return2glory wrote:Fierce1 wrote:playa-hater wrote:Like I said, if the coach is incompetent, the team does not win a championship.
That has been proven in the past with D'Antoni and Nash having multiple star players and MVP players but unable to get to the finals.
Even Shaq and Kobe couldn't get to the finals before Phil Jackson became their coach.
It's not lame azz, it's just a fact because history says so.
If Joe is as bad as you say he is, what makes you think the Cs will win a championship?
Some of the Celtic fans here are already conceding that Joe is not as bad as some of you say he is.
That's why the Celtics will win a championship.
When the Celtics win a championship with Joe as coach, it will only prove you doubters wrong.[/quote]
so lazy and wrong.. Doc Rivers says hello. He sucks as a coach..
So many vague comments. Boston can WIN 18, but it will be far more because of the great talent assembled by Stevens. Do you realize Commercial planes can basically fly itself on Auto-pilot?? So long as Joe doesn't cause a crash, Boston has a great chance!!!
That's your opinion.
But Doc took 3 players, Pierce, KG, and Ray, who never made it to the finals to the finals twice and won one championship.
Your analogy of commercial planes is also wrong.
Commercial planes can fly itself, but it can never land on its own.
You need still need a pilot for landing.
Also, when you look at your criticism of Joe, it's 100% the Cs are not winning a championship, based on what you say every time the Cs lose a game.
Teams don't win a championship when like what you say that Joe doesn't make in-game adjustments or Joe's rotations is fixed.
For a team to win a championship, in-game adjustments is a must and the rotations must not be fixed because the matchups change from one playoff series to another.
Here's the thing, every time the Cs lose you blame Joe.
Your tirades after every Celtic loss makes me wonder if you're better off changing your name to joe-hater instead of playa-hater.
Doc Rivers sucks as a coach. The Celtics won a title despite him.
Eh, disagree.
Not everything has to be such an all or nothing, black or white thing.
We can give credit to both the players *and* the coach for the 2008 title.
There's been a ton of content (blogs, videos, podcasts, interviews, hall of fame speeches, etc.) since 2008 where guys like Pierce and other players from the team have spoken highly of Doc. They have given Doc credit for managing the egos on that team, getting them to buy in to the team concept, getting them to play together, getting them to work hard, etc.
In short, the players have given Doc credit for helping them win that title. So we should do the same.
Was Doc a perfect coach? Of course not. No coach is perfect (Pop, Phil and Red are pretty close, though).
Was Doc a great coach? Probably not. He certainly has flaws as a coach. But I think that a lot of the issues he's had as a coach have been more recently - like in the past 7 or so years. Perhaps the game has changed and he hasn't been able to keep up as much..and the players have changed, the way they want to be coached and communicated with has changed and perhaps he hasn't been able to keep up.
But when he was in Boston, I thought he was a decent coach.
To say we won the 08 title despite him and to not give him any credit whatsoever for winning that ring is wrong, imo.
Yes, the 08 team had a good roster. But
a) talent alone doesn't win titles. Lots of very talented teams have come up short of winning it all. Look at the 97, 98 and 99 Lakers. Look at the 04 Lakers. Look at the Heat in 2011. Look at the warriors in 2016, the celtics in 2019, the Magic and Bulls in 95..
b) not only doesn't it not guarantee a title just because you have lots of talent, but it's even less of a guarantee when that talent was all thrown together in 1 single offseason. Yes, the 08 team had lots of talent. But basically everyone on the team was new. KG was new, Allen was new, Posey, etc.
All these new guys had to learn how to play together..and when there's that many new pieces added, there's more of a chance that the chemistry is off, or some of the pieces won't fit together well, some guys might not play well together or see eye to eye off the court. That's why typically when you have lots of new guys added (even if they have lots of talent) they won't win a ring in their first year together. Like Miami not winning it in 2011, Lakers not winning it in their first 3 years with Shaq and Kobe, spurs didn't win it their first year with duncan/robinson, that warriors core didn't win it their first year together, neither did AD/Lebron, neither did Giannis/Middleton, Harden/Kyrie/KD didn't win any titles together, neither did Harden/westbrook/KD, etc.
So let's give Doc credit that he was able to take all those new pieces and get them to put egos aside, and get them to play so well on the court together that it looked like they had been playing together for 5+ years.
