Kobe & Pau vs Stockton & Malone

parsnips33 · Post #1 » by **parsnips33** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 4:45 pm

Which duo would you rather build around over their entire careers?

RCM88x · Post #2 » by **RCM88x** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 5:17 pm

Kobe is the best player here, I would go with his pair. While both Stockton and Malone are on the Mt. Rushmore of longevity I don't think the advantage is worth taking them.

onedayattatime · Post #3 » by **onedayattatime** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 6:09 pm

The differences in the quality of their supporting casts is massive, yet Stockton & Malone still led a contender/finals team. imagine i offered the following trade: Jeff Hornacek, Bryon Russell, and Greg Ostertag for Lamar Odom, Trevor Ariza, Andrew Bynum, Derek Fisher, Sasha Vujačić, Vladimir Radmanović, and Luke Walton. Would you take it? You only need to give 3 players because I just named the only Jazz players with positive VORP. So yes, Kobe and Pau did great with that supporting cast, but Stockton and Malone would be insane with those players.

Post #4 » by **penbeast0** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 7:31 pm

Kobe and Malone are close in value though Kobe's is probably a bit higher. Stockton's, however, is quite a bit higher than Pau Gasol's, probably significantly closer to Kobe's, so the combined value of the Utah pair should be clearly superior.

Colbinii · Post #5 » by **Colbinii** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 7:41 pm

In terms of team building, I would prefer Kobe + Pau in a vacuum.

ceiling raiser · Post #6 » by **ceiling raiser** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 7:44 pm

Is it insane to prefer Pau to Malone?

Matt15 · Post #7 » by **Matt15** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 8:06 pm

Kobe and Pau since it’s reasonably close and Kobe is the best player here.

parsnips33 · Post #8 » by **parsnips33** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 8:21 pm

ceiling raiser wrote:Is it insane to prefer Pau to Malone?

Based on what? Passing?

ceiling raiser · Post #9 » by **ceiling raiser** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 8:41 pm

parsnips33 wrote:
ceiling raiser wrote:Is it insane to prefer Pau to Malone?

Based on what? Passing?

Passing, spacing and defense.

onedayattatime · Post #10 » by **onedayattatime** » Mon Aug 14, 2023 10:58 pm

ceiling raiser wrote:
parsnips33 wrote:
ceiling raiser wrote:Is it insane to prefer Pau to Malone?

Based on what? Passing?

Passing, spacing and defense.

Isn't Malone better at at least two of those things? I always thought he was a better passer, and his assist rates tend to be higher than Gasol's. And by spacing I think you mean long 2's since Gasol didn't takes 3s until late in his career. Karl Malone long 2's (16+ feet): 45.2% (34.4% of shots taken); Pau Gasol long 2's: 43.1% (16.1% of shots taken).

I could maybe see an argument for taking Pau based on fit if you had the perfect roster for him or something. But personally, "I'm drafting Pau Gasol over Karl Malone" sounds insane to me.

migya · Post #11 » by **migya** » Tue Aug 15, 2023 2:25 am

onedayattatime wrote:The differences in the quality of their supporting casts is massive, yet Stockton & Malone still led a contender/finals team. imagine i offered the following trade: Jeff Hornacek, Bryon Russell, and Greg Ostertag for Lamar Odom, Trevor Ariza, Andrew Bynum, Derek Fisher, Sasha Vujačić, Vladimir Radmanović, and Luke Walton. Would you take it? You only need to give 3 players because I just named the only Jazz players with positive VORP. So yes, Kobe and Pau did great with that supporting cast, but Stockton and Malone would be insane with those players.

Absolutely, context shows it. They almost won it against many high level opponents.

iggymcfrack · Post #12 » by **iggymcfrack** » Tue Aug 15, 2023 4:40 am

Stockton > Malone >> Kobe >>>> Pau

Don't be results oriented about the rings. Stockton and Malone are clearly the better duo.