2023-24 Season Discussion and Speculation 5 - the calm before the storm

[Ghost of Kleine]

I've mentioned this before a few times, but the reason a Phoenix/Cleveland trade will never happen under Ishbia while he's the owner of the suns. Below is a really good article on both owners' contentious feuding:

https://www.espn.co.uk/nba/story/_/id/39854533/nba-billionaire-mortgage-battle-owner-rivalry-cavs-dan-gilbert-suns-mat-ishbia


Read the full article in the link if you like? But basically they really don't like each other, and haven't for a long time, and are constantly trying to competitively one up each other.

In many cases this might cost somebody their job for using a homophobic slur, but I doubt we will get a new owner considering the NBA is likely not, despite the progressive exterior, particularly progressive in-house/on the interior about gay men.

So yeah Im just gonna put a damper on it before we go ahead getting excited about replacing Ishbia.

Man, he sounds like a dick. It doesn't sound like Gilbert has ever really wanted to get into it, but Ishbia went on the attack...

The public vitriol has been a one-sided affair, with Ishbia lobbing numerous attacks against Rocket, including in a 2020 Super Bowl commercial. Gilbert, on the other hand, has avoided the fray. Rocket executives have taken the lead on publicly countering Ishbia's remarks, questioning UWM's business tactics and calling Ishbia a "playground bully." The feud continues.

This isn't good either...

Two months after the "bully" remarks, Bloomberg Business published a report detailing allegations from current and former UWM employees about racial disparities, sexual harassment and bullying inside UWM. In a statement, UWM disputed the report, calling it false and misleading.

Aside from overzealous willingness to spend money, is anyone else seeing possibly concerning similarities of reported patterns of behavior here if what's being reported here is at all factual/true?

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

We should trade Booker immediately

Theres little to worry about with that honestly! as Booker would never, ever get traded outside of an outlier anomalous situation like IF we decided to trade KD, and Booker then decided that he was either upset that we traded his buddy KD, OR he wouldn't want to be part of another rebuild (If we chose to blow it up next season), and he then asked out as star players occasionally do.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Well this is the healthiest Kawhi has been in a season. They nearly beat us without him in our finals year...without that Valleyoop it would have been 3-3 after 6. They also never have Harden (who I thought had declined a lot but he has adjusted his role) and Westbrook is a solid bench guy. Kawhi is also one of those players who gets better in the playoffs and more clutch, and his intensity and defense rises up a notch.

But yeah, if Kawhi is out or something, I'd prefer that.

They have never accomplished anything and they're together for a bunch of years already.

Last year out in the first round. Two years ago no playoffs. Yeah, I know that Khawi wasn't healthy but that's who he is since his Raptors days, so no surprises here. He is older now so not as decisive as he was in the past.

We will see but they don't scare me at all. I can be wrong but I think we would play better against a known superveteran team like the Clippers rather than against a young and upcoming team.

Well we haven't accomplished anything either and it looks like most of our success can be mostly attributed to Chris Paul running the show. They don't totally scare me, but I'd rather play the Wolves or the Nuggets if everyone is healthy.

[bwgood77]

In many cases this might cost somebody their job for using a homophobic slur, but I doubt we will get a new owner considering the NBA is likely not, despite the progressive exterior, particularly progressive in-house/on the interior about gay men.

So yeah Im just gonna put a damper on it before we go ahead getting excited about replacing Ishbia.

Man, he sounds like a dick. It doesn't sound like Gilbert has ever really wanted to get into it, but Ishbia went on the attack...

The public vitriol has been a one-sided affair, with Ishbia lobbing numerous attacks against Rocket, including in a 2020 Super Bowl commercial. Gilbert, on the other hand, has avoided the fray. Rocket executives have taken the lead on publicly countering Ishbia's remarks, questioning UWM's business tactics and calling Ishbia a "playground bully." The feud continues.

This isn't good either...

Two months after the "bully" remarks, Bloomberg Business published a report detailing allegations from current and former UWM employees about racial disparities, sexual harassment and bullying inside UWM. In a statement, UWM disputed the report, calling it false and misleading.

Aside from overzealous willingness to spend money, is anyone else seeing possibly concerning similarities of reported patterns of behavior here if what's being reported here is at all factual/true?

Of course. It would be nice if we could just have a generally respected guy as an owner....the days of Jerry Colangelo, so far in the distant past.

[sunskerr]

Aside from overzealous willingness to spend money, is anyone else seeing possibly concerning similarities of reported patterns of behavior here if what's being reported here is at all factual/true?

Of course. It would be nice if we could just have a generally respected guy as an owner....the days of Jerry Colangelo, so far in the distant past.

The willingness to spend money would be a good thing if he wasnt a meddler. But he's a meddler like Sarver was, although I suppose in his last couple of years Sarver stepped back a bit.

But yeah, now that his behaviour is on record, and that the reports about the work environment are multiple, makes me think there is a likelihood of truth to the reports about the company's work environment.

[bwgood77]

https://www.si.com/nba/suns/phoenix-suns-owner-mat-ishbia-heavy-fire-voicemail

Read on Twitter

I wonder why he hates them so much....if there is a reason other than he is a rival. I wonder if he will go into the locker room if we win a playoff series and say that about the other team.

[garrick]

In many cases this might cost somebody their job for using a homophobic slur, but I doubt we will get a new owner considering the NBA is likely not, despite the progressive exterior, particularly progressive in-house/on the interior about gay men.

So yeah Im just gonna put a damper on it before we go ahead getting excited about replacing Ishbia.

Man, he sounds like a dick. It doesn't sound like Gilbert has ever really wanted to get into it, but Ishbia went on the attack...

The public vitriol has been a one-sided affair, with Ishbia lobbing numerous attacks against Rocket, including in a 2020 Super Bowl commercial. Gilbert, on the other hand, has avoided the fray. Rocket executives have taken the lead on publicly countering Ishbia's remarks, questioning UWM's business tactics and calling Ishbia a "playground bully." The feud continues.

This isn't good either...

Two months after the "bully" remarks, Bloomberg Business published a report detailing allegations from current and former UWM employees about racial disparities, sexual harassment and bullying inside UWM. In a statement, UWM disputed the report, calling it false and misleading.

Aside from overzealous willingness to spend money, is anyone else seeing possibly concerning similarities of reported patterns of behavior here if what's being reported here is at all factual/true?

https://www.reddit.com/r/pillar7/

You can ask in the UWM subreddit.

A bunch of current and ex UWM workers post in this subreddit.

[garrick]

I've mentioned this before a few times, but the reason a Phoenix/Cleveland trade will never happen under Ishbia while he's the owner of the suns. Below is a really good article on both owners' contentious feuding:

https://www.espn.co.uk/nba/story/_/id/39854533/nba-billionaire-mortgage-battle-owner-rivalry-cavs-dan-gilbert-suns-mat-ishbia


Read the full article in the link if you like? But basically they really don't like each other, and haven't for a long time, and are constantly trying to competitively one up each other.

In many cases this might cost somebody their job for using a homophobic slur, but I doubt we will get a new owner considering the NBA is likely not, despite the progressive exterior, particularly progressive in-house/on the interior about gay men.

So yeah Im just gonna put a damper on it before we go ahead getting excited about replacing Ishbia.

Man, he sounds like a dick. It doesn't sound like Gilbert has ever really wanted to get into it, but Ishbia went on the attack...

The public vitriol has been a one-sided affair, with Ishbia lobbing numerous attacks against Rocket, including in a 2020 Super Bowl commercial. Gilbert, on the other hand, has avoided the fray. Rocket executives have taken the lead on publicly countering Ishbia's remarks, questioning UWM's business tactics and calling Ishbia a "playground bully." The feud continues.

This isn't good either...

Two months after the "bully" remarks, Bloomberg Business published a report detailing allegations from current and former UWM employees about racial disparities, sexual harassment and bullying inside UWM. In a statement, UWM disputed the report, calling it false and misleading.

Watch on YouTube

If this statement is true then it could explain why Ishbia made a "win now" decision to go all in on the next 4 years because he might not feel confident he can keep the team if UWM shares tank and he will be forced to give up the Suns.

From all accounts they are bleeding talent because Mat refuses to pay decent wages and the working environment is so toxic people leave as soon as they can. Not a good look.

[Calvin Klein]

First time I heard ishbia talk, in the Simmons podcast, he sounded like another coked up arrogant rich boy. Just saying bs like “I’m all about winning bla bla bla”.

Yeah, I don’t like him…


The best team owners are usually the ones you don’t hear much about. I don’t even know the names of the spurs, Celtics or heat owners.

[bwgood77]

In many cases this might cost somebody their job for using a homophobic slur, but I doubt we will get a new owner considering the NBA is likely not, despite the progressive exterior, particularly progressive in-house/on the interior about gay men.

So yeah Im just gonna put a damper on it before we go ahead getting excited about replacing Ishbia.

Man, he sounds like a dick. It doesn't sound like Gilbert has ever really wanted to get into it, but Ishbia went on the attack...

The public vitriol has been a one-sided affair, with Ishbia lobbing numerous attacks against Rocket, including in a 2020 Super Bowl commercial. Gilbert, on the other hand, has avoided the fray. Rocket executives have taken the lead on publicly countering Ishbia's remarks, questioning UWM's business tactics and calling Ishbia a "playground bully." The feud continues.

This isn't good either...

Two months after the "bully" remarks, Bloomberg Business published a report detailing allegations from current and former UWM employees about racial disparities, sexual harassment and bullying inside UWM. In a statement, UWM disputed the report, calling it false and misleading.

Watch on YouTube

If this statement is true then it could explain why Ishbia made a "win now" decision to go all in on the next 4 years because he might not feel confident he can keep the team if UWM shares tank and he will be forced to give up the Suns.

From all accounts they are bleeding talent because Mat refuses to pay decent wages and the working environment is so toxic people leave as soon as they can. Not a good look.

Wow, from 4:30 to 5:45 or so is scary. I didn't even listen past that.

Especially at 4:40. HE HIRED ISIAH THOMAS' SON TO WORK IN THE FRONT OFFICE AS A SCOUT, AND HE HAS NO BASKETBALL EXPERIENCE AND IS A DJ.

Then after that all the stuff about Mat and Isiah Thomas.

It seriously feels like we basically got a clone of Sarver...in some ways better but in other ways worse.

[bwgood77]

First time I heard ishbia talk, in the Simmons podcast, he sounded like another coked up arrogant rich boy. Just saying bs like “I’m all about winning bla bla bla”.

Yeah, I don’t like him…


The best team owners are usually the ones you don’t hear much about. I don’t even know the names of the spurs, Celtics or heat owners.

That is true. I had to look up Boston and SA's and I have barely heard their names ever. I knew MIckey Arison from the Heat. I think he personally dealt with Sarver on the Shaq trade iirc.

[Frank Lee]

Wishbea is a piece of work

[Calvin Klein]

I’ve listened to 5 minutes of the Pablo Torres podcast and I’m already fuming. I can’t believe nobody really talked about this stuff when it was all out there. It is so obvious how this guy operates…

[Frank Lee]

The league was so desperate to get rid of Sarver, they took the first swinging checkbook that came along. Perhaps a little more vetting was needed. Man, can we catch a break? Always felt like we needed local ownership.


* damn talk text

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Ghost of Kleine]

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[lilfishi22]

Read on Twitter

I saw this and I can't (nor could be bothered to) verify it but Hunterbrook isn't out there doing great investigative journalism to the people, they are out to enrich themselves by shorting UWM before the reporting came out. They are a short fund, short and simple (pun intended).

That's not to say what they've uncovered isn't true but I think where it's devious is the purpose of 'outing' UWM in particular. And I'm also not saying what was reported isn't a bad look but I do think if you investigate any big company, you're bound to find things you're looking for.

All I can say is that, I think most CEO's have an a-hole angle. You kinda have to be a bit ruthless to get to the the top of your industry, you just generally don't know about it because it doesn't come to light.

[Calvin Klein]

JJ gets so much crap (some of it deserved) but when he eventually is fired I really hope he tells his side of the story.

[garrick]

I’ve listened to 5 minutes of the Pablo Torres podcast and I’m already fuming. I can’t believe nobody really talked about this stuff when it was all out there. It is so obvious how this guy operates…

I brought it up when it was announced he bought the team but I think most fans were euphoric that a billionaire was buying out broke ass Sarver they were willing to overlook any bad press about him.

Hell anyone could have gone to the UWM subreddit and gotten an insider look into how the man operates.

[Qwigglez]

So when it comes to Miles Bridges, if the Suns end up getting him, I can't do anything about it as a fan except just stop watching the Suns to show that I do not support that behavior and that type of player on my team. The thing here is the guy served his suspension by the league, and some championship caliber team will likely get him for a very cheap trade. If it ends up being the Suns, I will still watch the team and root for them.

You have nothing to worry about Q. The Suns never got him as he remained on the same team that drafted him. I don’t believe teams are looking to pick Miles up after his domestic violence incident.

I'm confused why you brought this up