NBA MVP Discussion Thread 2023-24 (Part 4: MVP Thread's Revenge)

[Woodsanity]

SGA is the MVP....

Jokic still the best player in the world...

Ez...

they're both been immense and honestly are neck to neck, I could see arguments for either
I don't think the Nuggets are likely to repeat (tho they will have a chance, if healthy) but it would be glorious if SGA would win MVP and Jokic would go on to lead his team to another title

25 years later, Realgmers born in 2040 would try to examine this stretch of last few years an will be like: "dafuq?!"
failing to understand how the best player in the world got back to back MVPs and then was randomly slighted two years in a row, despite winning a ring in a Dirk-esque fashion in between

fwiw, SGA is right up there with him so it wouldn't be like last year where it was flat out wrong but still, it'd be pretty wild it it played out that way

The best player in the league has been passed on for MVP quite a bit historically, I'm not sure why this instance would be wild.

Also lol at the dirk-esque style title. They played nobody. Dirk led his team over OKC and the Heatles with prime LeBron, Wade and Bosh. Denver beat an old Lakers team that wasn't great last year and isn't this year, because there were weak 2/3 seeds out west, and an 8 seed Miami without one of their top players, with maybe one top 10 guy in Butler. They were relying on Kyle Lowry to create and make big shots. And if you're going to say Butler is a top player because of how he elevates in the playoffs, then Jokic had a top player on his team as well in Murray. Murray's playoff numbers 26/7/6 were basically identical to Butlers 27/6/6.

You can only play whose in front of you.

The fact that a Heat team made it to the Finals just means the other Eastern teams were not up to par. Celtics last season were frauds and don't get me started on the Sixers. Celtics this season added Porzingis and Jrue so they are far better than last season.

I don't think the Celtics last season were a threat at all but this season is a different story.

[Genjuro]

No I don't think sac or Memphis would've beat Denver. The only team that would've had a chance was Boston imo. How they lost those first 3 games to Miami will remain a mystery to me. I don't think Miami was playing at nearly the same level by the time they got to Denver as they were earlier in the playoffs. I think it was a weak field last year, which is why I don't consider it a Dirk-esque run. They beat that OKC team which was extremely good and the heatles, and I think both of those teams would've steamrolled the same teams that Denver did last year. It seems there will be better matchups and competition this year. For example there is obviously Boston, and maybe 5 teams out west who are better than any team Denver faced in the playoffs last season if they are healthy (OKC, Minnesota, LAC, Phoenix, New Orleans).

OKC was extremely young and they had a very easy path to the Conference Finals. First the George Karl's post-Carmelo-trade-Nuggets (Karl's teams famously overperformed in regular season and underperformed in postseason, at least relatively to the RS), with Lawson, Afflalo/Chandler, Gallinari, Martin and Nenê as the starting five. Then the 8th-seeded Memphis in the second round. They could've lost (or won) to any of the teams Denver beat in the last postseason, which weren't amazing teams, but all four were fairly competitive squads. To say that they would've steamrolled is just a baseless guess.

Let's remember that most people were declaring the Suns and the Lakers favourites against the Nuggets. Suddenly they became crappy opponents once Denver beat them.

[bisme37]

Read on Twitter

JT also got it for Oct/Nov, so he's won East POM in 3 of the 5 months so far.

[azcatz11]

I’m not saying Lebron has a chance but he’s 100k-1 odds rn. If the lakers win every game the rest of the season and Lebron posts something like 33/8/8 he may win it all. Is it worth a $10 bet to win $10k? Crazier things have happened

[bisme37]

Bucks reporter:

Read on Twitter

His MVP list is Jokic, Tatum, SGA, Giannis, Kawhi in that order.

[Crunch 99]

Donovan Mitchell wasn't going to win the MVP anyway, but he is getting close to getting tapped out from missing too many games. He's already missed 13 games, and he is expected to miss at least three more games with a knee issue.

[scrabbarista]

Bucks reporter:

Read on Twitter

His MVP list is Jokic, Tatum, SGA, Giannis, Kawhi in that order.

I know it's incredibly boring to say so, but the current bbref Tracker has the ranking right: Jokic, SGA, Giannis, Doncic, and Tatum.

[scrabbarista]

I’m not saying Lebron has a chance but he’s 100k-1 odds rn. If the lakers win every game the rest of the season and Lebron posts something like 33/8/8 he may win it all. Is it worth a $10 bet to win $10k? Crazier things have happened

Actually, crazier things than a negative point differential team winning its final twenty games of an NBA season have not happened.

[brettski]

Bucks reporter:

Read on Twitter

His MVP list is Jokic, Tatum, SGA, Giannis, Kawhi in that order.

I know it's incredibly boring to say so, but the current bbref Tracker has the ranking right: Jokic, SGA, Giannis, Doncic, and Tatum.

You would both benefit by scrolling through his Twitter feed. I don't think he's really a bucks reporter anymore. He was under the old owners at some point but I don't think he has been at all since the new owners came in and cleaned house. From observation most of his articles I've seen linked in the bucks sub forum have been very negative towards the Bucks. I'm shocked he even put Giannis in the top 5. I think a number of posters here are blocked by him on Twitter too.

[Woodsanity]

Gap between Jokic and SGA just widened.

[Wolfgang630]

Okc lost to the Lakers. The same team Jokic went into the other night with all the spotlight of Lebrons 40K and pulled out a win.

[Infinite Llamas]

All this talk of “OKC with the better record” has been silly because it’s never been more than 1-2 games more and they are tied right now. Standings can have an impact but when teams are so close that they flip flop every other day, it’s sort of useless to use in a guys favor.

[Champ1on]

Not sure why the betting markets matter, they aren’t talking to the voters anymore than the rest of us.

That was another statement game I have SGA in the drivers seat.

Their odds are a reflection of what those that bet think.
To be fair, it is a far more objective opinion than what you or I think individually.

Vegas prob has a bot that scans the twitters, Facebook pages, and YouTube video of all the voters.

[QPR]

A good day for Jokic

[AleksandarN]

All this talk of “OKC with the better record” has been silly because it’s never been more than 1-2 games more and they are tied right now. Standings can have an impact but when teams are so close that they flip flop every other day, it’s sort of useless to use in a guys favor.

Also the Thunder have been like one of the healthiest teams in the league. Murray missed a month KCP and AG missed games yet they are tied with the Thunder, I think Denver takes the number 1 spot when all said and done.

[HotRocks34]

Jokic dominated the playoffs last year in a way that's never been done. Denver would have beaten any team in its way.

Zero apologies.




I don't think OKC matches up well with the Lakers. I would try to avoid that pairing in the playoffs if I were OKC.

[Exp0sed]

All this talk of “OKC with the better record” has been silly because it’s never been more than 1-2 games more and they are tied right now. Standings can have an impact but when teams are so close that they flip flop every other day, it’s sort of useless to use in a guys favor.

Also the Thunder have been like one of the healthiest teams in the league. Murray missed a month KCP and AG missed games yet they are tied with the Thunder, I think Denver takes the number 1 spot when all said and done.

Here's the thing: Realgmers already knew SGA was an MVP caliber player before this season, some even way back (shoutout to OKCfansince...)

It's not like SGA made a massive leap this season. He made a leap for sure, some of it is due to his own individual development and some due to having quality running mates and to finally actually competing

His superstardom was masked to the casuals and general public (including most media talking heads) by Okc being a small market that few watch or follow and mostly by them tanking these last couple of seasons, including deliberately shutting him down as to not win too many games and hurt the tank

He was already at say 0.225 ws last season and a fringe MVP candidate if it werent for games played and team record

That's the narrative now, meaning: SGA should win MVP because everyone expected them to be a play-in team and they are battling for top of the West

That means that even if say the Nuggets and Minny finish above OKC, say a couple of games..this narrative would still prevail, as the Nuggets were first last season, won a ring and are expected to be a top seed

This is funny in it's own right cuz we can go back to preaseason predictions and hardly anyone picked the Nuggets to end up with the first seed, but that's another matter for another day


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[The-Power]

Gap between Jokic and SGA just widened.

Okc lost to the Lakers. The same team Jokic went into the other night with all the spotlight of Lebrons 40K and pulled out a win.

The day-to-day commentary is really tiring. SGA's team lost on a back-to-back road game (with SGA not even playing poorly). So what? Jokic has lost games before. Jokic has played poorly before. Just look at the last three games before the All-Star break for a reminder.

This commentary has nothing to do with a credible analysis of the MVP race and is all about reinforcing pre-existing opinions, looking for anything to prop up one's position no matter the validity or consistency of the argument. I wish the conversation was better than this but I can't say it's a surprise.

All I'm going to say is that no, of course this one random early March game is not going to have a tangible effect on the MVP race. It shouldn't have to be stated yet here we are.

[Jaqua92]

All this talk of “OKC with the better record” has been silly because it’s never been more than 1-2 games more and they are tied right now. Standings can have an impact but when teams are so close that they flip flop every other day, it’s sort of useless to use in a guys favor.

And to be fair, Murray was out a month, AND Denver also had about 2-4 games losing this year that they had no business losing, AND they're still tied with OKC. They're much better than the 42-19 record they're running with right now.

I wouldn't be surprised to see them finish with the 1 seed.

[Crunch 99]

1a. Jokic
1b. Tatum
3. SGA
4. Giannis

The only team that has meaningfully separated itself from a crowd this season are the Celtics, and their lead is widening. Hence, I am moving Tatum up to top tier with Jokic. Jokic is there for his overall advanced stats and good standing in the west, while Tatum is there for best player on best team, combined with a bit less impressive advanced stats.

SGA has Jokic-like advanced stats and team standing, but I have a mental struggle to give the MVP to a player with so little playoff history, notwithstanding this award is supposed to have nothing to do with past years' history.