Official 2023-2024 Magic Trade Ideas Thread

[Landshark]

Thoughts on trading for Tyus Jones? 27 years old, 14 mil salary, career 5.0 AST/TO ratio (!). He could run the point for the starting unit and shoot the 3. He's not as flashy as some of the bigger names mentioned already, but he would also be cheaper in terms of both salary and trade cost. He's an expiring contract on a rebuilding Wizards team, so they may be looking to move him at the deadline. Denver pick + salary matching might get it done.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

Thoughts on trading for Tyus Jones? 27 years old, 14 mil salary, career 5.0 AST/TO ratio (!). He could run the point for the starting unit and shoot the 3. He's not as flashy as some of the bigger names mentioned already, but he would also be cheaper in terms of both salary and trade cost. He's an expiring contract on a rebuilding Wizards team, so they may be looking to move him at the deadline. Denver pick + salary matching might get it done.

that's exactly who I'd be looking at. Fultz + Denver 1st at deadline if things don't look pretty.

[Residual-Heat]

I think the value is pretty close for POR, except that POR sees Grant as a 4 instead of a 3. Rebounds like a guard, handles like a pf.

POR needs to figure out the best deal to send out Williams. Probably Brogdon too. Will want frp for each, though trading Brogdon will mean POR will need a competent vet mentor for the guards.

Outside if Brogdon there isn’t a competent pg on the roster.

2 1sts from the Magic? I wouldnt do that. I would give up 1 pick+ a 2nd for both, but that 1st will probably be a good pick. If the Blazers are looking for a 1st for each, they will likely have to settle for very late 1sts.

In this iteration, I suppose I'd agree to include the DEN 25 frp. WCJ is arguably the best player in the deal, just more useful to POR. Williams and Simons are, to this point, specialists, and Williams' health is unreliable. I'm not knocking them at all, obviously. WCJ is an excellent player that could move around in the POR rotation (with or without Ayton) and contribute immediately. He's also very young and on, maybe the best deal in the NBA. I don't think Fultz is the guy for ORL, but he's a very viable PG and still young enough to take a long look at before his $17m deal expires.

POR sends: Simons, R. Williams
ORL sends: DEN 25 frp, Wendell Carter, Fultz, Chuma

I forgot about the Denver pick...
I wouldnt inlcude WCJ in this trade. Would rather include a 1st, and Im pretty sure the Blazers might prefer a 1st since they have Ayton.

[OrlChamps2030]

Thoughts on trading for Tyus Jones? 27 years old, 14 mil salary, career 5.0 AST/TO ratio (!). He could run the point for the starting unit and shoot the 3. He's not as flashy as some of the bigger names mentioned already, but he would also be cheaper in terms of both salary and trade cost. He's an expiring contract on a rebuilding Wizards team, so they may be looking to move him at the deadline. Denver pick + salary matching might get it done.

that's exactly who I'd be looking at. Fultz + Denver 1st at deadline if things don't look pretty.

Good call. I like Tyus as a bridge PG for us.

Not to mention, it wouldn’t surprise me if the Wizards were interested in Fultz next summer. Probably some additional value for them to get a look at him ahead of FA. Hometown guy, no PG, and lots of opportunities to defer to Poole and Kuzma

I like Brogdon for us too, but I think he would cost more

[Knightro]

Fultz isn't part of the core but I sure am happy as hell we don't have FVV on that ridiculous contract over here.

They’d be 3-1 with FVV in Fultz’s spot

The Raptors is bringing Gary Trent Jr. off of the bench. A trade of Suggs for Trent instantly leads to wins that Suggs is leading the team to losses.

Loooking up SGs making threes: alec-burks, max-strus, lonnie-walker, and bogdan-bogdanovic have all started very strong.

The Magic needs a starting shooting guard that can (and does) shoot.

They need a point guard just as much, if not more.

Trent for Suggs is one of the worst ideas ever suggested on here.

[drsd]

Trent for Suggs is one do the worst ideas ever suggested on here.

Do you see Suggs as a PG or SG?

/..

[tiderulz]

Thoughts on trading for Tyus Jones? 27 years old, 14 mil salary, career 5.0 AST/TO ratio (!). He could run the point for the starting unit and shoot the 3. He's not as flashy as some of the bigger names mentioned already, but he would also be cheaper in terms of both salary and trade cost. He's an expiring contract on a rebuilding Wizards team, so they may be looking to move him at the deadline. Denver pick + salary matching might get it done.

that's exactly who I'd be looking at. Fultz + Denver 1st at deadline if things don't look pretty.

so he is an expiring. Fultz is expiring. we add a pick too, for what, 6-7 weeks of him? just wait until the offseason or get him earlier.

[eyriq]

Do you agree or disagree: Orlando needs better shooting from its guards?

It is clear that Fultz and Suggs cannot co-exist. One of the two needs to go: this season, before the trade deadline.

Replacing Fultz for a high volume PG that can also lead the offense: that's a max player in today's NBA.
Replacing Suggs for a high volume SG that can also play "some" defense: that's a MLE player in today's NBA.

I am not a fan of Fultz per se, it is just that it is "easier" to upgrade the SG slot over the PG slot.

Suggs is playing elite defense and bringing elite energy. And he's on his rookie contract. It's not a hard decision.

Edit: said another way, if we want to be a top 5 defense, we need to play Suggs. If we want to be a top 20 offense... Fultz doesn't matter.

I think Suggs thinks he is better than he really is.

That could be, he is fearless.

[MartinsIzAfraud]

Thoughts on trading for Tyus Jones? 27 years old, 14 mil salary, career 5.0 AST/TO ratio (!). He could run the point for the starting unit and shoot the 3. He's not as flashy as some of the bigger names mentioned already, but he would also be cheaper in terms of both salary and trade cost. He's an expiring contract on a rebuilding Wizards team, so they may be looking to move him at the deadline. Denver pick + salary matching might get it done.

that's exactly who I'd be looking at. Fultz + Denver 1st at deadline if things don't look pretty.

so he is an expiring. Fultz is expiring. we add a pick too, for what, 6-7 weeks of him? just wait until the offseason or get him earlier.

thought he had 1 more year on his deal sheittt.

[Audi]

Thoughts on trading for Tyus Jones? 27 years old, 14 mil salary, career 5.0 AST/TO ratio (!). He could run the point for the starting unit and shoot the 3. He's not as flashy as some of the bigger names mentioned already, but he would also be cheaper in terms of both salary and trade cost. He's an expiring contract on a rebuilding Wizards team, so they may be looking to move him at the deadline. Denver pick + salary matching might get it done.

that's exactly who I'd be looking at. Fultz + Denver 1st at deadline if things don't look pretty.

Good call. I like Tyus as a bridge PG for us.

Not to mention, it wouldn’t surprise me if the Wizards were interested in Fultz next summer. Probably some additional value for them to get a look at him ahead of FA. Hometown guy, no PG, and lots of opportunities to defer to Poole and Kuzma

I like Brogdon for us too, but I think he would cost more

Too many question marks, imo. Worse rebounder than Fultz, gets to the line less than Fultz, less steals than Fultz. If we are this desperate for spacing we might as well start Cole and save any assets for an actual upgrade.

[thelead]

Thoughts on trading for Tyus Jones? 27 years old, 14 mil salary, career 5.0 AST/TO ratio (!). He could run the point for the starting unit and shoot the 3. He's not as flashy as some of the bigger names mentioned already, but he would also be cheaper in terms of both salary and trade cost. He's an expiring contract on a rebuilding Wizards team, so they may be looking to move him at the deadline. Denver pick + salary matching might get it done.

that's exactly who I'd be looking at. Fultz + Denver 1st at deadline if things don't look pretty.

so he is an expiring. Fultz is expiring. we add a pick too, for what, 6-7 weeks of him? just wait until the offseason or get him earlier.

I'm a fan of Tyus but yeah, he's definitely not worth a 1st round pick on an expiring deal. If you can snag him for Fultz and 2 2nd rd picks (that we never use anyway ) then, yeah, sure.

[Skybox]

2 1sts from the Magic? I wouldnt do that. I would give up 1 pick+ a 2nd for both, but that 1st will probably be a good pick. If the Blazers are looking for a 1st for each, they will likely have to settle for very late 1sts.

In this iteration, I suppose I'd agree to include the DEN 25 frp. WCJ is arguably the best player in the deal, just more useful to POR. Williams and Simons are, to this point, specialists, and Williams' health is unreliable. I'm not knocking them at all, obviously. WCJ is an excellent player that could move around in the POR rotation (with or without Ayton) and contribute immediately. He's also very young and on, maybe the best deal in the NBA. I don't think Fultz is the guy for ORL, but he's a very viable PG and still young enough to take a long look at before his $17m deal expires.

POR sends: Simons, R. Williams
ORL sends: DEN 25 frp, Wendell Carter, Fultz, Chuma

I forgot about the Denver pick...
I wouldnt inlcude WCJ in this trade. Would rather include a 1st, and Im pretty sure the Blazers might prefer a 1st since they have Ayton.

I'd rather include a first too, but I figure WCJ could be the versatile PF next to Ayton to create a very physical solid frontcourt to go with their promising young guards in Scoot and Sharpe. Grant slides to 3 easily, until he can be moved for more youngsters that fit. WCJ could also play backup C (with Grant at 4) when Ayton's out, so Williams becomes a luxury (he's an incomplete 5, but can't play 4 next to Ayton, IMO). WCJ was really meant to be a 4 but the NBA changed, he could definitely be a complementary player next to Ayton, who is huge but limited outside of the paint.

[pepe1991]

Part of a problem is rotation. We have 4 guards. Cole & Harris as shooters, Fultz and Suggs as non shooters. And instad of doing what worked last year ( Fultz- Harris / Cole Suggs) we paired them in fashion where we either have 2 solid shooting options or non.


Look how we won games when we won. By Cole Anthony averaging 20 ppg on effective scoring.
vs Lakers we were only in game because Harris shot 100%.


Easiest quick fix is simply reverting back to what worked last year. Harris in SL, Suggs back to bench.


Imo, Fultz- Suggs duo hinders Banchero and Franz a lot. Their pick&roll numbers are horrific.
And Fultz- Suggs combined for 5-23 for 3 over 4 games. Including Fultz 1 FTA and Suggs 3-13 spotups.



We also have problem putting ball through hoop enough times. I've posted it earlier today, but it's worth repeating, aside from Houston's game ( still winless team) ,we can't put up +105 points on board for 3 games straight.
Quick fix- play faster and get into transition. We are young, slow team that scores very few points in transition.

[VFX]

Box score grazing vs watching games exhibit A right here.

Do you agree or disagree: Orlando needs better shooting from its guards?

It is clear that Fultz and Suggs cannot co-exist. One of the two needs to go: this season, before the trade deadline.

Replacing Fultz for a high volume PG that can also lead the offense: that's a max player in today's NBA.
Replacing Suggs for a high volume SG that can also play "some" defense: that's a MLE player in today's NBA.

I am not a fan of Fultz per se, it is just that it is "easier" to upgrade the SG slot over the PG slot.

I don't understand this line of thinking.

A high volume SG doesn't solve an offense predicated on multiple players deferring to 1 guy. Gary Harris and Fultz were not world beaters last season in the starting lineup. Yes it was slightly better offensively but not defensively. Paolo wasn't super efficient in the second half of the season regardless. It wasn't because they added 1 extra guy into the starting lineup that can shoot.

How your offense is run is what matters. 1 of the 2 players you mentioned are shooting the basketball, albeit not efficiently. The other doesnt at all. And no, you aren't finding defense and defensive playmaking at the level of Suggs on an MLE.

The problem isnt even Fultz per se. The problem is that Fultz skillset effectively limits anything that can be set up in a half court situation. In any other scenario Paolo is setting hard screens and looking for the ball downhill or he is creating space for a point guard to shoot the basketball. That means you are either finding a GUARD that can do those things at high efficiency (Mitchell, Booker, etc) or you simply replace Fultz with a POINT GUARD that CAN 100% do those two things point guards are required to do. Starting Fultz next to a high volume catch and shoot guy like Harris or Trent solves neither of those things. It opens the court up by 1 position and leaves the defense on the table.

It's not to say Paolo is exempt from criticism. However, you are asking a second year guy to break down multiple defenders packing the paint because your point guard is unable to put him in better positions on the floor.

[pepe1991]

But how many good shooting guards in nba are bad shooters?

Teams who don't have star SGs usually fill that position with great spot up shooters.

Once PG is off the ball, he acts like SG nowdays anyway. And yes, Fultz creates massive problems ,but it's not like Suggs solves anything. And together, they turn our spacing into 2000s basketball era where teams pack paint with 5 bodies inside 12 feet and wait for brick to land.

[Bensational]

The problem isnt even Fultz per se. The problem is that Fultz skillset effectively limits anything that can be set up in a half court situation. In any other scenario Paolo is setting hard screens and looking for the ball downhill or he is creating space for a point guard to shoot the basketball. That means you are either finding a GUARD that can do those things at high efficiency (Mitchell, Booker, etc) or you simply replace Fultz with a POINT GUARD that CAN 100% do those two things point guards are required to do. Starting Fultz next to a high volume catch and shoot guy like Harris or Trent solves neither of those things. It opens the court up by 1 position and leaves the defense on the table.

It's not to say Paolo is exempt from criticism. However, you are asking a second year guy to break down multiple defenders packing the paint because your point guard is unable to put him in better positions on the floor.

What lead scorer isn’t able to create their own buckets? If Paolo is so heavily reliant on a PG to set him up then he just becomes a role player. Moe Wagner is already that guy.

What people want out of a PG is what we should be expecting from Paolo.

[VFX]

The problem isnt even Fultz per se. The problem is that Fultz skillset effectively limits anything that can be set up in a half court situation. In any other scenario Paolo is setting hard screens and looking for the ball downhill or he is creating space for a point guard to shoot the basketball. That means you are either finding a GUARD that can do those things at high efficiency (Mitchell, Booker, etc) or you simply replace Fultz with a POINT GUARD that CAN 100% do those two things point guards are required to do. Starting Fultz next to a high volume catch and shoot guy like Harris or Trent solves neither of those things. It opens the court up by 1 position and leaves the defense on the table.

It's not to say Paolo is exempt from criticism. However, you are asking a second year guy to break down multiple defenders packing the paint because your point guard is unable to put him in better positions on the floor.

What lead scorer isn’t able to create their own buckets? If Paolo is so heavily reliant on a PG to set him up then he just becomes a role player. Moe Wagner is already that guy.

What people want out of a PG is what we should be expecting from Paolo.

I'm not saying that he cant be a guy that can create his own shot down the road. Orlando is asking him to be the guy in year two with defenses heavily schemed against him due to the ineffectiveness of roster construction.

It's not that he's reliant on a PG that can do those things... It's that his game does not compliment the rest of the roster comparatively to what he's being asked to do on his development curve. That is much different than a guy like Sharpe coming in and jacking up 3's with a wide open court. It requires an actual offense.

[VFX]

But how many good shooting guards in nba are bad shooters?

Teams who don't have star SGs usually fill that position with great spot up shooters.

Once PG is off the ball, he acts like SG nowdays anyway. And yes, Fultz creates massive problems ,but it's not like Suggs solves anything. And together, they turn our spacing into 2000s basketball era where teams pack paint with 5 bodies inside 12 feet and wait for brick to land.

This is irrelevant IMO.

Why? Because not every team needs to be built the same exact way. However, there ARE some things that you need to have if you are not going to have a conventional lineup.

No, you can't have two guards that are both inefficient, one of which doesn't shoot whatsoever OR run action with what is considered your second best option on offense.

The rest of the offense has to be working though, which means Franz, Paolo, and your point guard have to be efficient while the team provides top 5 defense. Jalen Suggs isn't nothing on offense. It's not like we are talking about Thabo Sefalosha or Matisse Thybulle here.

[Bensational]

The problem isnt even Fultz per se. The problem is that Fultz skillset effectively limits anything that can be set up in a half court situation. In any other scenario Paolo is setting hard screens and looking for the ball downhill or he is creating space for a point guard to shoot the basketball. That means you are either finding a GUARD that can do those things at high efficiency (Mitchell, Booker, etc) or you simply replace Fultz with a POINT GUARD that CAN 100% do those two things point guards are required to do. Starting Fultz next to a high volume catch and shoot guy like Harris or Trent solves neither of those things. It opens the court up by 1 position and leaves the defense on the table.

It's not to say Paolo is exempt from criticism. However, you are asking a second year guy to break down multiple defenders packing the paint because your point guard is unable to put him in better positions on the floor.

What lead scorer isn’t able to create their own buckets? If Paolo is so heavily reliant on a PG to set him up then he just becomes a role player. Moe Wagner is already that guy.

What people want out of a PG is what we should be expecting from Paolo.

I'm not saying that he cant be a guy that can create his own shot down the road. Orlando is asking him to be the guy in year two with defenses heavily schemed against him due to the ineffectiveness of roster construction.

It's not that he's reliant on a PG that can do those things... It's that his game does not compliment the rest of the roster comparatively to what he's being asked to do on his development curve. That is much different than a guy like Sharpe coming in and jacking up 3's with a wide open court. It requires an actual offense.

Lead options are going to face defenses that scheme for them. The definition of him being a #1 option means he has to be able to create the offense himself, and adapt when defenses adapt. I mean, who does his game actually compliment and improve?

If you reduce Paolo to a rim rolling big then he becomes a much less significant factor and less of a focal point worth changing the roster for. If these first 4 games have shown anything it’s that Franz is the guy we should be focused on building around, and there are better fits for him than Paolo.

[VFX]

What lead scorer isn’t able to create their own buckets? If Paolo is so heavily reliant on a PG to set him up then he just becomes a role player. Moe Wagner is already that guy.

What people want out of a PG is what we should be expecting from Paolo.

I'm not saying that he cant be a guy that can create his own shot down the road. Orlando is asking him to be the guy in year two with defenses heavily schemed against him due to the ineffectiveness of roster construction.

It's not that he's reliant on a PG that can do those things... It's that his game does not compliment the rest of the roster comparatively to what he's being asked to do on his development curve. That is much different than a guy like Sharpe coming in and jacking up 3's with a wide open court. It requires an actual offense.

Lead options are going to face defenses that scheme for them. The definition of him being a #1 option means he has to be able to create the offense himself, and adapt when defenses adapt. I mean, who does his game actually compliment and improve?

If you reduce Paolo to a rim rolling big then he becomes a much less significant factor and less of a focal point worth changing the roster for. If these first 4 games have shown anything it’s that Franz is the guy we should be focused on building around, and there are better fits for him than Paolo.

The bigger point is that Paolo’s offense is predictable right now and he’s unable to do anything in the paint for the reasons outlined. He needs to develop a shot.

One of his strengths is passing. Is he best utilizing that ability on this roster? Not really. Right now he’s settling on drawing contact inside against multiple defenders, which is fine if you get to the line and hit free throws. He isn’t doing either of those things effectively.

Having a point guard makes these things easier, which is what the FO and Mosley should be doing in year 2 of his development - not more difficult.