Which Versions of Michael Jordan Was More Athletic Than Prime Westbrook?

[IG2]

1984-1989

[Cavsfansince84]

For the most part, I think his Jordan probably had a bit of an edge in first step and a bigger one in deceleration/mobility, but I find brons attributes in this regard far more impressive given the strength difference. I think had it been 10-20 pounds I would lean jordan, but we’re talking about A guy heavier than a center vs a guy lighter than most shooting guards, jordan from what I found was 200 pounds earlier in his career, whereas if you go to 2009 bron weight it’ll generally be 260-270 with the measurement rumored to be 274. He’s closer to weight to rookie Shaq than to jordan lol

09 LeBron is likely 260-265. He maxed out at near 275 in Miami but he wasn't as quick or fast as he was in 09-10 but either way he's obviously way bigger than prime MJ who was about 210-215 in 90-92(he hit the gym more after losing to the Pistons).

[Pelly24]

Just jumping back, MJ is really amazing. Ppl keep comparing other athletes to him, but besides Lebron no one really approaches him all the way. His ability to start/stop and contort his body and feet in obscene angles on the ground and in the air like a 5'9" running back/short point guard at LA fitness was just insane. Those are micro abilities people don't understand when they compare folks like Zach Lavine to MJ. Just a totally different level of coordination and finesse.

[lessthanjake]

How come a thread about Michael Jordan and Russell Westbrook got immediately derailed to talking about LeBron James?

Anyways, I think the answer to this question probably depends on what we define as athleticism. I think MJ was pretty clearly more athletic than prime Westbrook in MJ’s early years, and of course quite obviously less athletic in his Wizards years. So the question is more just which, if any, of the title years MJ was more athletic than prime Westbrook. And I think the call on that probably depends on what falls under the bucket of athleticism. For instance, does Jordan’s huge hands count as part of athleticism? Is height part of athleticism? Is strength factored in, or are we just limiting ourselves to speed and burst? What about body control? I think the more things we count as part of athleticism, the more years Jordan’s athleticism is ahead of peak Westbrook.

[rk2023]

How come a thread about Michael Jordan and Russell Westbrook got immediately derailed to talking about LeBron James?

Anyways, I think the answer to this question probably depends on what we define as athleticism. I think MJ was pretty clearly more athletic than prime Westbrook in MJ’s early years, and of course quite obviously less athletic in his Wizards years. So the question is more just which, if any, of the title years MJ was more athletic than prime Westbrook. And I think the call on that probably depends on what falls under the bucket of athleticism. For instance, does Jordan’s huge hands count as part of athleticism? Is height part of athleticism? Is strength factored in, or are we just limiting ourselves to speed and burst? What about body control? I think the more things we count as part of athleticism, the more years Jordan’s athleticism is ahead of peak Westbrook.

I wouldn't say this thread was derailed by any means. The conversation proceeded into including LBJ with CavsFanSnce84 mentioning MJ (pre baseball retirement) as his pick for the best athlete in NBA History - to which I responded that Bill Russell and LeBron have great cases for this superlative as well. Of course, they're all goat level athletes.

I don't think anybody came into the thread looking to make it a measuring-contest , rather great arguments were brought up.

[Cavsfansince84]

I wouldn't say this thread was derailed by any means. The conversation proceeded into including LBJ with CavsFanSnce84 mentioning MJ (pre baseball retirement) as his pick for the best athlete in NBA History - to which I responded that Bill Russell and LeBron have great cases for this superlative as well. Of course, they're all goat level athletes.

I don't think anybody came into the thread looking to make it a measuring-contest , rather great arguments were brought up.

It was JJ_PR who said that about young MJ. If its just a matter of having the ball at the top of key though and going by a defender for a dunk then WB is up there with anyone. Its everything else where MJ is better than him though Russ is also extremely strong for a guard.

[TheGOATRises007]

Every version up until '93, I'd say easily. I think 95-96 is close. 97-98 might lean towards Westbrook, but Westbrook is just so much more robotic compared to Jordan even past Jordan's apex.

I think Jordan's athleticism declined a good amount once he came back in '95. He was still an incredible athletic specimen, but not uber-generational as he was prior to that.

[MacGill]

Where is RAPM when you need it to measure overall athletic impact across different eras with all instances being equal?

There is no way to accurately measure this but both were 100% genetic freaks! The question I would ask would be: Would Westbrook still be the same tier athlete if his playing days started in the 70's and 80's as we saw? And why, or why not?

Would MJ improve or decline if he was starting in the late 90's into the 00's? And why or why not?

And what are the measurements we are using to define both players athleticism?

I believe Westbrook also had 3 knee surgeries and still kept going which is very impressive. MJ also broke his foot and continued. Warriors, both of them athletically, not to be confused with better player.

[Peregrine01]

Westbrook might be as, if not more, explosive than even young Jordan. But he didn't have the fluidity of movement or coordination and touch that Jordan had, which I think should be included in the definition of athleticism just like jumping high and running fast are. MJ used to be compared to a black cat precisely because of this. So even if Westbrook had more raw horsepower, Jordan converted it better into a useable form.

[Redmoon]

I'd go with MJ till about 91. As a leaper MJ was actually slightly better than Westbrook.
https://streamable.com/xtfwcq
Just floats.

He was still a phenomenal athlete in 92 but he noticeably lost a step in quickness. MJ's first step burned rubber it was so quick. Something MJ has a clear advantage over westbrook imo is his ability to organize his jumps in traffic and awkward angles. When you combine that with his first step it becomes pretty ridiculous. Westbrook seems like he needs more of a runway or open lane to really utilize his leaping ability.

Watch on YouTube

https://streamable.com/9qszjj
This clip showcases some of that. The first step to blow by Robinson and the speed he gets to his max jump height is really note worthy. He basically gets his head level with the backboard without much knee bend. Kinda reminiscent of bill Russell's quick leaping ability.

https://streamable.com/lvfggs
Maybe some others can shed light here but this play seems especially ridiculous to me. Jumps high to catch a lob then immediately explodes back up for a dunk. His second jump ability was off the charts as well. One of the reasons why he was a great offensive rebounder for a guard.

[DSMok1]

I would define athleticism for this exercise as basketball movements governed muscularly, and perhaps more specifically: speed, acceleration, and change in acceleration in all 3 directions.

In general greater weight (and to a lesser extent height) will hinder these, so equal lateral quickness, first step, or leaping at greater size is more impressive.