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PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win

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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#101 » by tedbrogen » Tue Nov 21, 2023 2:30 pm

German Athens wrote:So far this year, I’ve really liked Giannis’s patience in the pick n roll as a ball-handler. He’s been putting guys on his back more often, ensuring he has the man advantage and then toasting the bigs at the rim.

In the past, he’s mostly tried to fly past the screener, and at times he’d be out of control, or the primary defender didn’t get properly screened. He’s dabbled with putting guys on his back, but never seemingly this often. I’d like to see this continue.


I know in reality it’s probably Dame working with Giannis causing this but maybe, just maybe, AG is spending time in practices on stuff like setting screens and running PnR. We know Bud didn’t really invest time in that because anyone who wasn’t already good at those things when they got to the Bucks didn’t get better at them. Which is why Ingles seemed like a PnR God last season.

Giannis has seemed to try to be more patient in all aspects so clearly someone pointed out to him that immediately blindly running into a wall of players wasn’t going to work all the time and is what was causing him to be so banged up all the time.

Even when he’s initiating at the top of the key, he’s usually calling for a screen and then ending up attacking from more towards the wing which is a better angle for him to finish while avoid being undercut.

But yeah, Giannis PnR with Pat or Brook screening for him was working really well last night.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#102 » by tedbrogen » Tue Nov 21, 2023 2:34 pm

greekbuck34 wrote:I re-watched the game and I noticed Dame shouting at Giannis "YOU, YOU!" multiple times while Giannis was watching at him ready to give him the ball after a rebound.

Either Dame was tired and wanted to coast this game for a bit or he wasn't 100% and he wanted to protect himself until he was really needed.


I think Dame is trying to have Giannis be the ball handler on transition opportunities. Dame’s smart enough to know that Giannis is the most unstoppable transition player in the league. Probably something they’ve discussed in their film sessions since they are coaching the team for the most part.

I wish Bobby and Beas realized this instead of dribbling themselves into trouble.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#103 » by Karsenmitsche » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:08 pm

can we never talk about play random again

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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#104 » by theFireBlanket » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:14 pm

Karsenmitsche wrote:can we never talk about play random again

Read on Twitter


Random Rick over in Indiana, for the record.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#105 » by MoreTrife » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:16 pm

IDK, I wasn't too concerned about the defense. Completely felt like they knew who the opponent was.

I didn't think Green was bad. Thought he competed on D pretty well and while he didn't hit a three he had a nice fake and drive and contested jumper.

I did like the Giannis shot chart (with two nice mid range fades) but the highlight was the tip dunk on the backs of two Wizards.

EDIT: Make that three Wizards (https://youtu.be/JyP57ddNLOY?si=lm88ondw6eNeFPIR at 8:45)
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#106 » by tedbrogen » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:18 pm

Bmaasse wrote:
tedbrogen wrote:
TroyD92 wrote:
Aj was getting cooked up tonight.


Name me one Bucks player that wasn’t getting cooked up tonight on D? Lol

But he wasn't making shots either.


He got to take like three shots and hasn’t been able to be given a regular role in the rotation.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#107 » by crkone » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:21 pm

jimmybones wrote:
Dick Tate wrote:Jordan Poole is an awesome tank commander.


Sincerely one of the best. Guaranteed losses and hilarious plays every game? :lol:




My favorite moment. Does he think the game clock stops?

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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#108 » by MissKhriddleton » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:22 pm

Nice to see Giannis take over. This style of offense should carry over nicely into the playoffs if we face the Wizards. 8-)
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#109 » by Brewhoopfan » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:29 pm

HKPackFan wrote:Played with food for 3 quarters is the only way to describe that defense, it's so bad lol....im not going to think about it too much, bucks were definitely coasting. Giannis was unstoppable. Anytime he felt the team needed a bucket he just went and dunked or finger rolled. Just crazy. He was automatic.


Khris looked good and has looked good, his shot is silky smooth.

Beas in the 4th around 3- 4 minutes left had a dagger three, and I think he was being heckled on a corner three from Courtside fans. Because he was pissed!

He turned and screamed something back. He was hot! Then on the way to the bench he was still jawing at them and said 'look at the scoreboard' and waved bye. SAVAGE! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: just destroyed those fans.

I have ripped on Beas a lot (mainly D fit) but I'm loving those 3 bombs and loved that emotion!!


BTW when the game started I was like wait... This is a tank job right? That wizards team is just so awful.


Can't wait for Beas to take a stupid shot in a big spot just to shut up some fan. His shooting isn't sustainable, nor is playing 30+ minutes if the Bucks want to contend.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#110 » by BigO » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:31 pm

tedbrogen wrote:
Daver wrote:Can someone please in a abbreviated answer please explain to me how +/- work i mean how can you be as bad as you all say beas is on D n still have a +20 is that juat a Offense type of stat


Bucks outscores the Wiz by 20 tonight when Beas was on the floor.

One game +/- isn’t a great stat as it doesn’t have context such as maybe Beas was on the floor a lot when a really bad Wizards player (Jordan Poole) was so he benefited from that guy tanking the Wiz.



Beasley is playing a tad better defense, but he had the worst defensive effort on a play that I've ever seen. He was alone on a fast break and he didn't move his feet and just watched the guy go by him for a layup, until out of nowhere Giannis comes and blocks it away.

It symbolizes the effort of Giannis vs. Beasley. Just horrible. He should have been benched right after that. He's getting a little too cocky (I'm old, old school) for a below average player.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#111 » by tedbrogen » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:32 pm

Karsenmitsche wrote:can we never talk about play random again

Read on Twitter


Anyone referencing Play Random as a negative should have to go listen to Bud explain the true logical meaning that he did on the Lowe Pod right after the title.

Everyone outside the team misunderstood it. It’s why Giannis is still using it, it’s completely logical.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#112 » by sidney lanier » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:37 pm

BigO wrote:
tedbrogen wrote:
Daver wrote:Can someone please in a abbreviated answer please explain to me how +/- work i mean how can you be as bad as you all say beas is on D n still have a +20 is that juat a Offense type of stat


Bucks outscores the Wiz by 20 tonight when Beas was on the floor.

One game +/- isn’t a great stat as it doesn’t have context such as maybe Beas was on the floor a lot when a really bad Wizards player (Jordan Poole) was so he benefited from that guy tanking the Wiz.



Beasley is playing a tad better defense, but he had the worst defensive effort on a play that I've ever seen. He was alone on a fast break and he didn't move his feet and just watched the guy go by him for a layup, until out of nowhere Giannis comes and blocks it away.

It symbolizes the effort of Giannis vs. Beasley. Just horrible. He should have been benched right after that. He's getting a little too cocky (I'm old, old school) for a below average player.


Yeah, he would have been benched if Adrian Griffin was Gene Hackman and this was Hickory High School and not the NBA.

Of all the mortal and venial sins an NBA player might commit, letting a guy go on a breakaway instead of risking injury, a foul (flagrant or common) and a three-point play should hardly make it into the confessional.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#113 » by greekbuck34 » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:40 pm

tedbrogen wrote:
greekbuck34 wrote:I re-watched the game and I noticed Dame shouting at Giannis "YOU, YOU!" multiple times while Giannis was watching at him ready to give him the ball after a rebound.

Either Dame was tired and wanted to coast this game for a bit or he wasn't 100% and he wanted to protect himself until he was really needed.


I think Dame is trying to have Giannis be the ball handler on transition opportunities. Dame’s smart enough to know that Giannis is the most unstoppable transition player in the league. Probably something they’ve discussed in their film sessions since they are coaching the team for the most part.

I wish Bobby and Beas realized this instead of dribbling themselves into trouble.


No it wasn't a transition opportunity. Giannis grabs the rebound, slowly brings the ball up looking at Dame, everyone is already back, Dame shouts "You, you!" and goes to the corner and Giannis starts a PNR with Lopez or Pat.

I truly think Dame coasts/protects himself in order to have enough energy to run the show in the 4th quarter if needed or if Giannis gets stuck on offense like against the Mavs in the 3rd quarter.
GHOSTofSIKMA wrote: I think that we will do worse than last season and that Giannis is now just a mere all star. All because we switched from Bud to Griffin.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#114 » by Brewhoopfan » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:45 pm

tedbrogen wrote:
German Athens wrote:So far this year, I’ve really liked Giannis’s patience in the pick n roll as a ball-handler. He’s been putting guys on his back more often, ensuring he has the man advantage and then toasting the bigs at the rim.

In the past, he’s mostly tried to fly past the screener, and at times he’d be out of control, or the primary defender didn’t get properly screened. He’s dabbled with putting guys on his back, but never seemingly this often. I’d like to see this continue.


I know in reality it’s probably Dame working with Giannis causing this but maybe, just maybe, AG is spending time in practices on stuff like setting screens and running PnR. We know Bud didn’t really invest time in that because anyone who wasn’t already good at those things when they got to the Bucks didn’t get better at them. Which is why Ingles seemed like a PnR God last season.


What Ingles and Khris did/do so well with Giannis on PnR is keep their dribble alive for an extra count and allow Giannis to get all the way to the rim. No help = Giannis lob dunk. Help = Pass to corner for open 3. This takes the decision out of Giannis's hands. Dame gives it up earlier, and Giannis just isn't quite comfortable making the read yet, but getting better. Last night, Dame was giving it up really early, which I think helps Giannis catch with a little more space / runway. Giannis running the PnR is simply about getting him to a physical matchup he can (and does) destroy. Chemistry is building.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#115 » by BigO » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:48 pm

sidney lanier wrote:
BigO wrote:
tedbrogen wrote:
Bucks outscores the Wiz by 20 tonight when Beas was on the floor.

One game +/- isn’t a great stat as it doesn’t have context such as maybe Beas was on the floor a lot when a really bad Wizards player (Jordan Poole) was so he benefited from that guy tanking the Wiz.



Beasley is playing a tad better defense, but he had the worst defensive effort on a play that I've ever seen. He was alone on a fast break and he didn't move his feet and just watched the guy go by him for a layup, until out of nowhere Giannis comes and blocks it away.

It symbolizes the effort of Giannis vs. Beasley. Just horrible. He should have been benched right after that. He's getting a little too cocky (I'm old, old school) for a below average player.


Yeah, he would have been benched if Adrian Griffin was Gene Hackman and this was Hickory High School and not the NBA.

Of all the mortal and venial sins an NBA player might commit, letting a guy go on a breakaway instead of risking injury, a foul (flagrant or common) and a three-point play should hardly make it into the confessional.


Beasley was 10 feet in front of the guy. He wasn't trying to catch a breakaway (Giannis was trying and was successful).

Either he gave no effort at a guy coming straight at him or he's such a bad defender that the guy went right by him without Beasly moving his feet.

Bucks have a lot of young players finally. It was a good teaching moment to yank him. If I was Giannis, I'd be pissed that I had to run the entire court to catch the guy, while Beasely was just standing there. Old skool.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#116 » by Brewhoopfan » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:53 pm

sidney lanier wrote:
BigO wrote:
tedbrogen wrote:
Bucks outscores the Wiz by 20 tonight when Beas was on the floor.

One game +/- isn’t a great stat as it doesn’t have context such as maybe Beas was on the floor a lot when a really bad Wizards player (Jordan Poole) was so he benefited from that guy tanking the Wiz.



Beasley is playing a tad better defense, but he had the worst defensive effort on a play that I've ever seen. He was alone on a fast break and he didn't move his feet and just watched the guy go by him for a layup, until out of nowhere Giannis comes and blocks it away.

It symbolizes the effort of Giannis vs. Beasley. Just horrible. He should have been benched right after that. He's getting a little too cocky (I'm old, old school) for a below average player.


Yeah, he would have been benched if Adrian Griffin was Gene Hackman and this was Hickory High School and not the NBA.

Of all the mortal and venial sins an NBA player might commit, letting a guy go on a breakaway instead of risking injury, a foul (flagrant or common) and a three-point play should hardly make it into the confessional.


100% correct for superstars on max contracts, but at some point, the Bucks will need someone willing to do the dirty work.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#117 » by tedbrogen » Tue Nov 21, 2023 4:03 pm

Brewhoopfan wrote:
tedbrogen wrote:
German Athens wrote:So far this year, I’ve really liked Giannis’s patience in the pick n roll as a ball-handler. He’s been putting guys on his back more often, ensuring he has the man advantage and then toasting the bigs at the rim.

In the past, he’s mostly tried to fly past the screener, and at times he’d be out of control, or the primary defender didn’t get properly screened. He’s dabbled with putting guys on his back, but never seemingly this often. I’d like to see this continue.


I know in reality it’s probably Dame working with Giannis causing this but maybe, just maybe, AG is spending time in practices on stuff like setting screens and running PnR. We know Bud didn’t really invest time in that because anyone who wasn’t already good at those things when they got to the Bucks didn’t get better at them. Which is why Ingles seemed like a PnR God last season.


What Ingles and Khris did/do so well with Giannis on PnR is keep their dribble alive for an extra count and allow Giannis to get all the way to the rim. No help = Giannis lob dunk. Help = Pass to corner for open 3. This takes the decision out of Giannis's hands. Dame gives it up earlier, and Giannis just isn't quite comfortable making the read yet, but getting better. Last night, Dame was giving it up really early, which I think helps Giannis catch with a little more space / runway. Giannis running the PnR is simply about getting him to a physical matchup he can (and does) destroy. Chemistry is building.


This is why I want the Dame/Giannis PnR out as high as possible. Give Giannis a long runway so it’s basically Giannis leading a 4 on 3 fast break.

Dame can’t keep the dribble for that extra beat because he gets treated differently than most as teams show and blitz him hard on those PnRs. If he waits, he’s trapped and he isn’t as tall as Midds or Ingles to see over the top. So he’s trained himself to recognize when the blitz or trap is coming and make that pocket pass so his teammates have a 4 on 3.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#118 » by sidney lanier » Tue Nov 21, 2023 4:05 pm

Brewhoopfan wrote:
sidney lanier wrote:
BigO wrote:

Beasley is playing a tad better defense, but he had the worst defensive effort on a play that I've ever seen. He was alone on a fast break and he didn't move his feet and just watched the guy go by him for a layup, until out of nowhere Giannis comes and blocks it away.

It symbolizes the effort of Giannis vs. Beasley. Just horrible. He should have been benched right after that. He's getting a little too cocky (I'm old, old school) for a below average player.


Yeah, he would have been benched if Adrian Griffin was Gene Hackman and this was Hickory High School and not the NBA.

Of all the mortal and venial sins an NBA player might commit, letting a guy go on a breakaway instead of risking injury, a foul (flagrant or common) and a three-point play should hardly make it into the confessional.


100% correct for superstars on max contracts, but at some point, the Bucks will need someone willing to do the dirty work.

Playoffs, yes I agree, but regular season sometimes discretion is the better part of valor regardless of your role. Maybe it's Bogut PTSD on my part thinking about the things that can happen trying to defend a breakaway, but sometimes -- most of the time -- just let it go.

I get the appeal of a Marcus Smart or Caruso type designated to make kamikaze plays, but not a fan of either or of the style.
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#119 » by skones » Tue Nov 21, 2023 4:12 pm

tedbrogen wrote:
Karsenmitsche wrote:can we never talk about play random again

Read on Twitter


Anyone referencing Play Random as a negative should have to go listen to Bud explain the true logical meaning that he did on the Lowe Pod right after the title.

Everyone outside the team misunderstood it. It’s why Giannis is still using it, it’s completely logical.


Preach. I don't know why people jumped on it like they did. Pretty clearly to me meant play within our structure but appear unpredictable to the opponent. We've got squares on the floor for crying out loud, what about that was ever chickens running around with their heads cut off?
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Re: PG Wizards - Bucks Sleepwalk to Win 

Post#120 » by CharityStripe34 » Tue Nov 21, 2023 4:22 pm

tedbrogen wrote:
Brewhoopfan wrote:
tedbrogen wrote:
I know in reality it’s probably Dame working with Giannis causing this but maybe, just maybe, AG is spending time in practices on stuff like setting screens and running PnR. We know Bud didn’t really invest time in that because anyone who wasn’t already good at those things when they got to the Bucks didn’t get better at them. Which is why Ingles seemed like a PnR God last season.


What Ingles and Khris did/do so well with Giannis on PnR is keep their dribble alive for an extra count and allow Giannis to get all the way to the rim. No help = Giannis lob dunk. Help = Pass to corner for open 3. This takes the decision out of Giannis's hands. Dame gives it up earlier, and Giannis just isn't quite comfortable making the read yet, but getting better. Last night, Dame was giving it up really early, which I think helps Giannis catch with a little more space / runway. Giannis running the PnR is simply about getting him to a physical matchup he can (and does) destroy. Chemistry is building.


This is why I want the Dame/Giannis PnR out as high as possible. Give Giannis a long runway so it’s basically Giannis leading a 4 on 3 fast break.

Dame can’t keep the dribble for that extra beat because he gets treated differently than most as teams show and blitz him hard on those PnRs. If he waits, he’s trapped and he isn’t as tall as Midds or Ingles to see over the top. So he’s trained himself to recognize when the blitz or trap is coming and make that pocket pass so his teammates have a 4 on 3.


I've noticed their chemistry is steadily improving. Especially when they run the high-screen on the left side near the left-block. Freak caught a couple of passes into advantageous post-ups. One possession he scored on a baseline drive and then after a timeout he simply caught the ball, Dame's defender stupidly shaded over for a double and Gianni simply flipped it out to an open Dame three, splash. And I also noticed Dame was giving the ball to him on some possessions to initiate early offense with the Brook/Pat screens.
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