instead of a PF?

dygaction · Post #14 » by **dygaction** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:17 pm

UcanUwill wrote:I still hate when people call TIm Duncan PF, because he was obviously center in every way beside what he was listed on paper, but whatever, I never gonna win this debate, so will just say it NO, he will not be better than Duncan.

If he was selected 10+ all-nba as a PF year by year during this entire prime, it is pointless trying to picture him something else now.

Karate Diop · Post #15 » by **Karate Diop** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:18 pm

He'll never overtake Duncan.

It's unlikely Giannis ever sniffs another finals if we're being honest...

Post #16 » by **Mavrelous** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:19 pm

He's behind Duncan by healthy margin, it'll take 3 MVP level years and more than one finals appearance to get into the discussion.
He'll pass Malone IMO.

Kurt Heimlich · Post #17 » by **Kurt Heimlich** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:19 pm

Duncan is a no brainer top 10 all timer to me. So yeah, obviously Giannis has a ways to go. But lucky for him he's got some time on his side still. But he does have to make the most of it to get to that level.

MrBigShot · Post #18 » by **MrBigShot** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:21 pm

I don't think so. I believe we have seen Giannis' peak (2021) and it isn't as high as peak Duncan.

Blame Rasho · Post #19 » by **Blame Rasho** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:26 pm

dirkdiggler4177 wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:I still hate when people call TIm Duncan PF, because he was obviously center in every way beside what he was listed on paper, but whatever, I never gonna win this debate, so will just say it NO, he will not be better than Duncan.

He played power forward. Centers like Robison, Nesterović, Mohammed, Oberto, Elson started with him. Yes, he played some center, but he was a power forward, even if his style in today's game was center-like, he was a power forward in any other era. Later in his career he was a center and played the center spot.

.

I think the title of power forward for him is kinda useless. Compared to other centers of that era, he could shoot a jump shot. Heck, his go to shot was a bank shot from 15 to 17 feet. You think Shaq would even attempt that it or any centers would do that?

Dirk Nowitzki's one-legged fadeaway, KG high post jumpshoot from key, and etc were a part of a power forwards skill set. The difference between them and him is that he would be ok with banging in the post more often. Dirk and KG when they entered the nba were pf/sf and Duncan was pf/center if you liken to nba2k series.

UcanUwill · Post #20 » by **UcanUwill** » Fri Jul 7, 2023 10:27 pm

dirkdiggler4177 wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:I still hate when people call TIm Duncan PF, because he was obviously center in every way beside what he was listed on paper, but whatever, I never gonna win this debate, so will just say it NO, he will not be better than Duncan.

He played power forward. Centers like Robison, Nesterović, Mohammed, Oberto, Elson started with him. Yes, he played some center, but he was a power forward, even if his style in today's game was center-like, he was a power forward in any other era. Later in his career he was a center and played the center spot.

He really did play center, even with Rasho and Splitter, he played more center than these guys, and at the end of the day, they just played 2 center lineups. I know just from simple linguistics point of view, it makes no sense to have more than one ''center'', but they simply had 2 centers on the court, just like you can have two PGs on the court, or even 3. Look at that tape back, Splitter would start with Duncan,. then he would sit, Duncan would play center most of the time even on paper, but even with another center, he was a freaking center, Duncan was more center than Splitter or Rasho or Oberto even. he always played the same, he defended the rim, he played in low post, he was a center. All of his game was pure center. I dont why everyone wanted to make DUncan a PF, but I remember they used to list Mat Bonner as C and Tim Duncan as PF when they played together, at that point that was just stupid. If anything, Splitter, Rasho and Oberto were more of the PFs in this logic, because Duncan was a damn center.

I know back in the day the difference between PF and C was minimal to begin with, but even then Tim Duncan was a center, stop telling me he wasnt, I am not being arrogant, but I understand this game, they played two centers sometimes and thats the explanation. Lingvistically it makes no sense, but from tactics point of few, you can have two centers.

I always was subscriber to logic that 5 players on the court, that doesnt mean that each of them is either PG, SG, SF, PF, C and its a lock. Lots of lineups had no center at all, some had 4 guards, it just how it goes. THinking outside NBA, Panathinaikos always played Dimantidis, Spanoulis and Jasikevicius, that didnt make Jasikevicius an SF, not ever, he was a PG, all 3 of them were PGs playing in same lineup. Some coaches always loved to have as much PGs as possible, some loved as much of bigs as possible, some jsut adapted to waht they had.