Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - Crowder Out 8 Weeks

Ron Swanson · Post #681 » by **Ron Swanson** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 2:29 pm

Shouldn't be a surprise that Caruso was at his best when LA was using him as a 20-minute bench guy behind a much more offensively capable 3&D dude (KCP). While I get that the Dame trade has afforded us more flexibility in the backcourt, I'm also not gonna actively target the biggest offensive zero at the SG position I can find just because his defense is elite. And like emunney said, why even bother when you just drafted a dude (AJJ) who you hope/expect to be that guy anyways? Just play Andre.

German Athens · Post #682 » by **German Athens** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 2:48 pm

If we want to match up even better with boston, we should look for more quickness from that 2-guard spot.

Examples being quickley in game 1 against the Celtics, and last year against the Celtics when he dropped 38. Quickness kills. For as talented defensively as the Celtics are up and down their roster, Jrue, white, brown, Tatum are still mostly different versions of wing defenders and can be exploited by quick as hell players.

Obviously, I love quickley. But does anyone have any other targets to add to the list with that skillset?

Ruben Quevedo · Post #683 » by **Ruben Quevedo** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 3:19 pm

I think Caruso is comfortably better than Pat, but it's pretty clear Pat is an important culture guy. Probably a trade you can't do unless the defense becomes an emergency-level disaster

ShootingtheJ · Post #684 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 4:30 pm

Bucksmaniac wrote:
emunney wrote:Caruso's better than Pat but maybe not enough to motivate a trade.

Couldn’t he be the type of player to motivate the whole team to play better defense, become infectious through his actions? I also think he could be nearly as effective or possibly better at hitting the wide open 3s he’s sure to get if he’s the 5th starter.

I don't think he can, because he didn't hasnt done it in Chicago. However, Beverly was able to do that for Chicago in his short late season stint there.

Beverly would bee a better fit here than Beasley, but I'd rather just develop Marjon, AJJ, and AJG.

BroncoBuck · Post #685 » by **BroncoBuck** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 5:59 pm

Ron Swanson wrote:Shouldn't be a surprise that Caruso was at his best when LA was using him as a 20-minute bench guy behind a much more offensively capable 3&D dude (KCP). While I get that the Dame trade has afforded us more flexibility in the backcourt, I'm also not gonna actively target the biggest offensive zero at the SG position I can find just because his defense is elite. And like emunney said, why even bother when you just drafted a dude (AJJ) who you hope/expect to be that guy anyways? Just play Andre.

Caruso reminds me of when Portland had Mo Harkless. Sure he’s shooting 40% from 3, but there is no volume to that shooting. There’s no quick trigger, everything has to be perfect for him to even put up the shot. You’re effectively playing 4 on 5 on offense. It just allows the other team to put their worst defender on him.

buckboy · Post #686 » by **buckboy** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 7:39 pm

As has been stated just play AJJ.

I think he will eventually (later this season)

ShootingtheJ · Post #687 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 9:46 pm

buckboy wrote:As has been stated just play AJJ.

I thinknl he will eventually (later this season)

I think he'll get a chance to work on his game, and shot, once the G League season opens in 2 weeks. That league shifted to a veteran league last year, the competition is real now.

midranger · Post #688 » by **midranger** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 9:48 pm

BroncoBuck wrote:
Ron Swanson wrote:Shouldn't be a surprise that Caruso was at his best when LA was using him as a 20-minute bench guy behind a much more offensively capable 3&D dude (KCP). While I get that the Dame trade has afforded us more flexibility in the backcourt, I'm also not gonna actively target the biggest offensive zero at the SG position I can find just because his defense is elite. And like emunney said, why even bother when you just drafted a dude (AJJ) who you hope/expect to be that guy anyways? Just play Andre.

Caruso reminds me of when Portland had Mo Harkless. Sure he’s shooting 40% from 3, but there is no volume to that shooting. There’s no quick trigger, everything has to be perfect for him to even put up the shot. You’re effectively playing 4 on 5 on offense. It just allows the other team to put their worst defender on him.

PJ Tucker in 2021

drdrG · Post #689 » by **drdrG** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 9:55 pm

We aren't stopping Tatum or Butler with a better defensive 2 guard. If we want to get a helpful asset for those guys on defense, it better be a rangy wing. I think Thybulle is a better target than Caruso and won't cost as much.

Anyway, here's hoping AJJ can be that guy in March and beyond

giannis and 1 · Post #690 » by **giannis and 1** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 10:04 pm

drdrG wrote:We aren't stopping Tatum or Butler with a better defensive 2 guard. If we want to get a helpful asset for those guys on defense, it better be a rangy wing. I think Thybulle is a better target than Caruso and won't cost as much.

Anyway, here's hoping AJJ can be that guy in March and beyond

We need a perimeter defender to stop Brown/Herro

tedbrogen · Post #691 » by **tedbrogen** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 10:08 pm

giannis and 1 wrote:
drdrG wrote:We aren't stopping Tatum or Butler with a better defensive 2 guard. If we want to get a helpful asset for those guys on defense, it better be a rangy wing. I think Thybulle is a better target than Caruso and won't cost as much.

Anyway, here's hoping AJJ can be that guy in March and beyond

We need a perimeter defender to stop Brown/Herro

I think AJJ could give them fits and Marjon could stay in front of them.

Beasily, yeah they’ll light him up. Even Brook was lighting up Beasily’s D last night.

neiLz · Post #692 » by **neiLz** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 10:12 pm

German Athens wrote:If we want to match up even better with boston, we should look for more quickness from that 2-guard spot.

Examples being quickley in game 1 against the Celtics, and last year against the Celtics when he dropped 38. Quickness kills. For as talented defensively as the Celtics are up and down their roster, Jrue, white, brown, Tatum are still mostly different versions of wing defenders and can be exploited by quick as hell players.

Obviously, I love quickley. But does anyone have any other targets to add to the list with that skillset?

Dame lillard.

soxperry · Post #693 » by **soxperry** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 10:12 pm

The singular defensive stopper is a myth. We need a guy who plays smart team oriented defense and makes winning plays. Like pj tucker basically. I love Dre but i just dont know if a rookie can be trusted in the playoffs. Marjon could be the guy, we'll see.

Ron Swanson · Post #694 » by **Ron Swanson** » Fri Oct 27, 2023 10:32 pm

giannis and 1 wrote:
drdrG wrote:We aren't stopping Tatum or Butler with a better defensive 2 guard. If we want to get a helpful asset for those guys on defense, it better be a rangy wing. I think Thybulle is a better target than Caruso and won't cost as much.

Anyway, here's hoping AJJ can be that guy in March and beyond

We need a perimeter defender to stop Brown/Herro

I laughed.

ShootingtheJ · Post #695 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:50 am

soxperry wrote:The singular defensive stopper is a myth. We need a guy who plays smart team oriented defense and makes winning plays. Like pj tucker basically. I love Dre but i just dont know if a rookie can be trusted in the playoffs. Marjon could be the guy, we'll see.

Another myth: PJ being useful. Bucks were better then with Pat. Was Pat a defensive dynamo?

Defensive stoppers can be super useful, especially on this team with numerous team oriented defenders already.

Baddy Chuck · Post #696 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 12:59 am

ShootingtheJ wrote:Another myth: PJ being useful. Bucks were better then with Pat. Was Pat a defensive dynamo?

They were SIGNIFICANTLY better with PJ.

ShootingtheJ · Post #697 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 3:32 am

Baddy Chuck wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:Another myth: PJ being useful. Bucks were better then with Pat. Was Pat a defensive dynamo?

They were SIGNIFICANTLY better with PJ.

Skewed from early round insignificant games where Pat played with 2nd unit guys, but you know that. Do the Finals

Baddy Chuck · Post #698 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 3:50 am

ShootingtheJ wrote:Skewed from early round insignificant games where Pat played with 2nd unit guys, but you know that. Do the Finals

The Finals where Pat was -4.9 to PJ's -5.1 is supposed to show how much more useful he was?

You are absolutely the most disingenuous person I've ever seen regarding players you don't like vs players you like and what stats and metrics you will use or goalposts you'll move to tell yourself you're right :lol:

. From vorp, to on/offs, to "playoff performer!" to whatever else and the way you pick and choose and cut up the stats to fit your narrative it never ceases to amaze me.

ShootingtheJ · Post #699 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:04 am

Baddy Chuck wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:Skewed from early round insignificant games where Pat played with 2nd unit guys, but you know that. Do the Finals

The Finals where Pat was -4.9 to PJ's -5.1 is supposed to show how much more useful he was?

You are absolutely the most disingenuous person I've ever seen regarding players you don't like vs players you like and what stats and metrics you will use or goalposts you'll move to tell yourself you're right . From vorp, to on/offs, to "playoff performer!" to whatever else and the way you pick and choose and cut up the stats to fit your narrative it never ceases to amaze me.

Your numbers are off. It amazes me how unglued someone gets when their favorite player gets criticism. Are you his mom?

Baddy Chuck · Post #700 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:34 am

ShootingtheJ wrote:
Baddy Chuck wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:Skewed from early round insignificant games where Pat played with 2nd unit guys, but you know that. Do the Finals

The Finals where Pat was -4.9 to PJ's -5.1 is supposed to show how much more useful he was?

You are absolutely the most disingenuous person I've ever seen regarding players you don't like vs players you like and what stats and metrics you will use or goalposts you'll move to tell yourself you're right . From vorp, to on/offs, to "playoff performer!" to whatever else and the way you pick and choose and cut up the stats to fit your narrative it never ceases to amaze me.

Your numbers are off. It amazes me how unglued someone gets when their favorite player gets criticism. Are you his mom?

You go as far as to just lie. It's crazy.

https://www.nba.com/stats/team/1610612749/onoffcourt-advanced?Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Playoffs&OpponentTeamID=1610612756

Pat Connaughton on court during the Suns series: +0.3, off court +5.2
Tucker on court +1.6, off court +6.7