2024 NBA Playoffs: East Semifinals: #2 New York Knicks vs #6 Indiana Pacers (IND WINS 4-3)

[OldSchoolNoBull]

OG: 42:05
Hart: 48:00
Brunson: 43:33
Donte: 43:41

Hope these guys don't break down before the team is done playing.

Thibs + depleted bench = rough load for the starters.

[knicksNOTslick]

but to say it was one sided is just plain wrong imo.

Yet only Knicks fans seem to have this opinion tonight.

So sure, maybe 95% of non-Knicks fans who have no dog in the fight are wrong and Knicks fans are the only correct people.

Most fans only focus on the final minutes of the game. Then no one even addresses the missed call on Brunson when it was out on Nembhard's foot. That was a missed call in the favor of Indiana. But no one wants to talk about that. Only the calls that favor the Knicks.

So no, everyone here has an agenda. Whoever says they're unbiased in the series is a liar. You always favor a team, even if it's 51-49. Lies. This GB is always right according to you.

[Luv those Knicks]

You have every right to feel screwed by the refs, but if they were trying to fix it then why call it out of bounds off Brunson when he dribbled it off Nembhard's foot? If Thibs hadn't used his last challenge there that would've handed you the ball game on a refereeing error.

I'm biased, but that call just kills the "it's all rigged" narrative for me. That looked more like gross incompetence from a crew that was shook by the crowd than match-fixing to my eye.

Every team has these nights. “The officials screwed us!” It sucks, we all do it, and it’s usually our frustration shining when we’re mad about a loss. That’s the case for Pacer fans tonight. Calls can be complained about on both sides, but to imply any one call made THIS game a win or a loss is foolish.

Except for 95% of the people in this thread saying the Pacers got screwed are not Pacers fans.

You even have some Knick fans saying it on the Knicks board. So . . . that seems to be the consensus.

I've seen the Knicks get screwed by the refs a lot, so that happens too. We're not the Lakers or LeBron who always gets the call.

Pacers are a good team and the Knicks are missing Randle, which takes us down a notch. Whenever someone says "Knicks are the better team . . . I'm not so sure. If we had Randle, maybe. The Pacers have a bench. NY's bench is very thin.

I'm curious what the LTM report will say.

The NBA wants 7 game series, so they certainly won't want NY to win it in 4. Still, I hate that all these close games can come down to questioning the refs. It's like there's no clear winner. The Philly series too.

And there's still a lot of series to play. I wonder if the Refs will go into the next game thinking they owe Indy one. You never know. They did that with Philly in game 3.

[cgf]

Nuntius can tell you, my interest in the NBA has been hanging on by a thread. I absolutely hate everything the NBA is, I just have an undying love for the Pacers that I can't seem to shut off.

Tonight might have been the final straw for me. This isn't a sport. Its WWE. The game wasn't decided by the players and it was never going to be. The NBA/refs knew who would win this game before the tip-off. The end of that game was WILD. It wasn't even slightly one-sided. It was a full blown mission from the NBA to make sure the Knicks won.

I'm running out of reasons to continue to watch this league.

You have every right to feel screwed by the refs, but if they were trying to fix it then why call it out of bounds off Brunson when he dribbled it off Nembhard's foot? If Thibs hadn't used his last challenge there that would've handed you the ball game on a refereeing error.

I'm biased, but that call just kills the "it's all rigged" narrative for me. That looked more like gross incompetence from a crew that was shook by the crowd than match-fixing to my eye.

You can think what you want. I believe the NBA/refs decided who would win this game and not the players. I've just seen too much to think its just an honest mistake at this point. Always seems to favor certain teams/players. The Charlotte Hornets are never getting these calls, but you look at a Laker the wrong way and its a trip to the free throw line.

Whether it was on purpose or not, the refs decided this game, not the players, and if the refs are deciding these games, what is the point of watching?

I'm less trying to change your mind...though I hope you can still get enjoyment from the NBA...and just trying to understand the "it's all rigged" thinking. You've been reasonable in other interactions, so I figured you might be able to help me better get how people who think it's rigged...which isn't exactly a crazy suggestion given that we've had a ref arrested for fixing games before & it happens in other sports too...square the refs trying to fix it with the mistake they made that almost won you the game.


As to your final question, I can only answer for myself but I still watch because human error has always played a part in deciding winning & losing in every sport.

So many World Cups would have to be re-distributed if video replay and modern PED testing had been available...we'd have to give back at least one of our stars...but that adversity is part of the experience, as long as that adversity isn't artificially ensured.

I'm a Union Berlin fan and back in the DDR days we played in the East German league where matches were actively being fixed in favored of the Stasi supported club. This has been well documented and isn't a controversial claim. So I totally get how actual match-fixing can kill a competition. But incompetence just doesn't bother me as much*

Trying to force a moment of refereeing incompetence that benefits my team is part of why we sing & scream & whistle from the stands. It's one of the few things we as fans can do to help our team from the sidelines alongside energizing them with our support and trying to distract/throw off the opposing team in crucial moments.


*"as much" being the operative phrase. I still make fun of the English Premier League because of how incompetently it is officiated compared to the German Bundesliga and enjoy the BuLi more in part because it's so much better run, but I can forgive mistakes. Intentional manipulation otoh just turns me off.

[robillionaire]

but to say it was one sided is just plain wrong imo.

Yet only Knicks fans seem to have this opinion tonight.

So sure, maybe 95% of non-Knicks fans who have no dog in the fight are wrong and Knicks fans are the only correct people.

Most fans only focus on the final minutes of the game. Then no one even addresses the missed call on Brunson when it was out on Nembhard's foot. That was a missed call in the favor of Indiana. But no one wants to talk about that. Only the calls that favor the Knicks.

So no, everyone here has an agenda. Whoever says they're unbiased in the series is a liar. You always favor a team, even if it's 51-49. Lies. This GB is always right according to you.

Right if it was “rigged by the nba” why would they have made this blatantly obvious bad call. Thankfully we still had the challenge

[knicksNOTslick]

Yet only Knicks fans seem to have this opinion tonight.

So sure, maybe 95% of non-Knicks fans who have no dog in the fight are wrong and Knicks fans are the only correct people.

Most fans only focus on the final minutes of the game. Then no one even addresses the missed call on Brunson when it was out on Nembhard's foot. That was a missed call in the favor of Indiana. But no one wants to talk about that. Only the calls that favor the Knicks.

So no, everyone here has an agenda. Whoever says they're unbiased in the series is a liar. You always favor a team, even if it's 51-49. Lies. This GB is always right according to you.

Right if it was “rigged by the nba” why would they have made this blatantly obvious bad call. Thankfully we still had the challenge

Yup! And so far not one "unbiased" poster has acknowledged that. Just the same "NBA rigging it for the Knicks" BS. They can address that and then we can have a conversation. Until then this is all just crying.

[Luv those Knicks]

OG: 42:05
Hart: 48:00
Brunson: 43:33
Donte: 43:41

Hope these guys don't break down before the team is done playing.

Thibs + depleted bench = rough load for the starters.

The Philly series, MPG over the 6 games:

Josh Hart 46.3
Brunson 43.8
OG 41.7

I think Josh Hart has one of those motors where he never gets tired. Still, if NY gets past Indy, I have a feeling the Celtics will kill us.

[CreekShow]

Btw if I see an Indiana fan complain about flops or foul baiting after having cheered on Reggie Miller in the 90s against the Knicks, then I don't know what to tell you. Dude was kicking his legs after 3 pt shot looking for any type of contact on the defender.

Dont think Ive ever seen a deflection quite like this

[Ugly Duckling]

dang the knicks are fun to watch

[cgf]

Randle's absence was really felt in that one. Not just because of our lack of depth and Brunson's minutes, but Julius has absolutely bodied Siakam in their past few meetings and is really huge for us early in games...so we don't have to dig ourselves out of a hole every game once Jalen finds his rhythm/dials in the range.

[cgf]

Btw if I see an Indiana fan complain about flops or foul baiting after having cheered on Reggie Miller in the 90s against the Knicks, then I don't know what to tell you. Dude was kicking his legs after 3 pt shot looking for any type of contact on the defender.

Dont think Ive ever seen a deflection quite like this

You're not wrong...but f*** Reggie Miller

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

I'm less trying to change your mind...though I hope you can still get enjoyment from the NBA...and just trying to understand the "it's all rigged" thinking. You've been reasonable in other interactions, so I figured you might be able to help me better get how people who think it's rigged...which isn't exactly a crazy suggestion given that we've had a ref arrested for fixing games before & it happens in other sports too...square the refs trying to fix it with the mistake they made that almost won you the game.


As to your final question, I can only answer for myself but I still watch because human error has always played a part in deciding winning & losing in every sport.

So many World Cups would have to be re-distributed if video replay and modern PED testing had been available...we'd have to give back at least one of our stars...but that adversity is part of the experience, as long as that adversity isn't artificially ensured.

I'm a Union Berlin fan and back in the DDR days we played in the East German league where matches were actively being fixed in favored of the Stasi supported club. This has been well documented and isn't a controversial claim. So I totally get how actual match-fixing can kill a competition. But incompetence just doesn't bother me as much.

Trying to force a moment of refereeing incompetence that benefits my team is part of why we sing & scream & whistle from the stands. It's one of the few things we as fans can do to help our team from the sidelines alongside energizing them with our support and trying to distract/throw off the opposing team in crucial moments.

I stopped enjoying the NBA when Adam Silver removed defense from the game. As I said, I just love the Pacers, I grew up watching them and want to support them, but I absolutely hate the league. It isn't basketball, its entertainment around basketball, but the rules have been butchered left and right for so long that its nearly unrecognizable at this point.

I can watch other sports and chalk things up to human error for the most part. I think some players get some extra love, but I don't think its anything egregious. Even in other sports, it can be a bad call that changes a game, and that sucks, but its not bad call, after bad call, after bad call, all favoring one team. I mean, the refs completely took any chance the Pacers had away from them at the end of this game. The Pacers literally had no chance with the way the end of the game was called.

Its crazy to me that the refs can decide who wins a game like that. A playoff game. Its wild to me....and yes, you had a ref get caught saying that other refs influence games. Everyone quickly dismissed him....but why? Why was it tossed aside as a solo thing so quickly? Especially when everyone can see how bad these refs are constantly?

There was a game earlier this year where the Pacers were up by 3, the other team had like 3 seconds to score from an inbound, I can't remember who it was or I would go find the video. The other team inbounded the ball, the star player caught it and tripped over his own feet, falling to the ground. He then stood up and shot the ball. He missed, so it didn't matter, but this dude literally fell down after taking a step, then stood up without dribbling, and a travel was not called.

That would get called in a middle school game. Yet you are trying to tell me the best refs in the world missed the most obvious call ever? ORRRRRRR is it an entertainment product where they don't really care about the rules and just want to call things as they come?

Either way, its terrible for the game. Either you have refs unable to understand the most basic rules or you have a league that doesn't care about the rules and will decide which ones to enforce/not enforce depending on the team/situation. The moving screen on Turner is an example of that tonight. The NBA has spent the last 15 years allowing that screen...hell most of the ones they've allowed over the last 15 years were significantly worse than that one....but they decided to call it tonight. Why? Because it allows the NBA to have control over games/situations.

[Spandau]

but to say it was one sided is just plain wrong imo.

Yet only Knicks fans seem to have this opinion tonight.

So sure, maybe 95% of non-Knicks fans who have no dog in the fight are wrong and Knicks fans are the only correct people.

Most fans only focus on the final minutes of the game. Then no one even addresses the missed call on Brunson when it was out on Nembhard's foot. That was a missed call in the favor of Indiana. But no one wants to talk about that. Only the calls that favor the Knicks.

So no, everyone here has an agenda. Whoever says they're unbiased in the series is a liar. You always favor a team, even if it's 51-49. Lies. This GB is always right according to you.

Exactly. As I said earlier, that’s why I think it’s perfectly fair to “both sides” this game. I saw good calls and bad calls on both sides. But I’m not trying to make non-Knick fans feel better about this by pretending it only happened in the final two minutes.

Some fans here are too polite with this stuff. Enjoy the win, own it, the Knicks played great. Their MVP showed up and showed out. Celebrate, don’t pacify people who want to diminish it.

[LordCovington33]

I love the Knicks grittiness and hope they win the series, but the Pacers got screwed in the Big Apple.

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

You have every right to feel screwed by the refs

Found the play I was talking about:

Watch on YouTube

Long video but you can go to the end.

A middle school ref would make that call, but the NBA ref doesn't. Why not? Did he just miss it? If he just simply missed it, how did he miss it when its absurdly obvious?

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

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Not to mention the Knicks set a more egregious moving screen right before the Pacers stole the ball, which the refs decided to just give to the Knicks for no reason at all.

I mean, you can't make this **** up.

[cgf]

I'm less trying to change your mind...though I hope you can still get enjoyment from the NBA...and just trying to understand the "it's all rigged" thinking. You've been reasonable in other interactions, so I figured you might be able to help me better get how people who think it's rigged...which isn't exactly a crazy suggestion given that we've had a ref arrested for fixing games before & it happens in other sports too...square the refs trying to fix it with the mistake they made that almost won you the game.


As to your final question, I can only answer for myself but I still watch because human error has always played a part in deciding winning & losing in every sport.

So many World Cups would have to be re-distributed if video replay and modern PED testing had been available...we'd have to give back at least one of our stars...but that adversity is part of the experience, as long as that adversity isn't artificially ensured.

I'm a Union Berlin fan and back in the DDR days we played in the East German league where matches were actively being fixed in favored of the Stasi supported club. This has been well documented and isn't a controversial claim. So I totally get how actual match-fixing can kill a competition. But incompetence just doesn't bother me as much.

Trying to force a moment of refereeing incompetence that benefits my team is part of why we sing & scream & whistle from the stands. It's one of the few things we as fans can do to help our team from the sidelines alongside energizing them with our support and trying to distract/throw off the opposing team in crucial moments.

I stopped enjoying the NBA when Adam Silver removed defense from the game. As I said, I just love the Pacers, I grew up watching them and want to support them, but I absolutely hate the league. It isn't basketball, its entertainment around basketball, but the rules have been butchered left and right for so long that its nearly unrecognizable at this point.

I can watch other sports and chalk things up to human error for the most part. I think some players get some extra love, but I don't think its anything egregious. Even in other sports, it can be a bad call that changes a game, and that sucks, but its not bad call, after bad call, after bad call, all favoring one team. I mean, the refs completely took any chance the Pacers had away from them at the end of this game. The Pacers literally had no chance with the way the end of the game was called.

Its crazy to me that the refs can decide who wins a game like that. A playoff game. Its wild to me....and yes, you had a ref get caught saying that other refs influence games. Everyone quickly dismissed him....but why? Why was it tossed aside as a solo thing so quickly? Especially when everyone can see how bad these refs are constantly?

There was a game earlier this year where the Pacers were up by 3, the other team had like 3 seconds to score from an inbound, I can't remember who it was or I would go find the video. The other team inbounded the ball, the star player caught it and tripped over his own feet, falling to the ground. He then stood up and shot the ball. He missed, so it didn't matter, but this dude literally fell down after taking a step, then stood up without dribbling, and a travel was not called.

That would get called in a middle school game. Yet you are trying to tell me the best refs in the world missed the most obvious call ever? ORRRRRRR is it an entertainment product where they don't really care about the rules and just want to call things as they come?

Either way, its terrible for the game. Either you have refs unable to understand the most basic rules or you have a league that doesn't care about the rules and will decide which ones to enforce/not enforce depending on the team/situation. The moving screen on Turner is an example of that tonight. The NBA has spent the last 15 years allowing that screen...hell most of the ones they've allowed over the last 15 years were significantly worse than that one....but they decided to call it tonight. Why? Because it allows the NBA to have control over games/situations.

I appreciate your response and can definitely understand loving your basketball team even when you hate the league...that's my relationship with the Avs & the NHL right now lol.

I don't have as much of a problem about the rules favoring offense...especially after how ugly things basketball had gotten with the rules favoring defense...but I can certainly understand your frustration with the refs impacting results, regardless of intent. Especially with how often it happens.

But to me there are just too many plays that don't fit...like missed call when Brunson dribbled it off Nembhard's leg...and also we've seen the way match fixing is done in basketball before in the NBA and elsewhere. It's done with a series of BS fouls to key players throughout the fixed match, not egregious bad calls in the deciding moments of a game.

So while I also hate how bad NBA refs and fully believe that their incompetence can be swayed subconsciously by home crowds, as well as by star players and big markets...the way Real always happens to get favorable calls at the Bernabeau...I struggle to buy that it's really rigged on that kind of a massive scale.

[blueNorange]

OG: 42:05
Hart: 48:00
Brunson: 43:33
Donte: 43:41

Hope these guys don't break down before the team is done playing.

Thibs + depleted bench = rough load for the starters.

he’s been playing them like this since november lol they’re good

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

So while I also hate how bad NBA refs and fully believe that their incompetence can be swayed subconsciously by home crowds, as well as by star players and big markets...

This is a massive problem.

The fact that the refs are swayed at all from calling a correct game is an issue. We shouldn't so easily accept that stars and big markets will get a better whistle, or that the home team will get a better whistle. But yet....we all do accept it. Why?

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

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