2023-24 NY Knicks trade ideas

[Jalen Bluntson]

I dunno. I like Murray alot.
I see the warts, but everything is about cost. How many picks will it cost? Which picks? Do they need Grimes too?

If you can get him for Fournier, Mavs 2024 and Knicks 2025, it's interesting because a) we will still have a significant amount of draft capital and b) Murray can be continuous soup and used in the next deal.

That's a fair position. If that's all it cost, then it becomes a much more defensible gamble.

But the reports have included Grimes and an unprotected future FRP or two, which would prevent us from being able to afford an MVP caliber dude if one became available until that pick debt was paid off. And at that price, we can't be gambling.

We have something like 8 tradeable firsts for the next 3-4 years. You can get Murray even at a bit of a higher cost (including Grimes and/or one more additional pick) then that and still have enough for a bigger fish later. Especially if Randle and/or Murray 2- 20+ pt scorers with sub 30M AAV deals were to be included.

We have to trade or use this years FRP. So that's an unprotected first and we have the DAL pick which will most likely convey this year. Add Grimes and Deuce/Evan and that's a harmless asset package for a quality upgrade like Murray. He's definitely better than Deuce/Grimes combined output on offense and would be a decent consolidation trade because he can play both positions.

No star will become available before those picks are used. We get a decent trade chip in Murray for a future star trade when our own pick is replenished. Also keeps us from playing Brunson 40mpg

It's not a bad idea but, whatever.

[8516knicks]

That's a fair position. If that's all it cost, then it becomes a much more defensible gamble.

But the reports have included Grimes and an unprotected future FRP or two, which would prevent us from being able to afford an MVP caliber dude if one became available until that pick debt was paid off. And at that price, we can't be gambling.

We have something like 8 tradeable firsts for the next 3-4 years. You can get Murray even at a bit of a higher cost (including Grimes and/or one more additional pick) then that and still have enough for a bigger fish later. Especially if Randle and/or Murray 2- 20+ pt scorers with sub 30M AAV deals were to be included.

We have to trade or use this years FRP. So that's an unprotected first and we have the DAL pick which will most likely convey this year. Add Grimes and Deuce/Evan and that's a harmless asset package for a quality upgrade like Murray. He's definitely better than Deuce/Grimes combined output on offense and would be a decent consolidation trade because he can play both positions.

No star will become available before those picks are used. We get a decent trade chip in Murray for a future star trade when our own pick is replenished. Also keeps us from playing Brunson 40mpg

It's not a bad idea but, whatever.

I'm tempted to go for Murray since we can sunload him later on if he doesn't work out for us. However I want to keep at least ONE of our two anticipated FRPs.

We need a bench microwave guy, a bench rim protector and we're good for the playoffs this year. Murray might elevate us some but still need someone to at least fake what Medical Mitch does.

[KnixinSix]

Woj just said a trade for a player with a big contract a team may like but have to move on from so they can get ahead of the new apron.

As we've been hinting at the past few weeks, That sounds like KAT. They like him bc they are winning right now but that contract is an absolute monster considering both Goebert and Edwards are right at 40M themselves and then Jaden Daniels adding a long 23 ish M AAV deal to that.

KAT at 36 now but it jumps to 52/56/60 and the 64 the 4 years after that.....

Knicks salary cap shape is one of the few teams looking to buy which has enough space to absorb that hit.

[Knicksfan1992]

As much as I loved Dunn coming out in his draft, his career just sadly never panned out like I thought it would. While the bump in shooting is good to see and I'm happy that he seems to have carved out a role for himself, the Knicks should not be giving up assets for a guy who was on the scrap heap less than 12 months ago. I think if you're targeting Dunn, then you're better off putting faith in McBride or Flynn for a month and seeing what they can do rather than get a backup guy who can just as easily regress to the mean. If you're desperate at the deadline you can always make an 11th hour deal for a guy like Dunn for a 2nd or two anyway.

The Knicks, at this point, don't need to take flyers on anyone unless it's a smaller part of a deal (ie. Achiuwa as part of the Anunoby deal). If they want to upgrade the backup pg spot, then they need to get a real guy there. The tricky part is what are you willing to give up to get what essentially amounts to a rental upgrade?

To me, future draft capital and prime young assets (Like Mitch or Grimes) should be off limits for something like that. If you want to do a deal like the Cam deal for Hart last year that would seemingly work here since the Knicks would almost surely not actually make 2 first round selections this year. The problem with that kind of deal is that it takes a couple things off the table for them in the offseason.

-They would lose a current first to trade at draft time if a certain star shakes loose
-They also lose some ability to make a "punt the picks down the line" trade if you give up on your 1st now. Although, in theory, they could punt on the 1st round of the draft for a 3rd year in a row but, I don't think they want to do that considering they are soon going to need all the cost controlled they can get IMO.

Given those constraints there are still some good targets out there that might be varying degrees of gettable IMO. Some of them might even be able to play with Brunson in certain matchups.

-Tyus and Tre Jones
-Brogdon
-Schroder
-Caruso
-Clarkson
-Smart
-D'Lo
-Fultz
-Ivey
-Sexton
-Rozier
-DSJ
-Dosunmo

There's some good options out there but, it's about finding the right fit for the right price. I still think they are going to give Deuce and Flynn every chance to prove they can play those minutes because allocating a chunk of cap space to a backup guard going forward is probably something they don't want to do. They basically told us that when they traded away IQ

[Knicksfan1992]

Woj just said a trade for a player with a big contract a team may like but have to move on from so they can get ahead of the new apron.

This is why when people said Randle is a negative asset I always called BS. A fringe All-NBA caliber guy making less than 30 mill per is a steal given the new CBA restrictions.

The only downside to Randle is that he's a bit of an awkward fit in some roster constructions because he can't really play C or SF, but other than that and the bad playoff resume his positives outweigh his negatives especially for teams who are near the luxury tax line IMO

-He's durable
-He's on a very manageable deal
-Can soak up a ton of usage mostly efficiently and gives you a chance to win every night even if your star player is out because he can put up star numbers
-In his prime years

[cgf]

From the Murray Returns to San Antonio thread

Spurs Fan

The idea that ATL should move on from Trae gets thrown around a lot on here. His defenders often suggest that his defense has improved and that Murray hasn't lived up to his reputation on that end. Yet in here, people are citing Murray's strong defense as a reason he's more valuable than KJ. Not overly familiar with it, so just trying to gauge where exactly he stands on that end...

Murray's not a good defender. No one's going to fool the Spurs into rating him as a good defender. Keldon is at the point where people finally understand there are reasons to be critical of him but are going a bit overboard. Keldon is the most versatile scorer on the team besides Wemby who's currently inconsistent. Johnson is the only guy who can consistently get into the paint and finish. He shoots 66 percent inside the circle, as opposed to Murray's 53 percent.

DeJounte is more of a point guard. But we're still talking about someone who passes more as an afterthought than a real play-maker. DJM averages 5.4 assists per 36 compared to Keldon's 4.4. But someone like Tre Jones averages 7.6 despite he and DJM turning the ball over at the same rate (2.2 per 36). So if the point of this is to get the Spurs a guy who can pass the ball, they already have at least one player who's good at that and isn't getting enough minutes.

The only thing I think Murray would instantly improve on the team is the rebounding. If he could get back to his old ways, he and Wemby should be a terror on there. Issue is that Johnson is also a good rebounder for his size and position and has been outrebounding DeJounte by quite a lot this year (6.9 per 36 to 4.8), so I don't know if that's an instant win.

I have full confidence that Murray on this Spurs team would be an awful defender. Everything he does wrong on defense would be magnified on a team where basically no one plays sound D. Johnson's not a good defender, but he's playing below his limitations right now. I think he'd be fine on another team with a good defensive culture.

Hawks fan

I don’t think Murray’s lived up to the reputation on that end but I think he’s clearly better defensively than Keldon. Also it’s more than defense, dejounte is more impactful not to mention the price hawks gave to get him. No one would trade unprotected picks for Keldon. Agree Spurs probably don’t want Dejounte back either.

[Jalen Bluntson]

We have something like 8 tradeable firsts for the next 3-4 years. You can get Murray even at a bit of a higher cost (including Grimes and/or one more additional pick) then that and still have enough for a bigger fish later. Especially if Randle and/or Murray 2- 20+ pt scorers with sub 30M AAV deals were to be included.

We have to trade or use this years FRP. So that's an unprotected first and we have the DAL pick which will most likely convey this year. Add Grimes and Deuce/Evan and that's a harmless asset package for a quality upgrade like Murray. He's definitely better than Deuce/Grimes combined output on offense and would be a decent consolidation trade because he can play both positions.

No star will become available before those picks are used. We get a decent trade chip in Murray for a future star trade when our own pick is replenished. Also keeps us from playing Brunson 40mpg

It's not a bad idea but, whatever.

I'm tempted to go for Murray since we can sunload him later on if he doesn't work out for us. However I want to keep at least ONE of our two anticipated FRPs.

We need a bench microwave guy, a bench rim protector and we're good for the playoffs this year. Murray might elevate us some but still need someone to at least fake what Medical Mitch does.

Agreed that we need a backup big more than anything. Deuce/Grimes may be able to help but, we have nothing behind Randle/iHart. There was a Sexton/Olynyk trade idea that I like too but, is Sexton at 19mil two more years a good enough piece in a star trade?

Whatever we do, we have draft capital we have to use for something this year. So add Evan salary and whatever else and we can fix our bench situation this year without killing the future asset pile.

[RHODEY]

IDK about that. WE just extended McBride meaning we have expectations for him to jump into a role. Brunson, McBride, DDV and Murray is A LOT of little guards.

I think Bridges is realistic. Murray would be a good fit in BKN or even CLE in a bigger deal. It all begs the question though of what would ATL be looking for other than cap space and picks. Fournier + 2 picks (say NY 24, MIL '25) and even DET/WAS thrown in if need be to ATL, Murray + NY '26, Dal '24 to BKN and Bridges to NY.


That's all a stretch, but Bridges and/or a center should be our targets.

Would love Bridges...but why would the Nets help us?
BTW.... Murray isnt small..dude is 6'5" with a 6'10" wingspan.

I suppose that would be the million dollar question. But you can bet that behind the scenes Bridges wants to play in NY with his friends. Murray is bigger than I though - he looks smaller on the court. Maybe that could be part of it? Murray to replace Bridges in BKN?

I think Grimes is also listed as 6'5'', but for some reason he just looks like he is 6'6" to me where as Murray looks more 6'4"

To me its the opposite, I think Murray looks taller..because he is in fact longer. 6'10" wingspan versus 6'8" wingspan.

[spree2kawhi]

Woj just said a trade for a player with a big contract a team may like but have to move on from so they can get ahead of the new apron.

This is why when people said Randle is a negative asset I always called BS. A fringe All-NBA caliber guy making less than 30 mill per is a steal given the new CBA restrictions.

The only downside to Randle is that he's a bit of an awkward fit in some roster constructions because he can't really play C or SF, but other than that and the bad playoff resume his positives outweigh his negatives especially for teams who are near the luxury tax line IMO

-He's durable
-He's on a very manageable deal
-Can soak up a ton of usage mostly efficiently and gives you a chance to win every night even if your star player is out because he can put up star numbers
-In his prime years

He overdribbles and has a knack for the stupid.

In the Minnesota game, final minute, he lost the ball dribbling into trouble near the sideline. Easy to forget because the play was bailed out and he had a really good game regardless. He had plenty more of these stupid plays against Minnesota. Towns, unlikable as his style is, was a killer down the stretch. Randle looked good against KAT, but Towns has such a good shot. I’d trade for him in a heartbeat.

[8516knicks]

Woj just said a trade for a player with a big contract a team may like but have to move on from so they can get ahead of the new apron.

As we've been hinting at the past few weeks, That sounds like KAT. They like him bc they are winning right now but that contract is an absolute monster considering both Goebert and Edwards are right at 40M themselves and then Jaden Daniels adding a long 23 ish M AAV deal to that.

KAT at 36 now but it jumps to 52/56/60 and the 64 the 4 years after that.....

Knicks salary cap shape is one of the few teams looking to buy which has enough space to absorb that hit.

KAT should buy his own team. Team Catfish.

[8516knicks]

Woj just said a trade for a player with a big contract a team may like but have to move on from so they can get ahead of the new apron.

This is why when people said Randle is a negative asset I always called BS. A fringe All-NBA caliber guy making less than 30 mill per is a steal given the new CBA restrictions.

The only downside to Randle is that he's a bit of an awkward fit in some roster constructions because he can't really play C or SF, but other than that and the bad playoff resume his positives outweigh his negatives especially for teams who are near the luxury tax line IMO

-He's durable
-He's on a very manageable deal
-Can soak up a ton of usage mostly efficiently and gives you a chance to win every night even if your star player is out because he can put up star numbers
-In his prime years

He overdribbles and has a knack for the stupid.

In the Minnesota game, final minute, he lost the ball dribbling into trouble near the sideline. Easy to forget because the play was bailed out and he had a really good game regardless. He had plenty more of these stupid plays against Minnesota. Towns, unlikable as his style is, was a killer down the stretch. Randle looked good against KAT, but Towns has such a good shot. I’d trade for him in a heartbeat.

Nope. KAT is kryptonite to his own team). Randle may play stupid but comes up big more often. Who won yesterday. Not Kat's team.

[KnixinSix]

Woj just said a trade for a player with a big contract a team may like but have to move on from so they can get ahead of the new apron.

This is why when people said Randle is a negative asset I always called BS. A fringe All-NBA caliber guy making less than 30 mill per is a steal given the new CBA restrictions.

The only downside to Randle is that he's a bit of an awkward fit in some roster constructions because he can't really play C or SF, but other than that and the bad playoff resume his positives outweigh his negatives especially for teams who are near the luxury tax line IMO

-He's durable
-He's on a very manageable deal
-Can soak up a ton of usage mostly efficiently and gives you a chance to win every night even if your star player is out because he can put up star numbers
-In his prime years

He overdribbles and has a knack for the stupid.

In the Minnesota game, final minute, he lost the ball dribbling into trouble near the sideline. Easy to forget because the play was bailed out and he had a really good game regardless. He had plenty more of these stupid plays against Minnesota. Towns, unlikable as his style is, was a killer down the stretch. Randle looked good against KAT, but Towns has such a good shot. I’d trade for him in a heartbeat.

KAT at 36 now but it jumps to 52/56/60 and the 64 the 4 years after that.....he is quite possibly the guy Woj is hinting at that a team likes but needs to move on from for salary cap purposes.....

Knicks salary cap shape is one of the few teams looking to buy which has enough space to absorb that hit.

NOT saying I would do this but Randle left CAA and KAT is CAA , a local boy, a much better personality and has been long linked to Leon Rose and us in rumors.....

Would it be something like.....

KAT (36M) and Naz Reid (12M) for Robinson (15M), Randle (28M) , Flynn (3.8M)

Murray (23M) for Fournier (18M) + Precious (4.4M)+ 2FRPs


Rotation (Minutes):

C I-Hart (23), KAT (13), Naz Reid (12)
PF KAT (21),Reid (17),OG (10)
SF OG (23), Hart(20), Precious (5)
SG Murray (18), DDV (20), Hart (10)
PG Brunson (34), Murray (12), DDV (2)

[nykballa2k4]

Would love Bridges...but why would the Nets help us?
BTW.... Murray isnt small..dude is 6'5" with a 6'10" wingspan.

I suppose that would be the million dollar question. But you can bet that behind the scenes Bridges wants to play in NY with his friends. Murray is bigger than I though - he looks smaller on the court. Maybe that could be part of it? Murray to replace Bridges in BKN?

I think Grimes is also listed as 6'5'', but for some reason he just looks like he is 6'6" to me where as Murray looks more 6'4"

To me its the opposite, I think Murray looks taller..because he is in fact longer. 6'10" wingspan versus 6'8" wingspan.

I mean, when I've seen them play, I've felt Grimes looked like a thinner Butler whereas Murray always looked like a combo guard size. But wingspan doesn't always show in height. Maybe Grimes has a taller torso and that has me biased?

[Jeffrey]

Woj just said a trade for a player with a big contract a team may like but have to move on from so they can get ahead of the new apron.

Off the top of my head since I've been following which teams that is close or over the 2nd apron.

Wolves (over) - even without signing Conley to a new deal
Suns (way over) - they are so over, their whole bench will be vet minimums
Lakers (close) - if Lebron opts out or takes less AAV then Lakers will be fine
Blazers (close) - too many vet contracts + don't forget that they will be drafting a top 4 rookie which will take them over the apron
Warriors (close) - if they sign Klay to 30+ million contract they will be over
Celtics (way over) - Jrue will pick up his option. If not, he will sign with less AAV but they will still be over
Bucks (close) - just a few million shy of going over. Want to see what they will do with Beasley
Clippers (depends) - if they re-sign all 3.. way over. If sign Leonard and PG they should be fine

[Jeffrey]

This is why when people said Randle is a negative asset I always called BS. A fringe All-NBA caliber guy making less than 30 mill per is a steal given the new CBA restrictions.

The only downside to Randle is that he's a bit of an awkward fit in some roster constructions because he can't really play C or SF, but other than that and the bad playoff resume his positives outweigh his negatives especially for teams who are near the luxury tax line IMO

-He's durable
-He's on a very manageable deal
-Can soak up a ton of usage mostly efficiently and gives you a chance to win every night even if your star player is out because he can put up star numbers
-In his prime years

He overdribbles and has a knack for the stupid.

In the Minnesota game, final minute, he lost the ball dribbling into trouble near the sideline. Easy to forget because the play was bailed out and he had a really good game regardless. He had plenty more of these stupid plays against Minnesota. Towns, unlikable as his style is, was a killer down the stretch. Randle looked good against KAT, but Towns has such a good shot. I’d trade for him in a heartbeat.

KAT at 36 now but it jumps to 52/56/60 and the 64 the 4 years after that.....he is quite possibly the guy Woj is hinting at that a team likes but needs to move on from for salary cap purposes.....

Knicks salary cap shape is one of the few teams looking to buy which has enough space to absorb that hit.

NOT saying I would do this but Randle left CAA and KAT is CAA , a local boy, a much better personality and has been long linked to Leon Rose and us in rumors.....

Would it be something like.....

KAT (36M) and Naz Reid (12M) for Robinson (15M), Randle (28M) , Flynn (3.8M)

Murray (23M) for Fournier (18M) + Precious (4.4M)+ 2FRPs


Rotation (Minutes):

C I-Hart (23), KAT (13), Naz Reid (12)
PF KAT (21),Reid (17),OG (10)
SF OG (23), Hart(20), Precious (5)
SG Murray (18), DDV (20), Hart (10)
PG Brunson (34), Murray (12), DDV (2)

Woj was talking about a team that will make a move during the deadline to jumpstart and get away from the apron. No way are the Wolves trading KAT this deadline. They are the # 1 team in the West and they are doing alright.

[8516knicks]

He overdribbles and has a knack for the stupid.

In the Minnesota game, final minute, he lost the ball dribbling into trouble near the sideline. Easy to forget because the play was bailed out and he had a really good game regardless. He had plenty more of these stupid plays against Minnesota. Towns, unlikable as his style is, was a killer down the stretch. Randle looked good against KAT, but Towns has such a good shot. I’d trade for him in a heartbeat.

KAT at 36 now but it jumps to 52/56/60 and the 64 the 4 years after that.....he is quite possibly the guy Woj is hinting at that a team likes but needs to move on from for salary cap purposes.....

Knicks salary cap shape is one of the few teams looking to buy which has enough space to absorb that hit.

NOT saying I would do this but Randle left CAA and KAT is CAA , a local boy, a much better personality and has been long linked to Leon Rose and us in rumors.....

Would it be something like.....

KAT (36M) and Naz Reid (12M) for Robinson (15M), Randle (28M) , Flynn (3.8M)

Murray (23M) for Fournier (18M) + Precious (4.4M)+ 2FRPs


Rotation (Minutes):

C I-Hart (23), KAT (13), Naz Reid (12)
PF KAT (21),Reid (17),OG (10)
SF OG (23), Hart(20), Precious (5)
SG Murray (18), DDV (20), Hart (10)
PG Brunson (34), Murray (12), DDV (2)

Woj was talking about a team that will make a move during the deadline to jumpstart and get away from the apron. No way are the Wolves trading KAT this deadline. They are the # 1 team in the West and they are doing alright.

This is the BEST the Wolves have EVER been. Fans would KILL them to break it up.

[KnixinSix]

Woj just said a trade for a player with a big contract a team may like but have to move on from so they can get ahead of the new apron.

Off the top of my head since I've been following which teams that is close or over the 2nd apron.

Wolves (over) - even without signing Conley to a new deal
Suns (way over) - they are so over, their whole bench will be vet minimums
Lakers (close) - if Lebron opts out or takes less AAV then Lakers will be fine
Blazers (close) - too many vet contracts + don't forget that they will be drafting a top 4 rookie which will take them over the apron
Warriors (close) - if they sign Klay to 30+ million contract they will be over
Celtics (way over) - Jrue will pick up his option. If not, he will sign with less AAV but they will still be over
Bucks (close) - just a few million shy of going over. Want to see what they will do with Beasley
Clippers (depends) - if they re-sign all 3.. way over. If sign Leonard and PG they should be fine

top 2 in worst shape have Booker, KAT both high salaried players (coincidentally CAA).

Economically these teams may have little choice but to trade oneof thier high salary guys out.....

[KnixinSix]

KAT at 36 now but it jumps to 52/56/60 and the 64 the 4 years after that.....he is quite possibly the guy Woj is hinting at that a team likes but needs to move on from for salary cap purposes.....

Knicks salary cap shape is one of the few teams looking to buy which has enough space to absorb that hit.

NOT saying I would do this but Randle left CAA and KAT is CAA , a local boy, a much better personality and has been long linked to Leon Rose and us in rumors.....

Would it be something like.....

KAT (36M) and Naz Reid (12M) for Robinson (15M), Randle (28M) , Flynn (3.8M)

Murray (23M) for Fournier (18M) + Precious (4.4M)+ 2FRPs


Rotation (Minutes):

C I-Hart (23), KAT (13), Naz Reid (12)
PF KAT (21),Reid (17),OG (10)
SF OG (23), Hart(20), Precious (5)
SG Murray (18), DDV (20), Hart (10)
PG Brunson (34), Murray (12), DDV (2)

Woj was talking about a team that will make a move during the deadline to jumpstart and get away from the apron. No way are the Wolves trading KAT this deadline. They are the # 1 team in the West and they are doing alright.

This is the BEST the Wolves have EVER been. Fans would KILL them to break it up.

not the point , the cap may flat out force them to

[shrink]

Woj was talking about a team that will make a move during the deadline to jumpstart and get away from the apron. No way are the Wolves trading KAT this deadline. They are the # 1 team in the West and they are doing alright.

This is the BEST the Wolves have EVER been. Fans would KILL them to break it up.

Yes, the first move of the new owners is not going to be to trade a star to hurt a playoff run to save themselves money.

In fact, they will likely use the team’s success to help get some public financing for a new arena. MSG is only one older.

[thebuzzardman]

He overdribbles and has a knack for the stupid.

In the Minnesota game, final minute, he lost the ball dribbling into trouble near the sideline. Easy to forget because the play was bailed out and he had a really good game regardless. He had plenty more of these stupid plays against Minnesota. Towns, unlikable as his style is, was a killer down the stretch. Randle looked good against KAT, but Towns has such a good shot. I’d trade for him in a heartbeat.

KAT at 36 now but it jumps to 52/56/60 and the 64 the 4 years after that.....he is quite possibly the guy Woj is hinting at that a team likes but needs to move on from for salary cap purposes.....

Knicks salary cap shape is one of the few teams looking to buy which has enough space to absorb that hit.

NOT saying I would do this but Randle left CAA and KAT is CAA , a local boy, a much better personality and has been long linked to Leon Rose and us in rumors.....

Would it be something like.....

KAT (36M) and Naz Reid (12M) for Robinson (15M), Randle (28M) , Flynn (3.8M)

Murray (23M) for Fournier (18M) + Precious (4.4M)+ 2FRPs


Rotation (Minutes):

C I-Hart (23), KAT (13), Naz Reid (12)
PF KAT (21),Reid (17),OG (10)
SF OG (23), Hart(20), Precious (5)
SG Murray (18), DDV (20), Hart (10)
PG Brunson (34), Murray (12), DDV (2)

Woj was talking about a team that will make a move during the deadline to jumpstart and get away from the apron. No way are the Wolves trading KAT this deadline. They are the # 1 team in the West and they are doing alright.

So it's identifying a bad or borderline playoffs team with a large contract player