I compiled this list a while ago of every player who DID NOT make the 2020 list but DID make at least one prior list.
They are divided into two categories - those who made the NBA's top 50 at 50 or 75 at 75 lists, and the rest. I thought this was a worthwhile distinction to make, given those lists - particulary the 50 at 50 - elevated a lot of those guys in "the story of the NBA", especially for those of us who weren't around when they played.
Within each category, the players are listed in ascending order of their most recent placement, and all of their placements are listed in parenthesis.
NBA 50 at 50/75 at 75 Guys
Nate "Tiny" Archibald(74/2014, 75/2011, 69/2008, 61/2006)
Earl "The Pearl" Monroe(74/2008, 88/2006)
Dave Bing(79/2008, 77/2006)
"Pistol" Pete Maravich(81/2008, 62/2006)
Dave DeBusschere(93/2014, 97/2011, 70/2008, 74/2006)
Jerry Lucas(95/2011, 48/2008, 54/2006)
Lenny Wilkins(96/2008, 84/2006)
Bill Sharman(97/2014, 87/2011, 80/2008, 93/2006)
The Rest
Arvydas Sabonis(43/2006)
Dennis Johnson(63/2008, 58/2006)
Anfernee "Penny" Hardaway(65/2011, 90/2008, 90/2006)
Bernard King(70/2014, 63/2011, 72/2008, 65/2006)
David Thompson(74/2011, 95/2008, 75/2006)
George McGinnis(75/2008, 68/2006)
Mark Price(79/2011)
Chris Webber(83/2017, 86/2014, 76/2011, 68/2008, 60/2006)
Drazen Petrovic(85/2006)
Deron Williams(85/2011)
Elton Brand(87/2017, 79/2014, 86/2011)
Mitch Richmond(88/2014, 89/2006)
Maurice Cheeks(89/2017, 83/2014, 100/2006)
Tim Hardaway(91/2017, 94/2011, 100/2008)
Spencer Haywood(91/2008, 78/2006)
Fat Lever(92/2006)
Chris Mullin(94/2014, 96/2011, 85/2008, 80/2006)
Mookie Blaylock(94/2017)
Chet "The Jet" Walker(95/2017)
Shawn Kemp(95/2014, 82/2011, 91/2006)
Neil Johnston(96/2014, 89/2008)
Vlade Divac(97/2017)
Mark Aguirre(97/2008)
Brad Daugherty(98/2011)
Joe Dumars(98/2014, 91/2011, 45/2008, 57/2006)
Connie Hawkins(99/2017, 80/2011, 77/2008, 71/2006)
Bob Dandridge(99/2011, 99/2008)
Mel Daniels(100/2017, 91/2014, 89/2011, 71/2008, 79/2006)
Marques Johnson(100/2014, 61/2011, 98/2006)
Bill Laimbeer(100/2011)
The purpose of this thread is simply to see if any of these guys who have made lists before still have any champions around here. It's probably not time yet for any of these guys to be discussed in the actual project threads, but seeing as we're about to cross #60 and that if any of these guys were to make it, it would be in the 75+ range, we're not all that far away, so I thought this could be a place to start advocating if anyone wants to.
Some of the guys on this list look like one-time flukes, others may have had an argument in the past but maybe don't anymore with the arrival of more recent players, but I like to think a lot of them are still worth discussing. I'll get it started with some players I felt compelled to write about, if not outright champion.
Keep in mind, championing at this point just means advocating for inclusion in the Top 100, not necessarily for any particular numerical placement.
Bill Sharman
Maybe the guy on the above list I see the least argument against.
To start with, he was one of the most efficient perimeter scorers of his era. In his eleven years in the league, he had an average rTS of +4.2 - including four 5+ and six 4+ seasons - and seven 100+ TS Add seasons. There pretty much wasn't a guard that efficient until West and Oscar came along(unless you count Arizin, who according to bbref was a SF). His season-by-season rTS:
+1.3
+2.7
+7.6
+8.9
+5.3
+5.0
+4.6
+3.6
+1.9
+4.3
+1.5
His efficiency was reasonably resilient in the postseason - as you can see below, his playoff TS only trailed his regular season TS by more than three points twice, and topped his regular season TS five times.
46.5/60.3
52.1/47.2
53.1/54.9
50.8/57.2
50.8/48.6
49.5/46.9
48.5/47.2
47.6/50.5
50.6/47.1
48.4/56.4
There is little data available with regards to it, but Sharman's peers - including his teammate Bob Cousy - considered him to be one of the best guard defenders of the era as well.
I'd also like to briefly point out that Sharman's 3.9rpg in the RS and 3.7rpg in the playoffs for his career, topping out at 4.7rpg in the 1958 RS and 5,4rpg in the 1955 playoffs. Those wouldn't normally be impressive rebounding numbers, but Sharman is listed at 6'1'! For him to even grab that many boards given his size is surely indicative of some combination of tenacity and athleticism.
We obviously don't have much to go by for overall impact in those days, but what we can see is that he posted strong WS/48 consistently in both RS and PO:
.148/.262
.201/.071
.202/.208
.150/.170
.157/.142
.207/.164
.189/.175
.154/,194
.198/.150
.169/.257
In 1953 and 1954, on the pre-Russell Celtics, Sharman was #2 on the team in WS/48 both seasons behind Ed Macauley(and ahead of Bob Cousy). Those teams posted 1.94 SRS/+2.5 Net Rtg(53 wins if we pro-rate to an 82-game season) and 1.97 SRS/+2.5 Net Rtg(47 wins if we pro-rate to an 82 game season). So before Russell even got there, Sharman was one of the most important parts of a decent playoff team.
And here is where his WS/48 ranked within the team for the four championship seasons he was a part of:
1957 - #1 RS, #1 PO
1959 - #4 RS, #2 PO
1960 - #2 RS, #4 PO
1961 - #3 RS, #1 PO
Now I probably shouldn't draw any specific conclusions from that, but broadly speaking it indicates that he was one of the most important players on four championship teams.
To sum up, based on the limited data we have, he was consistently one of the most efficient perimeter scorers in the game in his era, by reputation amongst his peers was a high-level perimeter defender, was a decent-to-good rebounder for his size, was one of the main guys on playoff teams before Russell arrived, played important roles on four championship teams(and another that made the Finals), he had decent longevity(especially for the era, eleven seasons without experiencing any significant decline), and was very durable to boot(in his ten years with the Celtics, he played in 680 out of a possible 723 reguar season games, which is 94%, and after missing two playoff games in his first year in Boston, he never missed any again).
Unless you just don't think guys from the 50s should make the Top 100, I really think he ought to make the list, and am not sure what the case against him is.
Chet Walker
If you asked me who the most underappreciated player of the 60s and 70s was, I'd say it was Walker. He was consistently one of the league's best forwards for 13 years and he just never gets his due. He finally made the Top 100 for the first time in 2017 only to fall out again in 2020.
On the 1967 Sixers - often touted as one of the greatest single-season teams ever - he was the second-highest WS/48 on the team after Wilt in both RS and PO - .181 and .201, respectively - and the second-highest TS Add after Wilt - 180.1 - ahead of Hal Greer and Billy Cunningham, both of whom usually get more credit than Walker.
1966-67: 19.3ppg/8.1rpg/2.3apg, 55.7% TS(+6.4 rTS, 180.1 TS Add), .181 WS/48 RS -> 21.7ppg/7.6rpg/2.1apg, 54.6% TS, .201 WS/48 in 15 playoff games
On the 1969 Sixers, after Wilt was gone, Walker was #1 on the team in WS/48 and TS/Add in the regular season on a team that won 55 games and recorded a 4.79 SRS and +4.2 Net Rtg. That team was upset by the Celtics in the first round of the playoffs, but there's no shame in losing to Russell in one of the great last-gasp runs in the history of sports. Walker's individual playoff performance was still solid...he scored fewer points because he got off fewer FGAs, but his efficiency was still where it normally was.
1968-69: 18.0ppg/7.8rpg/1.8apg, 54.8% TS(+5.7 rTS, 155.0 TS Add), .170 WS/48 RS -> 13.5ppg/5.8rpg/2.0apg, 55.9% TS, .132 WS/48 in 4 playoff games
And then he went to Chicago, in Dick Motta's second year there, and was there for six seasons.
No one remembers those Bulls teams because they had the misfortune of playing in the Western Conference in those years and constantly had the Wilt/West Lakers and Kareem/Oscar Bucks in their way.
But Walker was the best player on those teams.
They made the playoffs for six consecutive seasons, going to the WCF in the last two, and getting within a game of the Finals in the last season.
For all six seasons, Walker was #1 on the team in TS Add by a significant margin. In those six seasons, his TS Add was Top 5 in the league twice and Top 10 in the league five times.
69-70 - 143.2(next on team - Bob Love, 82.8), #9 in league
70-71 - 135.7(next on team - Bob Love, 60.3), #11 in league
71-72 - 231.1(next on team - Jim King, 3.7), #3 in league
72-73 - 128.6(next on team - Clifford Ray, 28.1), #7 in league
73-74 - 174.8(next on team - Clifford Ray, 42.8), #5 in league
74-75 - 168.5(next on team - Matt Guokas, 40.4), #7 in league
For five out of six seasons, Walker was #1 on the team in WS/48(the one season he wasn't, he was .004 below #1). In those six seasons, his WS/48 was Top 3 in the league three times, Top 5 4 times, and Top 10 5 times.
69-70 - .172(#10)
70-71 - .178(#11)
71-72 - .268(#2)
72-73 - .213(#3)
73-74 - .191(#5)
74-75 - .205(#3)
I suppose the knock against Walker is that he looked like a playoff faller a bit too often. I concede that his playoff numbers don't look too good from 70-73, but I also caution that those are smaller sample sizes because (for all but one of those years) the Bulls kept running into a Lakers team that just had their number.
And his playoff numbers do look good in 74 and 75 when they went on longer playoff runs. He was #1 on the team in TS/TS Add, WS/48, and BPM in the playoffs in both years, 74 being when they were swept by Kareem and Oscar in the WCF, and 75 being when they lost to the Warriors in 7 in the WCF:
1973-74: 19.3/5.0/2.4, 56.6% TS(+6.3 rTS, 174.8 TS Add), .191 WS/48, 2.6 BPM RS -> 20.9/5.5/1.6, 59.4% TS, .188 WS/48, 3.6 BPM in 11 playoff games
1974-75: 19.2/5.7/2.2, 56.8% TS(+6.6 rTS, 168.5 TS Add), .205 WS/48, 2.5 BPM RS -> 17.5/4.6/1.8, 57.9% TS, 205 WS/48, 3.4 BPM in 13 playoff games
Between those two years and Walker's performance in the 1967 Sixers run, I think he showed up in the playoffs just enough on top of his regular season excellence to warrant a late spot on the list.
One final note - after Walker retired in 1975, the Bulls' 2.88 SRS/+3.1 Net Rtg from 1974-75 - #3/18 in the league on both counts - cratered to -2.89 SRS/-2.9 Net Rtg in 1975-76 - dead last, #18/18 in the league, on both counts. It's true that Jerry Sloan also suffered a knee injury that limited him to just 22 games that season and ended his career, and given that Sloan's WOWY record for that season looks like this:
With Sloan: 8-14(.364)
Without Sloan: 16-44(.266)
that was certainly probaby part of it, but I'm leaning toward the loss of Walker being the primary factor in the drop-off, and I think it's a notable impact signal.
Chris Mullin
I might be biased because he's a guy I grew up watching and I just love his game, but I think prime Mullin is one of the most underappreciated scorers of his era. He wasn't just a shooter, either - at 6'7'/215lbs, he had legit size, he could put the ball on the floor a little, and he was surprisingly crafty/adept at finishing around the rim. He made the Top 100 four times before missing the last two, so I don't think it's too out there to say that I think he deserves to make it back in.
I understand what the arguments against him could/will be - that he lacks longevity as an elite player, that he often didn't seem to lift his team's floor enough, that he didn't have enough playoff success, but I think the argument is there, and I may have gone overboard in articulating it here.
The Five-Year Prime
After having issues with alcohol early in his career, Mullin got sober in 1988, and from 1988-89 until a torn right thumb ligament in February 1993 kicked off a string of injuries and effectively ended his prime, Mullin had a five season run(he played over half the games in 92-93) in which he scored at least 25ppg on at least +4 rTS in each season(the exact rTS are +4.4, +10.6, +8.4, +5.5, and +4.2). I haven't been able to do a comprehensive search, but it seems that not that many players have accomplished that feat, and most of the ones that have have either already been inducted on the 2023 list or were inducted on prior lists.
In 1989, he led the Warriors in WS/48(.165), BPM(4.0), and TS Add(164.0, #12 in the league).
In 1990, he led the Warriors in WS/48(.174), BPM(5.0), and TS Add(322.7, #4 in the league).
In 1991, he led the Warriors in WS/48(.176), BPM(4.7), and TS Add(285.6, #4 in the league).
In 1992, he led the Warriors in WS/48(.155), BPM(3.7), and TS Add(194.2, #7 in the league)
In 1993, when he played 46 games, he slipped a bit - #3 in WS/48(among those who played significant minutes, .122), #2 in BPM(3.3), #1 in TS Add(86.8).
And remember he was playing with Tim Hardaway for four of those seasons and Mitch Richmond for three. It's a very, very good five-year peak. Run TMC is a team remembered for its novelty, and Mullin was their best player, imo(I think Mullin has a better case than Richmond for the Top 100 and probably an equal case with Hardaway, though I'm not as high on Hardaway as others might be).
In addition to the scoring, he also recorded 5+ RPG and 3+ APG in those seasons, and seems to have a reputation as having been a solid man defender, and at the very least box stuff(steals/blocks) supports that.
Playoffs During Prime
Now, the question is the playoffs for those five seasons. I do think the extent to which Mullin might be a playoff faller is overstated. He delivered some great playoff performances during his prime.
1989
WCQF vs Jazz: 32.7ppg/5rpg/5apg/2.0spg on 62.6% TS
Leads the #7 seeded Warriors to an upset 3-0 sweep of the #2 seed, 4.01 SRS/+5.1 Net Rtg Malone/Stockton Jazz
WCSF vs Suns: 27.4ppg/6.4rpg/4.2apg/1.6spg on 60.0% TS
Warriors fall in 5, no shame in losing to that 6.84 SRS 55-win Suns team
1990
The Warriors missed the playoffs by four games, despite it being the first year of Run TMC. Everyone was healthy, so I'm not entirely sure what happened here, besides a glaring lack of rebounding. It seems difficult to blame Mullin for it though, when he put up 25.1ppg/5.9rpg/4.1apg/1.6spg on +10.6 rTS and, as I said before, leading the team in WS/48, BPM, and TS Add.
1991
WCQF vs Spurs: 25.3ppg/7.3rpg/3.5apg/1.8spg/1.3bpg on 62.6% TS
Leads the #7 seeded Warriors to a 3-1 upset over the #2 seed, 4.30 SRS/+4.5 Net Rtg D-Rob Spurs
WCSF vs Lakers: 22.3ppg/7.3rpg/2.3apg/2.0spg/1.8bpg on 61.5% TS
Warriors fall in 5 to Magic and the Finals-bound Lakers, even less shame in losing to them than the 1989 Suns.
(A side note: The Warriors were so deficient on the boards that Mullin's 7.3rpg led the team in the playoffs.)
1992
WCQF vs Sonics: 17.8ppg/3.0rpg/3.0apg/1.3spg on 51.3% TS
A poorer showing vs the Sonics, to be sure, in a 3-1 defeat.
1993
The Warriors missed the playoffs after Mullin only played 46 games.
1994
WCQF vs Suns: 25.3ppg/4.7rpg/3.7apg/1.7bpg on 68.1% TS
After missing the end of 92-93 and the beginning 93-94, Mullin helps Sprewell and Webber to 50 wins and, in his last playoff hurrah as a star, has a big series vs the #3 seeded Barkley Suns that were coming off a Finals appearance. His stellar performance wasn't enough to prevent a sweep.
So Mullin played in 24 playoff games between 1989 and 1994 and, while the team had limited success, he was putting up superstar box statlines for the bulk of it, and in fact led them to two playoff upsets vs fellow Dream Teamers Malone/Stockton and Robinson and also put up a monster statline against fellow dream teamer Barkley in a series loss. It's not as much as you might like to see, but it is something.
There is the question of why the Warriors were always playing from a lower seed, why wasn't their floor being raised higher, but as I alluded to before, I don't think it's fair to pin it on Mullin when the roster the front office constructed had such glaring rebounding and defensive deficiencies and also when they're making questionable trades like Richmond for Owens after the 91 playoffs.
Injury Plagued Years
So anyway, 1993-1996 was an injury-plagued time for Mullin, and the team missed the playoffs three out of four of those seasons, but here are the WOWY breakdowns for those seasons:
92-93(torn right thumb ligament)
20-26(.435) with
14-22(.389) without
93-94(torn ligament in fifth finger on right hand)
39-23(.629) with
11-9(.550) without
Also worth noting that Mullin had a +2.1 on/off in 93-94(via Pollack), which took a dive in 95 and 96(due to his further injuries and the fact that the team just got bad after Webber was traded).
94-95(chip fracture/sprained ligament left knee/sprained left hamstring, and then bruised left ankle)
8-17(.320) with
18-39(.316) without
95-96
24-31(.436) with
12-15(.444) without
I haven't done a deep dive into who else might've been in/out at various times that could've effected the outcomes(other than knowing Hardaway missed all of 93-94), but on the surface it looks like they were marginally better with him as he declined, with that margin shrinking as time went on and his injuries took their toll(also as the team around him got worse).
Last Year With The Warriors
Mullins last season with the Warriors - 1996-97 - was his healthiest season since 1991-92, and signaled the beginning of a late stretch of his career in which he'd re-invent himself as a role player.
He recorded 14.5ppg/4.0rpg/4.1apg/1.6spg, but even though Sprewell and Joe Smith scored on more volume, Mullin was much more efficient and ended up leading the team in TS Add(194.2), WS/48(.124), and BPM(2.8), and shot 41.1% 3P. This may not be saying much, because that Warriors team simply wasn't good, but it does show that Mullin was still a positive contributor at the point despite the diminished role.
Pacers Years
Mullin was dealt to the Pacers in the summer of 1997.
In his first season there - 1997-98 - he played and started all 82 games. Because he was in a smaller role, playing only 26.5mpg, and taking far fewer FGAs than in his prime, his counting stats took a hit - 11.3ppg/3.0rpg/2.3apg/1.2spg - but he shot 44% from 3 and was still #2 on the team - behind Reggie Miller - in TS Add(126.8), WS/48(.168), and BPM(4.3), and #4 on the team in points per 100 possessions(23.3) with a +7.8 on/off on a 6.25 SRS 58-win team.
In the playoffs, he looked like an elite role player for the first two rounds before having a poor shooting series vs the Bulls.
ECQF vs Cavs: 10.5ppg/4.0rpg/1.0apg/1.0spg/1.8bpg on 76.9% TS in 3-1 win
ECSF vs Knicks: 11.0ppg/3.4rpg/2.4apg/1.8spg on 56.7% TS in 4-1 win
ECF vs Bulls: 6.4ppg/3.4rpg/1.0apg on 48.5% TS in 3-4 loss
He had a 3.3 BPM and a -3.3 on/off(looks like that Bulls series really hurt him on that front - credit to Scottie I guess) for the playoffs.
In the lockout-shortened 1999 season, Mullin played and started all 50 games. He put up 10.1ppg/3.2rpg/1.6apg and shot 46.5% from 3 while leading the team in BPM(4.5), and being #2 behind Reggie in TS Add(86.1) and WS/48(.167) with a +5.6 on/off on a 3.86 SRS team that was in a three-way tie for the league's fourth best record.
Similar to 1998, he looked like a very good player in the 1999 playoffs.
ECQF vs Bucks: 11.3ppg/1.3rpg on 63.2% TS in 3-0 sweep
ECSF vs 7ers: 10.0ppg/1.3rpg/1.3apg/1.3spg on 54.8% TS in 4-0 sweep
ECF vs Knicks: 8.3ppg/1.8rpg/1.3apg on 53.5% TS in 2-4 loss
He had a 1.6 BPM and a +2.5 on/off for the playoffs.
He was replaced in the starting lineup with Jalen Rose for 1999-00 and played much less, and hardly at all in their run to the finals(10mpg), and his counting stats are pretty small, but his advanced box stats and on/off speak well of his impact in limited minutes.
.142 WS/48, 3.4 BPM, 59% TS(+6.7 rTS and 40.9% 3P), +2.6 on/off in 12.4mpg in 47 games
.148 WS/48, 3.6 BPM, 60% TS, +5.6 on/off in 10.0mpg in 9 playoff games
He played one more best-forgotten year with the Warriors after that, and that was it.
Conclusion
Mullin had a five-year prime where he was one of the league's elite scorers(again - five consecutive seasons of 25+ppg and 4+ rTS) and solid rebounder to boot, and he put up some superstar playoff performances upsetting higher-seeded teams, even if his own team never got past the second round.
After a string of injury-plagued seasons, he became a high-level role player for the late 90s Pacers. I do think this adds real value to his career, especially in light of certain other players who maybe don't accept a lesser role as gracefully in their later years.
There are reasons to argue against him, but there are players that made the last Top 100 that, like Mullin, are primarily known as volume scorers, but did so much less efficiently while not having much more in the way of playoff success - I'm thinking of Carmelo Anthony here, as well as Dominique. Those two had one 100+ TS Add season each, while Mullin has six(and it would've been seven if he hadn't gotten hurt in 92-93). Like Mullin, Dominique never got past the second round as an alpha, and Melo only did it once in a season where Chauncey Billups was arguably the better player. Melo and Dominique have alpha longevity over Mullin, but the efficiency gap is pretty big.
As a final note - Mullin was on The Dream Team, and there have always been people that say it should've been Dominique(even though he wouldn't have been able to play anyway due to his achilles injury), but I firmly believe it was the right choice, both because of the fit(Mullin could play off-ball and the team needed that release valve guy) and because Mullin was dramatically more efficient in 1990-91 when the selections were being made.
I really think Mullin deserves a spot, and if he doesn't get in, he'd be the only Dream Teamer other than Laettner to miss the cut.
Chris Webber
I'm thinking C-Webb, if and when he gets into the nomination discussion, could be one of the more polarizing and contentious figures in the project. The 2020 Top 100 was the first Top 100 on this board that Webber didn't make, so there has been enough support for him in the past. On the other hand, I know from experience that some of the people who wouldn't support him for the list really don't care for him.
I was pretty bullish for him when I started looking, and I still think there's an argument, but by the end of my research, I was less bullish. I'll just lay out both sides.
The argument FOR:
One of the criticisms often leveled about Webber is that he is overrated as a volume scorer because his efficiency leaves something to be desired. I don't dispute this, but I will say that while his efficiency leaves something to be desired, it's not terrible. In his prime years, it was usually hovering at either just above or just below league average. But the crux of my argument is that he did a bunch of other things besides scoring.
He always had the reputation of being one of the best passing big men in the game, and the numbers bare that out. These are his league ranks in assists per 100 possessions among PFs and Cs:
1994 - #7
1995 - #1
1996 - #2
1997 - #4
1998 - #6(4-way tie)
1999 - #8
2000 - #2
2001 - #4
2002 - #2
2003 - #3
2004 - #6 in 23 games
2005 - #3
2006 - #11(tie)
2007 - #4
2008 - #1 in 9 games
I would also posit that, while he was never an elite defender or anything, he was a solid, underrated defender pre-knee-injury based on D-RAPM(that wasn't the case after the injury except for the small sample size of 03-04):
97: 1.62
98: 2.04
99: 2.00
00: 0.23
01: 2.40
02: 1.66
03: 1.60
04: 1.36
He was also a consistently good, though not necessarily great, rebounder, posting 11+ RPG twice, 10+ RPG six times, and 9+ RPG twelve times in his career.
So he was scoring at high volume on what would charitably be described as league average-ish efficiency, while also providing good production as a playmaker, defender, and rebounder. He was a very, very good all around basketball player, and there are lot of people that fully believe he would've been the #1 on a championship team were it not for some shady officiating in 2002.
The argument AGAINST
So it isn't hard to predict the arguments against, and the thing that tempered my enthusiasm wasn't his (lack of) efficiency, or his anti-clutch reputation. It was the following.
2001-02(Webber played 54 games)
43-11(.796) with
18-10 (.643) without
2002-03(Webber played 67 games)
49-18(.731) with
10-5(.667) without
2003-04(Webber played 23 games)
11-12(.478) with
44-15(.746) without
So while the Kings were better with him in both 02 and 03, they were still plenty good without him, and the without sample in 2002 isn't insignificant either.
Further, when Webber missed most of 03-04, they didn't seem to miss a beat. They did go from 6.68 SRS/+6.8 Net Rtg to 5.41 SRS/+5.4 Net Rtg, but you would've expected Webber's absence to hurt more.
And who did they replace his production with? They traded bench depth in Hedo Turkoglu and Scot Pollard for Brad Miller, who in 2003-04, recorded the following: 14.1ppg/10.3rpg/4.3apg on +6.3 rTS, 2.48 RAPM.
Anyone who is down on Webber would pose the question - if he can apparently be so easily replaced with Brad Miller, is he really a Top 100 guy?
The counter might be - because they were a stacked and unselfish team with a deep bench(i.e. pieces they could move for another starter) and a HOF coach, they were uniquely set up to absorb the loss of a star player. But that's admittedly the view of someone who wants to see it in the best light.
Add the fact that in the five years they played together before Webber's injury, Vlade Divac had a higher RAPM four times(5.83 vs 3.38 1999, 5.85 vs 1.85 2000, 3.49 vs 2.83 2002, 3.49 vs 2.63 2003), and that Doug Christie and Scot Pollard both had higher RAPMs than Webber in 2002-03(3.79 and 3.26 vs 2.63), it doesn't paint the most flattering impact portrait in the world.
(Though to be fair, as a counter, his on/off is solid if a bit inconsistant in the playoffs. From 1996-97 until 2002-03(the year he was injured), he had a positive on/off every regular season but one. In the playoffs, he had crazy highs - +31.6 in 2001, +23.3 in 1997 with the Bullets - and crazy lows - -22.6 in 1999. Less extremely, he had a +10.9 in 2003 and +0.1 in 2000, as well as a -1.9 in 2002.)
Still, I think you can argue for Webber over some of the guys that made the back end of the 2020 list.
Connie Hawkins
So, I don't feel too strongly about Connie Hawkins either way, but I know there are some here that do, and I do feel like he should be discussed at least. His is one of the more unfair stories in the league's history, having been blackballed from the NBA for something he didn't do and thus not getting to play for what would've been a number of his prime years. And then on the other end, injuries cut his prime short.
And so it's the Bill Walton question - are one or two transcendent years enough on their own to earn a spot?
The question is even tougher here than with Walton because Walton's incredible and brief peak came in the NBA, whereas Hawkins' came not just in the ABA, but the early ABA - in fact, the first two years of the ABA.
Is
26.8ppg/13.5rpg/4.6apg, 59.7% TS(+11.4 rTS), .273 WS/48 in 44.9mpg RS
and
29.9ppg/12.3rpg/4.6apg, 65.1% TS, .310 WS/48 in 44mpg in the playoffs vs the Pacers(Roger Brown/Freddie Lewis/Bob Netolicky), Minnesota Muskies(Mel Daniels/Les Hunter), and New Orleans Buccaneers(Doug Moe/Jimmy Jones/Red Robbins)
enough?
I don't have an answer, but it's worth discussing.
Tiny Archibald
Tiny is a tough question for me. There's no question he had 2-3 impressive statistical seasons with the Royals/Kings. But in six years, they made the playoffs once, lost their lone playoff series, and Tiny shot poorly in that series - 20.2ppg/5.3apg on 44.2% TS, over ten percent lower than his RS TS of 54.4%.
I do understand that his rosters were fairly lousy, so perhaps this is just a case of Tiny being of one of the league's first cases of 'great player stuck on a bad team'.
TBH though, I'm not sure that I'd see any argument at all if it weren't for the added value of his Boston years, 1980 and 1981 in particular, and his contributions to that 1981 championship - he was a full-time starter playing 35+mpg, and he put up 13.8ppg/7.7apg on +4.8 rTS in the regular season(and similar numbers in the playoffs, though less efficiently).
Jerry Lucas
I don't anticipate Lucas having much Top 100 support here. He was never an alpha, but he was an efficient scorer and an elite rebounder, with good durability, reasonable longevity, and high intelligence. He just never had much in the way of playoff success until he won a ring with the Knicks as a role player near the end of his career, and 1960s pace inflation might make his box numbers look bigger than they were. I don't know that I feel too strongly about him, but I can see the argument.
Shawn Kemp
I'm honestly pretty high on Kemp's prime - say 1992-1997 - relatively speaking. He was a legit two-way force, an efficient scorer, explosive finisher, good defender, good rebounder, freak athlete. The 1994 and 1995 playoff collapses hurt, but his individual numbers in the 1995 playoffs - 24.8ppg/12.0rpg/2.8apg/2.0spg/1.8bpg on 66.7% TS, .260 WS/48, 7.4 BPM over four games - look very good(not so much in 1994). The knock on Kemp has always been the way he declined, the perception that he just stopped giving a crap, even if there may have been a legitimate drug addiction involved.
I could be swayed either way, but I do think highly of prime Kemp as a guy who who was a 1A or 1B(depending on your view) on a Finals team and had seven consecutive years of positive TS Add, four consecutive years of 100+ TS Add, and was at least one of the defensive anchors during a five-year run from 92-93 to 96-97 in which the Sonics had rel DRtgs of -3.1, -4.8, -2.0, -5.5, and -4.0 before dropping to -1.4 their first year without Kemp(97-98) and then not having an above league-average defense for the remainder of their time in Seattle. In five seasons from 92-93 to 96-97, he averaged 18.6ppg/10.8rpg/2.1apg/1.4spg/1.6bpg on +5.6 rTS while being imo a big factor in the aforementioned team defenses. If that prime had lasted ten seasons instead of five, I don't think it would even be a discussion whether or not he should be in the Top 100.
Bernard King
Sort of similar to to Mullin in that both had five-year primes in which they were elite volume scorers. Some are very high on King, and I can see the argument, but for me, Mullin's post-prime holds more value than King's, having contributed so positively for those Pacers teams. King made a remarkable comeback from his ACL injury at a time when that didn't happen, and scored on high volume again with the Bullets, but his efficiency was way down and those Bullets teams didn't make the playoffs for three out of the four years he was there.
Who wouldn't make the list, then?
If I'm going to argue for players who didn't make the list last time, then I feel it's only fair to think about who would have to get the boot to make room. I won't go into too much detail yet, or make any definitive "he shouldn't get in" statements, but some broad thoughts...
I mentioned Melo and Dominique before as volume scorers who aren't especially efficient and who don't have a lot of team success in the playoffs. It's hard to imagine Dominique not getting in(he's never not made it), but I do think at the very least Sharman impacted winning basketball more(just one stat, but Sharman has a career .178 WS/48 RS and .174 WS/48 PO, as compared to .148 and .079 for Dominique and .120 and .089 for Melo), and the numbers show Mullin as a much more efficient scorer too.
Horace Grant certainly has his merits, but I have to squint to see the argument for him over Sharman and even Walker did more as a #1 on those 70s Bulls teams than Horace ever did(obviously, he was never asked to be a #1 or even #2), and that pains me to say because as a lifelong Bulls fan, Horace is one of my guys, man, I love him. I'm not even sure he should go over Webber, and while longevity is an issue, peak Kemp over peak Grant seems pretty easy.
Guys like Jeff Hornacek and Terry Porter have good numbers and longevity, but in their time they were seen as supporting players, and it's worth questioning if they should get in over alphas(in their prime) like Kemp or Mullin or a guy like Sharman who objectively won more.
Dame got in last time - keeping with my caution with regards to inducting active players, has he done enough to go over some of these guys?
Just a few examples of guys you could argue against, but I'll stop now, because this post is already too long.
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