Ausar on the bench

[Patrick27]

Ausar Thompson is a fun player to watch. Great intensity, plays hard on defense, runs the floor, makes highlight reel plays at the basket.

But he needs to stay on the bench for now.

He needs to earn his minutes through improving his shooting in practice. If he is gifted minutes now despite poor shooting, he will never take the next step. On the other hand, Ausar seems to have the mental toughness to understand the assignment and focus on improving his game so he can be a much better player in the long run.

I'm no fan of Monty and I have always thought he was a bad hire, but I'm coming around to the idea that he was right to bench Ivey at first, in order to establish that he earns his minutes by working on the weakest part of his game. Ivey has shown improvement since the beginning of the season, and I think some of that is because he was able to take a step back and understand where he had to improve. Perhaps the same can happen for Ausar.

If the gift is given before improvements are made, then no improvements will be made. On the other hand, if the minutes are given after showing improvement, it establishes a pattern of earned reward in these young high draft picks.

It's probably the only thing I like that he's done so far, but it's a wise move, and it shows he's playing the long game with these guys.

[Cowology]

Ausar Thompson is a fun player to watch. Great intensity, plays hard on defense, runs the floor, makes highlight reel plays at the basket.

But he needs to stay on the bench for now.

He needs to earn his minutes through improving his shooting in practice. If he is gifted minutes now despite poor shooting, he will never take the next step. On the other hand, Ausar seems to have the mental toughness to understand the assignment and focus on improving his game so he can be a much better player in the long run.

I'm no fan of Monty and I have always thought he was a bad hire, but I'm coming around to the idea that he was right to bench Ivey at first, in order to establish that he earns his minutes by working on the weakest part of his game. Ivey has shown improvement since the beginning of the season, and I think some of that is because he was able to take a step back and understand where he had to improve. Perhaps the same can happen for Ausar.

If the gift is given before improvements are made, then no improvements will be made. On the other hand, if the minutes are given after showing improvement, it establishes a pattern of earned reward in these young high draft picks.

It's probably the only thing I like that he's done so far, but it's a wise move, and it shows he's playing the long game with these guys.

The problem is there needs to be some level of trust & buy-in for that to work.

[7r5ur]

Is there a player that "earned" minutes through effort more than Ausar did to start the year before Monty decided to banish him to the bench to watch from the corner as Killian flails around with the ball for his 10-12 minutes per game?

We knew Ausar was not a shooter. If we were going to be this terrible and still not play him, we shouldn't have drafted him. Not finding 20mpg minimum for him is malpractice, especially with guys like Livers playing so terribly and being gifted minutes night after night.

And if you put 2 and 2 together with the things we've heard from Gores and the front office, Ivey never "earned" those minutes from Monty, he was forced to play Ivey because the whole FO was pissed at him about it.

[Sort]

Monty has been a disaster. I don't think Ivey or anyone has shown much growth due to him as a coach. Man should have taken a year off instead of the money. That choice has put his name in the history books rightfully.

But this is the modern NBA. Ausar would have been awesome as Michael Curry back in the day, but he's here now. He has to shoot near to league average. Pistons can't survive much without the threat of shooting around Cade. That said, like many of the Pistons, Monty has not figured out how to create a role for them to succeed at. With a rookie that's always going to be bad.

[bstein14]

He was so incredibly aggressive starting the season out... it is crazy to see him come in and have 1 or 2 rebound games now.... even with the reduced minutes.


That said, I've said repeatedly that Duren and Ausar should be our only two guys that can't shoot 30% from deep that play and ideally we only have one on the court at a time most of the time.

[bjones521]

Watching Ausar play he needs to go to the G league. He can't really dribble and can't shoot. His main red flag from scouts were that they didn't think he could score in a half-court offense, and he can't! We shouldn't have drafted him bc he doesn't fit with this team but it is what it is. If we keep Ivey he'd never be able to start at the 3 or 4 unless he's able to shoot 38%+ from 3.

[WoyTreaver]

Simply another poor fit into the Troy Weaver puzzle.

[Crymson]

I'm no fan of Monty and I have always thought he was a bad hire, but I'm coming around to the idea that he was right to bench Ivey at first, in order to establish that he earns his minutes by working on the weakest part of his game. Ivey has shown improvement since the beginning of the season, and I think some of that is because he was able to take a step back and understand where he had to improve.

Ivey said in the offseason that his defense as a rookie had been terrible and that he needed to improve. And that improvement very well may be primarily improvement by a second-year player over his rookie season.

And Monty didn't simply bench him. He buried him, sometimes had him as 5th man off the bench, and denied him the opportunity to participate fully in an offense that desperately needed Ivey's contributions. He did so until Ivey's 23rd game of the season -- and given Gores' reference to discussing rotations with Monty, it may have been Tom who asked him to stop.

Now he's moved on to not trusting Ivey without Cade on the floor. He'd rather field Killian Hayes as backup point guard and guarantee an ineffectual bench unit than bring Ivey onto the floor instead without Cade.

The treatment has been 100% arbitrary, and also stupid from a development standpoint.

Perhaps the same can happen for Ausar.

If the gift is given before improvements are made, then no improvements will be made. On the other hand, if the minutes are given after showing improvement, it establishes a pattern of earned reward in these young high draft picks.

It's probably the only thing I like that he's done so far, but it's a wise move, and it shows he's playing the long game with these guys.

"The gift" literally was given immediately despite Ausar being almost absolutely guaranteed to be an enormous drain on the halfcourt offense. He was terrible in the halfcourt against OTE defenses, and the probability that he'd make a tremendous leap in his first offseason was extremely low. Monty nonetheless started him into a lineup that already had far too little shooting. He started for 18 games. Then he was moved to the bench for four games before being brought back into the starting lineup for five, then the bench for one, then the starting lineup again, and then the bench for the last three.

So no, that's not the case. Again, the treatment has been arbitrary. Ausar wasn't ready to start. He was barely ready for the NBA. And work ethic is no issue for him in the first place. It wasn't for Ivey either.

It's also worth noting that Monty stopped actually coaching Ausar weeks ago. He doesn't bother to play Ausar in the halfcourt in such a way as to emphasize Ausar's few strengths or to ameliorate to any degree Ausar's drain upon the offense. Nay, he generally just plops Ausar on the perimeter and leaves him there to do maximum damage to the offense.

[Kilo]

Player development doesn't necessarily mean playing time. They threw a lot at Ausar and now pull back to let him digest it all, know where he struggled to be able to work with PD coaches. Gleague is still bad.basketball where you just out athlete each other.

[7r5ur]

Player development doesn't necessarily mean playing time. They threw a lot at Ausar and now pull back to let him digest it all, know where he struggled to be able to work with PD coaches. Gleague is still bad.basketball where you just out athlete each other.

When you listen to veterans and former players, they almost all say that development does = playing time. Obviously there are ways to improve without playing in games, but not playing in games stunts growth significantly imo.

And it's hard to fathom not finding minutes for a #5 pick when you're 3-29 and desperate for wings. Are there examples of teams in history at the very bottom of the standings not playing their top-5 picks consistent minutes?

Let's be real, the Pistons ARE a g-league team. We've got Livers out there playing big minutes on many nights and he's basically Ausar without the defense at this point. It's one thing for someone like Taylor Hendricks to have difficulty finding minutes on a team with Lauri and John Collins, but we're playing Kevin Knox and Isaiah Livers! This is a very bad sign.

[MrBigShot]

There is zero reason kilian hayes should ever get mins over ausar

[vege]

There is zero reason kilian hayes should ever get mins over ausar

Or any other NBA player, even over Stanley Umude.

[ElectricMayhem]

Just to confirm: The premise is that Ausar Thompson will have no motivation to improve his shooting if he is given starting minutes now? Are we assuming that he has zero motivation to become the best player he can be, help his team win as much as possible, and earn the highest contracts he can? He'd say "Nah, I'm good. I'm starting and that's enough for me."? If we're going this far, let's just force him into a Skinner box until his shooting improves.

[Cowology]

Ausar is in a weird spot. He could go out and get you a dozen hustle points and stuff a stat sheet, but still break your half-court offense. His shot is broke. But you ***HAVE*** to find a way to get him at least 18-22 mpg. It's probably going to warp your lineups a bit as you try and keep shooters on the floor, but the kid is a +plus player and is only going to get better.

After the first few games of the season I thought Ausar was going to lead us in mpg by the All-Star break. Figured we'd just always have him out there vs. the other teams best player.

If we aren't developing players this year, then wtf are we doing?? Sasser, Ivey & Ausar should all be getting more burn than they've seen.

But I'll say it again, we need to find a Lindsey Hunter/Mike Conley type to be a player-coach on the court. Our vets are **** mentors.

[DetroitDon15]

Watching Ausar play he needs to go to the G league. He can't really dribble and can't shoot. His main red flag from scouts were that they didn't think he could score in a half-court offense, and he can't! We shouldn't have drafted him bc he doesn't fit with this team but it is what it is. If we keep Ivey he'd never be able to start at the 3 or 4 unless he's able to shoot 38%+ from 3.

I agree with you here. The Pistons need BB’s shooting in the starting lineup. Duren is not a player with range and Cade isn’t a high end three point shooter. Ansur isn’t a shooter and has looked lost offensively. I think with Duren/BB/Cade (need a 4 & 2 for the sl) and Stewart/Ivey/Sasser leading the bench. We can’t have a defensive player with zero shooting ability on the win. If he was 6’8 and play the four, it might be different. He wasn’t a fit or position of need. Alleged best player available. Another bad Weaver draft pick by Weaver. I’m open to dealing him for a legit improvement at the 4 or even 2.

[bjones521]

Maybe these brothers were just over hyped. Not like Amen is playing either.

[DetroitDon15]

Maybe these brothers were just over hyped. Not like Amen is playing either.

I’m more concerned on this ignite team overall. The next crop of players need a lot of work. They are struggling with shooting (Holland). I’m not sure what to make of it.

[Crymson]

Watching Ausar play he needs to go to the G league. He can't really dribble and can't shoot. His main red flag from scouts were that they didn't think he could score in a half-court offense, and he can't! We shouldn't have drafted him bc he doesn't fit with this team but it is what it is. If we keep Ivey he'd never be able to start at the 3 or 4 unless he's able to shoot 38%+ from 3.

He's extremely raw in the halfcourt, and he should never have been positioned to receive major minutes. Unfortunately, this front office is crewed by fools who have constantly given project players significant rotation roles, and so they punted on using the cap space and fielded a roster with four projects in significant roles.

They've never focused upon fielding a roster that has the basic necessities. Even in Cade's rookie season, they really did not bother in the least bit to position him for success. Nor did they do so this season.

[Canadafan]

There is zero reason kilian hayes should ever get mins over ausar

So very true. At this point our dumb coach needs to unfortunately relegate ol Killa to a towel waver. There is zero reason he can't stagger Ivey and Cade so one of them is always on the court. We lose way too much when they both sit.
I'm beyond happy he finally has started Ivey with Cade even though it appears it was likely forced by our owner.
So now he needs to realize Hayes has zero confidence and Ivey and Cade need be staggered.
Which will in turn open up minutes for Ausur.
Cade 32 Ivey 16
Ivey 16 Burks 16 Ausur 16
Bojan 32 Ausur 16
Knox 32 Stew 16
Duren 32 Stew 16

8man rotation Monty- wake up fool!
Once Morris comes back , then Burks can go take a seat next to Killian on the bench lmao.
And as beautiful as it was to see Knox knocking down so many 3s last game with that beautiful shot of his, let's hope they make a move for someone to take that spot
Let's gooooo
Happy 2024 everyone!

[Patrick27]

Is there a player that "earned" minutes through effort more than Ausar did to start the year before Monty decided to banish him to the bench to watch from the corner as Killian flails around with the ball for his 10-12 minutes per game?

We knew Ausar was not a shooter. If we were going to be this terrible and still not play him, we shouldn't have drafted him. Not finding 20mpg minimum for him is malpractice, especially with guys like Livers playing so terribly and being gifted minutes night after night.

And if you put 2 and 2 together with the things we've heard from Gores and the front office, Ivey never "earned" those minutes from Monty, he was forced to play Ivey because the whole FO was pissed at him about it.

On any given practice day, Ausar should be spending most of it working on his shot. Things like preparing for a specific defensive matchup for his upcoming 36 minutes of defense as a starter isn't as necessary right now as building him up as a good long-term player.

Building the skills that he doesn't have is a long-term move. Spending most of his time prepping for the next day's matchup is a win-now move. We need more of the former, so we can eventually focus on the latter.