Who's the G.O.A.T. ?

[TheGeneral99]

I'm not sure Lebron can ever pass MJ unless he wins another title, but what he did this year at age 39 was simply incredible.

[Hair Jordan]

Jordan’s the GOAT. Best combination of raw stats, advanced metrics, individual accolades, championships, eye test, cultural influence etc. Lebron isn’t above Kareem or Russell in my book. He’s a (longevity) stat freak Ike Wilt but also a loser like Wilt. Wilt was 2-4 in Finals and Lebron is 4-6. If it wasn’t for Ray Allen’s clutch jump shot he’d be 3-7. If Golden State doesn’t blow a 3-1 lead he’d be 2-8. 4-6 is un-GOAT-ly and he’s lucky it’s not worse. Top 10 or top 5 player ever but not close to being the GOAT. It’s laughable that people think he is. He also doesn’t handle himself like a GOAT. He’s a whiny, spoiled, insufferable man child who demands his “damn respect” while literally crowning and referring to himself as the GOAT. It’s obvious to me that even Lebron doesn’t believe he’s really the GOAT. If he did he wouldn’t feel the need to say it all the time. It’s like he’s trying to convince himself and others when deep down inside he knows it’s not true

[Jta444]

I'm not sure Lebron can ever pass MJ unless he wins another title, but what he did this year at age 39 was simply incredible.

Incredible indeed

But you can’t fault MJ for not having a more incredible age 39 season because he didn’t really have the motivation anymore to keep adding to his resume because at that point in 2002-2003 he is solidified as the GOAT by most peers and media

Compare that to Lebron who up to now is still not the consensus GOAT and therefore has all this added motivation and reason to keep improving and accumulating accolades to chase MJ

Switch their places and I’d think MJ would be as good if not better at age 39 if Lebron came first and MJ is still chasing Lebron. Remember the attribute most known to Michael is his competitiveness and desire to win and never lose and this is well-documented by those who know him.

[Lakers824]

Jordan is the greatest ever. And Kareem is 2nd for me. Lebron is still in the triumvirate but there's daylight to me.

He had to win more titles, MVPs, and/or FMVPs to bridge that gap and it'd evaded him. The last MVP Lebron won was 11 years ago when he was 28th. Its also the last time he led the league in PER or win share average.

In 2013, it looked almost a certainty that he'd atleast tie Kareem's 6 MVPs and inch ahead of MJ. I also thought that 6 titles was a realistic goal. It just....hasn't happened.
Which isn't something to sneaze it either. A great career.

[TheGeneral99]

I'm not sure Lebron can ever pass MJ unless he wins another title, but what he did this year at age 39 was simply incredible.

Incredible indeed

But you can’t fault MJ for not having a more incredible age 39 season because he didn’t really have the motivation anymore to keep adding to his resume because at that point in 2002-2003 he is solidified as the GOAT by most peers and media

Compare that to Lebron who up to now is still not the consensus GOAT and therefore has all this added motivation and reason to keep improving and accumulating accolades to chase MJ

Switch their places and I’d think MJ would be as good if not better at age 39 if Lebron came first and MJ is still chasing Lebron. Remember the attribute most known to Michael is his competitiveness and desire to win and never lose and this is well-documented by those who know him.

Oh I agree, and also given the fact that Jordan took 3 years off after winning MVP and the title in 1998, which obviously accelerates a decline.

[Gregoire]

MJ. Lebron with his ring and stats chasing only make this gap bigger.

[ShootersShoot]

Impact-wise in games, I'd say its close between Bron and MJ, but I gotta give the edge to MJ overall..more titles, mvps, scoring titles, plus what he did for the game on a global and cultural scale can never be matched by anyone.

[Birth of the Cool]

Jordan’s the GOAT. Best combination of raw stats, advanced metrics, individual accolades, championships, eye test, cultural influence etc. Lebron isn’t above Kareem or Russell in my book. He’s a (longevity) stat freak Ike Wilt but also a loser like Wilt. Wilt was 2-4 in Finals and Lebron is 4-6. If it wasn’t for Ray Allen’s clutch jump shot he’d be 3-7. If Golden State doesn’t blow a 3-1 lead he’d be 2-8. 4-6 is un-GOAT-ly and he’s lucky it’s not worse. Top 10 or top 5 player ever but not close to being the GOAT. It’s laughable that people think he is. He also doesn’t handle himself like a GOAT. He’s a whiny, spoiled, insufferable man child who demands his “damn respect” while literally crowning and referring to himself as the GOAT. It’s obvious to me that even Lebron doesn’t believe he’s really the GOAT. If he did he wouldn’t feel the need to say it all the time. It’s like he’s trying to convince himself and others when deep down inside he knows it’s not true

I voted MJ but the above post is ridiculous. Thanks for your nuanced unbiased take Hair Jordan lol.

[Hair Jordan]

Jordan’s the GOAT. Best combination of raw stats, advanced metrics, individual accolades, championships, eye test, cultural influence etc. Lebron isn’t above Kareem or Russell in my book. He’s a (longevity) stat freak Ike Wilt but also a loser like Wilt. Wilt was 2-4 in Finals and Lebron is 4-6. If it wasn’t for Ray Allen’s clutch jump shot he’d be 3-7. If Golden State doesn’t blow a 3-1 lead he’d be 2-8. 4-6 is un-GOAT-ly and he’s lucky it’s not worse. Top 10 or top 5 player ever but not close to being the GOAT. It’s laughable that people think he is. He also doesn’t handle himself like a GOAT. He’s a whiny, spoiled, insufferable man child who demands his “damn respect” while literally crowning and referring to himself as the GOAT. It’s obvious to me that even Lebron doesn’t believe he’s really the GOAT. If he did he wouldn’t feel the need to say it all the time. It’s like he’s trying to convince himself and others when deep down inside he knows it’s not true

I voted MJ but the above post is ridiculous. Thanks for your nuanced unbiased take Hair Jordan lol.

Everything I said is true. What part of my comment are you disputing?

[bledredwine]

Lebron didn't eclipse Jordan?

What a shocker. I thought that he was going to, based on all of those cherry-picked GIF's over the last two decades.
Like the gifs that said "before age X" comparing the players' achievements, then that disappeared quickly.... then X stats, then advanced stats favored Jordan and those disappeared as well.

Now you see constant longevity-based GIFs and stats based on that. Nah, can't be cherry picked right? These
fans are all purely objective when comparing the two.

[LaLover11]

Jordan’s the GOAT. Best combination of raw stats, advanced metrics, individual accolades, championships, eye test, cultural influence etc. Lebron isn’t above Kareem or Russell in my book. He’s a (longevity) stat freak Ike Wilt but also a loser like Wilt. Wilt was 2-4 in Finals and Lebron is 4-6. If it wasn’t for Ray Allen’s clutch jump shot he’d be 3-7. If Golden State doesn’t blow a 3-1 lead he’d be 2-8. 4-6 is un-GOAT-ly and he’s lucky it’s not worse. Top 10 or top 5 player ever but not close to being the GOAT. It’s laughable that people think he is. He also doesn’t handle himself like a GOAT. He’s a whiny, spoiled, insufferable man child who demands his “damn respect” while literally crowning and referring to himself as the GOAT. It’s obvious to me that even Lebron doesn’t believe he’s really the GOAT. If he did he wouldn’t feel the need to say it all the time. It’s like he’s trying to convince himself and others when deep down inside he knows it’s not true

I voted MJ but the above post is ridiculous. Thanks for your nuanced unbiased take Hair Jordan lol.

Everything I said is true. What part of my comment are you disputing?

Put the pipe down bald Jordan

[bledredwine]

I voted MJ but the above post is ridiculous. Thanks for your nuanced unbiased take Hair Jordan lol.

Everything I said is true. What part of my comment are you disputing?

Put the pipe down bald Jordan

Watch on YouTube

If you actually watch this, you'll understand.

[KembaWalker]

I’m pretty sure if you put Wizards MJ with a dominant prime 2 way big man during that era as the best player on the team, like a Tim Duncan, he would do a lot better than getting smoked in the 1st round

[Tor_Raps]

Man, imagine if Jordan didn't retire but instead when ring whoring like Lebron... he could have won another 2 or 3 rings.

Heck, if Krause just kept the band together, they had a chance to win at least 1 more in Chicago.

Like there shouldn't even be a conversation about this lol.

[bledredwine]

Mam, imagine if Jordan didn't retire but instead when ring whoring like Lebron... he could have won another 2 or 3 rings.

Heck, if Krause just kept the band together, they had a chance to win at least 1 more in Chicago.

Like there shouldn't even be a conversation about this lol.

And no one talks about the abysmal performance by everyone but MJ in the 1990 playoffs against Detroit game 7, or Jordan likely has another.

[Hair Jordan]

I voted MJ but the above post is ridiculous. Thanks for your nuanced unbiased take Hair Jordan lol.

Everything I said is true. What part of my comment are you disputing?

Put the pipe down bald Jordan

Yep. That’s what I thought. Everything I said was true. So far, you’re not denying it.

[The High Cyde]

I got Bron as the GOAT

4 titles, won with three different franchises as the best player, proving he’s adaptable and still as effective even as the league changed around him since he came in the league in 2003. He’s the all time leading scorer and counting. The 3-1 Finals comeback. Has the insane peak and prime that looks like it’s still going 20+ years in. I doubt we’ll see a player as good as him who peaked so high with a prime so long it’s longer than some all time greats careers.

[cool007]

It's MJ who is the GOAT and always has been.

LeBron is definitely the 2nd greatest player of all-time.

[Gregoire]

LeBron stans are sooo funny... its not even funny :
with all his roster-contructions, jumping teams, PEDs, flopping, stats-inflated soft league, ring-chasing and record-chasing playing to his 40s as a beta (with Davis alpha) LeBron just.... couldnt be equal with MJ. He knows it, his fanboys know it and it make them all and LeBron himself even more frustrated and angry... Its in realm of possibility than he would play to his 50s as 12th player in roster to have another ring or two I suppose....

[Jta444]

6 > 4. And before anybody says Robert Horry, did Horry lead those teams to the championship? The Horry counter is the dumbest argument ever. And before anybody says Bill Russell, then okay Bill Russell is the GOAT. Still doesn’t take away the fact that MJ > Lebron and 6 > 4. 4/21 to be exact. Like an inefficient chucker