Official RJ Barrett Thread

[douggood]

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[mdenny]

It’s only 16 games but if this is his level in our system then he is on a bargain contract. I think folks are really overreacting with the 1A potential though. He a perfect 3rd best player in my opinion. Probably best if he is a 2 longterm with Gradey at the 3

Agreed with this take. I never percieved him as filler in the trade nor did I consider his contract to be baggage..

But I have to admit....I didn't realize how good his handle was until watching him for consecutive games. I don't see him being the top scorer on a good team. The fact that he's such a diligent gym guy makes his future open to a wider set of possibilities though. His outside shot looks weird to me for some reason and that might be the ultimate thing that holds him back. His relentless rim-attacking a free throw manufacturing has been a huge breath of fresh air. He's been bailing us out of alot of possessions not going anywhere by drawing fouls. On the other hand....seems like alot of those calls would stop happening in a playoff situation.

Imo....it's worth alot to have a guy with his high character and down-to-earth personality in your starting lineup.

When he shoots 3s (while open)...it kinda looks like his lower body turns toward the right? He doesn't look square. I'm no expert obviously but something about it looks strange to me.

[WuTang_CMB]

RJ is lethal getting to the rim most times. He has that signature move where if he's stopped he puts it behind his back and then goes back left. Seems to work lol.

But man ... if he develops a consistent 3 pt shot, he's a whole new player

[manjusaka]

The very last shot of the pacers game is a perfect example. RJ put tons pressure on the defensive going to the rim. They respect him ability going to the hoop. Although he got a clean look, I think if he can add a move, turn around, step back or something. He can become unstoppable.

[no dice]

How on earth does a scorer like him so inconsistent at the free throw line? He is shooting like a defensive big at the stripe. That is way more crucial than the 3 ball as his next development since he is an amazing rim attacker

[manjusaka]

How on earth does a scorer like him so inconsistent at the free throw line? He is shooting like a defensive big at the stripe. That is way more crucial than the 3 ball as his next development since he is an amazing rim attacker

His overall shooting needs work maybe he needs renovate his shooting mechanics just like Barnes did. That process would take few years.

[Chandan]

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Really? Barnes is 3rd? It feels like he misses a bunch of at the rim shots this year.

[Statistician MK]

We were good with the Knicks, but we are much better with the Raptors!

[TheWave]

You all said he was wasted, dont lie. RJ was baggage until you all noticed what he could do and said oh damn.

[ash_k]

You all said he was wasted, dont lie. RJ was baggage until you all noticed what he could do and said oh damn.

Only because they didn't watch the Knicks nor did they watch last season's playoffs..and were just looking at "Analytics" and hearsay .
It was clear to me that RJ >> IQ; Anyone that had watched the playoffs last season would have known that! there must be a reason one was drafted 3rd while the other was a late first round pick.
Masai getting those 2 for OG&Precious still feels as amazing as it felt on December 30th, despite Darko's shortcomings.

[LastNameEver]

RJ and his family have also been battling a private manner, so what hes been doing is more impressive than you think.

[WuTang_CMB]

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RJ Barrett has done in Toronto has been impressive for a multitude of reasons, but most importantly because the numbers would indicate that he’s changed his approach and done so quite rapidly. When I asked Barrett about this, he scoffed at me, shook his head saying: “I didn’t change a thing.” then continued to shake his head and repeated: “I didn’t change a thing. That’s just who I am. That’s just how I play.”

Without change, RJ Barrett has converted 18.2ppg/2.4apg/4.3rpg on 53% TS into 20.5ppg/3.5apg/6.9rpg on 61% TS. Big change. Not everything is in the baseline stats — and we’ll get into the massive change in the underlying stuff later — but RJ’s offensive numbers have gone from, fundamentally, a very low efficiency volume scorer to a high efficiency, second-side creator. That change is extremely meaningful.

“It seems like a change to me. I understand he told you otherwise, but the reads I’m seeing are coming at a volume that wasn’t there when I watched his tape with the Knicks. Team style matters more than ever and that has to be considered, but Barrett deserves the credit for this. The level of gravity and decision making he’s bringing means you can actually build out parts of the offense for him to help others.”

An Eastern Conference Scout

[ConSarnit]

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RJ Barrett has done in Toronto has been impressive for a multitude of reasons, but most importantly because the numbers would indicate that he’s changed his approach and done so quite rapidly. When I asked Barrett about this, he scoffed at me, shook his head saying: “I didn’t change a thing.” then continued to shake his head and repeated: “I didn’t change a thing. That’s just who I am. That’s just how I play.”

Without change, RJ Barrett has converted 18.2ppg/2.4apg/4.3rpg on 53% TS into 20.5ppg/3.5apg/6.9rpg on 61% TS. Big change. Not everything is in the baseline stats — and we’ll get into the massive change in the underlying stuff later — but RJ’s offensive numbers have gone from, fundamentally, a very low efficiency volume scorer to a high efficiency, second-side creator. That change is extremely meaningful.

“It seems like a change to me. I understand he told you otherwise, but the reads I’m seeing are coming at a volume that wasn’t there when I watched his tape with the Knicks. Team style matters more than ever and that has to be considered, but Barrett deserves the credit for this. The level of gravity and decision making he’s bringing means you can actually build out parts of the offense for him to help others.”

An Eastern Conference Scout

Something definitely changed. Who is responsible for those changes I have no idea. If I had to guess it's probably the coaching staff considering RJ's self-created opportunities are way down here. Some pre/post trade RJ stats:

Midrange Attempts per game:

Knicks: 1.3
Raptors: 0.2 (2 total!)

Pullup Attempts per game:

Knicks: 1.8
Raptors: 0.4

% of 2pt FG assisted:

Knicks: 54%
Raptors: 66%

We (or someone) has basically removed RJ's self-creation chances, unless it's a drive to the basket. He's definitely improved his defensive rebounding (not sure how much that has to do with no longer playing with Robinson/Hartenstein/Randle who are all very good rebounders).

Whoever is responsible for the offensive changes deserves kudos. They've basically removed "bad" shots from RJ's game.

[deeps6x]

We were good with the Knicks, but we are much better with the Raptors!

Maybe add minutes played for context. I'd guess they are both getting more minutes then the Knicks were giving them.

[mdenny]

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RJ Barrett has done in Toronto has been impressive for a multitude of reasons, but most importantly because the numbers would indicate that he’s changed his approach and done so quite rapidly. When I asked Barrett about this, he scoffed at me, shook his head saying: “I didn’t change a thing.” then continued to shake his head and repeated: “I didn’t change a thing. That’s just who I am. That’s just how I play.”

Without change, RJ Barrett has converted 18.2ppg/2.4apg/4.3rpg on 53% TS into 20.5ppg/3.5apg/6.9rpg on 61% TS. Big change. Not everything is in the baseline stats — and we’ll get into the massive change in the underlying stuff later — but RJ’s offensive numbers have gone from, fundamentally, a very low efficiency volume scorer to a high efficiency, second-side creator. That change is extremely meaningful.

“It seems like a change to me. I understand he told you otherwise, but the reads I’m seeing are coming at a volume that wasn’t there when I watched his tape with the Knicks. Team style matters more than ever and that has to be considered, but Barrett deserves the credit for this. The level of gravity and decision making he’s bringing means you can actually build out parts of the offense for him to help others.”

An Eastern Conference Scout

Something definitely changed. Who is responsible for those changes I have no idea. If I had to guess it's probably the coaching staff considering RJ's self-created opportunities are way down here. Some pre/post trade RJ stats:

Midrange Attempts per game:

Knicks: 1.3
Raptors: 0.2 (2 total!)

Pullup Attempts per game:

Knicks: 1.8
Raptors: 0.4

% of 2pt FG assisted:

Knicks: 54%
Raptors: 66%

We (or someone) has basically removed RJ's self-creation chances, unless it's a drive to the basket. He's definitely improved his defensive rebounding (not sure how much that has to do with no longer playing with Robinson/Hartenstein/Randle who are all very good rebounders).

Whoever is responsible for the offensive changes deserves kudos. They've basically removed "bad" shots from RJ's game.

Interesting. I wonder if the removal of siakam/Randle type player from the offense has helped him? Specifically....the absence of a star level player at the 4 who specialized in iso plays?

I'm gonna say it again....ppl are talking about him like he's grizzled old vet. He's 24 and was selected 3rd overall yet the tank-crowd specifically seem to be so down on his potential/future. It's kinda bizarre. The tank ppl have a strange bias against any player who has actually played in the nba.

[Dalek]

I want to like RJ's game because I love the fact he can bully his way to the rim, but honestly, we have the same type of threat in Scottie. It is not that you can't have multiple players forcing their way to the rim, but we have two players on court that cannot create a lot of offense for themselves very easily.

RJ is great off the catch and in transition, but the moment he has defense set, he does not have a very good counter (same as Scottie). There is a reason that RJ stays away from mid-range shots, and it is because he is not very good at creating separation and gathering into a jumper. Can it become teachable in time? Maybe, I hope that Darko working with Booker can help RJ get better.

Aside from creating offense, my main concern with RJ is on defense. He has moments, but far too often he gets backdoored because he ball watches and misses rotations on cutters. He really has the tools to be a good defender, but he has not shown so in his career. It's often my beef with Duke guys who like to get buckets but often don't want to defend.

[ConSarnit]

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Something definitely changed. Who is responsible for those changes I have no idea. If I had to guess it's probably the coaching staff considering RJ's self-created opportunities are way down here. Some pre/post trade RJ stats:

Midrange Attempts per game:

Knicks: 1.3
Raptors: 0.2 (2 total!)

Pullup Attempts per game:

Knicks: 1.8
Raptors: 0.4

% of 2pt FG assisted:

Knicks: 54%
Raptors: 66%

We (or someone) has basically removed RJ's self-creation chances, unless it's a drive to the basket. He's definitely improved his defensive rebounding (not sure how much that has to do with no longer playing with Robinson/Hartenstein/Randle who are all very good rebounders).

Whoever is responsible for the offensive changes deserves kudos. They've basically removed "bad" shots from RJ's game.

Interesting. I wonder if the removal of siakam/Randle type player from the offense has helped him? Specifically....the absence of a star level player at the 4 who specialized in iso plays?

I'm gonna say it again....ppl are talking about him like he's grizzled old vet. He's 24 and was selected 3rd overall yet the tank-crowd specifically seem to be so down on his potential/future. It's kinda bizarre. The tank ppl have a strange bias against any player who has actually played in the nba.

RJ exists in a weird spot as far as role is concerned. With us, he has the FGA of a 2nd option (top 60 in the league). Now while he's scoring efficiently I don't know how much value that actually adds. For a guy in that type of role you'd ideally want:

-someone who is creating good shots for others (not really RJ's forte)

-someone who provides high end floor spacing, thus making everyone else life easier

RJ has been scoring well here but in a way that sort of only benefits RJ. Take a look at guys who take >14 fga and average <3.5 apg.
The guys we'd consider "positive" contributors are all volume 3pt guys (almost all of them are bigs). If RJ isn't going to create for others, isn't really a 3pt threat (or play high level defense) he's probably better served in a reduced offensive role. It's a limited sample size but even with RJ's efficiency boost we still have a horrible offensive rating with him on the floor (obviously the entire team has been terrible on both ends).

I know it sounds weird to say "yeah he's efficient but it doesn't help that much" but I think there are some complications that arise when a guy himself can score decently but due to the fact that there are many more possessions when he doesn't have the ball he's not really helping the offense overall. If his passing game (or shooting, which I am more dubious of given his form) improves I think he can justify those possessions.

As for tank people having bias against players in the NBA, I think the rational ones would look at a player like RJ and think "hmm, 4 years in the league and it's still debatable if he's a positive contributor? That's not a great sign". I definitely think he can get better but is the fully realized version of RJ a long term starter on this team? I don't know.

[Dalek]

I can't remember if I posted this or not, but I have a perfect comparison for RJ Barrett. He is a modern Corey Maggette.

I used to love Maggette's physicality, a literal battering ram driving right into defenders and drawing fouls like RJ does. Corey even was a Duke kid and the same type of physical specimen as RJ. He was just empty calories in the end because he had a negative DBPM and was a non-shooter or passer.

Not sure how you fix RJ's game but he needs an overhaul on the shot and reading the game.

[Scase]

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RJ Barrett has done in Toronto has been impressive for a multitude of reasons, but most importantly because the numbers would indicate that he’s changed his approach and done so quite rapidly. When I asked Barrett about this, he scoffed at me, shook his head saying: “I didn’t change a thing.” then continued to shake his head and repeated: “I didn’t change a thing. That’s just who I am. That’s just how I play.”

Without change, RJ Barrett has converted 18.2ppg/2.4apg/4.3rpg on 53% TS into 20.5ppg/3.5apg/6.9rpg on 61% TS. Big change. Not everything is in the baseline stats — and we’ll get into the massive change in the underlying stuff later — but RJ’s offensive numbers have gone from, fundamentally, a very low efficiency volume scorer to a high efficiency, second-side creator. That change is extremely meaningful.

“It seems like a change to me. I understand he told you otherwise, but the reads I’m seeing are coming at a volume that wasn’t there when I watched his tape with the Knicks. Team style matters more than ever and that has to be considered, but Barrett deserves the credit for this. The level of gravity and decision making he’s bringing means you can actually build out parts of the offense for him to help others.”

An Eastern Conference Scout

Something definitely changed. Who is responsible for those changes I have no idea. If I had to guess it's probably the coaching staff considering RJ's self-created opportunities are way down here. Some pre/post trade RJ stats:

Midrange Attempts per game:

Knicks: 1.3
Raptors: 0.2 (2 total!)

Pullup Attempts per game:

Knicks: 1.8
Raptors: 0.4

% of 2pt FG assisted:

Knicks: 54%
Raptors: 66%

We (or someone) has basically removed RJ's self-creation chances, unless it's a drive to the basket. He's definitely improved his defensive rebounding (not sure how much that has to do with no longer playing with Robinson/Hartenstein/Randle who are all very good rebounders).

Whoever is responsible for the offensive changes deserves kudos. They've basically removed "bad" shots from RJ's game.

I was mentioning this in another thread as well, he has moved to more inside shots, and a large uptick in how many of them were assisted. Our offence just puts him in a better place to score, it's also why I think people need to temper expectations about him being our true offensive threat.

His game is very limited, and once defences get in the passing lanes, or just bump him when he makes a cut, he will become much less efficient. We need a true creative scorer to carry the load.

I see him much like DD, he is not the solution, but he is a piece that will get us to the solution.

[WuTang_CMB]

His 3pt shot has to come a long way to open up his drive game more. Gotta work on that this summer

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