Trade Talk (Part 14): 2023-24 Edition

[KGdaBom]

We get far worse by making that trade. Not a little worse a huge amount worse.

We disagree on this...all good...

Bojan: 20/3/3 while shooting 41% on 7 3s/gm. Depth.
Burks: 13/2/2 while shooting 40% on 5 3s/gm. Depth.
Ivey: All-Star potential. PG of future. Can split minutes with Mike. 14/4/4. Can start learning from Mike NOW.
(NAZ starts in place of KAT)

Ivey isn’t ready, Burks is a less expensive Beasley, and Bojan is a role player with a limited skill set. You don’t even have a replacement for Naz in here. If Naz is the starter instead of the 6th man, who is the backup big who can sustain the defense when Naz or Rudy are in foul trouble? Plus Ivey isn’t necessarily a great fit with Ant. This is a sell low, and I don’t see think you are gonna find much support for it.

Very bluntly stated and great job of it.

[BlacJacMac]

Murray is a star so it isn't a hodgepodge. However, not good enough IMO.

Everyone draws their line at “star” differently. For me, it’s All NBA votes, which are limited to 15 winners, and a few other also-rans.

For his career, Dijounte Murray has received one, third place vote, two years ago. For points, Towns has a 385-to-1 lead, and has actually made All NBA twice.

Now, I’ll admit that Towns got some of those extra 384 votes by benefitting from being a center, and Towns or Gobert has been the third best center in the NBA. But where would you rank Dijounte Murray among guards? Is he even in the top 25? Being better than your opponent, night after night, is a big advantage for a team, and while Murray fits the Timberwolves, he is not better than most of the guards he faces.

Like I said, we all draw our “star” lines differently. I wouldn’t contradict your belief that Murray is a star. For me, he doesn’t rise to that level, particularly if we’re trying to put him in the same group as Towns. Sounds like you’d agree, since you would want Markkanen too.

I really like Murray, but if Jalen Johnson's shooting is for real, he's the "star" in that package. He's that athletic "swing forward" that grabs over 9 rebounds/36, defends at a high level, has some playmaking chops and racks up stocks. If that 37% from 3 is sustainable, he's a cornerstone player.

[KGdaBom]

Murray is a star so it isn't a hodgepodge. However, not good enough IMO.

Everyone draws their line at “star” differently. For me, it’s All NBA votes, which are limited to 15 winners, and a few other also-rans.

For his career, Dijounte Murray has received one, third place vote, two years ago. For points, Towns has a 385-to-1 lead, and has actually made All NBA twice.

Now, I’ll admit that Towns got some of those extra 384 votes by benefitting from being a center, and Towns or Gobert has been the third best center in the NBA. But where would you rank Dijounte Murray among guards? Is he even in the top 25? Being better than your opponent, night after night, is a big advantage for a team, and while Murray fits the Timberwolves, he is not better than most of the guards he faces.

Like I said, we all draw our “star” lines differently. I wouldn’t contradict your belief that Murray is a star. For me, he doesn’t rise to that level, particularly if we’re trying to put him in the same group as Towns. Sounds like you’d agree, since you would want Markkanen too.

I really like Murray, but if Jalen Johnson's shooting is for real, he's the "star" in that package. He's that athletic "swing forward" that grabs over 9 rebounds/36, defends at a high level, has some playmaking chops and racks up stocks. If that 37% from 3 is sustainable, he's a cornerstone player.

Johnson has potential of becoming a star. That's betting on the come and it's not bad. I'd still prefer Markkanen to Johnson.

[shrink]

I'm a big fan of Murray. He's not a STAR, but I think he's a star. He's definitely not on KAT's level, but what about him and Markkanen? Is that enough for you?

Fair enough. And since you asked me specifically, I would say that is one of very few Towns trades that I find interesting.

First, it has players that can win now. I can’t see the team making a trade that makes us less of a contender, and losing the public’s attention and goodwill, because I expect them to ask for public support for a new arena. Deals that make up value using future picks seems unrealistic to me.

Second, that deal would have two, well-fitting starters, who can take up spots that we need filled (Towns in the trade, and eventually Mike Conley).

Third, I think these are both players with experience, but still have upside left.

I don’t think it’s realistic, but this is one that makes me go .. “hmmm?”

——

One downside I don’t hear much about is that Markannen is only under contract one more year. We could lose him, if he wants to try free agency next summer. He also could use that leverage to force a bigger deal out of us. Even in a regular sized, Towns would likely be cheaper than Murray + Markannen, so this isn’t a lux-saving deal.

[cmoss84]

We get far worse by making that trade. Not a little worse a huge amount worse.

We disagree on this...all good...

Bojan: 20/3/3 while shooting 41% on 7 3s/gm. Depth.
Burks: 13/2/2 while shooting 40% on 5 3s/gm. Depth.
Ivey: All-Star potential. PG of future. Can split minutes with Mike. 14/4/4. Can start learning from Mike NOW.
(NAZ starts in place of KAT)

Ivey isn’t ready, Burks is a less expensive Beasley, and Bojan is a role player with a limited skill set. You don’t even have a replacement for Naz in here. If Naz is the starter instead of the 6th man, who is the backup big who can sustain the defense when Naz or Rudy are in foul trouble? Plus Ivey isn’t necessarily a great fit with Ant. This is a sell low, and I don’t see think you are gonna find much support for it.

All good.
If it was up to to me...after this trade is made I would trade SloMo/Shake/TBJ for a backup big and room for a buyout player...
(would also have extra draft picks)

[Domejandro]

...and if you want to build a sustainable winning franchise, tough decisions will need to be made. I guess I value Ivey over most of you. I think he will be an multi-all star.
@KGdaBom: do you think THIS years team gets worse by making this trade? to you KAT > Ivey, Bojan, and Burkes?

We get far worse by making that trade. Not a little worse a huge amount worse.

We disagree on this...all good...

Bojan: 20/3/3 while shooting 41% on 7 3s/gm. Depth.
Burks: 13/2/2 while shooting 40% on 5 3s/gm. Depth.
Ivey: All-Star potential. PG of future. Can split minutes with Mike. 14/4/4. Can start learning from Mike NOW.
(NAZ starts in place of KAT)

Bojan Bogdanović:
+ 41% three-point shooter on high volume (7.2 3PA)
+ Good screen navigator
+ Very fair contract (39/2 UNG)
- 35 by the Playoffs
- 3.4 rebounds per game.
- Injured for half of the season.
- One of the worst defensive players in the NBA
- Far less efficient than Karl-Anthony Towns (shooting and passing)

Alec Burks
+ 40% three-point shooter on high volume (5.8 3PA)
+ Solid defensive player
+ Expiring contract (neutral)
- 32 Years Old
- Cannot score inside the arc (38.1% 2PA)
- Bench Player

Jaden Ivey:
+ 22 Years Old
+ Potential as a scorer
- Horrendous defensive player
- Below league-average shooting efficiency
- Poor facilitator, absolutely not a Point-Guard (3.7/2.3 >1.6 AST/TO)


I like Bojan Bogdanović as a starter quality player and Alec Burks is a solid role-player, but you don't trade an All-NBA player averaging 23/9 on 52/44/87 splits for that collection of meh.

[thinktank]

Well, I tried. :zzz:

[Klomp]

All-Star nod officially kills any Towns trade talk until at minimum the offseason.

[KGdaBom]

All-Star nod officially kills any Towns trade talk until at minimum the offseason.

Why so? Does it escalate his salary?

[BlacJacMac]

All-Star nod officially kills any Towns trade talk until at minimum the offseason.

Why so? Does it escalate his salary?

Have you ever seen a player traded between being announced for the ASG and participating in it?

You're likely looking at a PR nightmare unless the trade is for Giannis or Jokic...

[KGdaBom]

All-Star nod officially kills any Towns trade talk until at minimum the offseason.

Why so? Does it escalate his salary?

Have you ever seen a player traded between being announced for the ASG and participating in it?

You're likely looking at a PR nightmare unless the trade is for Giannis or Jokic...

It would have been a PR nightmare either way. I take it the trade deadline passes before the ASG.

[BlacJacMac]

Why so? Does it escalate his salary?

Have you ever seen a player traded between being announced for the ASG and participating in it?

You're likely looking at a PR nightmare unless the trade is for Giannis or Jokic...

It would have been a PR nightmare either way. I take it the trade deadline passes before the ASG.

Trade Deadline: Thu, Feb 8, 2024
All-Star Game: Sunday, Feb 18, 2024

[KGdaBom]

Have you ever seen a player traded between being announced for the ASG and participating in it?

You're likely looking at a PR nightmare unless the trade is for Giannis or Jokic...

It would have been a PR nightmare either way. I take it the trade deadline passes before the ASG.

Trade Deadline: Thu, Feb 8, 2024
All-Star Game: Sunday, Feb 18, 2024

Wow with all the All star hype I thought it was a week or less away. Thanks.

[Domejandro]

Personally, I don't believe the All-Star game nomination any tangible impact on a ppotential trade, given that the only possible trades are absurdly unlikely situations anyways.

[Neeva]

All-Star nod officially kills any Towns trade talk until at minimum the offseason.

Why so? Does it escalate his salary?

Have you ever seen a player traded between being announced for the ASG and participating in it?

You're likely looking at a PR nightmare unless the trade is for Giannis or Jokic...

Not for a team in our salary predicament with “poor” owners, and face it Kats value may never be higher going forward on his upcoming supermax contract.

[shrink]

All-Star nod officially kills any Towns trade talk until at minimum the offseason.

Why so? Does it escalate his salary?

Have you ever seen a player traded between being announced for the ASG and participating in it?

You're likely looking at a PR nightmare unless the trade is for Giannis or Jokic...

Only one I can think of is Boogie Cousins, but the Kings were 32-50 that year, not leading the West like MIN.

[m2002brian]

I’ve been as big a pro trade KAT guy on here.

He’s not going anywhere.
He’s stepped up, showed great growth in his mental maturity. Is rounding into shape with his outside shot and, as last game showed, he can take the pressure off Ant when teams are less challenging.

[shrink]

Not for a team in our salary predicament with “poor” owners, and face it Kats value may never be higher going forward on his upcoming supermax contract.

Personally I think KAT’s value could get much higher, if MIN starts winning in the playoffs, and Towns is seen more than an empty stats guy. I think playing on losing MIN all these years has probably held his trade value down, despite his individual accolades of All Star appearances and All-NBA selections. Team success can change the narrative on Towns.

[Klomp]

I think we're seeing KAT's perception change locally, but I don't know that it's all that different nationally. All-star isn't a new thing for him, so it's not necessarily an indication of any shift.

[Mamba4Goat]

I think KAT getting an All Star nod when not many were expecting it, and getting it over Sabonis and Sengun is more of an indicator of how far off the majority of fans are on the leaguewide perception of KAT.