Wisconsin Badgers Thread

[LUKE23]

Completely forgetting how to play basketball is a bold strategy Cotton, lets see if it works out for them.

[HaroldinGMinor]

The move from the best team in the conference to the worst was quick.

[jschligs]

Defense on us is easy. Pressure ball handlers as outside of Chucky we don’t have any. And force us to shoot from deep as we’re not a great shooting team.

[tski1972]

If Klesmit doesn’t go off for those few games this team is on the bubble.

Crowl is getting bullied, Storr doesn’t seem to be coachable, Chucky is afraid to shoot, and Wanl does too many dumb things for a 10 year player.

That’s 4 of your starters.

[MikeIsGood]

Curious what the largest fall out of the AP Top 25 is. We feel primed to fall out from 11 this week.

Bump to the new page because I really am curious. I spent 20 minutes trying to find an answer and came up short. If anyone else likes dumb stats and can find it, drop a fellow depressed Badger a line (...here).

[ReginaldDwight]

This team has all the makings of an early exit in march.

See above. Is Gard really that guy?

So now do y’all see it? Gards teams never improve. They get worse as the year goes on and be never adjusts. Imagine the seat is getting hot now and the new ad will look to make a splashy hire. The new big10 might be rough going forward

[buckboy]

Yikes.

[BUCKnation]

This is 2 straight years of collapses where they just look rudderless

[trwi7]

Curious what the largest fall out of the AP Top 25 is. We feel primed to fall out from 11 this week.

Bump to the new page because I really am curious. I spent 20 minutes trying to find an answer and came up short. If anyone else likes dumb stats and can find it, drop a fellow depressed Badger a line (...here).

I don't know the answer but last year North Carolina went from 1st on November 21st to 18th on November 28th to out on December 5th.

[ReasonablySober]

I just don't understand the turnovers. It's so bizarre watching a Wisconsin team that can't protect the ball. For as long as I've been alive and watching the Badgers that's literally been their defining characteristic.

[chonestown]

Watch on YouTube

[chonestown]

Stellar commenting at BV:

It's a shame Gard doesn't have a son who is a top 20 National recruit that shoots 60 percent from 3. But maybe it is a good thing because Gard wouldn't be able to land him.

[Kerb Hohl]

I usually try not to put myself through it when a team like this is going through it, plus I was busy...I will admit to not watching a single play of this game mostly by choice. Some optimism and pessimism based on/replying to some of the comments on here:

Optimism
-Some nerds will tell you that your 3P% allowed is kind of fluky and more luck than you want to think. Obviously, this is not Wisconsin's best defense so they aren't helping themselves, but teams like Rutgers and Providence have shot well beyond their wildest dreams. Purdue was just hammering long 2s that the Badgers made them shoot. So maybe this will cool down.
-On the other side, the Badgers have a bunch of solid 3P shooters that suck right now. When they're good, Klesmit, Chucky, Essegian, Storr are hitting the shots. Right now - they are not. It's almost as simple as this. They hit shots. they're a top 10 teams. They don't, they are a bubble team.

Pessimism
-I've gone back and forth on Crowl as he's done some stuff to hide his physical limitations...but he's still limited enough that there are just going to be guys that dominate him.
-The turnovers are odd...I looked back, and the only other time it's been like this is the Happ/Koenig/Hayes era. I'm guessing a good deal of it this year is their newer motion offense that has been a good development puts them in more positions to turn it over.

[MikeIsGood]

I don't know how, but we're still ranked. We dropped 9 spots to 20th.

Honestly that probably feels fine, but the polls are so 'what have you done for me lately' that it surprises me coming off a week with two bad losses, and 4 straight overall. Overall record isn't keeping us in; must be Q1 wins.

[Kerb Hohl]

Recruit players who can actually hit a 3 in a game, or find a new coach who can.

Say Old Chap, you surely wouldn't be suggesting they replace the coach?

I have long given up the staunch defense of Gard - because I think the argument used to be "this guy is the worst coach ever" and I think he's proven that he's at least pretty good.

That said...I mean, they're 5th in the conference in 3P%. Middle-of-the-pack, nationally. It has just been ridiculous highs and lows.

I am always fine moving on these days, pretending the season continues to go downwards...

We are kind of doing the same thing as the Bo Ryan days in optimizing players that fit the system.

The problem is 2-fold. One being Bo was enough of a **** to maybe strain one more ounce out of what he had.

The other being that Bo was on the forefront of analytics. Don't foul, get to the line, shoot 3s and layups. I'm sure his teams had even worse stretches of shooting like trash. The problem is in 2008 you could draw Indiana or Illinois who would jack up a bunch of long 2s, play too aggressive of defense, or try to run the ball and turn it over too much and you'd win by being smarter even if you're a bit off. Now everybody is playing near-optimal ball. And when other teams shots are falling, suddenly Steven Crowl's lack of athleticism against Michigan's 5-star guy makes the difference.

[chonestown]

The other being that Bo was on the forefront of analytics. Don't foul, get to the line, shoot 3s and layups. I'm sure his teams had even worse stretches of shooting like trash. The problem is in 2008 you could draw Indiana or Illinois who would jack up a bunch of long 2s, play too aggressive of defense, or try to run the ball and turn it over too much and you'd win by being smarter even if you're a bit off. Now everybody is playing near-optimal ball. And when other teams shots are falling, suddenly Steven Crowl's lack of athleticism against Michigan's 5-star guy makes the difference.

Yeah, this is a real good point. Margins traditionally have been tight and this only makes them tighter.

The greatest hits of yesteryear was "Gard can't recruit / Gard can't use the portal effectively" and that's receded. Klesmax, Storrs and Reynolds are all examples of using the portal to its utmost. Blackwell and Winter are clear hits for the freshman class. Like I think a lot of people just want the novelty of a new coach/system. Nothing more, nothing less.

Ah but the boards, not a sanctuary of well-considered and sober thought.

[Kerb Hohl]

The other being that Bo was on the forefront of analytics. Don't foul, get to the line, shoot 3s and layups. I'm sure his teams had even worse stretches of shooting like trash. The problem is in 2008 you could draw Indiana or Illinois who would jack up a bunch of long 2s, play too aggressive of defense, or try to run the ball and turn it over too much and you'd win by being smarter even if you're a bit off. Now everybody is playing near-optimal ball. And when other teams shots are falling, suddenly Steven Crowl's lack of athleticism against Michigan's 5-star guy makes the difference.

Yeah, this is a real good point. Margins traditionally have been tight and this only makes them tighter.

The greatest hits of yesteryear was "Gard can't recruit / Gard can't use the portal effectively" and that's receded. Klesmax, Storrs and Reynolds are all examples of using the portal to its utmost. Blackwell and Winter are clear hits for the freshman class. Like I think a lot of people just want the novelty of a new coach/system. Nothing more, nothing less.

Ah but the boards, not a sanctuary of well-considered and sober thought.

Right. Ever since taking a step down from being Gard's burner is agreeing with some that it would be cool to see an elite team/year, even if it's just a mirage like some of Bo's "best" teams pre Kaminsky-era...we kinda got it in a fluky way with Davis. Thought it may be happening this year.

There actually may be the best collection of talent with Storr, if Freitag works out some of his weaknesses, Blackwell is good, etc...I Winter has issues on strength/defense right now, but I could see him being very good. But it may still sit in that 5-seed sweet spot...so...I dunno.

But to your initial point - it would be cool to hire somebody that is consistently getting great recruits and doing something with them. That's a lot easier said than done in Madison. There's only a handful of programs that can consistently do it and they are bluebloods pretty much.

[Kerb Hohl]

Granted, OSU was ultra cold for a while in 1H, but when we lose this one, you can chalk up one of the more insane run of shots/possessions in a B10 game for OSU. A few layups but otherwise banked 3s, tough runners…the only 2 misses were long bounces out to open shooters.

[Kerb Hohl]

Granted, OSU was ultra cold for a while in 1H, but when we lose this one, you can chalk up one of the more insane run of shots/possessions in a B10 game for OSU. A few layups but otherwise banked 3s, tough runners…the only 2 misses were long bounces out to open shooters.

I brought them back to earth.

[MikeIsGood]

Absolutely no idea what OSU is doing at the end here. No where near enough time to just let the game play out and get stops, and certainly not to waste almost an entire shot clock before taking your own shot. Was like they were just giving up.

Jamison Battle never beat UW.