Is Kat really gonna be worse to watch than Randle?

[knicks94]

I would seriously trade Randle for Kat Williams.

[nykballa2k4]

Evidently you don't realize the value in having a center who forces the other team's rim protector to have to defend the perimeter.

The Knicks have guys who need to operate in the paint...

Mitch's inability to do anything besides rebound is why a 40 year old Brook can just hang out in the paint have 8 blocks to Mitch's 0, yet Brook was WIDE open on TEN 3pt attempts and hit on 4 of them.

Again, if we are getting KAT, I would be pairing him with Randle.
I don't want to be putting Hart, RJ etc out there at PF. No one wins that way.

From last year and parts of the summer -- I wanted us to get Ayton because having a spread 4(Randle) and a C that can be an offensive threat is the best way to run Thibs offense. If you think back to the successful Bulls teams Noah was effective as a playmaker. This allowed Boozer, Deng, Rose etc to have space to work. Asik had his purpose and arguably better on defense, but Noah being able to be a weapon on both ends was huge.

If all you want is a spread small-ball team, then just put Randle at the 5... He is better defensively than KAT (though KAT is a better shot blocker).

I keep repeating that the Knicks will have to pick up a 3&D PF......

You can't get KAT in a trade without Randle going out.....He's the only centerpiece that makes sense with their roster.

And this isn't NBA 2k....how are you advocating for having 2 guys up front who don't play good defense? Randle doesn't even try..at all...And Chemistry is obviously also a thing.....You really Think Randle is going to be OK with KAT coming in and taking all his shots? Are you serious?

Randle at the 5? All right I'm going to check out of this convo. No offense, but you don't sound like a serious basketball guy.

Husk of PJ Tucker starting at the 4 is where you lost your credibility.

Wolves really like Naz Reid, so they may prefer to have him start at the 4 rather than pay another guy (Randle) to come in. They may be more apt to do something like Robinson to Griz, picks and Adams to the Wolves, and then the ask us for at least one of our wings (RJ, Grimes, IQ). In total sum a workable trade would be 2 protected picks from Mem, NY unprotected '24, 2 of our protected picks, IQ, then Adams and fournier contracts.

Ideally, I want us to be a better version of the Grit and Grind Griz. Randle and Brunson can fill the Conley/Randolph roles. I would argue RJ+Grimes has potential to be better than Allen/Prince. Can KAT at least be Gasol?

[RHODEY]

The idea is to play KAT at Center, make Mitch the backup, and pick up any random PJ Tucker to start at PF.

That's a bad idea.

Why?

When you take Mitch out of the starting lineup you diminish the team's biggest strength - interior defense and offensive rebounding - and make it into a huge weakness (w/Towns) ...all for the sake of stretching the floor. Mitch is our glue....I think he is singlehandedly keeping us out of the Lottery....

And while stretching the floor is a very big need, there are ways to do it without weakening what we do best. My suggestion is to insert a starting swingman of legit size who can really shoot. Someone like this guy...




Sure Bogs would not be a permanent solution due to age, but he's exactly what is needed to balance out this roster while being cheap enough to retain assets for future moves.

If we keep our offensive rebounding intact, just adding one true sniper would pay huge dividends towards making us truly competitive.

Brunson
RJ
Bogs
Julius
Mitch

The above lineup gives us spacing while retaining our Interior D and O rebounding.

[Jose7]

That's a bad idea.

Why?

When take Mitch out of the starting lineup you diminish the team's biggest strength - interior defense and offensive rebounding - and makeit into a huge weakness (w/Towns) ...all for the sake of stretching the floor.

And while stretching the floor is a very big nee, there are ways to do it without trashing what we do best. My suggestion is to insert a starting swingman of legit size who can really shoot. Someone like this guy...




Sure Bogs would not be a permanent solution due to age, but he's exactly what is needed to balance out this roster while being cheap enough to retain assets for future moves.

If we keep our offensive rebounding intact, just adding one true sniper would pay huge dividends towards making us truly competitive.

Brunson
RJ
Bogs
Julius
Mitch

The above lineup gives us spacing while retaining our Interior D and O rebounding.

Nothing competitive when you have a Randle thibs duo.

La la land

[RHODEY]

Why?

When take Mitch out of the starting lineup you diminish the team's biggest strength - interior defense and offensive rebounding - and makeit into a huge weakness (w/Towns) ...all for the sake of stretching the floor.

And while stretching the floor is a very big nee, there are ways to do it without trashing what we do best. My suggestion is to insert a starting swingman of legit size who can really shoot. Someone like this guy...




Sure Bogs would not be a permanent solution due to age, but he's exactly what is needed to balance out this roster while being cheap enough to retain assets for future moves.

If we keep our offensive rebounding intact, just adding one true sniper would pay huge dividends towards making us truly competitive.

Brunson
RJ
Bogs
Julius
Mitch

The above lineup gives us spacing while retaining our Interior D and O rebounding.

Nothing competitive when you have a Randle thibs duo.

La la land

Give Randle space, someone extra to kick the ball out to , and time to get his explosion back , and hell be back to dropping 25 ,10 , and even more assists....playoffs might be another story...

[KnixinSix]

If they will take Randle for Kat, no problem. But once Mitch is gone, we're going to be the worst defensive team in the league.

Kats. Power foward now. I think the goal would to play him with mitch

It does seem like its not working well with Gobert tho so thats concerning

I would be perfectly fine with Ihart starting tbh

They dont need Mitchell Rob bc they have Goebert. I Hart would be more complementary to Goebert.

Minny wants out of that contract. Randle may do better with a change of scenery.

Randle and IHart and 1-2FRP for KAT and Naz Reid

KAT(22),Mitchell (26)
Naz Reid (30), KAT (10), Hart(8)
RJ Barrett (30), Hart(18)
Grimes, IQ, Hart, DD
Brunson, DD

KAT can play the 4 but ideally only in spots.
Rotation/minutes distribution above would allow that.

[Iron Mantis]

Again, if we are getting KAT, I would be pairing him with Randle.
I don't want to be putting Hart, RJ etc out there at PF. No one wins that way.

From last year and parts of the summer -- I wanted us to get Ayton because having a spread 4(Randle) and a C that can be an offensive threat is the best way to run Thibs offense. If you think back to the successful Bulls teams Noah was effective as a playmaker. This allowed Boozer, Deng, Rose etc to have space to work. Asik had his purpose and arguably better on defense, but Noah being able to be a weapon on both ends was huge.

If all you want is a spread small-ball team, then just put Randle at the 5... He is better defensively than KAT (though KAT is a better shot blocker).

I keep repeating that the Knicks will have to pick up a 3&D PF......

You can't get KAT in a trade without Randle going out.....He's the only centerpiece that makes sense with their roster.

And this isn't NBA 2k....how are you advocating for having 2 guys up front who don't play good defense? Randle doesn't even try..at all...And Chemistry is obviously also a thing.....You really Think Randle is going to be OK with KAT coming in and taking all his shots? Are you serious?

Randle at the 5? All right I'm going to check out of this convo. No offense, but you don't sound like a serious basketball guy.

Husk of PJ Tucker starting at the 4 is where you lost your credibility.

Wolves really like Naz Reid, so they may prefer to have him start at the 4 rather than pay another guy (Randle) to come in. They may be more apt to do something like Robinson to Griz, picks and Adams to the Wolves, and then the ask us for at least one of our wings (RJ, Grimes, IQ). In total sum a workable trade would be 2 protected picks from Mem, NY unprotected '24, 2 of our protected picks, IQ, then Adams and fournier contracts.

Ideally, I want us to be a better version of the Grit and Grind Griz. Randle and Brunson can fill the Conley/Randolph roles. I would argue RJ+Grimes has potential to be better than Allen/Prince. Can KAT at least be Gasol?

"Lost credibility?" My goodness you sound stupid. PJ Tucker is playing for the Clippers, I am not suggesting we go after him....

Get a clue...It's the model/type of player we need at the 4. A rugged 3 & D PF....not PJ Tucker himself.


Anyway, NO to everything else you said.

[KnixinSix]

When take Mitch out of the starting lineup you diminish the team's biggest strength - interior defense and offensive rebounding - and makeit into a huge weakness (w/Towns) ...all for the sake of stretching the floor.

And while stretching the floor is a very big nee, there are ways to do it without trashing what we do best. My suggestion is to insert a starting swingman of legit size who can really shoot. Someone like this guy...




Sure Bogs would not be a permanent solution due to age, but he's exactly what is needed to balance out this roster while being cheap enough to retain assets for future moves.

If we keep our offensive rebounding intact, just adding one true sniper would pay huge dividends towards making us truly competitive.

Brunson
RJ
Bogs
Julius
Mitch

The above lineup gives us spacing while retaining our Interior D and O rebounding.

Nothing competitive when you have a Randle thibs duo.

La la land

Give Randle space, someone extra to kick the ball out to , and time to get his explosion back , and hell be back to dropping 25 ,10 , and even more assists....playoffs might be another story...

He missed most of his offseason training due to the rehab. It is obviously affecting him. Still would take KAT and his 40% 3pt shooting for him though.

[Kampuchea]

Without reading all, KAT is better but rather Randle at the contract.

KAT better fit also, bombing threes whole Brunson dominating the midrange. Would rather neither of them though.

[robillionaire]

If they will take Randle for Kat, no problem. But once Mitch is gone, we're going to be the worst defensive team in the league.

Kats. Power foward now. I think the goal would to play him with mitch

It does seem like its not working well with Gobert tho so thats concerning

I would be perfectly fine with Ihart starting tbh

They dont need Mitchell Rob bc they have Goebert. I Hart would be more complementary to Goebert.

Minny wants out of that contract. Randle may do better with a change of scenery.

Randle and IHart and 1-2FRP for KAT and Naz Reid

KAT(22),Mitchell (26)
Naz Reid (30), KAT (10), Hart(8)
RJ Barrett (30), Hart(18)
Grimes, IQ, Hart, DD
Brunson, DD

KAT can play the 4 but ideally only in spots.
Rotation/minutes distribution above would allow that.

minny wouldn’t trade both players they’d just start naz reid at PF themselves. That would probably be their motivation for even trading towns .We would have to get a PF elsewhere. Or maybe start Jericho Sims. That said none of this is happening

[RHODEY]

Nothing competitive when you have a Randle thibs duo.

La la land

Give Randle space, someone extra to kick the ball out to , and time to get his explosion back , and hell be back to dropping 25 ,10 , and even more assists....playoffs might be another story...

He missed most of his offseason training due to the rehab. It is obviously affecting him. Still would take KAT and his 40% 3pt shooting for him though.

Ill take the 40% shooting-- we can get that elsewhere, without weakening our defense and giving up excessive assets.

[Iron Mantis]

That's a bad idea.

Why?

When you take Mitch out of the starting lineup you diminish the team's biggest strength - interior defense and offensive rebounding - and make it into a huge weakness (w/Towns) ...all for the sake of stretching the floor. Mitch is our glue....I think he is singlehandedly keeping us out of the Lottery....

And while stretching the floor is a very big need, there are ways to do it without weakening what we do best. My suggestion is to insert a starting swingman of legit size who can really shoot. Someone like this guy...




Sure Bogs would not be a permanent solution due to age, but he's exactly what is needed to balance out this roster while being cheap enough to retain assets for future moves.

If we keep our offensive rebounding intact, just adding one true sniper would pay huge dividends towards making us truly competitive.

Brunson
RJ
Bogs
Julius
Mitch

The above lineup gives us spacing while retaining our Interior D and O rebounding.

Knicks need balance.

Mitch isn't lost...he comes off the bench to provide valuable minutes...we sacrifice moving down a few spots on defense to move up from being the worst on offense...maybe even surprisingly good.

Interior D and O rebounding is nice when your center can do more than that..ours can do nothing else...zero......Mitch is killing the offense: can't score, and his man is camping in the paint to challenge EVERYTHING. And if Mitch is having lackluster game....he's just a warm body because he can do literally nothing else.

KAT can create his own offense in the paint and draw doubles....so Maybe with KAT-centric offense....Grimes can get better looks and RJ, Brunson can score in the paint much easier without a camping 7-footer challenging them literally every single time...if they leave KAT open on the perimeter to challenge, he can quickly go off from 3........so offensive rebounding and a prayer will not need to be the primary offense. Actual organic scoring and passing can be.

[Iron Mantis]

Again, if we are getting KAT, I would be pairing him with Randle.
I don't want to be putting Hart, RJ etc out there at PF. No one wins that way.

From last year and parts of the summer -- I wanted us to get Ayton because having a spread 4(Randle) and a C that can be an offensive threat is the best way to run Thibs offense. If you think back to the successful Bulls teams Noah was effective as a playmaker. This allowed Boozer, Deng, Rose etc to have space to work. Asik had his purpose and arguably better on defense, but Noah being able to be a weapon on both ends was huge.

If all you want is a spread small-ball team, then just put Randle at the 5... He is better defensively than KAT (though KAT is a better shot blocker).

I keep repeating that the Knicks will have to pick up a 3&D PF......

You can't get KAT in a trade without Randle going out.....He's the only centerpiece that makes sense with their roster.

And this isn't NBA 2k....how are you advocating for having 2 guys up front who don't play good defense? Randle doesn't even try..at all...And Chemistry is obviously also a thing.....You really Think Randle is going to be OK with KAT coming in and taking all his shots? Are you serious?

Randle at the 5? All right I'm going to check out of this convo. No offense, but you don't sound like a serious basketball guy.

Name the championship level 3 and D PF we could realistically get though. We’d have to make at least 2 major trades and we can’t even make 1

Championship level?

Baby steps.....any PF that can hit a 3, rebound, play D: A role player......

It's the front office's job to see if any teams have an underutilized PF or a roster glut they can take advantage of..that's how they found J.Hart and Cam (even though Cam didn't pan out)..

[nykballa2k4]

I keep repeating that the Knicks will have to pick up a 3&D PF......

You can't get KAT in a trade without Randle going out.....He's the only centerpiece that makes sense with their roster.

And this isn't NBA 2k....how are you advocating for having 2 guys up front who don't play good defense? Randle doesn't even try..at all...And Chemistry is obviously also a thing.....You really Think Randle is going to be OK with KAT coming in and taking all his shots? Are you serious?

Randle at the 5? All right I'm going to check out of this convo. No offense, but you don't sound like a serious basketball guy.

Husk of PJ Tucker starting at the 4 is where you lost your credibility.

Wolves really like Naz Reid, so they may prefer to have him start at the 4 rather than pay another guy (Randle) to come in. They may be more apt to do something like Robinson to Griz, picks and Adams to the Wolves, and then the ask us for at least one of our wings (RJ, Grimes, IQ). In total sum a workable trade would be 2 protected picks from Mem, NY unprotected '24, 2 of our protected picks, IQ, then Adams and fournier contracts.

Ideally, I want us to be a better version of the Grit and Grind Griz. Randle and Brunson can fill the Conley/Randolph roles. I would argue RJ+Grimes has potential to be better than Allen/Prince. Can KAT at least be Gasol?

"Lost credibility?" My goodness you sound stupid. PJ Tucker is playing for the Clippers, I am not suggesting we go after him....

Get a clue...It's the model/type of player we need at the 4. A rugged 3 & D PF....not PJ Tucker himself.


Anyway, NO to everything else you said.

The problem you have is that "rugged 3 and D PF" may sound like an easy-to-get piece, but to get a starting quality guy, specifically one who can get rebounds, has good enough hands to make a decent pass etc... basically we land on we could really use Rasheed Wallace in his prime, maybe Shaun Marion.

I don't think either of us are over the moon with KAT OR Randle let alone both, but rather than having to make a series of deals like our roster is a rubix cube, it may just be easier to label some C's who can do 75% of what Mitch can with defense/boards, but who can hit a 3 (not lights out, but just enough to keep defenses honest) and make about 70% of free throws.

Most people don't like my #1 gamble target Ayton, but there are some names to look at. Turner, Embiid, KAT are high end targets. Wendell Carter Jr may be attainable. Naz Reid would be a guy, but I don't think he is available. Ayton and KP of course are other names to round out my target list. Not going to talk about anyone on their rookie contracts because no one good would/should be on a trade block.

All that to say that Ayton, WCJ, KAT are probably attainable and of those, the price/value would be best for Ayton and WCJ

[TheGreenArrow]

The issue with KAT at center is that your defense is going to be really bad. Teams will have a field day with Brunson and KAT. So is it really worth it

Meh people said the same thing about Jokic and he’s holding up at center pretty fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Same thing with Sabonis!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Brunson and Kat would be a legit Dynamic duo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They’d be fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Iron Mantis]

Husk of PJ Tucker starting at the 4 is where you lost your credibility.

Wolves really like Naz Reid, so they may prefer to have him start at the 4 rather than pay another guy (Randle) to come in. They may be more apt to do something like Robinson to Griz, picks and Adams to the Wolves, and then the ask us for at least one of our wings (RJ, Grimes, IQ). In total sum a workable trade would be 2 protected picks from Mem, NY unprotected '24, 2 of our protected picks, IQ, then Adams and fournier contracts.

Ideally, I want us to be a better version of the Grit and Grind Griz. Randle and Brunson can fill the Conley/Randolph roles. I would argue RJ+Grimes has potential to be better than Allen/Prince. Can KAT at least be Gasol?

"Lost credibility?" My goodness you sound stupid. PJ Tucker is playing for the Clippers, I am not suggesting we go after him....

Get a clue...It's the model/type of player we need at the 4. A rugged 3 & D PF....not PJ Tucker himself.


Anyway, NO to everything else you said.

The problem you have is that "rugged 3 and D PF" may sound like an easy-to-get piece, but to get a starting quality guy, specifically one who can get rebounds, has good enough hands to make a decent pass etc... basically we land on we could really use Rasheed Wallace in his prime, maybe Shaun Marion.

I don't think either of us are over the moon with KAT OR Randle let alone both, but rather than having to make a series of deals like our roster is a rubix cube, it may just be easier to label some C's who can do 75% of what Mitch can with defense/boards, but who can hit a 3 (not lights out, but just enough to keep defenses honest) and make about 70% of free throws.

Most people don't like my #1 gamble target Ayton, but there are some names to look at. Turner, Embiid, KAT are high end targets. Wendell Carter Jr may be attainable. Naz Reid would be a guy, but I don't think he is available. Ayton and KP of course are other names to round out my target list. Not going to talk about anyone on their rookie contracts because no one good would/should be on a trade block.

All that to say that Ayton, WCJ, KAT are probably attainable and of those, the price/value would be best for Ayton and WCJ

I wanted Ayton but that ship has sailed.

The most attainable may be KAT.

You just named two star PF's.....Knicks don't need a star PF. The center will be star up front.

Get A serviceable guy similar to Morris...just defend, rebound, hit the open 3, play D. A guy who can hit the 3 at league average....grab 6 or 7 boards and play defense.

This means the PF will probably be averaging only 10 points per game...and that's fine....because the WAY he's scoring those points (open kick out 3's, cuts) is conducive to an offense that's spreading the floor and allowing space for the ball to move and for Brunson, RJ, KAT to create effectively and efficiently in the paint...heck maybe even Grimes will drive more if the paint is open.

[3toheadmelo]

The issue with KAT at center is that your defense is going to be really bad. Teams will have a field day with Brunson and KAT. So is it really worth it

Meh people said the same thing about Jokic and he’s holding up at center pretty fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Same thing with Sabonis!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Brunson and Kat would be a legit Dynamic duo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They’d be fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jokic is one of the best offensive centers of all the time. KAT is not even close to his level.

sabonis has never made it out the 1st round of the playoffs.

Be better green arrow!!!

BE BETTER!!!

[TheGreenArrow]

The issue with KAT at center is that your defense is going to be really bad. Teams will have a field day with Brunson and KAT. So is it really worth it

Meh people said the same thing about Jokic and he’s holding up at center pretty fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Same thing with Sabonis!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Brunson and Kat would be a legit Dynamic duo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They’d be fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jokic is one of the best offensive centers of all the time. KAT is not even close to his level.

sabonis has never made it out the 1st round of the playoffs.

Be better green arrow!!!

BE BETTER!!!

Kat is arguably the greatest shooting big man in nba history!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Surround him a land Brunson with the right complimentary pieces and they’d be just as good if not better than Jokic&Murray!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As long as we get Rid of #30 we’ll be fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Chanel Bomber]

The issue with KAT at center is that your defense is going to be really bad. Teams will have a field day with Brunson and KAT. So is it really worth it

Meh people said the same thing about Jokic and he’s holding up at center pretty fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Same thing with Sabonis!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Brunson and Kat would be a legit Dynamic duo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They’d be fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jokic is one of the best offensive centers of all the time. KAT is not even close to his level.

sabonis has never made it out the 1st round of the playoffs.

Be better green arrow!!!

BE BETTER!!!

Crazy as it may sound, KAT is not even close to Jokic as a defender. Jok can direct a defense, disrupt passing lanes, and defend the post; he's just not a rim protector (which is a flaw).

I've rarely seen a prospect be so disappointing in the NBA in one aspect of the game after being elite in college. Unless it was all WCS, but I thought KAT stood out defensively at UK.

[nykballa2k4]

"Lost credibility?" My goodness you sound stupid. PJ Tucker is playing for the Clippers, I am not suggesting we go after him....

Get a clue...It's the model/type of player we need at the 4. A rugged 3 & D PF....not PJ Tucker himself.


Anyway, NO to everything else you said.

The problem you have is that "rugged 3 and D PF" may sound like an easy-to-get piece, but to get a starting quality guy, specifically one who can get rebounds, has good enough hands to make a decent pass etc... basically we land on we could really use Rasheed Wallace in his prime, maybe Shaun Marion.

I don't think either of us are over the moon with KAT OR Randle let alone both, but rather than having to make a series of deals like our roster is a rubix cube, it may just be easier to label some C's who can do 75% of what Mitch can with defense/boards, but who can hit a 3 (not lights out, but just enough to keep defenses honest) and make about 70% of free throws.

Most people don't like my #1 gamble target Ayton, but there are some names to look at. Turner, Embiid, KAT are high end targets. Wendell Carter Jr may be attainable. Naz Reid would be a guy, but I don't think he is available. Ayton and KP of course are other names to round out my target list. Not going to talk about anyone on their rookie contracts because no one good would/should be on a trade block.

All that to say that Ayton, WCJ, KAT are probably attainable and of those, the price/value would be best for Ayton and WCJ

I wanted Ayton but that ship has sailed.

The most attainable may be KAT.

You just named two star PF's.....Knicks don't need a star PF. The center will be star up front.

Get A serviceable guy similar to Morris...just defend, rebound, hit the open 3, play D. A guy who can hit the 3 at league average....grab 6 or 7 boards and play defense.

This means the PF will probably be averaging only 10 points per game...and that's fine....because the WAY he's scoring those points (open kick out 3's, cuts) is conducive to an offense that's spreading the floor and allowing space for the ball to move and for Brunson, RJ, KAT to create effectively and efficiently in the paint...heck maybe even Grimes will drive more if the paint is open.

What would be an example? Morris is obviously also a husk so who would you be targeting to pair with KAT assuming we dealt Randle, Fournier and 3 of our protected picks.