A polarizing trade proposal between Mavericks and Nets

[I-love-bball]

This is a trade proposal on which I expect many of the fans on both sides will have strong opinions. But I thought it was a fun exercise. While I present apparent bias as a Mavs fan, I tried to extract a balanced value from an assumed context.

Assumptions: The Mavs and Nets are opposites in rooster constructions. The Mavs are extremely heavy and talented, and the Nets have good talent from top to bottom but no (super)stars. If the goal is to contend for a championship, the Mavs need a perfect run, while the Nets… can’t. The second assumption is that neither the Mavs nor the Nets make a better move before the deadline but feel that a significant move needs to be made.

As constructed, the Nets are not financially stable or motivated to just tank. Also, they carry a couple of bad contracts, a behemoth in Ben Simmons and a big one in Cam Johnson). The idea is to let the Nets try to reclaim (baring injuries) some of Ben’s worth by surrounding him with young talent (Cam Thomas, young talent they’d get from the trades) and then decide if they are better off flipping him for more value or to use him as at least a neutral expiring contract). Ben may play better, with little to no expectations for the Nets' record next year.

Trade proposal:
• Mavericks should trade their diamond in a rough rookie center, Derek Lively, THJ, Grant Williams (or Maxi Kliber), and a first-round pick for the Nets' Mikal Bridges and Nic Claxton.

• Why for Mavs: The Mavs get a perfect third option to Luka and Kai (or second when Kai is out) in Mikal. Nix Claxton will replace Lively production this year and maybe next year.

• Why for Nets: The Nets receive a rookie center, already a historical anomaly, as a starter for a winning and playoff-bound team. Outside of Lively’s talent, the Nets get an extremely coachable player who works on his game and has only scratched the potential in both defense and offense (he is not playing out of his comfort zone this year, but Lively can and will stretch the floor in the future). As a mid-first-round pick, he is also secured at a rookie contract for four more years at a bargain deal. In addition to Lively, the Nets receive Mav's available 1st round pick, THJ (primarily for matching salaries), Grant Williams as a reclamation project (just like Dorian, he has value on contenders), and additional sweeteners (Hardy or 2nds). Net’s also get off a lot of money Nic will command if they’d resign him, or at least reclaim some value to him walking off.

• Why this sucks for Mavs:
o Lively is a bonafide young player and a part of a young Nets core to build around. With his talents and being coachable, he will be a star at Dallas in a couple of years.
o Mikal is what Mavs need, but he doesn’t add height (even at his position).
o Claxton fills the talent gap for this year but further deprives the Mavs of the interior defensive presence (6’11 " at 215 pounds to Lively’s 7’1 " and 230 pounds). But mostly, the Mavs would have to commit, which is probably well beyond 20M/y, to keep Claxton, which would likely push the Mavs into the first apron next year. He may be too expensive for what he has been over the years.
o The Mavs gave away a first and limited the scope of what they could trade with in the summer.

• Why this sucks for Nets: In a vacuum, Nets could argue Mikal is worth more (rumors of denied four first last year and denied Jalen Green + assets this year). Claxton could get a first even as an expiring contract. And Nets may not buy in Lively's potential And Nets would need to continue cleaning the house.


Framework:

Mavs send:
• Dereck Lively II ($5.5M)
• THJ ($17.8M)
• Grant Williams ($12.4M) or Maxi Kleber ($11M)
• 2027 First pick
• Sweetener/filler options (2x2nds or swaps Hardy/Omax, or Exum)

Mavs receive:
• Mikal Bridges ($21.7M)
• Nic Claxton ($9.6M)

[jayjaysee]

Imagine it’s really far off for Brooklyn and Dallas can’t fix it.

A lot of work in the OP though. Makes my posts look terrible.

[TheBrooklynKidd]

That would be a non-starter even for Mikal by himself.

[R-DAWG]

What about Lively and a filler for Claxton/DFS

[wemby]

This is an excellent move both Mavs and... THE ROCKETS. There's only one rebuild move for the Nets, and that's trading Mikal to the Rockets for their picks back and some prospects. Barring that, they have to keep him and be competitive.

[Ron Swanson]

I can't imagine this is even a remotely competitive offer for Bridges, let alone Claxton being thrown in there. You're off by about 2-3 1st round picks.

[jayjaysee]

This is an excellent move both Mavs and... THE ROCKETS. There's only one rebuild move for the Nets, and that's trading Mikal to the Rockets for their picks back and some prospects. Barring that, they have to keep him and be competitive.

If Houston drafts number 1 and 2 overall next season… it changes nothing for Brooklyn.

The op is still too short to fix but yeah. Nothing about those picks should matter to Brooklyn.

[Mavrelous]

Deal is very tilted in favour of DAL according to consensus valuation, BK doesn't gain anything from rebuilding since they don't control their picks, so they better take the Rockets deal, with that said, I have 0 interest in this as a Mavs fan.

[Skybox]

What about Lively and a filler for Claxton/DFS

If the filler was 2 frps- maybe

[mademan]

What about Lively and a filler for Claxton/DFS

If the filler was 2 frps- maybe

Youre either underrating Lively or overrating Claxton's value. I have Lively more valuable than the UFA to be Claxton and think DFS bridges the value gap.

[basketballwacko2]

Mavs send:
• Dereck Lively II ($5.5M)
• THJ ($17.8M)
• Grant Williams ($12.4M) or Maxi Kleber ($11M)
• 2027 First pick
• Sweetener/filler options (2x2nds or swaps Hardy/Omax, or Exum)

Mavs receive:
• Mikal Bridges ($21.7M)
• Nic Claxton ($9.6M)

I'm not a fan of either team, there is no way the nets take that for Bridges and Claxton.

[R-DAWG]

What about Lively and a filler for Claxton/DFS

If the filler was 2 frps- maybe

Youre either underrating Lively or overrating Claxton's value. I have Lively more valuable than the UFA to be Claxton and think DFS bridges the value gap.

That's the thought here. I'm not sure what Claxton's value is when you consider his upcoming contract extension, but in my opinion both DFS and Claxton are worth lightly protected 1st rd picks. Lively is worth that at this point IMO.

[TheNetsFan]

What about Lively and a filler for Claxton/DFS

If the filler was 2 frps- maybe

Win later for win now (Lively for Claxton) feels like a close enough structure to make work. The Mavs may be giving up some "value," but if they have an understanding on a new contract with Claxton, I think this move can help propel them forward quickly. Claxton would be a monster with Luka.

[Skybox]

If the filler was 2 frps- maybe

Youre either underrating Lively or overrating Claxton's value. I have Lively more valuable than the UFA to be Claxton and think DFS bridges the value gap.

That's the thought here. I'm not sure what Claxton's value is when you consider his upcoming contract extension, but in my opinion both DFS and Claxton are worth lightly protected 1st rd picks. Lively is worth that at this point IMO.

Lively is very promising and cost-controlled...Claxton is a DPOY candidate and DFS is pure 3&D....I love Lively but he's nowhere near the value of both. I'd say Lively and a frp gets you Claxton and only because he's a FA.

[wemby]

This is an excellent move both Mavs and... THE ROCKETS. There's only one rebuild move for the Nets, and that's trading Mikal to the Rockets for their picks back and some prospects. Barring that, they have to keep him and be competitive.

If Houston drafts number 1 and 2 overall next season… it changes nothing for Brooklyn.

The op is still too short to fix but yeah. Nothing about those picks should matter to Brooklyn.

If Bridges goes to Houston instead of Dallas and those picks go to Brooklyn, it changes everything. Any deal should at a minimum make up for what the Nets would get by flipping those 2 players individually (Bridges and Claxton), and this deal doesn't come even close. Think of this as 2 separate trades: Claxton for Lively, and Mikal Bridges for the rest of the package. The former is debatable but not unreasonable, the latter is just awful for the Nets, it's light years away from being fair value.

[nykballa2k4]

This is a trade proposal on which I expect many of the fans on both sides will have strong opinions. But I thought it was a fun exercise. While I present apparent bias as a Mavs fan, I tried to extract a balanced value from an assumed context.

Assumptions: The Mavs and Nets are opposites in rooster constructions. The Mavs are extremely heavy and talented, and the Nets have good talent from top to bottom but no (super)stars. If the goal is to contend for a championship, the Mavs need a perfect run, while the Nets… can’t. The second assumption is that neither the Mavs nor the Nets make a better move before the deadline but feel that a significant move needs to be made.

As constructed, the Nets are not financially stable or motivated to just tank. Also, they carry a couple of bad contracts, a behemoth in Ben Simmons and a big one in Cam Johnson). The idea is to let the Nets try to reclaim (baring injuries) some of Ben’s worth by surrounding him with young talent (Cam Thomas, young talent they’d get from the trades) and then decide if they are better off flipping him for more value or to use him as at least a neutral expiring contract). Ben may play better, with little to no expectations for the Nets' record next year.

Trade proposal:
• Mavericks should trade their diamond in a rough rookie center, Derek Lively, THJ, Grant Williams (or Maxi Kliber), and a first-round pick for the Nets' Mikal Bridges and Nic Claxton.

• Why for Mavs: The Mavs get a perfect third option to Luka and Kai (or second when Kai is out) in Mikal. Nix Claxton will replace Lively production this year and maybe next year.

• Why for Nets: The Nets receive a rookie center, already a historical anomaly, as a starter for a winning and playoff-bound team. Outside of Lively’s talent, the Nets get an extremely coachable player who works on his game and has only scratched the potential in both defense and offense (he is not playing out of his comfort zone this year, but Lively can and will stretch the floor in the future). As a mid-first-round pick, he is also secured at a rookie contract for four more years at a bargain deal. In addition to Lively, the Nets receive Mav's available 1st round pick, THJ (primarily for matching salaries), Grant Williams as a reclamation project (just like Dorian, he has value on contenders), and additional sweeteners (Hardy or 2nds). Net’s also get off a lot of money Nic will command if they’d resign him, or at least reclaim some value to him walking off.

• Why this sucks for Mavs:
o Lively is a bonafide young player and a part of a young Nets core to build around. With his talents and being coachable, he will be a star at Dallas in a couple of years.
o Mikal is what Mavs need, but he doesn’t add height (even at his position).
o Claxton fills the talent gap for this year but further deprives the Mavs of the interior defensive presence (6’11 " at 215 pounds to Lively’s 7’1 " and 230 pounds). But mostly, the Mavs would have to commit, which is probably well beyond 20M/y, to keep Claxton, which would likely push the Mavs into the first apron next year. He may be too expensive for what he has been over the years.
o The Mavs gave away a first and limited the scope of what they could trade with in the summer.

• Why this sucks for Nets: In a vacuum, Nets could argue Mikal is worth more (rumors of denied four first last year and denied Jalen Green + assets this year). Claxton could get a first even as an expiring contract. And Nets may not buy in Lively's potential And Nets would need to continue cleaning the house.


Framework:

Mavs send:
• Dereck Lively II ($5.5M)
• THJ ($17.8M)
• Grant Williams ($12.4M) or Maxi Kleber ($11M)
• 2027 First pick
• Sweetener/filler options (2x2nds or swaps Hardy/Omax, or Exum)

Mavs receive:
• Mikal Bridges ($21.7M)
• Nic Claxton ($9.6M)

Better off trading Lively + for Claxton, DFS+

Right now Knicks are dangling a ton of picks and Rockets are dangling a ton of picks for 3rd wheel Bridges and Nets are clinging for dear life.

[TheBrooklynKidd]

Lively hopes that one day he can have the defensive impact Claxton does now.

Maybe those workout videos of him shooting 3s come to fruition but we’ve seen plenty of career 50% FT shooters nail 3s in practice, including Claxton himself.

FA status is the only reason there’s a conversation to be had.

[mademan]

Youre either underrating Lively or overrating Claxton's value. I have Lively more valuable than the UFA to be Claxton and think DFS bridges the value gap.

That's the thought here. I'm not sure what Claxton's value is when you consider his upcoming contract extension, but in my opinion both DFS and Claxton are worth lightly protected 1st rd picks. Lively is worth that at this point IMO.

Lively is very promising and cost-controlled...Claxton is a DPOY candidate and DFS is pure 3&D....I love Lively but he's nowhere near the value of both. I'd say Lively and a frp gets you Claxton and only because he's a FA.

We just see it differently. In most situations, i would never trade 6-7 years of contract control on Lively for UFA Claxton, and i dont think Dallas would either. Contract control means a lot, and Lively being 15mill or so cheaper over the next 4 years is significant too

[TheNetsFan]

Lively hopes that one day he can have the defensive impact Claxton does now.

Maybe those workout videos of him shooting 3s come to fruition but we’ve seen plenty of career 50% FT shooters nail 3s in practice, including Claxton himself.

FA status is the only reason there’s a conversation to be had.

It's cap gymnastics as well. If the Nets can get cheaper at C (a Marks tradition) to free up room for Murray, that may be worthwhile. We know Marks has used Cs like NFL RBs. Develop & use them on their cheap, rookie years, draft their replacement & then move them before their big pay day. He seems to draft a big every other year. He moved Lopez, he moved Allen. it should ne no surprise if he moves Claxton & gives Sharpe a bigger role.

[R-DAWG]

That's the thought here. I'm not sure what Claxton's value is when you consider his upcoming contract extension, but in my opinion both DFS and Claxton are worth lightly protected 1st rd picks. Lively is worth that at this point IMO.

Lively is very promising and cost-controlled...Claxton is a DPOY candidate and DFS is pure 3&D....I love Lively but he's nowhere near the value of both. I'd say Lively and a frp gets you Claxton and only because he's a FA.

We just see it differently. In most situations, i would never trade 6-7 years of contract control on Lively for UFA Claxton, and i dont think Dallas would either. Contract control means a lot, and Lively being 15mill or so cheaper over the next 4 years is significant too

If I was a win now team, and can pick up an extra win now piece, I might consider it. Dallas has to think about NOW with Luka and Kyrie. Kyrie turns 32 in a few weeks.