2023-2024 Regular Season Game 10/In-Season Tournament Game 1: Orlando Magic (5-4) at Brooklyn Nets (5-5) - 7:30pm

[KillMonger]

Don't know what Cole was on tonight... Probably his worst game this season, just careless

Sent from the phone in my hands

[MasterGMer]

Cole will be fine. I do not seriously what went wrong but that wasn't him.

[VFX]

Spencer Dinwiddie had 29 points, 9 assists and made 5 threes tonight.

The Magic don't have a guard on their roster that could put up those numbers in 2 games combined. Maybe not even in 3 games combined.

They need a lead guard in the worst way. Not to take the ball *away* from Paolo and Franz, but to help those get even better by creating easier shots for them and everyone else.

Trying to consistently score points with your 3 and 4 initiating every set is not a recipe for long-term success. And that's especially the case when you don't have knockdown shooters at the 1, 2 or 5 either.

Yeah. The offense can’t be handing the ball to Paolo for a foul or hoping he hit super contested shots inside. Same with Franz… we’ve discussed this before. There has to be someone that can run an offense. Orlando hasn’t seen a guy like that in nearly a decade.

[thelead]

We're really missing WCJ. Last year's version of Fultz would have helped too.

We hear LaVine is available... and I bet Donovan Mitchell isn't far behind... for those that want offense

[davey_wavy]

Spencer Dinwiddie had 29 points, 9 assists and made 5 threes tonight.

The Magic don't have a guard on their roster that could put up those numbers in 2 games combined. Maybe not even in 3 games combined.

They need a lead guard in the worst way. Not to take the ball *away* from Paolo and Franz, but to help those get even better by creating easier shots for them and everyone else.

Trying to consistently score points with your 3 and 4 initiating every set is not a recipe for long-term success. And that's especially the case when you don't have knockdown shooters at the 1, 2 or 5 either.

Yeah. The offense can’t be handing the ball to Paolo for a foul or hoping he hit super contested shots inside. Same with Franz… we’ve discussed this before. There has to be someone that can run an offense. Orlando hasn’t seen a guy like that in nearly a decade.

Anfernee Simons. Pull the trigger

[Bensational]

Hush now. You spent all offseason calling him a PG and using that as justification to get Fultz off the team. He just doesn’t play PG in whatever strange way you seem to think point is played.

Paolo and Franz need to be able to dominate a game between them consistently. Bringing in someone else to take the load off them would mean they’re not franchise player caliber and it’s too early for that distinction.

My desire to have Fultz off the team is completely independent of what Black is or isn't right now as a teenage rookie playing in his 8th career NBA game. I want Fultz gone because what he provides isn't what the Magic (or really any team) needs out of their starting point guard spot.

And the bolded above is literally one of the silliest things you've ever said, and that's saying a lot.

Paolo Banchero and Franz Wagner are fantastic young players each with ceilings a mile high... but neither one of them are point guards and neither one of them are ever going to be point guards.

Both of them would benefit tremendously from having a guard in the backcourt who can actually create offense for others and himself.

Suggs isn't that guy. He provides a ton of value defensively and from a hustle/energy/effort perspective, but he's not a point guard.

Cole isn't that guy. He can create offense for himself in a bench capacity, but he can't create for others.

Black right now isn't that guy. Maybe he can develop into it down the road, but right now he's providing value in more ways like Suggs than a point guard.

The mere suggestion that bringing someone else in to take on playmaking responsibilities would be some sort of referendum on Paolo/Franz's ceilings is pure nonsense. It really is.

This reads like someone who hasn’t been watching the games this season.

A) we have a PG who can create offense for himself and others in Fultz.

B) Paolo doesn’t play well off him. He didn’t play well off Haliburton in FIBA either. He’s a point forward who operates best creating from the perimeter.

C) you whined all summer about the notion Black might be better used as a SF while he develops and you completely rejected the suggestion - but now you want to use that as justification to get another PG?

Do you want development or do you want to win now? I wish you’d just pick a lane.

[D12VCMagic]

Jordan Hawkins had 25 points on five threes tonight. At some point we gotta start wondering if the FO dropped the ball by taking Jett.

[SOUL]

DeRozan out tomorrow

[MasterGMer]

Fultz can help tonight's game. With our bad shooting 3s other than Paolo, Franz and Ingles. Fultz can be a great playmaker on the floor to create for our guards. Tonight's game especially on the offensive end proves one thing we have been talking about - We need a dominate scoring guard who can create for himself and others. That will help Franz and Paolo's game a lot by creating space to operate.

[VFX]

Hush now. You spent all offseason calling him a PG and using that as justification to get Fultz off the team. He just doesn’t play PG in whatever strange way you seem to think point is played.

Paolo and Franz need to be able to dominate a game between them consistently. Bringing in someone else to take the load off them would mean they’re not franchise player caliber and it’s too early for that distinction.

My desire to have Fultz off the team is completely independent of what Black is or isn't right now as a teenage rookie playing in his 8th career NBA game. I want Fultz gone because what he provides isn't what the Magic (or really any team) needs out of their starting point guard spot.

And the bolded above is literally one of the silliest things you've ever said, and that's saying a lot.

Paolo Banchero and Franz Wagner are fantastic young players each with ceilings a mile high... but neither one of them are point guards and neither one of them are ever going to be point guards.

Both of them would benefit tremendously from having a guard in the backcourt who can actually create offense for others and himself.

Suggs isn't that guy. He provides a ton of value defensively and from a hustle/energy/effort perspective, but he's not a point guard.

Cole isn't that guy. He can create offense for himself in a bench capacity, but he can't create for others.

Black right now isn't that guy. Maybe he can develop into it down the road, but right now he's providing value in more ways like Suggs than a point guard.

The mere suggestion that bringing someone else in to take on playmaking responsibilities would be some sort of referendum on Paolo/Franz's ceilings is pure nonsense. It really is.

This reads like someone who hasn’t been watching the games this season.

A) we have a PG who can create offense for himself and others in Fultz.

B) Paolo doesn’t play well off him. He didn’t play well off Haliburton in FIBA either. He’s a point forward who operates best creating from the perimeter.

C) you whined all summer about the notion Black might be better used as a SF while he develops and you completely rejected the suggestion - but now you want to use that as justification to get another PG?

Do you want development or do you want to win now? I wish you’d just pick a lane.

It doesn’t matter what anyone wants. It matters who is available to utilize. Fultz doesn’t create for others. That’s laughable.

The priority should be development. The core is in year 2 and 3 respectively. They should be acquiring players that ease them into good decisions and running efficient offense instead of struggling for lack of a real point guard currently.

You aren’t going to throw Black in at PG and just hope he can figure things out at lightspeed while expecting wins every night. Therefore, they need a vet PG that has an actual track record and not one that is injured and fighting them for minutes while they are terrible with your #1 pick.

[Redwood]

Bottom line this team doesn't know how to play with a lead

Sent from the phone in my hands

Can't play with a lead.

Playing poorly in the second half of games.

What do these two things hint at? Poor coaching. Coaches make adjustments at halftime and when their team is losing. Mosley is getting outcoached, simple as that. Other teams are making adjustments and he's not responding to them. This in addition to the fact that this roster is assembled terribly and has basically no veteran leadership (nobody that has any kind of playoff or championship pedigree at least), and the poor performance isn't a surprise. Young players are inconsistent, when they're having an off night we don't really have any kind of stabilizing presence to offset it. If both Cole and Suggs shoot poorly on the same night we're going to lose nearly all of those games, and that's going to happen a lot. This roster is basically a Mr. Potatohead fully assembled by a drunk four year old.

You just blamed coaching and then just said our team is young and the roster is poorly constructed, those opinions don't really jive with each other.

Also it's a whirlwind to hear how good he's doing from our posters one game (as well as other coaches and analysts), then our team full of non-shooters misses shots, we lose, and suddenly our coach doesn't know how to will our players to make shots they should be making.

What? Is there some kind of rule I'm unaware of that only one of those things can be true at a given time? I listed all of those things because all of them are true. Mosley helped shape the roster, if it's not adequate (it's not) and it has the wrong combination of players (it does), he's partially to blame for that. He, and the front office, felt a roster full of young players was the way to go...ignoring all of the situations (protecting a lead, performing well in high pressure situations, etc.) where that composition isn't ideal. Mosley doesn't get let off the hook because of having mostly young, inexperienced, inconsistent players, when that's exactly what he wanted. I think he, and some on here, are learning that mistakes were made, and that it's going to be a struggle to consistently win with what has been assembled here. I think even Mosley is learning that.

[3ddman23]

DeRozan out tomorrow

Some how some way another random player will step up for them and kill us

[eyriq]

Spencer Dinwiddie had 29 points, 9 assists and made 5 threes tonight.

The Magic don't have a guard on their roster that could put up those numbers in 2 games combined. Maybe not even in 3 games combined.

They need a lead guard in the worst way. Not to take the ball *away* from Paolo and Franz, but to help those get even better by creating easier shots for them and everyone else.

Trying to consistently score points with your 3 and 4 initiating every set is not a recipe for long-term success. And that's especially the case when you don't have knockdown shooters at the 1, 2 or 5 either.

Black is a stud rookie PG that is the perfect fit around Paolo and Franz. We should play him at PG and develop him. Getting a ball dominant PG is not a good move for current or future performance. It would reduce the offensive load on Paolo and Franz, which would be bad for winning and slow their development, and reduce Black's minutes, which would slow his development.

You just have to accept our offense is going to be garbage and enjoy the ride.

[VFX]

DeRozan out tomorrow

Some how some way another random player will step up for them and kill us

Nah this game will mean nothing as a win.

Chicago is demoralized and selling. How hard would you play if you knew your team was getting blown up in a weeks time? Almost pointless to even watch.

[MasterGMer]

DeRozan out tomorrow

Some how some way another random player will step up for them and kill us

Nah this game will mean nothing as a win.

Chicago is demoralized and selling. How hard would you play if you knew your team was getting blown up in a weeks time? Almost pointless to even watch.

Are you serious Mr. MagicMatic? That is the absolute recipe for a loss, period. Watch the game, bud! No win is a given!

[thelead]

Jordan Hawkins had 25 points on five threes tonight. At some point we gotta start wondering if the FO dropped the ball by taking Jett.

Hawkins is getting major minutes and is getting to jack up a ton of shots. He has also had 2-13 from 3 nights. Yes, you read that right. A rookie, on a team with 3 legit scorers, got to take THIRTEEN 3's in one game. He's averaging close to NINE 3PTA per game. We can have a conversation about Jett once he starts getting real minutes.

[Optimus_Steel]

Jordan Hawkins had 25 points on five threes tonight. At some point we gotta start wondering if the FO dropped the ball by taking Jett.

Hawkins is getting major minutes and is getting to jack up a ton of shots. He has also had 2-13 from 3 nights. Yes, you read that right. A rookie, on a team with 3 legit scorers, got to take THIRTEEN 3's in one game. He's averaging close to NINE 3PTA per game. We can have a conversation about Jett once he starts getting real minutes.

Shouldn't people wait until the season is over?

Sent from my Pixel 7 using RealGM mobile app

[Knightro]

This reads like someone who hasn’t been watching the games this season.

A) we have a PG who can create offense for himself and others in Fultz.

B) Paolo doesn’t play well off him. He didn’t play well off Haliburton in FIBA either. He’s a point forward who operates best creating from the perimeter.

C) you whined all summer about the notion Black might be better used as a SF while he develops and you completely rejected the suggestion - but now you want to use that as justification to get another PG?

Do you want development or do you want to win now? I wish you’d just pick a lane.

A. Fultz has never been good at creating offense for other people, particularly in the halfcourt. He's been good enough at shot creation for others in transition, but obviously that's always going to be a much smaller fraction of the game compared to halfcourt offense. And regardless of whether it's injury related or not, Fultz has been decidedly worse this season in basically every element of the game. His ability to create offense for himself has cratered and others has declined dramatically.

B. Paolo doesn't play well off of Fultz primarily for two reasons. 1. Because Fultz isn't good at getting Paolo (or anyone else) the ball in advantageous spots in the halfcourt. 2. Fultz is also incapable of creating space for Paolo's drive game, or punishing defenses when Paolo drives and kicks. Fultz is a double whammy of bad when it comes to pairing with Paolo. They don't compliment each other in any way.

I also think it's very silly to even cite *anything* - good or bad - when it comes to FIBA considering the rules are different, the teammates are all different, and most important - Paolo was playing a role for Team USA that's so dramatically different than what he'll ever play for the Magic.

C. If you go back and look, you'll see that I've quite literally used the phrase "I wish they'd pick a lane" about 50 times in the days, weeks and months leading up to the season and even into the season. I don't care which lane they pick, but they're trying to do both and inevitably it's going to end up with them barely making or outright missing the play in, but not having a clue whether or not Black and Howard can even be heavy minute guys on a team with real expectations next season.

If the Magic want to actually try and win games, then make some trades and get some better talent in here.

If the Magic aren't concerned with winning games and want to maximize development, then stick Black and Jett and Houstan in the rotation. Put Black on the ball every play and force him to initiate pick and rolls and live with the inevitable mistakes and consequences. It'

[OrlChamps2030]

I think Jett will be fine but man, I knew Hawkins shot was pure and there was an easy role for him in the NBA. Had some size concerns though defensively.

Looks like Hawkins went for 25 tonight too

[Knightro]

Black is a stud rookie PG that is the perfect fit around Paolo and Franz. We should play him at PG and develop him. Getting a ball dominant PG is not a good move for current or future performance. It would reduce the offensive load on Paolo and Franz, which would be bad for winning and slow their development, and reduce Black's minutes, which would slow his development.

You just have to accept our offense is going to be garbage and enjoy the ride.

I know that you like Anthony Black a lot, but this is just not accurate in any respect really.

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills hearing multiple people suggest with a straight face that bringing in an actual skilled point guard to take command of the offense in the halfcourt is going to somehow *HURT* Paolo and Franz and not help them tremendously by getting the half court offense more organized and helping them get the ball in more advantageous spots.