Around the NBA (and other Sports), 2023-24

[Mr_Mojo_Risin]

Can you really blame him for that? He has to completely carry the entire team's ball handling duties, shot creation, scoring, and rebounding. And he's supposed to also be a great defender? What other player in the league does that?

Yep, I can blame him for his complete lack of effort in defense. Also, he wants to carry the offense, he doesn’t always have to….

Kawhi, Tatum, Embiid, Giannis, SGA are all elite offensive players that carry a large offensive load for their teams but give great effort when defending most the time.

2 way players are obviously easier to build around. Think about dirk (ironically a mav), he was a once in a lifetime offensive talent for his position, but their real success only came when every other player on the roster complimented his strength and moreso weakness

He was also easier to build around as he was less ball dominant.

Luka is amazing offensively, but basketball is a team sport and his team mates have to be basically ok with being his puppets. They may find the right people to make it work, or others may look at how KP and Brunson flourished away from there and think no thanks.

[Smart2Nesmith43]

Yeah, but even in the international scene, Luka always comes up short.

Luka had KP as his 2nd option and Luka couldn't make it work.

When KP wins a chip in Boston, it will vindicate KP.

It's a story with too many details. It did kind of work in the bubble season and playoffs - until KP was injured. Then it failed badly and in the year when everyone missed a tonne of games with "Covid" KP and Brunson were a good fit when Luka was out and Luka wasn't a good fit with KP when both were in. That ended up with both KP and Brunson leaving Dallas. KP when interviewed does some preventative criticism of how he was then .. that's partly persona and partly how he is .. and it contrasts with how Luka is .. not to throw shade at Luka, just different types of people .. but KP really didn't get fair or even sensible usage in Dallas after the second injury.

Also, Cuban installed a guy with the bbiq of a gnat as GM. Probably a good shoe salesman .. but boy Dinwiddie + Bertans for KP????

[edit] obviously the international criticism of Luka is not fair. He led Slovenia to win the Euro champs at age 18? And his success with Real Madrid at a similar time is well documented.

I don't watch Euroleague.

I'm referring to international competition like the FIBA World Cup or Olympics.

Luka always put up great number the last few years, but Slovenia could never win it all.

Yes let's ignore all the time Doncic has won anything then sure he's a loser. But fine let's look just at how he performed at those international competitions.

World Cup 2019, Slovenia didn't qualify (Doncic didn't play the qualifiers because they were during the NBA season) = what a loser. Like if he's not here the roster legit isn't good enough to even qualify, let alone make some noise in those competitions.

Olympics 2020, Slovenia finishes as the top ranked team after the group stage before destroying Germany in the quarters. Then in the semis, down one to France, on the last possession Doncic draws two guys before dishing it to a teammate that has a straight line drive to the rim for what should have been his 19th assist of the day. Batum comes out of nowhere for the chasedown block at the buzzer and France advances to the final = Doncic is a ball hogging loser.

World Cup 2023, Slovenia goes 4-1 in group play with their only loss to eventual champion Germany. Slovenia then loses in the quarters to a Canada team with only current NBA players in its rotation. The only NBA player on Slovenia's roster is Doncic (and the only other guy to have even played at that level is Zoran Dragic for like 10 games a decade ago). Like if you take Doncic out of the equation those teams don't even belong on the same court. Admittedly he probably had one of the worst games of his Slovenia career (still 26 points on 20 shots and 5 assists to 3 turnovers) before getting tossed for a second technical (spending too much time complaining to officials is a valid criticism of his game).

As for the fact that he's allegedly not willing to cede control of the offense it's hilarious considering Goran Dragic not Doncic was the top scorer and the MVP of EuroBasket 2017 when Slovenia won. Brunson is a grinder that has gotten better every single year he has been in the league regardless of who was on his team. Doncic never played with this version of Brunson. Porzingis is also on record saying he rebuilt his game after going to Washington and quite obviously discovered how to post up efficiently while in DC. Doncic never played with this version of Porzingis.

People might say that he doesn't have to create that much offense for Dallas but he absolutely does. Irving is a spectacular indivdual talent but he has never led particularly efficient offenses at a team level. Considering they need to score a ton because their frontcourt offers no rim protection then Doncic has to be the engine for everything when he is on the court.

After games where he puts up stupid numbers, Doncic isn't going "look at me I'm the greatest" which you would expect from a ball hogging stat padder that only cares about his own accolades but he's always saying how tired he is. Which to me sounds like a guy that needs help and would like to not have to orchestrate every single possession all the time. Going into the season there was a decent amount of chatter that Grant Williams was the Mavs 3rd best player. How the hell is anyone supposed to win with a roster where Grant is the third best player

Doncic isn't a perfect player but he is absolutely a winner trapped in a dysfunctional organization. Celtics fans better hope he stays stuck in Dallas for a while because once he leaves for a competent franchise he will be a major problem.

[Fierce1]

Here's the thing with Luka, when it comes to individual performances, he's an absolute beast.

The problem is he's just too ball dominant.

It's not the talent of Luka, it's his style of play.

And no one can deny his effort on defense is poor.

Also, the version of Brunson in Dallas could be a case of Brunson couldn't blossom in Dallas because the offense in Dallas was too reliant on Luka.

Brunson got unleashed in NY.

KP averaged 20 ppg in Dallas and they still went nowhere.

Even now with Kyrie, Dallas is still nothing special.

Sooner or later the excuses will run out and Luka will end up one of the greatest player that never made it to the NBA Finals.

[Fierce1]

He’s the only one on his team who can dribble a ball now that Kyrie is injured.

Yeah, but even in the international scene, Luka always comes up short.

Luka had KP as his 2nd option and Luka couldn't make it work.

When KP wins a chip in Boston, it will vindicate KP.

In fairness to Luka, Tatum doesn't just have KP; he also has Brown, White and Holiday.

Tatum didn't have KP and Holiday and the Cs made it to the NBA Finals in 2022.

[Fierce1]

They literally won the European championships in 2017.

It's a tiny country with essentially no basketball tradition, especially in comparison to Serbia and Croatia. This is like expecting Maine + Rhode Island to have a World Cup or Olympics winning basketball team.

Yeah, the Euro part I don't see.

I only see the part where Luka and Slovenia face the world.

Not saying Luka is not a great player, no doubt he's a great player, but I think it's his style of play that can become his strength and also his weakness.

Basically harden. An over simplification perhaps, but they are one man wrecking crews that raise a teams floor, but perhaps limit their max ceiling

Agree.

[JaMarco]

Here's the thing with Luka, when it comes to individual performances, he's an absolute beast.

The problem is he's just too ball dominant.

It's not the talent of Luka, it's his style of play.

And no one can deny his effort on defense is poor.

Also, the version of Brunson in Dallas could be a case of Brunson couldn't blossom in Dallas because the offense in Dallas was too reliant on Luka.

Brunson got unleashed in NY.

KP averaged 20 ppg in Dallas and they still went nowhere.

Even now with Kyrie, Dallas is still nothing special.

Sooner or later the excuses will run out and Luka will end up one of the greatest player that never made it to the NBA Finals.

How is he too ball dominant when he's one of the best passers in the leauge?

[Fierce1]

Here's the thing with Luka, when it comes to individual performances, he's an absolute beast.

The problem is he's just too ball dominant.

It's not the talent of Luka, it's his style of play.

And no one can deny his effort on defense is poor.

Also, the version of Brunson in Dallas could be a case of Brunson couldn't blossom in Dallas because the offense in Dallas was too reliant on Luka.

Brunson got unleashed in NY.

KP averaged 20 ppg in Dallas and they still went nowhere.

Even now with Kyrie, Dallas is still nothing special.

Sooner or later the excuses will run out and Luka will end up one of the greatest player that never made it to the NBA Finals.

How is he too ball dominant when he's one of the best passers in the leauge?

Like I said, the ability is not in question here.

Would you really like to play with a guy that dictates everything?

That would prevent you from having multiple star players because other star players would be turned into role players if Luka has total control of the offense.

Look at the last shot of the Mavs against the Cavs.
The Mavs had a chance to tie the game, but when the double team came, Luka had no choice but to pass.
By then it was too late because the Mavs couldn't get a good shot.

When everything is about Luka, the offense becomes predictable and other players will not like being just one of Luka's mininons.

[BK_2020]

Here's the thing with Luka, when it comes to individual performances, he's an absolute beast.

The problem is he's just too ball dominant.

It's not the talent of Luka, it's his style of play.

And no one can deny his effort on defense is poor.

Also, the version of Brunson in Dallas could be a case of Brunson couldn't blossom in Dallas because the offense in Dallas was too reliant on Luka.

Brunson got unleashed in NY.

KP averaged 20 ppg in Dallas and they still went nowhere.

Even now with Kyrie, Dallas is still nothing special.

Sooner or later the excuses will run out and Luka will end up one of the greatest player that never made it to the NBA Finals.

How is he too ball dominant when he's one of the best passers in the leauge?

Like I said, the ability is not in question here.

Would you really like to play with a guy that dictates everything?

That would prevent you from having multiple star players because other star players would be turned into role players if Luka has total control of the offense.

Look at the last shot of the Mavs against the Cavs.
The Mavs had a chance to tie the game, but when the double team came, Luka had no choice but to pass.
By then it was too late because the Mavs couldn't get a good shot.

When everything is about Luka, the offense becomes predictable and other players will not like being just one of Luka's mininons.

That last play is on kidd. Like what did he expect, the cavs will just sag back and let Luka shoot a three? The worst coach in the league.

[Fierce1]

How is he too ball dominant when he's one of the best passers in the leauge?

Like I said, the ability is not in question here.

Would you really like to play with a guy that dictates everything?

That would prevent you from having multiple star players because other star players would be turned into role players if Luka has total control of the offense.

Look at the last shot of the Mavs against the Cavs.
The Mavs had a chance to tie the game, but when the double team came, Luka had no choice but to pass.
By then it was too late because the Mavs couldn't get a good shot.

When everything is about Luka, the offense becomes predictable and other players will not like being just one of Luka's mininons.

That last play is on kidd. Like what did he expect, the cavs will just sag back and let Luka shoot a three? The worst coach in the league.

Another example is why did KP want out of Dallas?

Playing with a future hall of fame player in Luka should be great for a guy like KP.

No matter how you try to defend Luka, it still comes down to basketball is just not fun if one guy controls everything.

[Fierce1]

An offense with Luka is everybody be ready to shoot when Luka gets doubled.

When Luka doesn't get doubled, Luka scores.

That's a very boring offense.

The creativity of guys like D-White will be negated because he will be forced to become a catch and shoot guy.

[JaMarco]

Luka is also 24, so any way you look at it it's premature to bury his career already.

Also I'm inherently skeptical about "you can't win with so-and-so" narratives. The same things were said about Jordan and LeBron before they won, think about that.

[Fierce1]

Luka is also 24, so any way you look at it it's premature to bury his career already.

Also I'm inherently skeptical about "you can't win with so-and-so" narratives. The same things were said about Jordan and LeBron before they won, think about that.

The difference with MJ and Lebron is both MJ and Lebron did their part on defense.

Did you see how Luka defended that LeVert 3 late in the 4th?

Everything is about Luka and when it comes defense, Luka doesn't do his part.

That's deflating to teammates because they do the hard work on defense and Luka doesn't.

The offense turns everybody into a catch and shoot player and it's like 4 vs. 5 on defense.

Like I said, why did KP want out of Dallas when they could've been the next great dynamic duo?

[JaMarco]

Luka is also 24, so any way you look at it it's premature to bury his career already.

Also I'm inherently skeptical about "you can't win with so-and-so" narratives. The same things were said about Jordan and LeBron before they won, think about that.

The difference with MJ and Lebron is both MJ and Lebron did their part on defense.

Did you see how Luka defended that LeVert 3 late in the 4th?

Everything is about Luka and when it comes defense, Luka doesn't do his part.

That's deflating to teammates because they do the hard work on defense and Luka doesn't.

The offense turns everybody into a catch and shoot player and it's like 4 vs. 5 on defense.

Like I said, why did KP want out of Dallas when they could've been the next great dynamic duo?

Defense in basketball isn't really a skill though, it's more of an effort/coaching/environment thing. Guys like Peirce and Irving had horrible defensive reputations before they were on contenders, then they turned their defense around when they were on a real contending team. So Luka can likely turn his defense around whenever he has a real contending roster.

[Fierce1]

Luka is also 24, so any way you look at it it's premature to bury his career already.

Also I'm inherently skeptical about "you can't win with so-and-so" narratives. The same things were said about Jordan and LeBron before they won, think about that.

The difference with MJ and Lebron is both MJ and Lebron did their part on defense.

Did you see how Luka defended that LeVert 3 late in the 4th?

Everything is about Luka and when it comes defense, Luka doesn't do his part.

That's deflating to teammates because they do the hard work on defense and Luka doesn't.

The offense turns everybody into a catch and shoot player and it's like 4 vs. 5 on defense.

Like I said, why did KP want out of Dallas when they could've been the next great dynamic duo?

Defense in basketball isn't really a skill though, it's more of an effort/coaching/environment thing. Guys like Peirce and Irving had horrible defensive reputations before they were on contenders, then they turned their defense around when they were on a real contending team. So Luka can likely turn his defense around whenever he has a real contending roster.

That's the point!

How can you have a contending roster when no one wants to be a part of Luka-ball?

When you have one of the best unicorns in the game want out, that means there's something wrong with the team.

Jalen Brunson got unleashed in NY, plays like a legit All-Star player now.

What was Brunson in Dallas?

Again, this has nothing to do with Luka's ability, it's this total control of the offense and not doing your part on defense that will prevent Dallas from having a contending team.

[Homerclease]

Here's the thing with Luka, when it comes to individual performances, he's an absolute beast.

The problem is he's just too ball dominant.

It's not the talent of Luka, it's his style of play.

And no one can deny his effort on defense is poor.

Also, the version of Brunson in Dallas could be a case of Brunson couldn't blossom in Dallas because the offense in Dallas was too reliant on Luka.

Brunson got unleashed in NY.

KP averaged 20 ppg in Dallas and they still went nowhere.

Even now with Kyrie, Dallas is still nothing special.

Sooner or later the excuses will run out and Luka will end up one of the greatest player that never made it to the NBA Finals.

How is he too ball dominant when he's one of the best passers in the leauge?

He’s Euro Harden. Fantastic player, will never win playing the way he does

[JaMarco]

The difference with MJ and Lebron is both MJ and Lebron did their part on defense.

Did you see how Luka defended that LeVert 3 late in the 4th?

Everything is about Luka and when it comes defense, Luka doesn't do his part.

That's deflating to teammates because they do the hard work on defense and Luka doesn't.

The offense turns everybody into a catch and shoot player and it's like 4 vs. 5 on defense.

Like I said, why did KP want out of Dallas when they could've been the next great dynamic duo?

Defense in basketball isn't really a skill though, it's more of an effort/coaching/environment thing. Guys like Peirce and Irving had horrible defensive reputations before they were on contenders, then they turned their defense around when they were on a real contending team. So Luka can likely turn his defense around whenever he has a real contending roster.

That's the point!

How can you have a contending roster when no one wants to be a part of Luka-ball?

When you have one of the best unicorns in the game want out, that means there's something wrong with the team.

Jalen Brunson got unleashed in NY, plays like a legit All-Star player now.

What was Brunson in Dallas?

Again, this has nothing to do with Luka's ability, it's this total control of the offense and not doing your part on defense that will prevent Dallas from having a contending team.

Even if that's all true, he's 24 so he's still young enough to fix any "problems" he has. My point is I would definitely bet on his talent and take him in a second if Dallas would ever be stupid enough to want to give him away on a discount because "you can't win with him."

[KillahGhostface]

Qdoba>>>

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[165bows]

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Brad Stevens would win at least 45 games with this amount of talent.

Celtics roster consists of a ton of guys drafted at 3 and then at 29.

In other news. Seth Rollins was the big winner tonight at the Garden and the boys were amped about that and Cody Rhodes’ appearance.

So, what, this is 3, 3, 3, 4, 17 (Jrue), 26 (PP), 29 (DW), 38, 39, 46, 47, 53, and the other five undrafted?

Something like that, thought KP was 5 but that’s just by memory. It does seem a bit of a trend that the middle third of the first round is pretty soft in general.

[shackles10]

Qdoba>>>

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I used to think so, but then the Qdoba near me closed so I've only had Chipotle for a few years. Thought I missed it, but last 3 times I've had it in another area I wasn't impressed. Put me on team Chipotle.

[djFan71]

Qdoba>>>

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I used to think so, but then the Qdoba near me closed so I've only had Chipotle for a few years. Thought I missed it, but last 3 times I've had it in another area I wasn't impressed. Put me on team Chipotle.

I haven't had Qdoba since I left CT a long time ago, so I can only sit back and watch.