NBA MVP Discussion Thread 2023-24

[eyeatoma]

People really still believe Jokic is a negative defensively?

Go to the DPOY board. Do you ever see Jokic even mentioned?

Who is on the poll right now?

I'd say at best Jokic is even on defense. He has good positioning, great rebounding, and is handsy. But you don't plan a defensive scheme with Jokic's strengths, he's not a hub on defense. Jokic does excel with Bball IQ, so he does bring a lot of intagibles there on the defensive end. Knowing plays, and positiong is very important, and that can't be calculated statistically.

[eyeatoma]

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[CobraCommander]

KD quietly scoring 30 and shooting 50% from 3- I’m not saying he is the MVP...but he gonna have something to say about it if Phoenix wins a lot of games and he keeps this up

[LordCovington33]

Jokic getting blown out for over 20 points needs to count for something in dinging him. Especially when Embiid has been putting up these numbers with atleast 4-5 games where he hasn't played the entire 4th quarter.

Both players have played roughly the same number of minutes per game - 34.1(embiid) and 34.3 (Jokic).
A bit disappointed about Embiid sitting out one assist shy of a triple double.

[Chokic]

Early prediction but Embiid will win his back to back mvp. He's looking incredible.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

KD quietly scoring 30 and shooting 50% from 3- I’m not saying he is the MVP...but he gonna have something to say about it if Phoenix wins a lot of games and he keeps this up

I agree but got to assume playing him 37mpg is going cause him to get his annual 2 month injury.

[bigboi]

But does Dame cancel out some potential votes for Giannis? Having a superstar teammate sometimes has that effect.

Ehh. Nuggets are pretty stacked so I don’t see how. Barring a slowdown, Jokic runs away with this. I don’t think anyone can deny him rn. Dude is playing at a historic pace like it’s rookie mode on 2k. It doesn’t make sense how a dude so unathletic is so good but it just is. And it’s not even like Luka where he’s a sneaky athlete, Jokic legit is one of the worst athletes in the league.

He has possibly the best hands ever, quick feet and moves very well for a 7foot 270 guy, hand eye etc.

Far from the worst athlete. I actually think Towns/Davis are worse fundamentally. They can’t hold any extra weight and can be very sloppy with how they move. He was running circles on Val because his foot movement is so crisp. A ton of Forefoot/Midfoot in close

Lmao. I’m not taking what you say seriously if you think Towns and Davis are worse athletes than Jokic. Especially AD. That’s extremely silly.

[FrodoBaggins]

I've picked Joel Embiid to go back-to-back. He's an awesome player. Nikola's defense was exposed tonight. Just ugly stuff.

[dygaction]

People really still believe Jokic is a negative defensively?

Go to the DPOY board. Do you ever see Jokic even mentioned?

Who is on the poll right now?

I'd say at best Jokic is even on defense. He has good positioning, great rebounding, and is handsy. But you don't plan a defensive scheme with Jokic's strengths, he's not a hub on defense. Jokic does excel with Bball IQ, so he does bring a lot of intagibles there on the defensive end. Knowing plays, and positiong is very important, and that can't be calculated statistically.

You seem to have a hard time comprehending there are rooms in between DPOY and negative defensively.

[Special_Puppy]

I’ve never heard of Dunks and Threes

Epm is supposed to be one of the best advanced stats out there, came out a few seasons ago.

Also does a better job measuring defensive impact. You can see Jokic is a negative over there, while Embiid is +1.2.

Sent from my SM-S918B using Tapatalk

I hold EPM in very high regard, but its also the advanced stat with the most negative view of Jokic's defense. A weighted average of various advanced stats has Jokic at +2.1 on Defense. Embiid is at +2.3. Note that this doesn't include data from the 2024 season as I am waiting 30 games until I update it

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1p7OdQxN74sBrzkIf0nwt8ftlORXZ7Jz3/edit?usp=drive_link

[CobraCommander]

Nobody on Sacramento is in the running for MVP but sac town seems to like to light the beam on the heads of MVP contenders- tonight they put it on Luka and Kyrie - all gas no breaks

[Special_Puppy]

So far Jokic+Embiid+SGA are the three clear-cut candidates.

[eyeatoma]

People really still believe Jokic is a negative defensively?

Go to the DPOY board. Do you ever see Jokic even mentioned?

Who is on the poll right now?

I'd say at best Jokic is even on defense. He has good positioning, great rebounding, and is handsy. But you don't plan a defensive scheme with Jokic's strengths, he's not a hub on defense. Jokic does excel with Bball IQ, so he does bring a lot of intagibles there on the defensive end. Knowing plays, and positiong is very important, and that can't be calculated statistically.

You seem to have a hard time comprehending there are rooms in between DPOY and negative defensively.

Tell that to the people who think that Jokic is on Embiid's level defensively on this thread. Go back a few pages and you'll see what I'm talking about. The chasm of Embiid's defense is as wide as the chasm of Jokic's passing.

[Ambrose]

People really still believe Jokic is a negative defensively?

Go to the DPOY board. Do you ever see Jokic even mentioned?

Who is on the poll right now?

I'd say at best Jokic is even on defense. He has good positioning, great rebounding, and is handsy. But you don't plan a defensive scheme with Jokic's strengths, he's not a hub on defense. Jokic does excel with Bball IQ, so he does bring a lot of intagibles there on the defensive end. Knowing plays, and positiong is very important, and that can't be calculated statistically.

What does being a DPOY candidate have to do with being a liability defensively? Who said he was a defensive hub?

Jokic is a clear positive on defense for anyone with eyes to see. You highlighted a number of reasons why. That doesn't mean he's incredible or one of the best in the league.

You quoted me. Don't move the goalposts.

[mdonnelly1989]

Nobody on Sacramento is in the running for MVP but sac town seems to like to light the beam on the heads of MVP contenders- tonight they put it on Luka and Kyrie - all gas no breaks

I came here to say that it's a Shame D.Fox who was my pre season pick to win MVP wasn't even an Option or H/M.

I just watched a video saying that in his 5 games out. Sacrament was the worst offense in the league. And with him in they are the best.

They went 1-5 with him gone and 6-1 with him on .

That on/off has to be insane.

D.Fox if he stays healthy will have absolutely something to say about MVP

[_NoMas]

Guys like Fox Halliburton and SGA deserve a mention, and Luka, KD and Tatum will all be around the convo… but it’s going to be Jokic, Embiid and Giannis as the top 3 again - Embiid is probably just edging it right now and I think a decent bet to go back to back

[SeanieWard]

I think Jokic will be the most deserving for MVP but I think they will still get tired of voting for him. I think Jokic, Luka, Embiid, Shai, and Tatum will be the top 5 guys in the MVP race this year but I think Luka ends up getting it

[Rainwater]

Delete

[eyeatoma]

People really still believe Jokic is a negative defensively?

Go to the DPOY board. Do you ever see Jokic even mentioned?

Who is on the poll right now?

I'd say at best Jokic is even on defense. He has good positioning, great rebounding, and is handsy. But you don't plan a defensive scheme with Jokic's strengths, he's not a hub on defense. Jokic does excel with Bball IQ, so he does bring a lot of intagibles there on the defensive end. Knowing plays, and positiong is very important, and that can't be calculated statistically.

What does being a DPOY candidate have to do with being a liability defensively? Who said he was a defensive hub?

Jokic is a clear positive on defense for anyone with eyes to see. You highlighted a number of reasons why. That doesn't mean he's incredible or one of the best in the league.

You quoted me. Don't move the goalposts.

Tell me the positives he showed on the floor on the defensive end today? He was awful. Those type of games are more frequent than most players.

[Lakers In 5]

People really still believe Jokic is a negative defensively?

Go to the DPOY board. Do you ever see Jokic even mentioned?

Who is on the poll right now?

I'd say at best Jokic is even on defense. He has good positioning, great rebounding, and is handsy. But you don't plan a defensive scheme with Jokic's strengths, he's not a hub on defense. Jokic does excel with Bball IQ, so he does bring a lot of intagibles there on the defensive end. Knowing plays, and positiong is very important, and that can't be calculated statistically.

Jokic isn't mentioned as Defensive Player of the Year = bad defender.

You have no shame, absolutely pathetic.