Swap Karl Malone with Kevin Garnett

[Ancalagon]

Thinking through this season by season and skipping Garnett’s rookie season since he was in the league for one more year. Working backward from retirement for each, making up theoretical scenarios.

1997 Garnett on the 1986 Jazz - Jazz improve substantially in the RS and arguably get the 2 seed. Garnett plays poorly in the playoffs and the result isn’t substantially different.
1986 Malone on the 1997 Timberwolves - Wolves miss playoffs.

1998 Garnett on the 1987 Jazz - again, Garnett has a more impactful regular season than Malone. Results in the playoffs are nearly identical.
1987 Malone on the 1998 Timberwolves - this is interesting because they both lost 3-2 in the first round, both shot atrociously (.462 TS% for Malone vs. .500 for KG), both averaged 10 RPG in the series, but Malone put up about 4 more points. Net rating was negative for both players but absolutely atrocious for KG.
In Game 5, KG went 3-11 with 7 points, 4 rebounds, and 10 turnovers. Malone went for 23 and 9 in a tight loss on good efficiency. Everyone not named Stockton or Malone shot a combined 27 for 61. I think Malone powers the Wolves over the Sonics but they lose in the second round.

To be continued …

1999 Garnett on the 1988 Jazz - here’s where it starts to get really interesting. Stockton is nearing the peak of his powers, and both Garnett and Malone play fairly well in the playoffs. I think Garnett improves the Jazz but they still lose that Game 7 in Los Angeles where Stockton goes for 29 and 20. Malone was great - 31 and 15. I don’t think KG makes up for Bob Hansen going 6 for 19.

1988 Malone on the 1999 Timberwolves - Malone seemed to be a perfect foil for Tim Duncan which makes this interesting- especially young, athletic, strong Malone. But I don’t think he gets a weak T Wolves team over the champs in the first round.

2000 Garnett on the 1989 Jazz - this is the year Malone started to make the leap. Very hard to see anything other than the same sweep against the Warriors.

1989 Malone on the 2000 Timberwolves - definitely a better team in the regular season. They probably get a better seed in the playoffs and may even make the second round. But not enough to take them over the top.

2001 Garnett on the 1990 Jazz - Malone was better in this Regular Season, so maybe the Jazz lose Home Court against Phoenix in the first round. The Jazz would lose that series in 5 on a shot by KJ with less than second to play. Malone had a great box score but spent much of the fourth quarter in foul trouble. Meanwhile KG was excellent but outgunned against the Spurs. I think there’s no question KG could propel those Jazz to a first round win and then put up a good fight against the Lakers. It’s a long shot but KG’s first real chance. Still, tough to give him the title when the Jazz were so far off.

1990 Malone on the 2001 Timberwolves - this is a no way. I think the Spurs take them easily.

[FuShengTHEGreat]

KG is an even bigger postseason underperformer than Malone. He had his chance with Cassell and Sprewell in 2004 and blew it. He was terrible in the NBA Finals in 2008; the Celtics won it in spite of him.

Now Cassell did get hurt during the 04 playoffs

But then again so what?

You'd think the MVP of the league would've stepped it up vs LA. How ironic we're comparing him to Malone, because the 40 year old version of him shut KG down to ice the series. Ended his season being forced out the paint and taking low % turnaround jumpers, not putting the defense under pressure by drawing fouls.

The MVP of the league at his peak facing elimination ends up:

Scoring fewer points
Taking fewer FGs
Attempting fewer FTs

Than 34 year old Latrell Spreewell!!

Karl Malone has had a bad reputation in the playoffs, but he damned sure had some better series performances than KG. 92 vs the Blazers. Heck in 98 as a old man he led utah past the next much younger 5 Finals MVPs (TIm and Shaq) in in b2b series.

What was KG doing at 34? Getting played to a standstill by Chris Bosh (talk about a world beater!) in a lopsided series loss.

Call a hater/troll but I can't recall one definiing/standout playoff series by KG....in his entire career.

Couldn't stand Karl Malone one bit due to being a Rockets fan and also due to him being a unapologetically dirty player, but I'd take him over any version of KG.

[Ancalagon]

Thinking through this season by season and skipping Garnett’s rookie season since he was in the league for one more year. Working backward from retirement for each, making up theoretical scenarios.

1997 Garnett on the 1986 Jazz - Jazz improve substantially in the RS and arguably get the 2 seed. Garnett plays poorly in the playoffs and the result isn’t substantially different.
1986 Malone on the 1997 Timberwolves - Wolves miss playoffs.

1998 Garnett on the 1987 Jazz - again, Garnett has a more impactful regular season than Malone. Results in the playoffs are nearly identical.
1987 Malone on the 1998 Timberwolves - this is interesting because they both lost 3-2 in the first round, both shot atrociously (.462 TS% for Malone vs. .500 for KG), both averaged 10 RPG in the series, but Malone put up about 4 more points. Net rating was negative for both players but absolutely atrocious for KG.
In Game 5, KG went 3-11 with 7 points, 4 rebounds, and 10 turnovers. Malone went for 23 and 9 in a tight loss on good efficiency. Everyone not named Stockton or Malone shot a combined 27 for 61. I think Malone powers the Wolves over the Sonics but they lose in the second round.

To be continued …

1999 Garnett on the 1988 Jazz - here’s where it starts to get really interesting. Stockton is nearing the peak of his powers, and both Garnett and Malone play fairly well in the playoffs. I think Garnett improves the Jazz but they still lose that Game 7 in Los Angeles where Stockton goes for 29 and 20. Malone was great - 31 and 15. I don’t think KG makes up for Bob Hansen going 6 for 19.

1988 Malone on the 1999 Timberwolves - Malone seemed to be a perfect foil for Tim Duncan which makes this interesting- especially young, athletic, strong Malone. But I don’t think he gets a weak T Wolves team over the champs in the first round.

2000 Garnett on the 1989 Jazz - this is the year Malone started to make the leap. Very hard to see anything other than the same sweep against the Warriors.

1989 Malone on the 2000 Timberwolves - definitely a better team in the regular season. They probably get a better seed in the playoffs and may even make the second round. But not enough to take them over the top.

2001 Garnett on the 1990 Jazz - Malone was better in this Regular Season, so maybe the Jazz lose Home Court against Phoenix in the first round. The Jazz would lose that series in 5 on a shot by KJ with less than second to play. Malone had a great box score but spent much of the fourth quarter in foul trouble. Meanwhile KG was excellent but outgunned against the Spurs. I think there’s no question KG could propel those Jazz to a first round win and then put up a good fight against the Lakers. It’s a long shot but KG’s first real chance. Still, tough to give him the title when the Jazz were so far off.

1990 Malone on the 2001 Timberwolves - this is a no way. I think the Spurs take them easily.

2002 KG on the 1991 Jazz - Malone was really good that season and played well in the playoffs. Jazz ended up getting eviscerated 4-1 in the Second Round by a 63-19 Blazers team. I don’t think KG changes that. In fact, they might be a lower seed and facing a better team earlier. I would say their results are the same or worse.

1991 Malone on the 2002 Timberwolves - KG got absolutely destroyed by Dirk in this series as the Wolves got swept by the Mavs. This has always been one of the reasons I have been flabbergasted by this board’s placement of KG relative to Dirk on all-time lists. Malone always performed better against Dirk given his strength. Still, I don’t think he’s enough to necessarily turn this series. Maybe it’s closer or maybe the Wolves lose in the second round.

[SportsGuru08]

KG basically needed super stacked rosters just to get out of the first round. In 1988, Malone & Stockton -with basically no bench production- pushed the Showtime Lakers to the brink. But for Cooper's heroics in Game 5, they might have won the series outright

Funny you didn't mention Thurl Bailey in that same game leading both teams with 28 points. Very convenient to ignore the 20 ppg scorer off the Jazz bench who finished 2nd in 6MOY voting while you repeatedly talk about the lack of bench production.

And there is nothing super stacked about the 04 TWolves other than a solid #2 in Cassell. Unless you want to make the argument that Latrell Sprewell at that stage was some underrated superstar, or that Trenton Hassell and Ervin Johnson were great starters.

Fine, a team with no DEPTH to speak of since we're splitting hairs here. And the MPG distribution in that series proves it, especially compared to the Lakers.

[WherePipAt]

Nothing really changes outside of Malone getting a ring in 2008

[OhayoKD]

KG is an even bigger postseason underperformer than Malone. He had his chance with Cassell and Sprewell in 2004 and blew it. He was terrible in the NBA Finals in 2008; the Celtics won it in spite of him.

Now Cassell did get hurt during the 04 playoffs

But then again so what?

You'd think the MVP of the league would've stepped it up vs LA. How ironic we're comparing him to Malone, because the 40 year old version of him shut KG down to ice the series. Ended his season being forced out the paint and taking low % turnaround jumpers, not putting the defense under pressure by drawing fouls.

The MVP of the league at his peak facing elimination ends up:

Scoring fewer points
Taking fewer FGs
Attempting fewer FTs

Than 34 year old Latrell Spreewell!!

Karl Malone has had a bad reputation in the playoffs, but he damned sure had some better series performances than KG. 92 vs the Blazers. Heck in 98 as a old man he led utah past the next much younger 5 Finals MVPs (TIm and Shaq) in in b2b series.

What was KG doing at 34? Getting played to a standstill by Chris Bosh (talk about a world beater!) in a lopsided series loss.

Call a hater/troll but I can't recall one definiing/standout playoff series by KG....in his entire career.

Couldn't stand Karl Malone one bit due to being a Rockets fan and also due to him being a unapologetically dirty player, but I'd take him over any version of KG.

Both his Lakers and Sacramento performances from this run you're criticizing were better than any of Malone's at any point in his career.

Defense is a thing. And Garnett had a masterclass on that front vs LA and in those playoffs and regular-season matches in general.

Stepping up, the Wolves played to that MVP-led regular-season level(emperically produced by a season-wide performance as or more valuable than any year from anyone crossing paths with Malone ever) before the only notable teammate got hurt. He proceeded to take 2 games in a close series against a team where lockdown Malone was a distant distant 3rd banana.

I am sympathetic to "ugh stats" up until the point it becomes clear ignoring data is just an excuse to cherrypick whatever aspect of the game or, better yet, parts of a series or season, and ignore everything else.

Assuming winning is the goal, there is virtually no evidence supporting Malone as a comparable win-generator, and there is no reason to think his advantage on offense offset his disadvantage on defense in the regular season or in the playoffs. Bringing up KG's biggest weakness relative to Malone in a specific stretch is no different from me highlighting that Malone's Jazz are possibly champions had he just managed the ball better in 98.

[SSUBluesman]

KG is an even bigger postseason underperformer than Malone. He had his chance with Cassell and Sprewell in 2004 and blew it. He was terrible in the NBA Finals in 2008; the Celtics won it in spite of him.

Now Cassell did get hurt during the 04 playoffs

But then again so what?

You'd think the MVP of the league would've stepped it up vs LA. How ironic we're comparing him to Malone, because the 40 year old version of him shut KG down to ice the series. Ended his season being forced out the paint and taking low % turnaround jumpers, not putting the defense under pressure by drawing fouls.

The MVP of the league at his peak facing elimination ends up:

Scoring fewer points
Taking fewer FGs
Attempting fewer FTs

Than 34 year old Latrell Spreewell!!

Karl Malone has had a bad reputation in the playoffs, but he damned sure had some better series performances than KG. 92 vs the Blazers. Heck in 98 as a old man he led utah past the next much younger 5 Finals MVPs (TIm and Shaq) in in b2b series.

What was KG doing at 34? Getting played to a standstill by Chris Bosh (talk about a world beater!) in a lopsided series loss.

Call a hater/troll but I can't recall one definiing/standout playoff series by KG....in his entire career.

Couldn't stand Karl Malone one bit due to being a Rockets fan and also due to him being a unapologetically dirty player, but I'd take him over any version of KG.

At first I thought the worst part of your "argument" was saying "so what" about the PG and 2nd best player on the team being injured. Don't get me wrong, that's incredibly idiotic, especially when you go on to opine about KG "being forced out of the paint". Surely it had nothing to do with having to initiate more of the offense because they didn't have an NBA quality PG on the floor

No, the worst part is when you claim that Spree out produced him in multiple categories, when in fact he did not. A five minute internet search (https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2004-nba-western-conference-finals-lakers-vs-timberwolves.html) will show that KG scored 17 more points, attempted 15 more field goals, and 1 more free throw than Spree in the series against the Lakers.

It's laughable that you're going to take a 6 game series that the Jazz lost when against the Kings KG went for 24/15 capped off with a 32/21 game 7 where he made every Wolves shot from the field in the 4th quarter while also making clutch plays all over the court down the stretch.

[Ancalagon]

1999 Garnett on the 1988 Jazz - here’s where it starts to get really interesting. Stockton is nearing the peak of his powers, and both Garnett and Malone play fairly well in the playoffs. I think Garnett improves the Jazz but they still lose that Game 7 in Los Angeles where Stockton goes for 29 and 20. Malone was great - 31 and 15. I don’t think KG makes up for Bob Hansen going 6 for 19.

1988 Malone on the 1999 Timberwolves - Malone seemed to be a perfect foil for Tim Duncan which makes this interesting- especially young, athletic, strong Malone. But I don’t think he gets a weak T Wolves team over the champs in the first round.

2000 Garnett on the 1989 Jazz - this is the year Malone started to make the leap. Very hard to see anything other than the same sweep against the Warriors.

1989 Malone on the 2000 Timberwolves - definitely a better team in the regular season. They probably get a better seed in the playoffs and may even make the second round. But not enough to take them over the top.

2001 Garnett on the 1990 Jazz - Malone was better in this Regular Season, so maybe the Jazz lose Home Court against Phoenix in the first round. The Jazz would lose that series in 5 on a shot by KJ with less than second to play. Malone had a great box score but spent much of the fourth quarter in foul trouble. Meanwhile KG was excellent but outgunned against the Spurs. I think there’s no question KG could propel those Jazz to a first round win and then put up a good fight against the Lakers. It’s a long shot but KG’s first real chance. Still, tough to give him the title when the Jazz were so far off.

1990 Malone on the 2001 Timberwolves - this is a no way. I think the Spurs take them easily.

2002 KG on the 1991 Jazz - Malone was really good that season and played well in the playoffs. Jazz ended up getting eviscerated 4-1 in the Second Round by a 63-19 Blazers team. I don’t think KG changes that. In fact, they might be a lower seed and facing a better team earlier. I would say their results are the same or worse.

1991 Malone on the 2002 Timberwolves - KG got absolutely destroyed by Dirk in this series as the Wolves got swept by the Mavs. This has always been one of the reasons I have been flabbergasted by this board’s placement of KG relative to Dirk on all-time lists. Malone always performed better against Dirk given his strength. Still, I don’t think he’s enough to necessarily turn this series. Maybe it’s closer or maybe the Wolves lose in the second round.

Ok, the meat of their primes.


2003 Garnett on the 1992 Jazz - Malone was absolutely awesome during this playoff run - the best yet for the Jazz where they went down in the Conference Finals. He averaged 28 and 12 in the Conference Finals on 63% TS%. Not sure I see KG doing any better.

1992 Malone on the 2003 Timberwolves - KG averaged 27 and 16 and no one seriously thought they threatened the Lakers. Even with Malone’s better scoring efficiency, I don’t see a big change here.

2004 Garnett on the 1993 Jazz - Great year for KG (MVP Regular Season), weird year for the Jazz (only 47 wins, reversing their consistent uphill trajectory since Stockton and Malone were drafted). Even so, I can’t see KG pushing the Jazz over the top in MJ’s final year of his threepeat. Maybe a first round victory over the Sonics but not a lot more.

1993 Malone on the 2004 Timberwolves - Not a 1 seed and not making it out of the first round in a punishing Western Conference. Substantial downgrade.

[Ancalagon]

2000 Garnett on the 1989 Jazz - this is the year Malone started to make the leap. Very hard to see anything other than the same sweep against the Warriors.

1989 Malone on the 2000 Timberwolves - definitely a better team in the regular season. They probably get a better seed in the playoffs and may even make the second round. But not enough to take them over the top.

2001 Garnett on the 1990 Jazz - Malone was better in this Regular Season, so maybe the Jazz lose Home Court against Phoenix in the first round. The Jazz would lose that series in 5 on a shot by KJ with less than second to play. Malone had a great box score but spent much of the fourth quarter in foul trouble. Meanwhile KG was excellent but outgunned against the Spurs. I think there’s no question KG could propel those Jazz to a first round win and then put up a good fight against the Lakers. It’s a long shot but KG’s first real chance. Still, tough to give him the title when the Jazz were so far off.

1990 Malone on the 2001 Timberwolves - this is a no way. I think the Spurs take them easily.

2002 KG on the 1991 Jazz - Malone was really good that season and played well in the playoffs. Jazz ended up getting eviscerated 4-1 in the Second Round by a 63-19 Blazers team. I don’t think KG changes that. In fact, they might be a lower seed and facing a better team earlier. I would say their results are the same or worse.

1991 Malone on the 2002 Timberwolves - KG got absolutely destroyed by Dirk in this series as the Wolves got swept by the Mavs. This has always been one of the reasons I have been flabbergasted by this board’s placement of KG relative to Dirk on all-time lists. Malone always performed better against Dirk given his strength. Still, I don’t think he’s enough to necessarily turn this series. Maybe it’s closer or maybe the Wolves lose in the second round.

Ok, the meat of their primes.


2003 Garnett on the 1992 Jazz - Malone was absolutely awesome during this playoff run - the best yet for the Jazz where they went down in the Conference Finals. He averaged 28 and 12 in the Conference Finals on 63% TS%. Not sure I see KG doing any better.

1992 Malone on the 2003 Timberwolves - KG averaged 27 and 16 and no one seriously thought they threatened the Lakers. Even with Malone’s better scoring efficiency, I don’t see a big change here.

2004 Garnett on the 1993 Jazz - Great year for KG (MVP Regular Season), weird year for the Jazz (only 47 wins, reversing their consistent uphill trajectory since Stockton and Malone were drafted). Even so, I can’t see KG pushing the Jazz over the top in MJ’s final year of his threepeat. Maybe a first round victory over the Sonics but not a lot more.

1993 Malone on the 2004 Timberwolves - Not a 1 seed and not making it out of the first round in a punishing Western Conference. Substantial downgrade.

2005 Garnett on the 1994 Jazz - this is a tough one because we don’t have a Garnett postseason to measure off of here. Garnett’s team got worse, while Malone’s supporting cast was strengthened with Hornacek. KG had a strong regular season and might have led the Jazz to more wins and a higher seed. But ultimately the Jazz fell 4-1 to the champs in the conference finals. Malone averaged 26/13/5 on 51% TS% that postseason, worse than Garnett’s regular season but arguably better than almost any KG postseason. While this one is an interesting hypothetical, I’m not going to give KG credit by saying he would play better in the 2005 postseason than he did in real life in the 2004 postseason.

1994 Malone on the 2005 Timberwolves - miss the playoffs

2006 Garnett on the 1995 Jazz - Garnett’s T Wolves were an actively bad team that year, while Malone’s Jazz won 60 games and got extremely unlucky running into the eventual champion Rockets in round one, underseeded due to injuries. The Jazz only lost the series due to the Rockets unexpectedly using 3 point variance earlier than it had ever been used before. In Game 2 in Salt Lake City, they broke the 3 point made record with !19! made threes (crazy to think about in 2024, right?). Malone had strong box score stats but weak impact stats in the series. It’s interesting to imagine the effect KG would have had on Olajuwon.
That Jazz team was very strong, and it’s possible to imagine KG winning a title in 1995. Very tough call here, but I’m going to call this one a narrow miss as well.

1995 Malone on 2006 Timberwolves - miss playoffs

[Ancalagon]

2002 KG on the 1991 Jazz - Malone was really good that season and played well in the playoffs. Jazz ended up getting eviscerated 4-1 in the Second Round by a 63-19 Blazers team. I don’t think KG changes that. In fact, they might be a lower seed and facing a better team earlier. I would say their results are the same or worse.

1991 Malone on the 2002 Timberwolves - KG got absolutely destroyed by Dirk in this series as the Wolves got swept by the Mavs. This has always been one of the reasons I have been flabbergasted by this board’s placement of KG relative to Dirk on all-time lists. Malone always performed better against Dirk given his strength. Still, I don’t think he’s enough to necessarily turn this series. Maybe it’s closer or maybe the Wolves lose in the second round.

Ok, the meat of their primes.


2003 Garnett on the 1992 Jazz - Malone was absolutely awesome during this playoff run - the best yet for the Jazz where they went down in the Conference Finals. He averaged 28 and 12 in the Conference Finals on 63% TS%. Not sure I see KG doing any better.

1992 Malone on the 2003 Timberwolves - KG averaged 27 and 16 and no one seriously thought they threatened the Lakers. Even with Malone’s better scoring efficiency, I don’t see a big change here.

2004 Garnett on the 1993 Jazz - Great year for KG (MVP Regular Season), weird year for the Jazz (only 47 wins, reversing their consistent uphill trajectory since Stockton and Malone were drafted). Even so, I can’t see KG pushing the Jazz over the top in MJ’s final year of his threepeat. Maybe a first round victory over the Sonics but not a lot more.

1993 Malone on the 2004 Timberwolves - Not a 1 seed and not making it out of the first round in a punishing Western Conference. Substantial downgrade.

2005 Garnett on the 1994 Jazz - this is a tough one because we don’t have a Garnett postseason to measure off of here. Garnett’s team got worse, while Malone’s supporting cast was strengthened with Hornacek. KG had a strong regular season and might have led the Jazz to more wins and a higher seed. But ultimately the Jazz fell 4-1 to the champs in the conference finals. Malone averaged 26/13/5 on 51% TS% that postseason, worse than Garnett’s regular season but arguably better than almost any KG postseason. While this one is an interesting hypothetical, I’m not going to give KG credit by saying he would play better in the 2005 postseason than he did in real life in the 2004 postseason.

1994 Malone on the 2005 Timberwolves - miss the playoffs

2006 Garnett on the 1995 Jazz - Garnett’s T Wolves were an actively bad team that year, while Malone’s Jazz won 60 games and got extremely unlucky running into the eventual champion Rockets in round one, underseeded due to injuries. The Jazz only lost the series due to the Rockets unexpectedly using 3 point variance earlier than it had ever been used before. In Game 2 in Salt Lake City, they broke the 3 point made record with !19! made threes (crazy to think about in 2024, right?). Malone had strong box score stats but weak impact stats in the series. It’s interesting to imagine the effect KG would have had on Olajuwon.
That Jazz team was very strong, and it’s possible to imagine KG winning a title in 1995. Very tough call here, but I’m going to call this one a narrow miss as well.

1995 Malone on 2006 Timberwolves - miss playoffs

2007 Garnett on the 1996 Jazz - by this point, Garnett isn’t playing nearly at his peak level and the Wolves have fallen to 32-50. Malone is again building some momentum and helps lead the Jazz to the brink of the Finals. There’s a part of me that saw KG peak higher in the playoffs and wants to say that he would have carried the Jazz through to face the Bulls (where they would have inevitably lost), but his postseason track record just isn’t good enough for me to give it to him in a year he himself missed the postseason and didn’t play particularly well. Malone was strong in the Sonics series despite a poor showing in a tight game 7 loss (aided by some poor officiating, if I'm remembering correctly). Malone missed critical free throws and was outplayed by Kemp, but I think the overall series result is the same with KG on the Jazz.

1996 Malone on 2007 Timberwolves - same result, miss the playoffs.

2008 Garnett on 1997 Jazz - this is the big one - the year they both make Finals runs. Malone was more durable and played more minutes during the regular season, but I think even 71 games of Garnett snags the 1 seed for the Jazz in a diluted Western Conference at the bottom. Garnett was better throughout the playoffs than Malone, who had some pedestrian outings and was somewhat carried by Stockton in the Conference Finals. Neither KG nor Malone had an exceptional Finals. Both shot poorly. I’m going to make the tough call and say this is the same result - a loss to the Bulls in the Finals, albeit in 7.

1997 Malone on the 2008 Celtics - the Celtics won 66 games with KG playing 71. They might have won 70 with Malone playing 82. I’m going to go series by series to see if Malone gets through.
Hawks series - through easily. Malone eviscerates that interior the same way he did the Clippers in round 1.
Cavs series - same. Malone gets through easily.
Detroit series - this is a doozy. Garnett was strong throughout the series, while Malone played poorly against Houston. For a tiebreaker, I go to their Game 6 clinching performance, in which Malone was superior and made several game-clinching plays (even if Stockton hit the game winner). Malone gets through.
Finals - I think Pau gets made into fried chicken. Malone wins championship.

[tsherkin]

In general, I don't think much changes in terms of rings. More Finals appearances, though.

In 97, I think maybe the Jazz look better because maybe Garnett doesn't collapse as much as Malone did against that Chicago D, but KG wasn't a particularly forceful scorer at most points of his career, so I don't know that it would have made much difference. KG certainly wouldn't have done anything relevant defensively against the style Chicago played. He was a great help defender for sure, but like, his length is somewhat meaningless against volume Jordan fadeaways that he couldn't actually stop.

I expect the Jazz to have made the Finals with KG in 92 and then lost to the Bulls. They might have defeated Seattle in 96: Malone had a pretty rough series, but for a hot second, Gary Payton knew how to shoot, and that's tough to overcome coupled to their D and overall offensive profile. Still, that was a 7-game series, so if Garnett just played MEH instead of pooping himself, then they might have earned the right to get smoked by the Bulls in the Finals in Jordan's last truly epic postseason. He was extremely good in 97 and 98 as well, but he was better in 96.

Like, I love KG's defense. I think that Utah's RS performance would look better than it did. I don't think he was any kind of upgrade over Malone as a scoring threat, which is all of what was missing from Utah's actual contention. He was never that kind of player. He certainly would have looked better in that regard next to Stockton, of course, but that matters only so much because he wasn't THAT much better a shooter than Malone, nor that much better as a postseason scorer.

98, I don't think much changes. Once again, Utah suffered from lack of scoring but that time, it wasn't Malone. Their generally weak backcourt was the issue. The lack of any kind of meaningful second scorer who wasn't just a set shooter was a big, big issue. Outside of Game 1, Stockton was irrelevant as a scoring threat. He was a < 10 ppg scorer that series. Hornacek sucked ass, as he often did against big, athletic defenders. And what else? Bryon Russell? Like, Malone can be forgiven for losing that series, you know what I mean? He had nothing to work with, Stockton's passing not to be overlooked and notwithstanding. You need help to defeat good teams and he didn't have it. Even Jordan didn't shoot well in that series, scoring at under playoff league average efficiency and posting a lofty 42.7% FG. KG wasn't ever going to do enough to overcome that sort of issue, we saw that enough in his own career.

Utah matched poorly with Chicago, and because Chicago was in the Finals so much in the 90s, I don't think too much changes. 97 would be the year, if any time. At least in 97, the Jazz had 3 other double-digit scorers. None of them particularly high-order or especially impressive, but much better than the dumpster fire they produced in 98. Stockton was a 15 ppg guy, Hornacek managed 12 on bleh efficiency, Russell managed 11, you know what I mean? But Malone pooped himself and that directly cost them the series. So MAYBE Garnett doesn't. But he was a career 51.1% TS guy in the playoffs with a drop-off in FG%. He wasn't a particularly strong playoff scorer. And Stockton feeding him a steady diet of mid-range jumpers wouldn't be any different than the steady diet of mid-range jumpers he generated for himself in his actual career. 03-06 were the only seasons he was a meaningfully efficient scorer to begin with, and while again, Stockton would have helped him a lot in the PS, there's a limit to how good he was ever going to be since he played like Old Malone a lot of his career to begin with and didn't have the same physicality around the basket as even 39 year-old Malone managed. That was never his game, he wasn't powerful and he wasn't aggressive in close... ever. So I don't imagine there would be HUGE changes, and I definitely don't see them winning a ring against Chicago outside of 97.

Now. 94 and 95, circling back. Those are interesting years. They got SMOKED in 94. I don't see Garnett changing that. Houston smacked them down 4-1. KG isn't good enough to have changed that outcome. The year after was closer. They lost 3-2 and Malone also didn't have a good series. They also ate it HARD from Olajuwon and that wasn't about to change. But even despite Malone having a weak series at the line, he was a 55% TS guy in that series and that's... more like regular season KG than postseason KG. I don't have huge faith that he'd have done anything differently, or that his impact on D would have been enough. Olajuwon was still going to beat on him severely, and worse if he tried to be the primary defender.

[FuShengTHEGreat]

At first I thought the worst part of your "argument" was saying "so what" about the PG and 2nd best player on the team being injured. Don't get me wrong, that's incredibly idiotic, especially when you go on to opine about KG "being forced out of the paint". Surely it had nothing to do with having to initiate more of the offense because they didn't have an NBA quality PG on the floor

No, the worst part is when you claim that Spree out produced him in multiple categories, [b]when in fact he did not. A five minute internet search (https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2004-nba-western-conference-finals-lakers-vs-timberwolves.html) will show that KG scored 17 more points, attempted 15 more field goals, and 1 more free throw than Spree in the series against the Lakers[/b].

It's laughable that you're going to take a 6 game series that the Jazz lost when against the Kings KG went for 24/15 capped off with a 32/21 game 7 where he made every Wolves shot from the field in the 4th quarter while also making clutch plays all over the court down the stretch.

Stop making me laugh. I was referring KG to season on the line as in facing elimination on the road.....not their series totals. KG as the MVP attempted fewer FGs than Spreewell. Got to the FT line FAR less than Spree. Couldn't step up vs a 40 year old Karl Malone. That was a big dilemma for teams with him offensively as a anchor.....spent too much time out on the perimeter taking those lower FG% turnaround 15 ft jumpers and not getting into the paint drawing fouls like some of the other historically great PFs.

Not clown at all as far as I'm concerned.

Oh whoop di do da.....KG feasted on the injury riddled CWebb that played all of 23 games that year. He didnt even shoot all that efficiently (44% FG) that series . That's like the highlight of his playoff career lol.

[FuShengTHEGreat]

Both his Lakers and Sacramento performances from this run you're criticizing were better than any of Malone's at any point in his career.

Defense is a thing. And Garnett had a masterclass on that front vs LA and in those playoffs and regular-season matches in general.

Stepping up, the Wolves played to that MVP-led regular-season level(emperically produced by a season-wide performance as or more valuable than any year from anyone crossing paths with Malone ever) before the only notable teammate got hurt. He proceeded to take 2 games in a close series against a team where lockdown Malone was a distant distant 3rd banana.

I am sympathetic to "ugh stats" up until the point it becomes clear ignoring data is just an excuse to cherrypick whatever aspect of the game or, better yet, parts of a series or season, and ignore everything else.

Assuming winning is the goal, there is virtually no evidence supporting Malone as a comparable win-generator, and there is no reason to think his advantage on offense offset his disadvantage on defense in the regular season or in the playoffs. Bringing up KG's biggest weakness relative to Malone in a specific stretch is no different from me highlighting that Malone's Jazz are possibly champions had he just managed the ball better in 98.

Strongly disagree with the bolded. They barely beat Sacramento in 04 with CWebb injury riddled and barely playing that year. KG the MVP of the league shot 44% for the series. Then when getting eliminated vs the Lakers on the road deferred on offense to 34 year old Spreewell in the last game of his career.

What'd KG do in his playoff career as impressive as Malone dropping 30/10 and running circles around Shaq/Elden in 98 in a lopsided series sweep? He was 34 years old at the time. 1994 Malone dominated the series vs a prime frontcourt pairing of Rodman and Robinson. It's not Karl's fault Stockton got ran roughshod by Terry Porter in 92 in a series he shot above average efficiency by his standards.

I dont see any series KG put forth surpassing those.

KG at 34 couldn't even dominate vs Chris Bosh in a lopsided series loss lol.

And Karl Malone was a very good/underrated defensive player. He wasnt a shotblocker/rim protector. And maybe not the team defender KG was. But very difficult to score 1 on 1 against, very good hands at stripping opponents of the ball....almost impossible to back down even for Centers in post up situations.

Much more impressed by Malones combination of offense/defense than I am of KG. As he was the better overall PF.

[tsherkin]

And Karl Malone was a very good/underrated defensive player.

"Very good?" Yes.

"Underrated?" No.

He made 4 All-Defensive teams. People knew he was a proficient man defender. He was not an especially good help defender, certainly not anchor-level. That's the only real blowback he gets on D. He was an extremely adept man defender in the post and he was a good defensive rebounder. But that has diminishing returns. Enough so that he was not underrated in that respect. Everyone knew what his defensive strength was during his career. It was even discussed often during his final year with LA during that season.

[Ancalagon]

Ok, the meat of their primes.


2003 Garnett on the 1992 Jazz - Malone was absolutely awesome during this playoff run - the best yet for the Jazz where they went down in the Conference Finals. He averaged 28 and 12 in the Conference Finals on 63% TS%. Not sure I see KG doing any better.

1992 Malone on the 2003 Timberwolves - KG averaged 27 and 16 and no one seriously thought they threatened the Lakers. Even with Malone’s better scoring efficiency, I don’t see a big change here.

2004 Garnett on the 1993 Jazz - Great year for KG (MVP Regular Season), weird year for the Jazz (only 47 wins, reversing their consistent uphill trajectory since Stockton and Malone were drafted). Even so, I can’t see KG pushing the Jazz over the top in MJ’s final year of his threepeat. Maybe a first round victory over the Sonics but not a lot more.

1993 Malone on the 2004 Timberwolves - Not a 1 seed and not making it out of the first round in a punishing Western Conference. Substantial downgrade.

2005 Garnett on the 1994 Jazz - this is a tough one because we don’t have a Garnett postseason to measure off of here. Garnett’s team got worse, while Malone’s supporting cast was strengthened with Hornacek. KG had a strong regular season and might have led the Jazz to more wins and a higher seed. But ultimately the Jazz fell 4-1 to the champs in the conference finals. Malone averaged 26/13/5 on 51% TS% that postseason, worse than Garnett’s regular season but arguably better than almost any KG postseason. While this one is an interesting hypothetical, I’m not going to give KG credit by saying he would play better in the 2005 postseason than he did in real life in the 2004 postseason.

1994 Malone on the 2005 Timberwolves - miss the playoffs

2006 Garnett on the 1995 Jazz - Garnett’s T Wolves were an actively bad team that year, while Malone’s Jazz won 60 games and got extremely unlucky running into the eventual champion Rockets in round one, underseeded due to injuries. The Jazz only lost the series due to the Rockets unexpectedly using 3 point variance earlier than it had ever been used before. In Game 2 in Salt Lake City, they broke the 3 point made record with !19! made threes (crazy to think about in 2024, right?). Malone had strong box score stats but weak impact stats in the series. It’s interesting to imagine the effect KG would have had on Olajuwon.
That Jazz team was very strong, and it’s possible to imagine KG winning a title in 1995. Very tough call here, but I’m going to call this one a narrow miss as well.

1995 Malone on 2006 Timberwolves - miss playoffs

2007 Garnett on the 1996 Jazz - by this point, Garnett isn’t playing nearly at his peak level and the Wolves have fallen to 32-50. Malone is again building some momentum and helps lead the Jazz to the brink of the Finals. There’s a part of me that saw KG peak higher in the playoffs and wants to say that he would have carried the Jazz through to face the Bulls (where they would have inevitably lost), but his postseason track record just isn’t good enough for me to give it to him in a year he himself missed the postseason and didn’t play particularly well. Malone was strong in the Sonics series despite a poor showing in a tight game 7 loss (aided by some poor officiating, if I'm remembering correctly). Malone missed critical free throws and was outplayed by Kemp, but I think the overall series result is the same with KG on the Jazz.

1996 Malone on 2007 Timberwolves - same result, miss the playoffs.

2008 Garnett on 1997 Jazz - this is the big one - the year they both make Finals runs. Malone was more durable and played more minutes during the regular season, but I think even 71 games of Garnett snags the 1 seed for the Jazz in a diluted Western Conference at the bottom. Garnett was better throughout the playoffs than Malone, who had some pedestrian outings and was somewhat carried by Stockton in the Conference Finals. Neither KG nor Malone had an exceptional Finals. Both shot poorly. I’m going to make the tough call and say this is the same result - a loss to the Bulls in the Finals, albeit in 7.

1997 Malone on the 2008 Celtics - the Celtics won 66 games with KG playing 71. They might have won 70 with Malone playing 82. I’m going to go series by series to see if Malone gets through.
Hawks series - through easily. Malone eviscerates that interior the same way he did the Clippers in round 1.
Cavs series - same. Malone gets through easily.
Detroit series - this is a doozy. Garnett was strong throughout the series, while Malone played poorly against Houston. For a tiebreaker, I go to their Game 6 clinching performance, in which Malone was superior and made several game-clinching plays (even if Stockton hit the game winner). Malone gets through.
Finals - I think Pau gets made into fried chicken. Malone wins championship.

2009 Garnett on the 1998 Jazz - Garnett misses much of the season, including the playoffs. The Jazz don’t go far.

1998 Malone on the 2009 Celtics - conceivable that this is a 70 win championship team again. A stronger postseason performance than 1997for Malone coupled with the group’s second year to gel together likely equals another title.

So now we’re in the perplexing position of Malone getting two more titles than KG with arguably a worse peak and less defensive impact.

[SSUBluesman]

At first I thought the worst part of your "argument" was saying "so what" about the PG and 2nd best player on the team being injured. Don't get me wrong, that's incredibly idiotic, especially when you go on to opine about KG "being forced out of the paint". Surely it had nothing to do with having to initiate more of the offense because they didn't have an NBA quality PG on the floor

No, the worst part is when you claim that Spree out produced him in multiple categories, [b]when in fact he did not. A five minute internet search (https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2004-nba-western-conference-finals-lakers-vs-timberwolves.html) will show that KG scored 17 more points, attempted 15 more field goals, and 1 more free throw than Spree in the series against the Lakers[/b].

It's laughable that you're going to take a 6 game series that the Jazz lost when against the Kings KG went for 24/15 capped off with a 32/21 game 7 where he made every Wolves shot from the field in the 4th quarter while also making clutch plays all over the court down the stretch.

Stop making me laugh. I was referring KG to season on the line as in facing elimination on the road.....not their series totals. KG as the MVP attempted fewer FGs than Spreewell. Got to the FT line FAR less than Spree. Couldn't step up vs a 40 year old Karl Malone. That was a big dilemma for teams with him offensively as a anchor.....spent too much time out on the perimeter taking those lower FG% turnaround 15 ft jumpers and not getting into the paint drawing fouls like some of the other historically great PFs.

Not clown at all as far as I'm concerned.

Oh whoop di do da.....KG feasted on the injury riddled CWebb that played all of 23 games that year. He didnt even shoot all that efficiently (44% FG) that series . That's like the highlight of his playoff career lol.

Of course not as far as you're concerned because you're incredibly irrational and biased against KG. You downplay his series against the Kings by pointing to his FG% (44) as inefficient after crowing about how Spree "outperformed" KG by attempting a whopping 2 more FG's and 5 points while shooting 36% on his FG's. KG put up over 2x the pts and almost 2x the rebounds as Malone and you actually expect people to take you seriously when you say he couldn't "step up"?

[SSUBluesman]

Both his Lakers and Sacramento performances from this run you're criticizing were better than any of Malone's at any point in his career.

Defense is a thing. And Garnett had a masterclass on that front vs LA and in those playoffs and regular-season matches in general.

Stepping up, the Wolves played to that MVP-led regular-season level(emperically produced by a season-wide performance as or more valuable than any year from anyone crossing paths with Malone ever) before the only notable teammate got hurt. He proceeded to take 2 games in a close series against a team where lockdown Malone was a distant distant 3rd banana.

I am sympathetic to "ugh stats" up until the point it becomes clear ignoring data is just an excuse to cherrypick whatever aspect of the game or, better yet, parts of a series or season, and ignore everything else.

Assuming winning is the goal, there is virtually no evidence supporting Malone as a comparable win-generator, and there is no reason to think his advantage on offense offset his disadvantage on defense in the regular season or in the playoffs. Bringing up KG's biggest weakness relative to Malone in a specific stretch is no different from me highlighting that Malone's Jazz are possibly champions had he just managed the ball better in 98.

Strongly disagree with the bolded. They barely beat Sacramento in 04 with CWebb injury riddled and barely playing that year. KG the MVP of the league shot 44% for the series. Then when getting eliminated vs the Lakers on the road deferred on offense to 34 year old Spreewell in the last game of his career.

What'd KG do in his playoff career as impressive as Malone dropping 30/10 and running circles around Shaq/Elden in 98 in a lopsided series sweep? He was 34 years old at the time. 1994 Malone dominated the series vs a prime frontcourt pairing of Rodman and Robinson. It's not Karl's fault Stockton got ran roughshod by Terry Porter in 92 in a series he shot above average efficiency by his standards.

I dont see any series KG put forth surpassing those.

KG at 34 couldn't even dominate vs Chris Bosh in a lopsided series loss lol.

And Karl Malone was a very good/underrated defensive player. He wasnt a shotblocker/rim protector. And maybe not the team defender KG was. But very difficult to score 1 on 1 against, very good hands at stripping opponents of the ball....almost impossible to back down even for Centers in post up situations.

Much more impressed by Malones combination of offense/defense than I am of KG. As he was the better overall PF.

Webber played every game of that series and the 3rd most minutes on his team while leading the team in scoring, so stop making it sound like he was hobbled and barely available in that series.

KG had the highest USG on the Wolves and took 20 FG's to Spree's 22, how exactly is that "deferring"? Let me guess, in the same way that was Spree's "final game" even though he played the following season. I fully expect you to walk this back with something to the effect of "Well I meant his final playoff game" or some other nonsense.

I already told you what KG did that was more impressive than anything Malone has done: He put up 32 and 21 while scoring every field goal for his team in the 4th quarter to clinch the series. You seem stuck looking at boxscores looking for something to use to nitpick, so let me help you out:

Game 7 KG highlights:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=GAMETIMEHIGHLIGHTS
Full game 7:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=MaxMilly85

At the end of game 7 KG switches onto Bibby on the perimeter forcing him to give the ball up and after the 3pt attempt is airmailed he comes down and blocks Miller at the rim. On the final inbound the ball goes out to Webber who misses a 3 being contested by KG. Wolves win.

But that's what everyone else sees and talks about. However, your review would be something to the effect of:
"Why didn't KG get the rebound on the airballed 3"?
"He blocked the ball out of bounds, which gave the Kings the chance to reset and run and inbounds play"
"He shouldn't have let Webber receive the pass and instead of blocking the shot he allowed Webber to get a shot off"

[FuShengTHEGreat]

Of course not as far as you're concerned because you're incredibly irrational and biased against KG. You downplay his series against the Kings by pointing to his FG% (44) as inefficient after crowing about how Spree "outperformed" KG by attempting a whopping 2 more FG's and 5 points while shooting 36% on his FG's. KG put up over 2x the pts and almost 2x the rebounds as Malone and you actually expect people to take you seriously when you say he couldn't "step up"?

He didn't show to be their go to guy when they needed him to be facing elimination.

Who is saying outperformed other than you? As far as I'm concerned he didn't show to be a more aggressive go to option than Spreewell in game 6 which is what Minny needed from him. Committed almost half his teams' turnovers. 40 year old Malone repeatedly forced him out on the perimeter taking lower % jumpers. Not getting to the line.

Actually you're the one that shouldn't be taken seriously by claiming Karl Malone didnt have better playoff series performances his resume than KG in 04.

[FuShengTHEGreat]

Webber played every game of that series and the 3rd most minutes on his team while leading the team in scoring, so stop making it sound like he was hobbled and barely available in that series.

KG had the highest USG on the Wolves and took 20 FG's to Spree's 22, how exactly is that "deferring"? Let me guess, in the same way that was Spree's "final game" even though he played the following season. I fully expect you to walk this back with something to the effect of "Well I meant his final playoff game" or some other nonsense.

I already told you what KG did that was more impressive than anything Malone has done: He put up 32 and 21 while scoring every field goal for his team in the 4th quarter to clinch the series. You seem stuck looking at boxscores looking for something to use to nitpick, so let me help you out:

Game 7 KG highlights:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=GAMETIMEHIGHLIGHTS
Full game 7:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=MaxMilly85

At the end of game 7 KG switches onto Bibby on the perimeter forcing him to give the ball up and after the 3pt attempt is airmailed he comes down and blocks Miller at the rim. On the final inbound the ball goes out to Webber who misses a 3 being contested by KG. Wolves win.

But that's what everyone else sees and talks about. However, your review would be something to the effect of:
"Why didn't KG get the rebound on the airballed 3"?
"He blocked the ball out of bounds, which gave the Kings the chance to reset and run and inbounds play"
"He shouldn't have let Webber receive the pass and instead of blocking the shot he allowed Webber to get a shot off"

Oh poppycock! Webber was never the same player again after getting injured in the 03 playoffs. He missed the bulk of the season injured prior to the playoffs.

Barely scraping past that version of him and claiming Karl Malone didnt have better playoff performances than him in his career is quite laughable to read.

And it's funny people have brought up Cassells injury when in fact even with him there KG was shooting in the mid 40s FG for both the series preceding the WCF. Very below average for a HOF PF, much less the MVP of the league.

How someone finds that more impressive than Karl Malone absolutely STOMPING on a prime HOF frontcourt duo of David Robinson and Dennis Rodman in a lopsided series win in 94? Or better than Karl running circles around prime Shaq & Elden in a sweep is beyond me.

[DCasey91]

Is it wrong to say none for each? Or one for Malone

94/95 Hakeem was killing everyone. 95 had Drex. And Hakeen dropped 27 and then 35 on the Jazz lol. Yeah dude went bananas in those years

And Hakeem dampened the Centers in that timeframe too. Stylistically it’s a bad matchup. You can say Garnett would effect him but then what would peak Hakeem do to Garnett

Two of the hardest roads and Keem went scorched earth

Suns were the closer series in the end (offensively had it f that getting Suns 1st rnd both times lmao

97/98 Malone was older (33/34) it just depends if you use the same ages or the timeline factor for Garnett as he started in his teens. You did get Jordan post peak but it’s still Jordan and a quartet of a defensive structure in Pippen, Rodman, Harper along.

The rules don’t suit Garnett’s style to the max imho, with heavy iso press. I find his shot selection is unders

08/09/10 any of those years. It is definetly possible but Doc threw 010 into the rafters by playing the bench in game 7 lol.

To be honest I don’t like either as the main option.