All Things Thunder Offseason Thread

[Devilanche]

I think we just fundamentally disagree on how much the needle needs to be moved this year. We saw with harden not being retained how financial limitations can force you to make non-talent related decisions. That cascaded into losing durant. Star hunting a big man and then losing Jalen/Chet/Giddey in a couple years when you don’t even know how the team fits together right now doesn’t make sense.

Keep flexibility. There will be opportunities later. But in the meantime, see if you can figure out a way to get a decent big and develop what you have. If they turn into something, then you have the assets to turn it into the Duncan-era spurs. They aren’t winning a championship this year regardless.

I'd take Simmons for Dort and expirings if he wants to be here and will play 20 minutes a game.

Do you want to keep the flexibility or do you want pay Simmons $40M for the next two years? Pick one. Why add Simmons if OKC isn't in a position to add? Pick a side. OKC could contend for the title if they added the right pieces or OKC has no chance to be good enough to justify adding. Keep cap flexibility or trade for Simmons?

They actually could maintain cap flexibility and improve their title odds by giving up Dort and three first round picks for Nurkic. The contracts are the same length and the salary difference maxes out at $2M in '25-'26. That would be the first year of Giddy's new contract and before Chet gets a contract giving OKC time to draft and develop another big man. In theory, your max guys are going to be SGA-Giddy-Chet. After that you have to figure out Jalen. Maybe Cason forces it so you have to go into the luxury tax in '27-'28.

This isn't a situation where you have KD and Russ maxed with Ibaka having a big contract and you trade for Perkin's big contract, coming off a career changing knee injury, making you afraid to extend Harden.

The Nurkic that was remotely worth 3 first was probably 2 seasons ago. Think injuries has slowed him down.

[slick_watts]

three 1sts for nurkic. i think covid really messed kizz's mind up.

[jake_swivel]

If nurkic is a positive asset, it’s only just barely. He’s as much of a positive asset as dort. I like his toughness and passing, though. And a rebuilding blazers team shouldn’t be too opposed to selling him off for parts. Don’t think dort would hold much appeal to them, but I wouldn’t be super excited about giving up too much beyond Lu.

[Dn4sty]

What has happened to this thread?

[Dn4sty]

Do you want to keep the flexibility or do you want pay Simmons $40M for the next two years? Pick one. Why add Simmons if OKC isn't in a position to add? Pick a side. OKC could contend for the title if they added the right pieces or OKC has no chance to be good enough to justify adding. Keep cap flexibility or trade for Simmons?

They actually could maintain cap flexibility and improve their title odds by giving up Dort and three first round picks for Nurkic. The contracts are the same length and the salary difference maxes out at $2M in '25-'26. That would be the first year of Giddy's new contract and before Chet gets a contract giving OKC time to draft and develop another big man. In theory, your max guys are going to be SGA-Giddy-Chet. After that you have to figure out Jalen. Maybe Cason forces it so you have to go into the luxury tax in '27-'28.

This isn't a situation where you have KD and Russ maxed with Ibaka having a big contract and you trade for Perkin's big contract, coming off a career changing knee injury, making you afraid to extend Harden.

The Nurkic that was remotely worth 3 first was probably 2 seasons ago. Think injuries has slowed him down.

That’s putting it nicely.

[Dadouv47]

Read on Twitter

/photo/1

yeah maybe he can play the 4

Poku and Chet need to work out with JDub

[Dadouv47]

If nurkic is a positive asset, it’s only just barely. He’s as much of a positive asset as dort. I like his toughness and passing, though. And a rebuilding blazers team shouldn’t be too opposed to selling him off for parts. Don’t think dort would hold much appeal to them, but I wouldn’t be super excited about giving up too much beyond Lu.

I think Dort is more valuable than Nurkic...I have Dort being worth a very late FRP and Nurkic the opposite. I might be wrong but Dort could help several good teams, Nurkic not so much.

[jake_swivel]

What has happened to this thread?

I apologize for the Ben Simmons part I’ve played in this thread. I’m just looking at the roster and seeing the absolute glut of wings and guards and trying to figure out a way to get some minor help down low. And a way to send out dort. I wouldn’t be at all excited by Ben Simmons. But it’s an idea I’m not 100% opposed to.

[jake_swivel]

That really is quite the wild transformation from his rookie year.

[tleikheen]

I think Chet and Poku are going to be paired up moreso than less so as opposed to fighting for the same position,They bring alot of versatility and length offensively and defensively.

[jake_swivel]

I think Chet and Poku are going to be paired up moreso than less so as opposed to fighting for the same position,They bring alot of versatility and length offensively and defensively.

Poku may not have an unbroken bone in his body by the time the season rolls around.

[Dadouv47]

I think Chet and Poku are going to be paired up moreso than less so as opposed to fighting for the same position,They bring alot of versatility and length offensively and defensively.

Poku may not have an unbroken bone in his body by the time the season rolls around.

and I will still ask for Presti to keep him. I have an irrational desire that this kid succeed in the NBA.

[Xatticus]

If nurkic is a positive asset, it’s only just barely. He’s as much of a positive asset as dort. I like his toughness and passing, though. And a rebuilding blazers team shouldn’t be too opposed to selling him off for parts. Don’t think dort would hold much appeal to them, but I wouldn’t be super excited about giving up too much beyond Lu.

I think Dort is more valuable than Nurkic...I have Dort being worth a very late FRP and Nurkic the opposite. I might be wrong but Dort could help several good teams, Nurkic not so much.

I'm not going to get into the particulars on their values, but Dort is clearly more valuable. It isn't because Nurkic is washed, but rather because Dort is just a much better bet to play and because he is a wing, where alternatives aren't as cheap. I don't think either really moves the needle, but both can be solid rotation pieces. Nurkic just isn't a good bet to give you a lot of minutes. On top of that, he is significantly older. He's just much less likely to retain the value he has right now.

We all lament Dort's shortcomings, but he is actually a solid player. He helps at the defensive end and he doesn't kill your offense. Dillon Brooks just got 4/$80M and I believe Dort is the better player, so his deal isn't bad. If he hits 28% of his threes next year, then the math changes.

[Xatticus]

What has happened to this thread?

I apologize for the Ben Simmons part I’ve played in this thread. I’m just looking at the roster and seeing the absolute glut of wings and guards and trying to figure out a way to get some minor help down low. And a way to send out dort. I wouldn’t be at all excited by Ben Simmons. But it’s an idea I’m not 100% opposed to.

I don't see how a Simmons deal happens. It doesn't make sense for Brooklyn to move him right now. They have to hope his value bounces back. His contract is a massive negative and Brooklyn isn't going to pay someone to take him unless they come out of the gates strong next year. The only sort of scenario that makes any sense to me is a bad money for bad money deal, but Brooklyn would have to feel that Simmons is a sunk cost, in which case I wouldn't have any interest at all.

[jake_swivel]

I'm not going to get into the particulars on their values, but Dort is clearly more valuable. It isn't because Nurkic is washed, but rather because Dort is just a much better bet to play and because he is a wing, where alternatives aren't as cheap. I don't think either really moves the needle, but both can be solid rotation pieces. Nurkic just isn't a good bet to give you a lot of minutes. On top of that, he is significantly older. He's just much less likely to retain the value he has right now.

We all lament Dort's shortcomings, but he is actually a solid player. He helps at the defensive end and he doesn't kill your offense. Dillon Brooks just got 4/$80M and I believe Dort is the better player, so his deal isn't bad. If he hits 28% of his threes next year, then the math changes.

I agree that on the whole, dort is a player that most teams would want strictly in terms of value. I think for this particular team, his skill set is less valuable due to other options who can contribute as much or more without disrupting the offense. Im not convinced that he doesn’t disrupt the defense with his refusal to switch on his man and his tendency to overswitch off ball on to giddey’s man. He’s good on ball.

[jake_swivel]

I don't see how a Simmons deal happens. It doesn't make sense for Brooklyn to move him right now. They have to hope his value bounces back. His contract is a massive negative and Brooklyn isn't going to pay someone to take him unless they come out of the gates strong next year. The only sort of scenario that makes any sense to me is a bad money for bad money deal, but Brooklyn would have to feel that Simmons is a sunk cost, in which case I wouldn't have any interest at all.

Not to restart the discussion, but we have the expirings to get him with Dipo, Bertans, and Gay. Mann or JRE could be added along with dort. Brooklyn could send something back. It’s doable. Not saying it’s a great idea or anything. Way down on the list of options.

[Xatticus]

I don't see how a Simmons deal happens. It doesn't make sense for Brooklyn to move him right now. They have to hope his value bounces back. His contract is a massive negative and Brooklyn isn't going to pay someone to take him unless they come out of the gates strong next year. The only sort of scenario that makes any sense to me is a bad money for bad money deal, but Brooklyn would have to feel that Simmons is a sunk cost, in which case I wouldn't have any interest at all.

Not to restart the discussion, but we have the expirings to get him with Dipo, Bertans, and Gay. Mann or JRE could be added along with dort. Brooklyn could send something back. It’s doable. Not saying it’s a great idea or anything. Way down on the list of options.

Yeah. For that to work though, Brooklyn has to feel that there is no upside in holding onto him, which would concern me.

[Big nick]

I am out on Simmons before he was drafted I watched him alot in college and he couldn't shoot at all. I couldn't believe he was drafted number one. I mean he was a deamon on defense but didn't bring much else. He has gotten no better with his shot and seems like a very unlikable person i think he would be a rotten team mate. Now I sure wished dort could finish this year but I am not holding my breath. Last year when he went to the basket I was wishing he would pass.

[Dadouv47]

I might be pissed at Presti if Siakam gets traded for half the value Masai supposedly want. Still think Siakam would be an incredible fit for us.

[jake_swivel]

I might be pissed at Presti if Siakam gets traded for half the value Masai supposedly want. Still think Siakam would be an incredible fit for us.

What’s your top offer?