DelAbbot wrote:JN wrote:DelAbbot wrote:
You have to look at what AA did from when he become GM to when he left. He had few assets and accumulated the most dominant lineup in Jays 20 years and strong enough bullpen to go all the way.
Just watch the trash heap Shapkins will leave for the next Jays GM when they get fired, then you will appreciate what AA left Shapkins with
What an odd point.
We only needed like 2 years to see how the 2016 roster moved forward. It wasn't good - at all. Other than Vlad, there was literally nothing to appreciate. Well there as Donaldson too -- and that was flopped by Shatkins who waited too long to move on from him.
This team is much better positioned for new mgmt today in 2023 than it was for new mgmt in 2016. Now all we need though is new mgmt.
What! The post 2016 was still very strong and with veteran assets like MVP Josh Donaldson at peak performance with 2 years of control. If you want to argue the 2016 roster was a full of declining assets, then I argue it's because AA constructed the roster (trading away future prospects for current veterans) for the 2013-2017 window - and he had plenty to show for it with 2015 & 2016. Much of the assets AA accumulated were spent for the competitive run in 2015-2016, and it was totally worth it.
My main point was that Shatkins did not inherit the good situation that was asserted by one of the members here.
I never said that 2015 and 2016 wasn't worth it - those were great teams especially the 2015 one. Or that it was a poor decision to make the pushes for those years. AA made the right calls and those teams in terms of assessing what we had. But ultimately the lack of positional prospect development over the years (and not really the trading of some prospects) was the key factor in the short window. Not that I disagreed with his prospect deals in 2015 at all - short window is better than no window. His acquisitions of the 3 key players for those teams Bautista, Encarnacion, and Donaldson were all brilliant in terms of costs. But by the end of 2016 the window on that team had largely closed - old and budget constrained.
AA could have certainly done the rebuild as well. He's proven to be a great executive. But again my point is that Shatkins did not inherit the good situation that was asserted.
Personally I thought Shatkins did a better job than some gave them credit for up to 2021. That was a really good team, what seemed like a good farm system at the time. But looking how the team and organization has moved forward from 2021 to 2023 in terms of its roster management, its player development / coaching on the big team, and its clear they have been heading in the wrong direction in many aspects beyond just some questionable moves like the Varsho one.