Official Scottie Barnes Thread - Part 6

[MikeM]

He's our best shooter

[Purple+Black]

He's been taking a backseat for the past half dozen games, he needs to get back to being the alpha

Agreed

[720]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuff is because Darko likes his guard to be the person that runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

[Yeezus_]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

I don't think it's all that though. If they didn't have Dennis, that team would have zero effective pick and roll players in the starting lineup. Even the best players have other ball handling PnR players on the court with them

[720]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

I don't think it's all that though. If they didn't have Dennis, that team would have zero effective pick and roll players in the starting lineup. Even the best players have other ball handling PnR players on the court with them

Barnes and Jakob have really good pnr chemistry though. Maybe as the coaching staff sees it more and more they’ll be more willing to have that be the primary action.

[brownbobcat]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

It all really depends on what "point guard stuff" means. It's been evident for a while now that Scottie has excellent vision, instincts and a high bball IQ. He excels when the pace is frenetic, which is a problem as the initiator in the half court because his technical ability isn't quite there yet and his first step is average. The key is getting the ball to him in motion or having the motion work around him.

[720]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

It all really depends on what "point guard stuff" means. It's been evident for a while now that Scottie has excellent vision, instincts and a high bball IQ. He excels when the pace is frenetic, which is a problem as the initiator in the half court because his technical ability isn't quite there yet and his first step is average. The key is getting the ball to him in motion or having the motion work around him.

That’s my verbiage I should have been more specific. Set actions, pnr’s, freelancing in the half court after the other team sets up on defence after transition. Right now it’s very Schroeder heavy and he said these things are by design because Darko prefers a guard to do all this. He said if the Raptors were really serious about point guard Scottie they would have Dennis come off the bench and Gary start to compliment Scottie where he would have more on ball responsibility. I agree with this btw.

It’s probably the main reason why Scottie is the first guy that goes to the bench and has that all bench lineup they ask him to carry. So he gets some practice with them. They’re not ready to give him the keys with the starters just yet it seems. I don’t really care about the not having guard like quick first step thing, he just has to get more comfortable handling the ball in tight corners and he will be money imo.

[tdotrep2]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

It all really depends on what "point guard stuff" means. It's been evident for a while now that Scottie has excellent vision, instincts and a high bball IQ. He excels when the pace is frenetic, which is a problem as the initiator in the half court because his technical ability isn't quite there yet and his first step is average. The key is getting the ball to him in motion or having the motion work around him.

That’s my verbiage I should have been more specific. Set actions, pnr’s, freelancing in the half court after the other team sets up on defence after transition. Right now it’s very Schroeder heavy and he said these things are by design because Darko prefers a guard to do all this. He said if the Raptors were really serious about point guard Scottie they would have Dennis come off the bench and Gary start to compliment Scottie where he would have more on ball responsibility. I agree with this btw.

It’s probably the main reason why Scottie is the first guy that goes to the bench and has that all bench lineup they ask him to carry. So he gets some practice with them. They’re not ready to give him the keys with the starters just yet it seems.

the funny thing is, scottie with the ball would work better with the starters and dennis with the bench.

[brownbobcat]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

It all really depends on what "point guard stuff" means. It's been evident for a while now that Scottie has excellent vision, instincts and a high bball IQ. He excels when the pace is frenetic, which is a problem as the initiator in the half court because his technical ability isn't quite there yet and his first step is average. The key is getting the ball to him in motion or having the motion work around him.

That’s my verbiage I should have been more specific. Set actions, pnr’s, freelancing in the half court after the other team sets up on defence after transition. Right now it’s very Schroeder heavy and he said these things are by design because Darko prefers a guard to do all this. He said if the Raptors were really serious about point guard Scottie they would have Dennis come off the bench and Gary start to compliment Scottie where he would have more on ball responsibility. I agree with this btw.

It’s probably the main reason why Scottie is the first guy that goes to the bench and has that all bench lineup they ask him to carry. So he gets some practice with them. They’re not ready to give him the keys with the starters just yet it seems. I don’t really care about the not having guard like quick first step thing, he just has to get more comfortable handling the ball in tight corners and he will be money imo.

I agree with the philosophy. Trying to be everything all at once is often a recipe for failure. It needs to be a mix between trying to improve a skillset and doing what you're good at.

[MoMan24]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

I don't think it's all that though. If they didn't have Dennis, that team would have zero effective pick and roll players in the starting lineup. Even the best players have other ball handling PnR players on the court with them

Barnes and Jakob have really good pnr chemistry though. Maybe as the coaching staff sees it more and more they’ll be more willing to have that be the primary action.

Dennis isn't even good in the PnR so that's not a good excuse. Anthony Davis complained about this issue his first year with Dennis that he wasn't getting the ball where he needed it and wasn't getting any lobs after Rondo left. If you can't properly run a PnR with AD, you definitely can't with Yak. Dennis is not a point guard, he is just short and quick so he resembles one. Same thing with Flynn. Barnes is our best PnR player. What he did in the 4th quarter with Yak vs the Bucks last week Dennis could never dream of doing.

[Yeezus_]

I don't think it's all that though. If they didn't have Dennis, that team would have zero effective pick and roll players in the starting lineup. Even the best players have other ball handling PnR players on the court with them

Barnes and Jakob have really good pnr chemistry though. Maybe as the coaching staff sees it more and more they’ll be more willing to have that be the primary action.

Dennis isn't even good in the PnR so that's not a good excuse. Anthony Davis complained about this issue his first year with Dennis that he wasn't getting the ball where he needed it and wasn't getting any lobs after Rondo left. If you can't properly run a PnR with AD, you definitely can't with Yak. Dennis is not a point guard, he is just short and quick so he resembles one. Same thing with Flynn. Barnes is our best PnR player. What he did in the 4th quarter with Yak vs the Bucks last week Dennis could never dream of doing.

Dennis is a much different player than he was in that first season with AD.

[Yeezus_]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

I don't think it's all that though. If they didn't have Dennis, that team would have zero effective pick and roll players in the starting lineup. Even the best players have other ball handling PnR players on the court with them

Barnes and Jakob have really good pnr chemistry though. Maybe as the coaching staff sees it more and more they’ll be more willing to have that be the primary action.

They definitely will I think. Scotties PPP on Pick and Rolls as the ball handler is higher than I thought. I think as the season goes on, they'll probably shift more responsibility to him. I'd assume at least. Scottie is also super effective as the screener, so I still see the value in having our only other solid PnR player playing with him, especially since the team prefers to stagger Siakam/Barnes.

[HumbleRen]

I think Darko like Nurse thinks running Scottie at point takes away from what he does best which is being a playmaking slasher against tilted defences.

Operating at the top of the key really does take away from that. Also he's improved his drives, he was at 6.4 last year and is now at 9.4. That's great but it's still not enough to be a lead ball handler of a team. It needs to be atleast 12 drives per game. I think he can get there but he needs more improvement with his handles.

Me personally ? I'd run Scottie at point anyways and live with the results, it's not like our halfcourt offence can't get any worse lol.

[MoMan24]

Barnes and Jakob have really good pnr chemistry though. Maybe as the coaching staff sees it more and more they’ll be more willing to have that be the primary action.

Dennis isn't even good in the PnR so that's not a good excuse. Anthony Davis complained about this issue his first year with Dennis that he wasn't getting the ball where he needed it and wasn't getting any lobs after Rondo left. If you can't properly run a PnR with AD, you definitely can't with Yak. Dennis is not a point guard, he is just short and quick so he resembles one. Same thing with Flynn. Barnes is our best PnR player. What he did in the 4th quarter with Yak vs the Bucks last week Dennis could never dream of doing.

Dennis is a much different player than he was in that first season with AD.

There is a reason Dennis has switched teams 5 years straight and been mostly a bench player. He is not that good. Now on this team I guess he's pretty good but his vision and fell for the game are pretty poor. He consistently over dribbles, misses passes, and calls his own number too often. For a guy who is fast he often plays slow and walks the ball up. It really does sicken me that a guy like Dennis is taking a lot Scottie's on ball reps away especially as a PnR ballhandler. One cause Dennis won't be here in 2 years and we suck now anyways and secondly Scottie is better than him right now. Dennis should be in the background not upfront. Can't stand a mediocre player betting on himself with us.

[ATLTimekeeper]

It can get worse if teams just sit on his drive and bait him into shooting. This is the crux of what Darko was saying about a "guy that thinks he's great at 4 things." He wants Scottie driving to the basket, and I agree with you that it's better against a shifting defense than against a set one. When he gets better at beating his guy off the dribble and keeping his dribble alive when he's cut off, then he'll take more lead reps. No one's really going to respect his shot until he puts a lot of games together hitting those shots. They'll wait for the regression.

The Raptors shoot like 9% better from 2 off passes from Dennis than they do from Scottie, and Dennis has more volume. He's the PG of the team.

[PushDaRock]

if scottie develops that jimmy butler type of savvy game where he can draw fouls instead of taking a tough shot - then he becomes a star.

Yeah, I think the next leap to be made is in drawing fouls. Right now, he's always trying to finish everything in traffic. He gets that FTA number to 8 a game and he's going to easily be a 25 ppg player.

[sidsid]

I don't think it's all that though. If they didn't have Dennis, that team would have zero effective pick and roll players in the starting lineup. Even the best players have other ball handling PnR players on the court with them

Barnes and Jakob have really good pnr chemistry though. Maybe as the coaching staff sees it more and more they’ll be more willing to have that be the primary action.

Dennis isn't even good in the PnR so that's not a good excuse. Anthony Davis complained about this issue his first year with Dennis that he wasn't getting the ball where he needed it and wasn't getting any lobs after Rondo left. If you can't properly run a PnR with AD, you definitely can't with Yak. Dennis is not a point guard, he is just short and quick so he resembles one. Same thing with Flynn. Barnes is our best PnR player. What he did in the 4th quarter with Yak vs the Bucks last week Dennis could never dream of doing.

The piece from the Samson interview that relates here is that the pgs get us into sets faster. Not necessarily a skillset advantage, just greasing the wheels of the offense at the proper pace.

I don't really care that much about it, because I'd rather see Scottie setup in the hub more which is more of a Jak problem than Dennis. That being said, this is also a point for Flynn to start. We need more Barnes and less Dennis in general. Flynn solves that problem with the starters if we're hellbent on a PG starting, even for a short stint.

[Madhouse]

Being more aggressive and drawing more fouls will probably be the topic for the entire season.

But what he is accomplishing on the defensive end is pretty amazing. I'm not sure who the last player was who improved this much on defense.

[Tha Cynic]

Samson Folk was talking about this today. He thinks a big reason why there has been less Scottie point guard stuffs is because Darko likes his guard to be the person the runs action and sets up the plays. He said if they actually wanted Scottie to be the primary ball guy they would have Gary start instead of Schroeder and have Barnes start all the actions.

I don't think it's all that though. If they didn't have Dennis, that team would have zero effective pick and roll players in the starting lineup. Even the best players have other ball handling PnR players on the court with them

In the 4th or in close games, Barnes should be bringing the ball and setting the team up every play. In the first half when he's playing with Flynn, Flynn should be bringing it up and setting up Barnes to make a play.

There had to be big stretches in every game where Barnes gets the ball 5-6 possessions in a row where he's keeping it and making plays.

You can have your PG do his thing and have your best player handle the ball. There should never be games where he's standing multiple possessions in a corner. That's what Darko has to figure out how to stop.

[ArthurVandelay]

The 3 looks legit.

When he catches in Rhythm off ball movement it is smoooth.