2023-24 NBA Season Discussion

[falcolombardi]

How anyone can look at the Sixers this year, and Harden this year, and then come to the conclusion that they should hire the guy who had both of them playing worse together last year is beyond me, even beyond every other failure Doc has had over the last 10+ years.

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Hard for me to imagine anyone other than a current/former NBA player thinking Doc is the answer for a contender at this point.

You dont think owners would look at that famous, one time champion coach with 2 decades of experience they can see on tv and think "i want that!" Without any deeper look into his underachieving record?

Like i get criticizing players sometimes having myopia about coaching or player quality aspects but GM's and specially owners can match them too

[tsherkin]

You dont think owners would look at that famous, one time champion coach with 2 decades of experience they can see on tv and think "i want that!" Without any deeper look into his underachieving record?

I think the challenge is that the owners have been around for years and years. The level of apathy they have to possess in order not to know that Doc is a waste of time is pretty high. It's certainly not impossible, but it speaks very poorly about them.

[Doctor MJ]

How anyone can look at the Sixers this year, and Harden this year, and then come to the conclusion that they should hire the guy who had both of them playing worse together last year is beyond me, even beyond every other failure Doc has had over the last 10+ years.

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Hard for me to imagine anyone other than a current/former NBA player thinking Doc is the answer for a contender at this point.

You dont think owners would look at that famous, one time champion coach with 2 decades of experience they can see on tv and think "i want that!" Without any deeper look into his underachieving record?

Like i get criticizing players sometimes having myopia about coaching or player quality aspects but GM's and specially owners can match them too

Fair point as a general principle, but:

1. I think GMs/owners are less naive than they used to be.
2. I think mostly when they did stuff like this it was for non-contending teams.
3. I think Doc at this point is mostly known as a coach rather than a TV guy, and he's been associated with disappointment for years.
4. I think the Bucks had the opportunity to acquire Doc in the off-season and chose not to, so I think clearly they weren't that in love with the idea of him back when they had options.

[MartinToVaught]

You dont think owners would look at that famous, one time champion coach with 2 decades of experience they can see on tv and think "i want that!" Without any deeper look into his underachieving record?

I think the challenge is that the owners have been around for years and years. The level of apathy they have to possess in order not to know that Doc is a waste of time is pretty high. It's certainly not impossible, but it speaks very poorly about them.

The new owner the Bucks recently brought in is the same guy who made the Deshaun Watson trade and wasted a first-round pick on Johnny Manziel because a homeless man convinced him to. His coaching hires include Freddie Kitchens, Hue Jackson, and Butch Jones.

[sp6r=underrated]

How anyone can look at the Sixers this year, and Harden this year, and then come to the conclusion that they should hire the guy who had both of them playing worse together last year is beyond me, even beyond every other failure Doc has had over the last 10+ years.

Sent from my SM-N981U using Tapatalk

Hard for me to imagine anyone other than a current/former NBA player thinking Doc is the answer for a contender at this point.

You dont think owners would look at that famous, one time champion coach with 2 decades of experience they can see on tv and think "i want that!" Without any deeper look into his underachieving record?

Like i get criticizing players sometimes having myopia about coaching or player quality aspects but GM's and specially owners can match them too

I'll just add owners do not run sports teams the way they do normal businesses. If they ran their business the way they would a normal, bland widget company you'd see a lot more Sterling type owners who just refuse to spend on players and mooch off revenue sharing.

Most buy sports teams because it is fun, provides fame and they love the sport they buy into.

That helps why failed but popular coaches get hired.

[tsherkin]

You dont think owners would look at that famous, one time champion coach with 2 decades of experience they can see on tv and think "i want that!" Without any deeper look into his underachieving record?

I think the challenge is that the owners have been around for years and years. The level of apathy they have to possess in order not to know that Doc is a waste of time is pretty high. It's certainly not impossible, but it speaks very poorly about them.

The new owner the Bucks recently brought in is the same guy who made the Deshaun Watson trade and wasted a first-round pick on Johnny Manziel because a homeless man convinced him to. His coaching hires include Freddie Kitchens, Hue Jackson, and Butch Jones.

None of that sentence went anywhere I was expecting.

[OhayoKD]

OG's Kawhi arc has begun

[sp6r=underrated]

The top half of the East is loaded but as a Knicks fan I'm very excited about this season. Easily the most excited I've been in a decade. And I was dead wrong on the OG trade. I don't see anyway NY can win a series against Boston but I feel pretty good that they could make the 2nd round. And that they even have an outside shot at the CF

[falcolombardi]

The top half of the East is loaded but as a Knicks fan I'm very excited about this season. Easily the most excited I've been in a decade. And I was dead wrong on the OG trade. I don't see anyway NY can win a series against Boston but I feel pretty good that they could make the 2nd round. And that they even have an outside shot at the CF

Jalen brunson arguably the first real star player they have since carmelo, and a easier personality/play style archetype to build around than him to boot

And thet have paired him with some fantastic young pieces too like anunoby. Only question mark is randle value at his contract but he is still young enough you can wait to see if he takes a leap (?)

[Special_Puppy]

The top half of the East is loaded but as a Knicks fan I'm very excited about this season. Easily the most excited I've been in a decade. And I was dead wrong on the OG trade. I don't see anyway NY can win a series against Boston but I feel pretty good that they could make the 2nd round. And that they even have an outside shot at the CF

What do you think the Knicks have to do to be very competitive against a team like the Celtics in a 7 game series? Just internal development or do you think they need to get a superstar like many people think?

[Special_Puppy]

Celtics are the biggest frauds ever if they don't win a chip this year

[sp6r=underrated]

The top half of the East is loaded but as a Knicks fan I'm very excited about this season. Easily the most excited I've been in a decade. And I was dead wrong on the OG trade. I don't see anyway NY can win a series against Boston but I feel pretty good that they could make the 2nd round. And that they even have an outside shot at the CF

What do you think the Knicks have to do to be very competitive against a team like the Celtics in a 7 game series? Just internal development or do you think they need to get a superstar like many people think?

Making the leap from a 48-55 win team to legitimate championship contender is the hardest leap maybe in sports. I don't know how the Knicks can make that leap but right now I'm enjoying this.

[Colbinii]

The top half of the East is loaded but as a Knicks fan I'm very excited about this season. Easily the most excited I've been in a decade. And I was dead wrong on the OG trade. I don't see anyway NY can win a series against Boston but I feel pretty good that they could make the 2nd round. And that they even have an outside shot at the CF

What do you think the Knicks have to do to be very competitive against a team like the Celtics in a 7 game series? Just internal development or do you think they need to get a superstar like many people think?

It is going to fall on Randle being able to score and make the correct decisions on both ends and Robinson being a force defensively like he was against Cleveland in Round 1 last year.

[AEnigma]

The top half of the East is loaded but as a Knicks fan I'm very excited about this season. Easily the most excited I've been in a decade. And I was dead wrong on the OG trade. I don't see anyway NY can win a series against Boston but I feel pretty good that they could make the 2nd round. And that they even have an outside shot at the CF

What do you think the Knicks have to do to be very competitive against a team like the Celtics in a 7 game series? Just internal development or do you think they need to get a superstar like many people think?

I think they absolutely can be competitive and pull an upset over anyone — including the Celtics — as is. I probably like how they match up with the Celtics more than I like how they match up with the Bucks (and theoretically the 76ers, if Embiid manages to finally carry over his regular season level). However, as the Heat have learned, pulling off multiple consecutive unexpected upsets is taxing and — historically barring the presence Russell or Hakeem — not something that can be done all the way to a championship.

I think there are a couple of keys for the Knicks:

1) Their defence needs to be excellent for… say at least three games. Not going to say something banal like oh Anunoby needs to shut down Tatum (not actually one of Anunoby’s preferred assignments anyway), but the Celtics are beatable in a rock fight, and the Knicks have the personnel and coaching to largely turn it into one.

2) Brunson needs to be able to manage Jrue. I am guessing Jrue is why the Celtics appear insurmountable. The Knicks rely so much on Brunson that if we see a 2018 Lillard repeat, they have no chance. I agree Randle needs to play well and take off some of the strain. Everyone needs to play well for that type of upset. But they truly depend on Brunson, and Brunson is the closest thing the Knicks have to a superstar.

3) One reason I believe the Knicks can hold their own is that their now thin depth should be less of an issue in the postseason. However, whether it is through the buy-out market (Lowry?) or just internal development, I do think it is important to figure out a third initiator, because Randle is already not an ideal second-best initiator, and I am not sure I trust their wings to do that in a playoff setting.

[Clyde Frazier]

The top half of the East is loaded but as a Knicks fan I'm very excited about this season. Easily the most excited I've been in a decade. And I was dead wrong on the OG trade. I don't see anyway NY can win a series against Boston but I feel pretty good that they could make the 2nd round. And that they even have an outside shot at the CF

Jalen brunson arguably the first real star player they have since carmelo, and a easier personality/play style archetype to build around than him to boot

And thet have paired him with some fantastic young pieces too like anunoby. Only question mark is randle value at his contract but he is still young enough you can wait to see if he takes a leap (?)

Randle has been terrible in the playoffs, but he was legitimately hurt last year. So I’d say there’s at least some hope he shows up this year. Brunson has brought out the best in him similar to billups with carmelo in denver. For all of his flaws, he's very talented.

Wing skills, good vision as long as he’s going down hill and might be the strongest player in the league when it comes to absorbing contact at the rim. He went right through jokic of all players last night after multiple up fakes for the finish. Got blocked on the next possession and went right back up for another finish.

On the season: Brunson / Randle 1,337 min, +6.17 net

Knicks 11-2 since trading for Anunoby: Brunson / Randle / Anunoby 266 min, an absurd +28.02 net

[tsherkin]

Randle has been terrible in the playoffs, but he was legitimately hurt last year. So I’d say there’s at least some hope he shows up this year. Brunson has brought out the best in him similar to billups with carmelo in denver. For all of his flaws, he's very talented.

He's an interesting one, and he's been playing very well of late.

Still has turnover issues, but from Nov 28 onward, he's scoring at around +3% rTS and is balling overall. He's been very effective in close, and he passes pretty well for a big. Having Brunson alongside him is very specifically important, as you said, and that's a good synergy to exploit. He's looking good. If he can mostly maintain, he's going to be a major boost to the team, and Brunson will be a big help to that goal.

[AEnigma]

I’m just not really moved by huge regular season scoring outbursts anymore. When you combine a bad team and a soft whistle and a scorer as talented as Embiid who exploits both and is intent on putting up monster numbers, you’re bound to get nights like these.

Call me a hater or whatever, but statlines against bottom-feeders of this season, like the Spurs, Wizards, Pistons, Hornets, the injury-riddled Grizzlies, especially in this era, should be taken with a pinch of salt. These teams don't belong in the NBA.

Honestly, for example, pretty sure not many non-Portland people care or even remember that Dame put up 70+ points (I had to look it up) against the Rockets last year?

I had a longer comment typed before the classic RealGM webpage crash.

Most historically notable scoring performances have either occurred against a bad team or involved several overtimes:

Kobe’s 81 and 65 were both against bottom five teams. Skywalker’s 73 was against a Lanier-less Pistons team. David Robinson’s 71 was against a bad Clippers team while he was blatantly chasing the scoring title. And the early 1960s Knicks allowed 71 to Baylor, 73 to Wilt… and of course that 100 to Wilt. Then on the other side, Jordan’s three career high outputs all featured at least one overtime. Wilt’s 78 was a triple overtime game. Mitchell’s 71, overtime game.

That is part of why the most legendary scoring game to me is Kobe’s 62 in three quarters against a Mavericks team that would go to the Finals that season. And people remember that game — just not as much as when he scored 82.

This historically does not bode well for the Hawks lol.

[falcolombardi]

West 1st seed back to okc. May be our second ever west 1st seed since 2013

Interestingly enough wr currently are on pace to high 50's and boston in pace to mid 60's. Back in 2013 we won 60 to miami 66

[AEnigma]

For those looking to mentally adjust for scoring inflation:

Wilt = 100 points scored of team’s 169 (59%)
Kobe = 81 points scored of team’s 122 (66%)
Skywalker = 73 points scored of team’s 137 (53%)
Baylor = 71 points scored of team’s 123 (58%)
Robinson = 71 points scored of team’s 112 (63%)
Mitchell = 71 points scored of team’s 145 (49%)
Lillard = 71 points scored of team’s 131 (54%)
Embiid = 70 points scored of team’s 133 (53%)
Booker = 70 points scored of (losing) team’s 120 (58%)
Jordan = 69 points scored of team’s 117 (59%)
Maravich = 68 points scored of team’s 124 (55%)

There are other ways to adjust (e.g. also factoring in minutes), but I feel like using this lens successfully takes off some of the modern shine while also providing an opportunity to celebrate those who played in suppressed eras (thinking about Fulks’ 63/103, McGrady’s 62/108, Mikan’s 61/91 Iverson’s 60/112, King’s 60/114, sophomore Lebron’s 56/98, etc.).

[ardee]

West 1st seed back to okc. May be our second ever west 1st seed since 2013

Interestingly enough wr currently are on pace to high 50's and boston in pace to mid 60's. Back in 2013 we won 60 to miami 66

Presti is honestly Riley tier as a GM at this point.