Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition

[shrink]

The best realistic Jaden Ivey package Minnesota could make from a value standpoint is Jaden McDaniels. Minnesota wouldn’t and shouldn’t do it.

I'd rate McDaniels value as being significantly higher than Ivey. McDaniels has proven to have an elite NBA skill while still having significant upside on offense. Ivey is still all projection and to date has been a bit disappointing.

Also, McDaniels extension makes him extremely hard to trade this season due to the poison pill nature of the required incoming and outgoing salaries.

Isn't Ivey more a Miller or two 2nd or 2023 late 1st type trade?

Nah, teams don’t give up on top 5 picks this early. Their board believes he is worth Markannen or OG Anunoby.

Our closest offer is probably Naz Reid. However, he is more than we should give up, and less than they want. I also don’t want to trade Naz and do him dirty, since he just signed for less because he actually WANTS to be here.

I was hoping we could crawl up there with Miller + Minott + 2030 swap, but I don’t think that gets us in a conversation.

[twolves31]

I don't know if trading Kyle Anderson is a good idea, it's a tough call. On one hand, Troy Brown Jr. breaking out might make filling his minutes less brutal, but on the flip-side, he is so important as connective tissue for both Minnesota's offense and defense.

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As someone who appreciates Tyus Jones a lot, I would love having him back on Minnesota, but trading Kyle Anderson for him would be pretty scary.

The Wizards have no interest in Anderson anyway, so it's moot.

Does it really matter who leads the Wizards to 8-10 wins this season The team is terrible and if they can get an asset they will gladly take Anderson, and they might try to trade Anderson after that for another asset. Neither Anderson, Tyus, or Wright are going to be in Washington next season. Now another team might offer more than the Wolves do for Tyus or Wright, but that's another conversation.

[KGdaBom]

Hi everyone, first time poster here but I have actually been actively reading this forum since 2008!

Interestingly, I see people mentioning Monte Morris from the Pistons but why not take a flyer on Jaden Ivey? Sure, he is struggling defensively (and so is everyone in that team bar Thompson and their young center) but was looking very good in the 2nd half of last year. Also, he is not a vet but rather, a sophomore. Nevertheless, he is talented.

Seems Monty Williams isn’t a fan and not playing him much. He could be a good PG/SG scorer off the bench imo. Thoughts?

I'm fine with adding Ivey.

[KGdaBom]

Hi everyone, first time poster here but I have actually been actively reading this forum since 2008!

Interestingly, I see people mentioning Monte Morris from the Pistons but why not take a flyer on Jaden Ivey? Sure, he is struggling defensively (and so is everyone in that team bar Thompson and their young center) but was looking very good in the 2nd half of last year. Also, he is not a vet but rather, a sophomore. Nevertheless, he is talented.

Seems Monty Williams isn’t a fan and not playing him much. He could be a good PG/SG scorer off the bench imo. Thoughts?

I think Ivey would be a great target, I'm just not sure how we could put together enough value for a trade. The Wolves don't have any 1st round picks that can be traded and I'm skeptical that Minott or Miller would have enough value to be the best asset in a deal. About the only path I can see to a deal would be if a third team really wanted Anderson and was willing to overpay a bit with a decent 1st (a pick expected to be in the late teens) that could be rerouted to Detroit.

DET are looking for stretch four, who can defend and shoot. Would you trade Miller, Milton and Moore for Ivey?

No. I would trade Moore for Ivey. I believe they would not accept that, but of that group that's all I would be willing to trade. I like Milton. I think he will come around and be better than Ivey. Miller I'm super high on.

[KGdaBom]

The best realistic Jaden Ivey package Minnesota could make from a value standpoint is Jaden McDaniels. Minnesota wouldn’t and shouldn’t do it.

I'd rate McDaniels value as being significantly higher than Ivey. McDaniels has proven to have an elite NBA skill while still having significant upside on offense. Ivey is still all projection and to date has been a bit disappointing.

Also, McDaniels extension makes him extremely hard to trade this season due to the poison pill nature of the required incoming and outgoing salaries.

Isn't Ivey more a Miller or two 2nd or 2023 late 1st type trade?

Yes and I wouldn't trade Miller for Ivey unless they were including a late first early 2nd round pick in the deal.

[KGdaBom]

I'd rate McDaniels value as being significantly higher than Ivey. McDaniels has proven to have an elite NBA skill while still having significant upside on offense. Ivey is still all projection and to date has been a bit disappointing.

Also, McDaniels extension makes him extremely hard to trade this season due to the poison pill nature of the required incoming and outgoing salaries.

Isn't Ivey more a Miller or two 2nd or 2023 late 1st type trade?

Nah, teams don’t give up on top 5 picks this early. Their board believes he is worth Markannen or OG Anunoby.

Our closest offer is probably Naz Reid. However, he is more than we should give up, and less than they want. I also don’t want to trade Naz and do him dirty, since he just signed for less because he actually WANTS to be here.

I was hoping we could crawl up there with Miller + Minott + 2030 swap, but I don’t think that gets us in a conversation.

Maybe their board believes he is worth a lot. Their coach doesn't. He will only play him when he is more or less forced into it by injuries. The coach would consider trading him addition by subtraction. I think he could be had for extremely less than you do.

[Mamba4Goat]

Isn't Ivey more a Miller or two 2nd or 2023 late 1st type trade?

Nah, teams don’t give up on top 5 picks this early. Their board believes he is worth Markannen or OG Anunoby.

Our closest offer is probably Naz Reid. However, he is more than we should give up, and less than they want. I also don’t want to trade Naz and do him dirty, since he just signed for less because he actually WANTS to be here.

I was hoping we could crawl up there with Miller + Minott + 2030 swap, but I don’t think that gets us in a conversation.

Maybe their board believes he is worth a lot. Their coach doesn't. He will only play him when he is more or less forced into it by injuries. The coach would consider trading him addition by subtraction. I think he could be had for extremely less than you do.

Ivey was a prospect with star potential written on him, showed flashes of it in his rookie year, and now seems to be in their stubborn head coach’s dog house (who has a history of doing this). I don’t think his stock has plummeted in the way that everyone is painting it. If he was legitimately made available for pennies there should be some very scary in house red flags that aren’t being talked about.

[KGdaBom]

Nah, teams don’t give up on top 5 picks this early. Their board believes he is worth Markannen or OG Anunoby.

Our closest offer is probably Naz Reid. However, he is more than we should give up, and less than they want. I also don’t want to trade Naz and do him dirty, since he just signed for less because he actually WANTS to be here.

I was hoping we could crawl up there with Miller + Minott + 2030 swap, but I don’t think that gets us in a conversation.

Maybe their board believes he is worth a lot. Their coach doesn't. He will only play him when he is more or less forced into it by injuries. The coach would consider trading him addition by subtraction. I think he could be had for extremely less than you do.

Ivey was a prospect with star potential written on him, showed flashes of it in his rookie year, and now seems to be in their stubborn head coach’s dog house (who has a history of doing this). I don’t think his stock has plummeted in the way that everyone is painting it. If he was legitimately made available for pennies there should be some very scary in house red flags that aren’t being talked about.

Fair enough.

[Baseline81]

Someone help me understand the Ivey love?

[KGdaBom]

Someone help me understand the Ivey love?

I agree with you that he is getting way too much love.
He's a somewhat talented player who is for whatever reason despised by his coach. Due to his being despised by his coach IMO we may be able to get him cheap. However, some of us IMO are considering outlandish offers for him.

[shrink]

Someone help me understand the Ivey love?

I agree with you that he is getting way too much love.
He's a somewhat talented player who is for whatever reason despised by his coach. Due to his being despised by his coach IMO we may be able to get him cheap. However, some of us IMO are considering outlandish offers for him.

I agree with you both. I wasn’t a big fan of his, but he has the potential to be a star.

Even if the coach doesn’t like him, the front office can’t trade him this early for scraps. After getting fans all excited, that would be an admission of incompetance that can push them towards losing their jobs.

[winforlose]

Someone help me understand the Ivey love?

I agree with you that he is getting way too much love.
He's a somewhat talented player who is for whatever reason despised by his coach. Due to his being despised by his coach IMO we may be able to get him cheap. However, some of us IMO are considering outlandish offers for him.

I agree with you both. I wasn’t a big fan of his, but he has the potential to be a star.

Even if the coach doesn’t like him, the front office can’t trade him this early for scraps. After getting fans all excited, that would be an admission of incompetance that can push them towards losing their jobs.

This, plus bad teams just don’t move high picks that often. Good teams maybe, but if you are going to be the bottom of your conference, you might as well give them minutes to see what you have. Unless you are talking about Culver levels of incompetence, you don’t make these kinds of moves with a 2nd year 5th overall pick. As you said, these are the moves that get people fired.

[wolves_89]

Someone help me understand the Ivey love?

I'm not sure I'd call it love, it's more about looking at the future and seeing a gaping hole at PG. It would be a great move to get a high upside young PG that could develop for a year or two under Conley. As far as Ivey, the discussion is probably a moot point since I don't see a trade that both sides would agree to.

[twolves31]

Someone help me understand the Ivey love?

Love? I don't know if I would consider offering Miller, Mionott, or Moore love. During the draft, a lot of teams wanted to trade up for Ivey. 16, 5, 4 as a rookie, but has been benched in favor of a more defensive minded player. I haven't watched Detroit at all this season and saw one game last season when they played the Wolves, so I can't speak one way or the other on Ivey from a eye test perspective. I don't think we have the assets to get it done, with players we would be willing to trade. If we did trade for him, I do wonder if he would be able to contribute in the playoffs this season, or if he would be riding pine at that point. We are going to need to find a future point guard, and that isn't going to be easy, unless Connelly hits a home run in the draft, or we are so good that a veteran pg is willing to sign a short term veteran min contracts to try and win a title.

[winforlose]

Someone help me understand the Ivey love?

Love? I don't know if I would consider offering Miller, Mionott, or Moore love. During the draft, a lot of teams wanted to trade up for Ivey. 16, 5, 4 as a rookie, but has been benched in favor of a more defensive minded player. I haven't watched Detroit at all this season and saw one game last season when they played the Wolves, so I can't speak one way or the other on Ivey from a eye test perspective. I don't think we have the assets to get it done, with players we would be willing to trade. If we did trade for him, I do wonder if he would be able to contribute in the playoffs this season, or if he would be riding pine at that point. We are going to need to find a future point guard, and that isn't going to be easy, unless Connelly hits a home run in the draft, or we are so good that a veteran pg is willing to sign a short term veteran min contracts to try and win a title.

Being in first will help with that. The problem is we are low on money for even a vet minimum. If we could move Moore for cap space then we could probably do it. It would be nice if the backup PG we add would be the solution moving forward, but you are correct we could do a one and done with a vet to chase the ring.

[BlacJacMac]

If Russell Westbrook is unhappy at the trade deadline maybe we could nab him.

He's clearly accepted a back up role and he seems to care purely about winning at this point.

There is a reason they call him Westbrick these days. Kinda prefer bad Shake to bad Rus just because Shake is still young and quick.

I'm not sure he's a great fit on our team, but Westbrook is still significantly quicker/faster than Shake.

[winforlose]

If Russell Westbrook is unhappy at the trade deadline maybe we could nab him.

He's clearly accepted a back up role and he seems to care purely about winning at this point.

There is a reason they call him Westbrick these days. Kinda prefer bad Shake to bad Rus just because Shake is still young and quick.

I'm not sure he's a great fit on our team, but Westbrook is still significantly quicker/faster than Shake.

Agree to disagree

[Baseline81]

I'm not sure I'd call it love, it's more about looking at the future and seeing a gaping hole at PG. It would be a great move to get a high upside young PG that could develop for a year or two under Conley. As far as Ivey, the discussion is probably a moot point since I don't see a trade that both sides would agree to.

Understandable, however, his numbers aren't even that good. Is the discussion just because he was a top-5 pick? Hayes, who plays in front of him, falls in the same boat.

And as shrink stated, Detroit will not give up on him unless the Wolves trade someone like McDaniels, which is ludicrous to consider at this stage.

[TimberKat]

If Russell Westbrook is unhappy at the trade deadline maybe we could nab him.

He's clearly accepted a back up role and he seems to care purely about winning at this point.

There is a reason they call him Westbrick these days. Kinda prefer bad Shake to bad Rus just because Shake is still young and quick.

I'm not sure he's a great fit on our team, but Westbrook is still significantly quicker/faster than Shake.

I am looking for Westbrook to drive and dish, play D, and rebound at the guard position. Just to bring energy off the bench. Not looking for him to shoot corner 3s. He is not perfect but I think there is room for him. Potentially, play along side Conley.

[TimberKat]

I'm not sure I'd call it love, it's more about looking at the future and seeing a gaping hole at PG. It would be a great move to get a high upside young PG that could develop for a year or two under Conley. As far as Ivey, the discussion is probably a moot point since I don't see a trade that both sides would agree to.

Understandable, however, his numbers aren't even that good. Is the discussion just because he was a top-5 pick? Hayes, who plays in front of him, falls in the same boat.

And as shrink stated, Detroit will not give up on him unless the Wolves trade someone like McDaniels, which is ludicrous to consider at this stage.

It maybe shocking to some of you that I don't watch DET play. Just on paper, they drafted Hayes, Cade, and Ivey. Hayes and Ivey feels like combo guards and not the future PG that we need. They also have Morris. They sure looked mess up in the draft if Hayes and Ivey are PGs too.