All Things Thunder Offseason Thread

[jake_swivel]

How long are you going to give him to reach that upside? I don't think anyone had him in the office pool for OKC's solution to needing legitimate big men. I was surprised to see he played over 90% of his minutes at center last year. He's either a dunk or 3pt guy with no mid-range game. His rebounding rates are low for a center. He'd be an interesting piece as the 4th big who gets some playing time to try and develop, but I'm not sure he does anything to upgrade the roster.

I still don't see a starting center on the roster and if you want to argue Chet is the starting center then I don't see a starting PF.

There are 22 people on the roster (including keyontae). They have 35 picks over the next 7 years. Why are you so confident that this will be the roster in October?

[Devilanche]

Lol.

Read on Twitter

Curious if there’s some cap circumvention going on.

Doubt it. The fillers are different and the trades all jump out due to the weird houston trade that originally happened cause they wanted cap space .

I legit believed we should have been their first partner for the trade few days ago. Us or spurs .

[slick_watts]

Garuba has some upside.

I still don't see a starting center on the roster and if you want to argue Chet is the starting center then I don't see a starting PF.

they are going to start chet at center, and jalen williams at pf.

[Dadouv47]

yeah I don't know if it will work long term and would be nice to have a decent back up plan but it looks pretty obvious that our frontcourt is gonna be Chet/JDub.

[Kizz Fastfists]

How long are you going to give him to reach that upside? I don't think anyone had him in the office pool for OKC's solution to needing legitimate big men. I was surprised to see he played over 90% of his minutes at center last year. He's either a dunk or 3pt guy with no mid-range game. His rebounding rates are low for a center. He'd be an interesting piece as the 4th big who gets some playing time to try and develop, but I'm not sure he does anything to upgrade the roster.

I still don't see a starting center on the roster and if you want to argue Chet is the starting center then I don't see a starting PF.

There are 22 people on the roster (including keyontae). They have 35 picks over the next 7 years. Why are you so confident that this will be the roster in October?

Everyone who wanted to dump salary has had the time to do it and very cheaply because of the number of teams that had to get to the floor. The number of teams that are rebuilding and looking to trade quality veterans for value hasn't changed much, with the exception of Portland. So unless Nurkic is going to come in as the center then there isn't much else out there.

Everyone keeps talking about "consolidating". What team has 3+ roster spots that wants garbage players and will give you a quality big man? What makes you think Presti will, for the first time in his tenure as GM, make a significant off-season trade after the draft? No, getting PG13 was not a significant trade. It didn't not improve the team from purgatory as an easy first round exit for any decent team. The same applies to the Melo trade. Presti did pull a massive rebuilding trade after the first week of July, but I think everyone will be pissed if he trades SGA for a huge rebuilding package.

[jake_swivel]

Everyone keeps talking about "consolidating". What team has 3+ roster spots that wants garbage players and will give you a quality big man?

Wiggins, joe, micic, dort, Poku, Dieng, Kenrich, and 35 draft picks over 7 years are there for trades. And $25 million worth of expiring contracts. You can trade those dudes and still have significant guard/wing depth.

[Devilanche]

Any chance our flotsam of salary and a first rounder (lotto protected) can net Simmons ?

He can connect plays and he can function as the big .

[zimpy27]

What 15-man roster do you want to see?

[Xatticus]

addicted to SRPs now

Read on Twitter

Garuba has some upside.

I'm baffled. I liked both TyTy and Garuba.

I like Washington's decision-making and he has a nice shot out to mid-range. He was banged up last year and never really got out of the gates. He needs time. He has to extend his shot and he needs to adjust to the speed of the NBA. I just don't see where he fits with us as we have a bundle of guys now that occupy a similar role.

I like Garuba. He has it at the defensive end. He is built like a tank but he has really fluid hips. He has been labeled a center, but I think he has more to him at the defensive end than that. He's undersized as a 5, but he can occupy a role similar to that of Aaron Gordon. You can throw him at one of the big bully wings in the NBA. His shot needs work. If he can hit the corner 3 at a respectable level, he has some value in the league. For me, he isn't entirely dissimilar from Jarace Walker, who just went 8th.

On value, I love this. The issue is that we have too many players that need development time and there are a finite number of roster spots. I think Presti is ahead of the rules on this. I wish the G-League was a proper league with real contracts. It's silly to me that teams have to dump guys on rookie-scale deals that they would be happy to develop if not for roster restrictions. What's the point of having a developmental league if you can't fully utilize it?

[ThunderBolt]

Any chance our flotsam of salary and a first rounder (lotto protected) can net Simmons ?

He can connect plays and he can function as the big .

I don't think we would need to be the one giving up a pick for Simmons. The idea of a diminished Ben Simmons isn't horrible but the issue for me is his availability. Assuming we have enough shooting to overcome his offensive deficiencies (which I don't think we do), I forsee him going AWOL when we need him most. He should have been eager to rebuild his value last year in Brooklyn and still had the same issues. I'd probably pass.

[jake_swivel]

Any chance our flotsam of salary and a first rounder (lotto protected) can net Simmons ?

He can connect plays and he can function as the big .

I don't think we would need to be the one giving up a pick for Simmons. The idea of a diminished Ben Simmons isn't horrible but the issue for me is his availability. Assuming we have enough shooting to overcome his offensive deficiencies (which I don't think we do), I forsee him going AWOL when we need him most. He should have been eager to rebuild his value last year in Brooklyn and still had the same issues. I'd probably pass.

If you thought he was pre-Atlanta series Ben Simmons would you do it with flotsam and protected lotto pick?

[timO]

What 15-man roster do you want to see?

SGA-Cason-Mann
Dort-Micic-Joe
Giddey-Poku-Wiggins
JWill-KW-Dieng
Chet-Jaylin-JRE

Cason and Micic seems good players, then trade Dort for a PF/C.

[Devilanche]

Any chance our flotsam of salary and a first rounder (lotto protected) can net Simmons ?

He can connect plays and he can function as the big .

I don't think we would need to be the one giving up a pick for Simmons. The idea of a diminished Ben Simmons isn't horrible but the issue for me is his availability. Assuming we have enough shooting to overcome his offensive deficiencies (which I don't think we do), I forsee him going AWOL when we need him most. He should have been eager to rebuild his value last year in Brooklyn and still had the same issues. I'd probably pass.

If you thought he was pre-Atlanta series Ben Simmons would you do it with flotsam and protected lotto pick?

I don’t think he will ever be pre Atlanta Simmons .

Reasons I’m ok to trade for him
- price will be low ( or is that still expensive) that we really not going to care.
- we have the matching expiring contract to force the trade.
- we need get our roster down anyway
- we do have a good 3 point shooting coach but obviously there’s a limit to coaching
- the roster is deep with potential and if Simmons come , he’s another potential piece . If we rehabbed him great , if we doesn’t what exactly have we wasted.


Reasons I’m not ok to trade him
- what is his influence / impact on the roster ?
- what are his expectations in terms of minutes ?
- take out any shooting , is there still a positive contribution guy in there somewhere ?

[jake_swivel]

Any chance our flotsam of salary and a first rounder (lotto protected) can net Simmons ?

He can connect plays and he can function as the big .

What are your thoughts on the spacing situation if that were to happen?

Maybe after being in a big city ben starts seeing the benefits of being in a lower pressure, small market city with the most supportive nba fan base that’s ever existed. Maybe having a couple of aussies around is good for him. Maybe he even reached out to them. Maybe his back is all healed up.

A lot of maybes, but I could see the value of a low risk, high reward reclamation project on a two year contract. You’d still have assets to get a backup big if you’re just sending expirings and a lotto protected first. Or perhaps one could be added to the deal.

I’ll tell ya what, that team would be a ball handling, defensive nightmare that could get out and run.

[ThunderBolt]

Any chance our flotsam of salary and a first rounder (lotto protected) can net Simmons ?

He can connect plays and he can function as the big .

I don't think we would need to be the one giving up a pick for Simmons. The idea of a diminished Ben Simmons isn't horrible but the issue for me is his availability. Assuming we have enough shooting to overcome his offensive deficiencies (which I don't think we do), I forsee him going AWOL when we need him most. He should have been eager to rebuild his value last year in Brooklyn and still had the same issues. I'd probably pass.

If you thought he was pre-Atlanta series Ben Simmons would you do it with flotsam and protected lotto pick?

I see the appeal from the defensive side to help Chet. However in the outgoing players we'd likely be losing some shooting. Bertans for sure. Guys like Wallace, Chet, Shai and Jalen I think can be capable three point shooters but they aren't guys that create great spacing. Let's assume Dort isn't here anymore. We'd still likely have lots of minutes with Giddey and Simmons on the floor together. That makes the other capable shooters life that much harder. The more I think about it, the more I think it creates as many or more problems than it solves.

[Devilanche]

Any chance our flotsam of salary and a first rounder (lotto protected) can net Simmons ?

He can connect plays and he can function as the big .

What are your thoughts on the spacing situation if that were to happen?

Maybe after being in a big city ben starts seeing the benefits of being in a lower pressure, small market city with the most supportive nba fan base that’s ever existed. Maybe having a couple of aussies around is good for him. Maybe he even reached out to them. Maybe his back is all healed up.

A lot of maybes, but I could see the value of a low risk, high reward reclamation project on a two year contract. You’d still have assets to get a backup big if you’re just sending expirings and a lotto protected first. Or perhaps one could be added to the deal.

I’ll tell ya what, that team would be a ball handling, defensive nightmare that could get out and run.

If I’m trading for him it will be to play around 10-15 minutes at best and I think I can space out minutes that our spacing won’t crater into non existence during that period.

Think of him as insurance in case Jaylin/Poku performance underwhelm. Heck he might get more runs in games when we rest out Chet etc.

I’m not worried about the minutes , I don’t really mind the fit issues so long as he does everything else other than shoot 3s and shoot jumper .

I think his value on this contract is non existence but if we somehow managed to make him into a 25-30% 3 point shooter on 1-1.5 3s a game , we potentially might be able to bring him back on a sub MLE offer, purely because no other team would dare bring him without actually trying out his fit on the roster.

[Devilanche]

I don't think we would need to be the one giving up a pick for Simmons. The idea of a diminished Ben Simmons isn't horrible but the issue for me is his availability. Assuming we have enough shooting to overcome his offensive deficiencies (which I don't think we do), I forsee him going AWOL when we need him most. He should have been eager to rebuild his value last year in Brooklyn and still had the same issues. I'd probably pass.

If you thought he was pre-Atlanta series Ben Simmons would you do it with flotsam and protected lotto pick?

I see the appeal from the defensive side to help Chet. However in the outgoing players we'd likely be losing some shooting. Bertans for sure. Guys like Wallace, Chet, Shai and Jalen I think can be capable three point shooters but they aren't guys that create great spacing. Let's assume Dort isn't here anymore. We'd still likely have lots of minutes with Giddey and Simmons on the floor together. That makes the other capable shooters life that much harder. The more I think about it, the more I think it creates as many or more problems than it solves.

The roster is deep with average roleplayers . They’re enough non giddey minutes that we can find to play Simmons . If he perform well enough to get extended minutes that will be a good problem to have cause hopefully with either him and/or giddey 3 point shooting improve abit .

[Dadouv47]

I like our core but our roster is clearly a mess right now...problem is that we still have a ton of "talented" young players that need playing time and are not valuable enough in trades (Dieng, Poku). I also think Presti is overrating a bit some guys on our roster (JWill, JRE). Love Wiggins but I'm worried we barely play him with the new players and Kenrich back.

[Big nick]

What 15-man roster do you want to see?

First let jre go either by trade or cut him and replace him with garuba. I really like our guards. The front line is very thin right know and no way chet can play center. I still believe that a big trade is in the works that's the only reason we have so many players on the roster. I hope we will trade for a nice center. Or chet will get hurt again. I realize you can win playing small if you have a curry like player but we don't have that yet. With that said it's going to be a very fun year.

[Dadouv47]

What 15-man roster do you want to see?

First let jre go either by trade or cut him and replace him with garuba. I really like our guards. The front line is very thin right know and no way chet can play center. I still believe that a big trade is in the works that's the only reason we have so many players on the roster. I hope we will trade for a nice center. Or chet will get hurt again. I realize you can win playing small if you have a curry like player but we don't have that yet. With that said it's going to be a very fun year.

I think last season we had 19 players before october (but worse players in Maledon, Ty Jerome and Krejci so easier decisions to make)