Official Trade Thread Part XLVI

[Dark Faze]

That's a pretty humbling return for Terry who's probably considered a bit better or in the same tier as a player as Kuzma.

With the way Miami operates, that's probably a very late lotto pick at best in 3 seasons.

[nate33]

That's a pretty humbling return for Terry who's probably considered a bit better or in the same tier as a player as Kuzma.

With the way Miami operates, that's probably a very late lotto pick at best in 3 seasons.

I think Kuzma is more highly regarded than Terry. Positional versatility matters. Kuzma has guard skills in a forward's body. He gives you a lot of lineup flexibility - particularly in the playoffs.

[FAH1223]

That's a pretty humbling return for Terry who's probably considered a bit better or in the same tier as a player as Kuzma.

With the way Miami operates, that's probably a very late lotto pick at best in 3 seasons.

I think Kuzma is more highly regarded than Terry. Positional versatility matters. Kuzma has guard skills in a forward's body. He gives you a lot of lineup flexibility - particularly in the playoffs.

And the contract too

[Endless Loop]

I would have high expectations in any trade for a non-expiring contract this year (other than Poole, but good luck with that).

First of all, there seem to be a lot more sellers than buyers this year. Charlotte's haul for Rozier was terrible.

Especially don't trade Kuzma. In a year he'll still have 3 years on his deal, but the contract will be looking more and more attractive.

There's similarly no rush to trade Kispert. Why would you trade him for a future low first round draft pick, when he's outperforming your typical low first round pick by a good margin? It's not a cap room issue, nor is it an age issue.

Why trade Gafford when the main reason the team sucks so bad is they only have one decent center, plus a new one who hasn't proven himself over time? Gafford's contract is fine.

The Wiz rushed when they made their deal with the Celtics this summer. They should be more patient now.

If they feel fidgety, then there's always the expiring contracts, plus they can be more aggressive swapping out bench players.

[penbeast0]

The big trade question is whether Tyus will resign with us. If the answer seems to be yes, then there's no real trade pressure outside of possibly Delon Wright who won't net more than a good second most likely. If the answer is probably not, then we need to work the phones hard to maximize a return for him. I agree there's no reason to sell low on Gafford, Kuzma, Deni, Shamet, Davis, or even Poole.

I do wish they would sign Jared Butler to a real contract and go back to giving him minutes.

[2Fluffy4U]

I would have high expectations in any trade for a non-expiring contract this year (other than Poole, but good luck with that).

First of all, there seem to be a lot more sellers than buyers this year. Charlotte's haul for Rozier was terrible.

Especially don't trade Kuzma. In a year he'll still have 3 years on his deal, but the contract will be looking more and more attractive.

There's similarly no rush to trade Kispert. Why would you trade him for a future low first round draft pick, when he's outperforming your typical low first round pick by a good margin? It's not a cap room issue, nor is it an age issue.

Why trade Gafford when the main reason the team sucks so bad is they only have one decent center, plus a new one who hasn't proven himself over time? Gafford's contract is fine.

The Wiz rushed when they made their deal with the Celtics this summer. They should be more patient now.

If they feel fidgety, then there's always the expiring contracts, plus they can be more aggressive swapping out bench players.

If these players are decent, outperforming, have attractive contract - then how is this team with only 7 wins...?

The reason for trading is not because players are decent - its because an overhaul is in dire need.

There are no positive leaders who are 'winners' in both heart and talent in this team- and it needs to change sooner than later

[nate33]

The big trade question is whether Tyus will resign with us. If the answer seems to be yes, then there's no real trade pressure outside of possibly Delon Wright who won't net more than a good second most likely. If the answer is probably not, then we need to work the phones hard to maximize a return for him. I agree there's no reason to sell low on Gafford, Kuzma, Deni, Shamet, Davis, or even Poole.

I do wish they would sign Jared Butler to a real contract and go back to giving him minutes.

I think there is some urgency to move Tyus. It's better to trade Tyus for any value we can get now, and then if we want another veteran of equivalent talent on the roster next year, we can sign that guy in the offseason. Either way we will have a stable vet on the roster, but by trading Tyus now, we will also have a future pick.

I think the best remaining destination for Tyus is Philadelphia. They have the pick; they have the need for one more ball handler; and they have the desire to unload some bad contracts to get until the luxtax. My biggest concern is that they probably see Bruce Brown as a better fit.

[nate33]

Especially don't trade Kuzma. In a year he'll still have 3 years on his deal, but the contract will be looking more and more attractive.

There's similarly no rush to trade Kispert. Why would you trade him for a future low first round draft pick, when he's outperforming your typical low first round pick by a good margin? It's not a cap room issue, nor is it an age issue.

Why trade Gafford when the main reason the team sucks so bad is they only have one decent center, plus a new one who hasn't proven himself over time? Gafford's contract is fine.

I agree with this. The trade market has suddenly become unfavorable with Toronto soaking up the demand by selling off Anunoby and Siakam (and shopping Bruce Brown). Now with Miami making their move for Rozier, there aren't that many teams left who are buying out of desperation to make a win-now move. Most of the remaining contending teams either have no cap flexibility to make moves (Boston, Denver, Milwaukee, Phoenix) or they are young enough that they won't be goaded into overpaying out of desperation (OKC, New Orleans, Sacramento).

The only teams to keep an eye on Philadelphia, Dallas and the Clippers; and maybe Minnesota.

[penbeast0]

The big trade question is whether Tyus will resign with us. If the answer seems to be yes, then there's no real trade pressure outside of possibly Delon Wright who won't net more than a good second most likely. If the answer is probably not, then we need to work the phones hard to maximize a return for him. I agree there's no reason to sell low on Gafford, Kuzma, Deni, Shamet, Davis, or even Poole.

I do wish they would sign Jared Butler to a real contract and go back to giving him minutes.

I think there is some urgency to move Tyus. It's better to trade Tyus for any value we can get now, and then if we want another veteran of equivalent talent on the roster next year, we can sign that guy in the offseason. Either way we will have a stable vet on the roster, but by trading Tyus now, we will also have a future pick.

I think the best remaining destination for Tyus is Philadelphia. They have the pick; they have the need for one more ball handler; and they have the desire to unload some bad contracts to get until the luxtax. My biggest concern is that they probably see Bruce Brown as a better fit.

I disagree about Tyus because I see his skill set (pass first PG with great turnover economy but without great scoring value) as undervalued around the league. I'd resign him to a reasonable contract if we could unless we can get a 1st rounder for him. He would still be valuable if we end up drafting a PG, he's shown himself very capable of being a top reserve and would be a good mentor/teacher who might even be able to play next to a big Cade Cunningham type lead guard. But I'm not desperate to deal him if we can resign him. I'm don't think Kuzma helps the other players develop with his overconfident chucking and the lack of defensive effort he's shown this year; I do think having Tyus helps our young guys.

[Frichuela]

Especially don't trade Kuzma. In a year he'll still have 3 years on his deal, but the contract will be looking more and more attractive.

There's similarly no rush to trade Kispert. Why would you trade him for a future low first round draft pick, when he's outperforming your typical low first round pick by a good margin? It's not a cap room issue, nor is it an age issue.

Why trade Gafford when the main reason the team sucks so bad is they only have one decent center, plus a new one who hasn't proven himself over time? Gafford's contract is fine.

I agree with this. The trade market has suddenly become unfavorable with Toronto soaking up the demand by selling off Anunoby and Siakam (and shopping Bruce Brown). Now with Miami making their move for Rozier, there aren't that many teams left who are buying out of desperation to make a win-now move. Most of the remaining contending teams either have no cap flexibility to make moves (Boston, Denver, Milwaukee, Phoenix) or they are young enough that they won't be goaded into overpaying out of desperation (OKC, New Orleans, Sacramento).

The only teams to keep an eye on Philadelphia, Dallas and the Clippers; and maybe Minnesota.

I'd add Golden State and Sacramento to that list, and both have been rumored to have interest in Kuzma. We shall see how things pan out, let's trust Winger&Dawkins to do the right thing.

[TGW]

Kuzma has a lot of suitors according to Woj. I think he ultimately is traded, but the FO likes him.

[nate33]

Kuzma has a lot of suitors according to Woj. I think he ultimately is traded, but the FO likes him.

I think he has a lot of suitors who are trying to pick him up on the cheap - for maybe one heavily protected first in the distant future or something. But I don't think OKC or Sacramento is going to step up with a bold offer, so we aren't going to trade him.

[AFM]

From Woj/Wiretap

Kyle Kuzma has been mentioned as a trade candidate leading to the deadline a few months after re-signing with the Washington Wizards on a four-year, $102 million deal. The Wizards, however, do not currently appear motivated to trade Kuzma.

"Washington has been very reticent with Kyle Kuzma," said Adrian Wojnarowski on his podcast. "People are calling them. Teams tell me they call them and they're not getting counters from Washington. If you want to register an offer for Kuzma, fine, you can do it. But they're not at the point now where it seems like they're really active in maybe seriously trying to move him. It could change by the deadline, but I know Michael Winger and Will Dawkins like Kuzma, like having him there. I think they'll be particular about what they might do."

Maybe this is some Art Of The Deal mindgame where we refuse to counter. Or maybe he really will still be here post deadline.

[nate33]

Right now, it's a game of chicken between sellers who have to move guys now or lose them this summer for nothing, and buyers who know they don't have enough for a title run and want to pick up an extra vet as cheaply as possible. Both really want to make a deal, but both are going to act like there is no real urgency... until there is a real urgency in the final days before the Trade Deadline.

[Nigel Tufnel]

Another factor with Kuzma is that we are in a multi-year rebuild, with hopes to add FRPs in 2025, 2026, and beyond, so there's no rush to dump him now if the market is soft.

[CntOutSmrtCrazy]

Kuzma has a lot of suitors according to Woj. I think he ultimately is traded, but the FO likes him.

I think he has a lot of suitors who are trying to pick him up on the cheap - for maybe one heavily protected first in the distant future or something. But I don't think OKC or Sacramento is going to step up with a bold offer, so we aren't going to trade him.

This is exactly how the front office should play things.

I for one would love to see one of the two of Poole and Kuzma to be off the team just so the team doesn't have two guys that have the green light mentality who shouldn't. Obviously, given a choice it would definitely be Poole, but Poole is simply untradeable at this given point unless they are attaching assets, so that leaves Kuzma as the best option.

With that said, absolutely no reason to rush things this season with Kuzma if they don't get an offer they deem to be a good return. They hold the upper hands in terms with him being under contract for another 3 years, on a descending contract that is far below what many comparable players are making.

EG would make a panic deal, or a deal for the sake of making one. Given the say we have over Kuzma, there's absolutely zero reason to move him for a poor return.

[pcbothwel]

Another factor with Kuzma is that we are in a multi-year rebuild, with hopes to add FRPs in 2025, 2026, and beyond, so there's no rush to dump him now if the market is soft.

This is my thoughts. We, and apparently the entire league, value 2025 & 2026 picks more than the 2024 draft. So it allows us to wait until the summer/next deadline to maximize the return.

[payitforward]

PIF, I believe Poole and Kuz would HAVE to play differently if they were with the Spurs under Pop…or Miami under Spo….

No doubt about it. To play for Pop, Kuz would have to become a far more disciplined player. Moreover, in Kuz’s two best years (his last in LA & his first with us), he was far more disciplined than he is now.

….nor do I have a problem with Kuz’s play most nights….

Is there a problem with "Kuz's play most nights?" &, if so, what is it?

Well, a player is good (i.e. his “play” is good) to the degree that his play increases the possibility of your team winning games. If a person doesn’t agree with the above statement, there’s no discussion to be had.

Now... because “winning a game” means having more points than your opponent, people tend to think that a player who scores a lot of points is a good player. Unfortunately, that is absolutely not the case. In fact, the only ways you can end up with more points than your opponent at the end of the game are to do one of the following:

1) score more efficiently than the opponent, or
2) have more chances to score (i.e. more possessions of the ball) than your opponent.

That’s not opinion; it’s fact:
Do both in a game, & you can’t lose.
Do 1 or the other, & you have a chance to win.
Do neither, & it’s impossible to win the game.

The best players help their teams do both. But, above all, great players score a ton of points – at high efficiency (TS%)

OTOH, if a player’s TS% is below average, then the more points he scores the less – not more – he helps his team win games. Period. Once again, that’s not an opinion; it’s a fact.

As we all know, Kuz is not an efficient scorer. & -- worse – he also takes a high volume of shots. This is not going to change: he's 28; he's in his 7th year. We just have to accept it.

Yet... we *need him* to take a lot of shots; we don't have anyone else to soak up the FGAs. Better Kuzma than Poole at this point. That’s a given. The problem is that, objectively, his scoring, his shooting, usually helps us lose not win.

But, what about the rest of "Kuz's play most nights"?? After all, as I mention above, a player can also help his team win by increasing its possessions.

Unfortunately, however, Kuz doesn’t do this either. Not overall.

If you look at Kuz's rebounding, assists, blocked shots, & number of fouls, on those numbers overall Kuz is solid -- even a bit above the NBA average at his position. The only negative might be to note that he's below average on the offensive glass. But when you add in the other two important stats, steals & turnovers, things fall apart again.

turnovers per 40 minutes:
An average NBA 2.17
Kuz 3.42

Steals per 40 minutes:
An average NBA 1.17
kuz .5

In short, to produce 9 more points than an average NBA PF in forty minutes, Kuz takes 11 more shots than an average NBA PF. Along the way, he also turns the ball over 1.25 times more than an average NBA PF. & he gets .67 fewer steals than that average.

Conclusion: Kuz’s play most nights is one of the reasons we lose most nights. I like the guy, so I wish it weren’t true. But it is.

[payitforward]

That's a pretty humbling return for Terry who's probably considered a bit better or in the same tier as a player as Kuzma.

With the way Miami operates, that's probably a very late lotto pick at best in 3 seasons.

I think Kuzma is more highly regarded than Terry. Positional versatility matters. Kuzma has guard skills in a forward's body. He gives you a lot of lineup flexibility - particularly in the playoffs.

Meh. I'd say the opposite if anything.

To be sure, versatility does matter. But, Rozier is simply a much better guard than Kuz is a forward.

OTOH, Rozier is about a year and a half older than Kuz. That helps level the scale.

[gambitx777]

Kuzma is fun to watch and one of the silver linings of the season. You don't want to completely demoralize fans or the team. If you get a fair or more than fair offer take it but don't sell him for scraps or pennies or risky maybe returns. Which it seems they are not.

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