Joel Embiid has become overhated

[EmpireFalls]

Embiid’s issue is not being healthy by the playoffs much moreso than anything with his game.

[nomansland]

The flopping is annoying but that's the NBA's fault if they let him get away with it. Ducking the Denver game last year was pretty lame though. He used to be pretty funny on social media. So I don't really hate him.

But I like him a lot less because of some Philly fans and the way they acted during the MVP race, and I'm convinced that a good bit of the hate Embiid gets is a direct result of their behavior.

[durden_tyler]

Winning cures everything. So until he wins a title he’ll always be seen as a disappointment, which means more bullets for the haters. Win a championship and shut them up (a bit).

[rzzzzz]

Do you know how many players are injured and playing through it in the POs. Most players don't say a word, others use it as an excuse...then there's "Sad Guy Joel"

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/clippers-center-mason-plumlee-has-sprained-knee-ligament/ar-AA1jyJQL

Is this not the same injury Joel suffered in the first round last year? Did he not try to come back after sitting out only a couple of games? How long do you think Plumlee will be out for?

Of course Joel didn’t look good playing on a bum knee. Just like he didn’t look good playing on a torn meniscus or torn thumb, or orbital fracture (x2). The time he merely had a leg sprain and gastrointestinal flu he was fairly effective against the Raptor team that, 4 bounces later, went on to the title. I would give anything for Joel to get through the playoffs just dinged up a bit, like other players.

[Statlanta]

Nah. He hasn't got the hate Brooks, Lowry, DeRozan, Harden, Westbrook, Gobert Irving, Morant and Williamson have over the years.

[Nate505]

The flopping is annoying but that's the NBA's fault if they let him get away with it.

Eh, I guess, even though that's not how human nature works. Like when I would play Tecmo Bowl as a kid with my friends, one friend would exploit a bug in the game to block my XP and I couldn't do the same, so he'd typically win the game by a few points. It got to the point I didn't want to play anymore because of the advantage he was exploiting.

It's the developers fault in the game that the bug existed, but at the same time it was pretty easy to fault him for using it.

[nomansland]

The flopping is annoying but that's the NBA's fault if they let him get away with it.

Eh, I guess, even though that's not how human nature works. Like when I would play Tecmo Bowl as a kid with my friends, one friend would exploit a bug in the game to block my XP and I couldn't do the same, so he'd typically win the game by a few points. It got to the point I didn't want to play anymore because of the advantage he was exploiting.

It's the developers fault in the game that the bug existed, but at the same time it was pretty easy to fault him for using it.

Yeah but there was a lot less at stake for that annoying kid.

[Pelly24]

To clarify, i did not see him as the MVP last year and his PO showings have been disappointing.
I cannot say with certainty whether he is just not cut out for it or caused by his bad injury history.

However he is an extremely good regular season player, shows tons of passion and has been more loyal than anybody could expect from him. Very few star players would be willing to put up with all those convoluted situations in Philly, many have quit on much better teams. He has done everything you could have asked for. Stayed through tough times, adjusted his game, now is willing to go through another retool.

But at this point it feels like any positive statement I see about him is met with constant critique and belittling. You can be upset about the voters decision but he has not earned that hate, if seen for what he is, he is still a really good player and deserves some more levelheaded takes.
This is a forum, filled with older more informed users, so i would hope people could formulate some more nuanced opinions, rather then falling for the modern hot take rollercoaster of constantly overhyping and devaluing.

I think Embiid deserves to be bashed. little longer after that bs he pulled last year, only to no-show during the playoffs, like always. He's a top 6-10-level player and he does really well in the regular season, but if you want to be in that upper tier the way he wants to be seen, he needs to play better when it matters — and just stop acting like a baby

[Peregrine01]

To clarify, i did not see him as the MVP last year and his PO showings have been disappointing.
I cannot say with certainty whether he is just not cut out for it or caused by his bad injury history.

However he is an extremely good regular season player, shows tons of passion and has been more loyal than anybody could expect from him. Very few star players would be willing to put up with all those convoluted situations in Philly, many have quit on much better teams. He has done everything you could have asked for. Stayed through tough times, adjusted his game, now is willing to go through another retool.

But at this point it feels like any positive statement I see about him is met with constant critique and belittling. You can be upset about the voters decision but he has not earned that hate, if seen for what he is, he is still a really good player and deserves some more levelheaded takes.
This is a forum, filled with older more informed users, so i would hope people could formulate some more nuanced opinions, rather then falling for the modern hot take rollercoaster of constantly overhyping and devaluing.

I think Embiid deserves to be bashed. little longer after that bs he pulled last year, only to no-show during the playoffs, like always. He's a top 6-10-level player and he does really well in the regular season, but if you want to be in that upper tier the way he wants to be seen, he needs to play better when it matters — and just stop acting like a baby

To further this point, Montrez Harrell, his former teammate, said on a recent podcast that Embiid exhausts himself trying to bait refs into blowing the whistle.

[FinnTheHuman]

The flopping is annoying but that's the NBA's fault if they let him get away with it.

Eh, I guess, even though that's not how human nature works. Like when I would play Tecmo Bowl as a kid with my friends, one friend would exploit a bug in the game to block my XP and I couldn't do the same, so he'd typically win the game by a few points. It got to the point I didn't want to play anymore because of the advantage he was exploiting.

It's the developers fault in the game that the bug existed, but at the same time it was pretty easy to fault him for using it.

Nah, we ain't going nowhere with that philosophy. "It's X invaded country's fault they have a bug where they can't defend themselves against the empire's advanced tech" sort of thinking. Sociopathic, results only in death and chaos caused by whoever has the upper hand in the given moment, and it's just cyclical into eternity. People have to expect a moral compass of themselves and the others.

[canada_dry]

Embiid’s issue is not being healthy by the playoffs much moreso than anything with his game.

thats such a convenient cop out.

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[canada_dry]

Do you know how many players are injured and playing through it in the POs. Most players don't say a word, others use it as an excuse...then there's "Sad Guy Joel"

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nba/clippers-center-mason-plumlee-has-sprained-knee-ligament/ar-AA1jyJQL

Is this not the same injury Joel suffered in the first round last year? Did he not try to come back after sitting out only a couple of games? How long do you think Plumlee will be out for?

Of course Joel didn’t look good playing on a bum knee. Just like he didn’t look good playing on a torn meniscus or torn thumb, or orbital fracture (x2). The time he merely had a leg sprain and gastrointestinal flu he was fairly effective against the Raptor team that, 4 bounces later, went on to the title. I would give anything for Joel to get through the playoffs just dinged up a bit, like other players.

He sure can drop 30 points in the first 3 quarters but hes all of a sudden hurt in the 4th for some reason and plays like crap. Very convenient.

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[VanWest82]

It’s such an ugly look on the game when the guy they deemed MVP is the same guy that’s game is predicated on flopping to draw fouls.

Harden also won an MVP playing this way. NBA doesn't seem to care.

I'd say he's properly hated.

So the NBA should ban media members from voting for a high impact player because he flops? Lol

Doesn't even make sense. Bruce Bowen was taking ankles, kicking in the air, elbowing guys, and flopping on defense and he was getting All-Defense.

No. NBA should enforce rules to deter star players from playing in a fashion that harms the product. Every year there's big talk about this kind of stuff but then they let up once the games start and stars go back to finding whatever edge they can, product be damned.

Media doesn't have the luxury to care about this stuff given current state of online engagement. You make one "wrong" pick (i.e. someone not backed up by the "right" stats) and the pitchforks come out. It's not an accident that media all run around checking notes with each other before submitting picks. Groupthink born out of fear of getting pilloried. NBA has to be above that. It's their product.

[nikster]

I am loving watching Embiid's game to start the season. He's mixing up things a lot more on offense while still being an unstoppable scorer. All this DHO action Phili is running has much better integrated Embiid into the team offense, rather than him being this island of scoring binges. A big reason 3 of his teammates are scoring 18ppg or more is that he's better using not just his scoring but also the threat of his scoring to move the defense around and pass. It's the #1 offense in the NBA right now. Embiid is also working hard on defense to start the season.

Yeah I don't enjoy the histrionic flopping, and I'll never forgive some Sixers/Embiid fans for how ugly the MVP "discourse" got last year. I enjoy watching Embiid play, but whenever he's playing against a team that I root for, I instantly hate him as the biggest villain in the NBA lol.

Yeah this offense looks way better than it did last year. Makes me think he will finally perform in the playoffs this season. If he doesn't this year for whatever reason I really have no hope for him tho.

[HotelVitale]

Basketball discourse is so toxic. 90% of you guys don’t even seem like you really enjoy following the NBA. One guy can never be propped up without putting another guy down. Sure, Jokic is better than Embiid and unlike Joel, he has a title now. Why does that have to be brought up when simply appreciating the fact that this 300 pound incredibly skilled big is a joy to watch on the court? Everything Embiid does is just pointless to people because he doesn’t have a ring. It took until last year for so many of you to finally appreciate Joker and pretend like you weren’t trashing him the prior years for winning MVPs without greater playoff success, as if he wasn’t pretty much just as amazing of a player the previous couple years as well. Whether Embiid wins a championship or not, he’ll go down as one of the greatest players ever.

It was bad even before this, but man, guys like Skip Bayless and Stephen A Smith have just done irreparable damage to basketball discussion. Even in more hardcore circles, you can just see the negativity, generalities, obsession with rings, and overreactions seep in.

It's the flopping and flailing while throwing others under the bus that turns people off.

I get it, something doesn't seem right about his personality and he does immature stuff a lot. But again all the stuff you metnienod doesn't happen very much and it's not really the story of Embiid the player. If you watched a couple weeks of him and didn't know anything about him, you likely wouldn't see any serious flopping (or no more than average), his attitude and support of teammates would be a clear positive, he'd complain to the refs but no more than most, and you'd probably notice he falls down but it would be a curiosity rather than something he's doing to cheat or whatever (since it obviously wouldn't benefit him). But as your message shows, people are taking like 4 things that happened over the past 4 years and being like 'that's Joel Embiid, a whiny loser who bashes his teammates, can't do anything if refs aren't rewarding flopping, and flails.' Those things have some basis in reality but they're more like random pieces of the puzzle rather than defninig characteristics of him.

Like I've said a few times, my point here isn't to make Embiid look good--Philly fans know his real flaws and issues and why he's not showing up as well as he should and his talent would dictate, and they're very frustrating. But the flopping, flailing whatever seems like a distraction from the main plot.

[Backcountry]

I don't want to give him the satisfaction of thinking he is overhated. I haven't liked him since the "I'm an airplane" thing he did in the 2019 playoffs against Toronto, and his flopping and whining since then have done nothing to improve my view of him. But hate is a strong term.

I also think it is so ironic that he and Nurse seemingly had such a grudge against each other last season, and now Nurse has them playing extremely well (so far) this season. So yeah, it's just a game.

[EmpireFalls]

Embiid’s issue is not being healthy by the playoffs much moreso than anything with his game.

thats such a convenient cop out.

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Name a playoffs where he’s been fully healthy and failed?

[RB34]

Embiid’s issue is not being healthy by the playoffs much moreso than anything with his game.

thats such a convenient cop out.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

Name a playoffs where he’s been fully healthy and failed?

The majority if not all of series he’s been bounced by the C’s.

[Black Mage]

To clarify, i did not see him as the MVP last year and his PO showings have been disappointing.
I cannot say with certainty whether he is just not cut out for it or caused by his bad injury history.

However he is an extremely good regular season player, shows tons of passion and has been more loyal than anybody could expect from him. Very few star players would be willing to put up with all those convoluted situations in Philly, many have quit on much better teams. He has done everything you could have asked for. Stayed through tough times, adjusted his game, now is willing to go through another retool.

But at this point it feels like any positive statement I see about him is met with constant critique and belittling. You can be upset about the voters decision but he has not earned that hate, if seen for what he is, he is still a really good player and deserves some more levelheaded takes.
This is a forum, filled with older more informed users, so i would hope people could formulate some more nuanced opinions, rather then falling for the modern hot take rollercoaster of constantly overhyping and devaluing.

He strikes me as this generation's KG. Loyal to a fault despite massive dysfunction in the front office and roster construction. Garnett went 7 seasons without going deep into the playoffs too. His personality also rubbed some the wrong way (more so after he went to Celtics).

In 40 plus years of watching NBA basketball, I've never seen a true MVP caliber superstar play with less talent than KG over a relatively long time. Even Lebron in his first stint with the Cleveland Cavs actually had more talent on average than KG.

If I remember correctly....KG's situation probably hard to duplicate since he was paid a large contract before max contracts went into full effect and you combine that with Joe Smith fiasco where the Wolves lost picks to illegal sign a marginal player.

Charles Barkeley was kind of in a no win situation in Philly as well. He was working with some big names early in his career but they were past their primes and then supporting cast got pretty darn bad.

I don't think there really is a this generation KG right now. Doncic may come closest but he despite not playing with truly great talent, he has probably already played with a better player than KG ever did in MN.

Embiid has had a couple of seasons if he played great or was healthy, his team had great chance to make the finals.

MN was so horrible outside of KG and western conference so strong, KG never had that chance even if he was healthy and playing at MVP level.

Embiid had better surrounding talent; but the level to which he has had to deal with bizarre events is unparalleled. His GM uses a burner-phone to trash him (b/c he was the prior GM's pick). Fultz forgets how to shoot before ever playing a minute in a real NBA game. Fultz comes back but still can't shoot and instead uses his shoulder to bash Joel's eye socket in. Simmons becomes and emo-cripple with the yips. Zhaire Smith nearly dies from a food allergy. Simmons quits and refuses to play. Harden quits and refuses to play team ball b/c he didn't get the All-star vote.

That's just about a quarter of the bizarre things that happened to him. Joel absolutely needs to play better in the playoffs; but there are A LOT of things he's had to deal with that no other player in the history of the sport ever has or ever will have to deal with.

[drekwins]

To clarify, i did not see him as the MVP last year and his PO showings have been disappointing.
I cannot say with certainty whether he is just not cut out for it or caused by his bad injury history.

However he is an extremely good regular season player, shows tons of passion and has been more loyal than anybody could expect from him. Very few star players would be willing to put up with all those convoluted situations in Philly, many have quit on much better teams. He has done everything you could have asked for. Stayed through tough times, adjusted his game, now is willing to go through another retool.

But at this point it feels like any positive statement I see about him is met with constant critique and belittling. You can be upset about the voters decision but he has not earned that hate, if seen for what he is, he is still a really good player and deserves some more levelheaded takes.
This is a forum, filled with older more informed users, so i would hope people could formulate some more nuanced opinions, rather then falling for the modern hot take rollercoaster of constantly overhyping and devaluing.

He is very vulnerable in the PnR… which is a fatal flaw in today’s NBA.